Another Religious Thread: If God is All-good, All-powerful, and All-knowing...

[galvelocity]

Originally Posted by 23ska909red02

Galvelocity:

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23ska909red02:

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These arguments go nowhere because of two things: stubbornness and narrow-mindedness.

For the record, I mean from any and all sides.

People ask questions already believing what they want to believe, and people answer questions with no intention of learning anything new from the person they're trying to 'fix' or 'convert'.

Go to a math tutor thoroughly convinced that 2+ 2 = filet mignon and carry with you a complete unwillingness to understand how that perspective is wrong, and you'll get as far with him as you would anyone else asking questions about God with an already established, thorough conviction that they are completely unwilling to have shaken or compromised.

What if you're like me and went from devoutly religious to devoutly atheist after taking the time to educate yourself the best way you knew how? Obviously I was open-minded or I would still be religious. And obviously I wouldn't still be reading about religion to learn about it if I was just going to say it was stupid in a blanket statement.
My closest friend right now fits that description. Got a ton of respect for dude.

I don't call myself a Christian, because I don't want the negative stigma associated with today's Christians attached to me, but I do believe there is a God, and I try to live according to that belief. I wasn't raised according to the way I believe, and I can definitely respect anyone who has developed their own belief system, even if the belief system they subscribe to is completely different than mine.
Yeah I like the idea of customized religion. Take the aspects of religion you like and apply them to your life as you choose instead of beingmandated to do a thousand different things. You do what you think makes you a better person who is happier in this life.

Although by doing so, you are worsening everyone's odds of choosing the correct religion to get you into heaven byadding a new one into the betting pool

....jk haha

 

[jimmy blanco1983]

I'm interested to see a response to my post on page 2 about the story of Job.

 

[jimmy blanco1983]

Originally Posted by Galvelocity

Originally Posted by 23ska909red02

Galvelocity:

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23ska909red02:

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These arguments go nowhere because of two things: stubbornness and narrow-mindedness.

For the record, I mean from any and all sides.

People ask questions already believing what they want to believe, and people answer questions with no intention of learning anything new from the person they're trying to 'fix' or 'convert'.

Go to a math tutor thoroughly convinced that 2+ 2 = filet mignon and carry with you a complete unwillingness to understand how that perspective is wrong, and you'll get as far with him as you would anyone else asking questions about God with an already established, thorough conviction that they are completely unwilling to have shaken or compromised.

What if you're like me and went from devoutly religious to devoutly atheist after taking the time to educate yourself the best way you knew how? Obviously I was open-minded or I would still be religious. And obviously I wouldn't still be reading about religion to learn about it if I was just going to say it was stupid in a blanket statement.

My closest friend right now fits that description. Got a ton of respect for dude.

I don't call myself a Christian, because I don't want the negative stigma associated with today's Christians attached to me, but I do believe there is a God, and I try to live according to that belief. I wasn't raised according to the way I believe, and I can definitely respect anyone who has developed their own belief system, even if the belief system they subscribe to is completely different than mine.
Yeah I like the idea of customized religion. Take the aspects of religion you like and apply them to your life as you choose instead of being mandated to do a thousand different things. You do what you think makes you a better person who is happier in this life.

Although by doing so, you are worsening everyone's odds of choosing the correct religion to get you into heaven by adding a new one into the betting pool

....jk haha


Customized religion? This is very confusing to me. I don't know your beliefs, but let me give you a scenario. Let's say you take manyof your customized religious beliefs from the Bible. The Bible is the Word of God and it is the guide to life. God is All-knowing. So if you are taking yourbeliefs from the Bible, how can you not omit certain things that you don't like or feel that apply to your life? To me that says that you have a betterunderstanding of what is best for your life rather than God. The Bible is not a buffet to where you can get helpings of things you like and disregard thethings you don't. Everything in the Bible was placed there with a purpose and we must take all of Gods commands to heart. Now this is assuming that yourtake your customized religion from the Bible, but I think it can apply to any other religious book.

 

[recycledpaper]

religion is just another man-made story to explain humanities uncertainties. it's impossible for us to comprehend how life started so why bother?

 

[meshies]

What is really at work here is the war between good and evil. There are 2 sides to everything. God doesn't control both the good and the evil.

 

[yen2dro3]

Originally Posted by Its That Dude

Scenario:

Someone is being robbed at gunpoint. Robber says, "Give me the money or I'll kill you."

There you are standing behind the robber with a gun. You have the power to stop him. He doesn't know you're there. But yet, you choose not to stop the robber. The person being robbed doesn't give up their money. The robbers shoots them and kills them.

Can you really say that you are still a good person after letting that person die, even though you deliberately chose not to save them? I definitely can't.

Can you say you're still good?


So how can a Christian say God is all-good when God has the power to stop evil, but purposely chooses not to stop it?

Furthermore, if you were raised without being taught that God is all-good, would you really say that God is all-good after growing up and seeing the kinds of things happen in this world?

That scenario is too vague. Is the person being robbed a good person? why is the guy robbing him? is it because his kid is dying of cancer and he needs to getcash to pay the bills? If you were to stop the guy from robbing him you might be just as evil as the guy killing him for someone cash. If you stop him fromrobbing why don't you just do that for everyone else there are people dying right now and you can easily stop it just like the guy behind the robber. soare you evil because you are on NT asking this question? instead of being out in the streets feeding homeless people?

 

[darthska]

It's not a matter of taking the Bible apart and applying the things you like and disregarding the things you don't. For me, there is nothing in theBible that I have thrown out.

However, there are MANY interpretations of things that are in the Bible that I have thrown out.

For example, there's a verse in Proverbs warning God's follower about being 'unequally yoked'. Do you know what a yoke is? Short definition:it's a neck harness that locks a couple oxen together. There's a verse in Proverbs that warns against being attached to someone who is not your equal(being unequally yoked).

If you were alive 150 years ago, nearly EVERY church you would have attended would tell you that 'unequally yoked' was God's way of telling us thatwe need to keep races separated. Think I'm lying? There are STILL Southern Baptists with an old school, traditional interpretation of the Bible that stillbelieve that verse in the Bible is God's instruction against mixing races.

Now, I haven't told myself 'Nah, I don't like that part of the Bible. I don't see a problem with mixed couples, so I'm just going to ignorethat verse.'

Never that.

Rather, I've done research on that verse, and I know what it's talking about, and it has nothing to do with race. I know the context that verse waswritten under, I know the dangers the author of that verse was trying to warn about, and I know the instruction being given there when God instructs Hisfollowers not to be unequally yoked.

See? I haven't thrown out that part of the Bible, but I have definitely thrown out the traditional, common misinterpretation. I've done this with a lotof parts of the Bible.

The sooner you realize that there has been a LOT of politics in Biblical interpretation/teaching over the years, and that it still goes on in churches today,the sooner you will realize the need to do your own studying of God's word and stop letting someone else tell you what it says.

 

[jimmy blanco1983]

Originally Posted by recycledpaper

religion is just another man-made story to explain humanities uncertainties. it's impossible for us to comprehend how life started so why bother?

I pray that you can be led to the Truth.

 

[jimmy blanco1983]

Originally Posted by 23ska909red02

It's not a matter of taking the Bible apart and applying the things you like and disregarding the things you don't. For me, there is nothing in the Bible that I have thrown out.

However, there are MANY interpretations of things that are in the Bible that I have thrown out.

For example, there's a verse in Proverbs warning God's follower about being 'unequally yoked'. Do you know what a yoke is? Short definition: it's a neck harness that locks a couple oxen together. There's a verse in Proverbs that warns against being attached to someone who is not your equal (being unequally yoked).

If you were alive 150 years ago, nearly EVERY church you would have attended would tell you that 'unequally yoked' was God's way of telling us that we need to keep races separated. Think I'm lying? There are STILL Southern Baptists with an old school, traditional interpretation of the Bible that still believe that verse in the Bible is God's instruction against mixing races.

Now, I haven't told myself 'Nah, I don't like that part of the Bible. I don't see a problem with mixed couples, so I'm just going to ignore that verse.'

Never that.

Rather, I've done research on that verse, and I know what it's talking about, and it has nothing to do with race. I know the context that verse was written under, I know the dangers the author of that verse was trying to warn about, and I know the instruction being given there when God instructs His followers not to be unequally yoked.

See? I haven't thrown out that part of the Bible, but I have definitely thrown out the traditional, common misinterpretation. I've done this with a lot of parts of the Bible.

The sooner you realize that there has been a LOT of politics in Biblical interpretation/teaching over the years, and that it still goes on in churches today, the sooner you will realize the need to do your own studying of God's word and stop letting someone else tell you what it says.

I totally agree. You have to read for yourself you know what the Bible truly says. Although many people take individual verses and turn theminto the wrong interpretation by either not know the verses context or removing the verses context for their own reasons.

 

[fromthatown]

Originally Posted by Galvelocity

Yeah I like the idea of customized religion. Take the aspects of religion you like and apply them to your life as you choose instead of being mandated to do a thousand different things. You do what you think makes you a better person who is happier in this life.

I thought I was the only one that did this.

I'vecustomized my beliefs, but I never wanted to use the word, religion. Maybe it's because I use to be an atheist, or maybe it's because I have nofollowers yet, in my religion. With my parent's traditions, beliefs and what I've read and experience, I have my own personal religion, I guess you cancall it.

My brother is an atheist, and we don't have any issueswhen it comes to beliefs. I just really believe people are gonna believe what they want, no point in trying to change them. That's why I just post what Ibelieve in most of these religion threads on NT, and never get into any debates or anything with people, cause I know somebody else isn't going to changemy views on that, nor am I changing theirs like Ska said. About to go post my beliefs in the other religion thread

 

[luckyp90]

How come when something good happens god is given credit but when something bad happens its about free will.

 

[djprestige21]

The truth is everyone has their own interpretation of God and religion. For example, nowhere in the Qur'an does it say to blow up buildings and nothing iswritten about 72 virgins at all in the original scriptures. With Christianity you will have people saying God will save us and lead us to supreme happinessthen when something bad happens they go right for the "God works in mysterious ways".

Religion is necessary in a life that really has no meaning. Reality is the quickest road to mediocracy.

 

[f3djam]

not only is he not all good or all powerful...
but he doesnt exist

 

[dathbgboy]

Originally Posted by f3DJam

not only is he not all good or all powerful...
but he doesnt exist

That statement just created his existence, but of course u knew that

 

[ace bomber]

I wasn't gonna add anything when I first clicked this thread but there are some seriously piss poor arguments against religion in here... (I don't"believe" btw)

The whole story that this thread was based on is a HORRIFIC example

A couple of yall are making some solid points though (Joe Camel and Galvelocity) I liketo see/hear a good religious discussion where both sides can keep their cool and not start making personal attacks on the other side. It just really baffles mehow many people believe in god. Not that it is a bad thing, I just personally could never do it. There is so much unknown that I can never look past... I'mgonna throw something out there that most of you, I would imagine, have already seen.� If you have not, I would appreciate responses from people who arechristian to please tell me what goes through your mind when you see information like this... This movie has plenty of bs in different parts so I am justposting the first segment of the religion topic. Feel free to watch the second and third parts if you wish



Also, if anybody can disprove these claims I would love to hear it... (I'm really not trying to be sarcastic even though it may be coming across that way)

 

[algarve23]

God is always good no matter what

 

[much respected]

Originally Posted by Its That Dude

So you guys still say that god is ALL-GOOD, even thought he lets innocent people die when HE HAS THE POWER to save them.

Simple minded thoughts. Not everything is about good or bad.

 

[prostaffer]

correct.

i'd rather die believing in god and finding out he doesn't exist instead of choosing not to believe in him only to find out i'm wrong when i meethim.

 

[melovp]

Originally Posted by Jimmy Blanco1983

Originally Posted by recycledpaper

religion is just another man-made story to explain humanities uncertainties. it's impossible for us to comprehend how life started so why bother?

I pray that you can be led to the Truth.

what exactly is this truth?

 

[thytkerjobs]

Originally Posted by Prostaffer

i'd rather die believing in god and finding out he doesn't exist instead of choosing not to believe in him only to find out i'm wrong when i meet him.

yup.
and also

at the 1st reply in this thread.

 

[prostaffer]

Originally Posted by Galvelocity

Originally Posted by Prostaffer

Originally Posted by Its That Dude

Scenario:

Someone is being robbed at gunpoint. Robber says, "Give me the money or I'll kill you."

There you are standing behind the robber with a gun. You have the power to stop him. He doesn't know you're there. But yet, you choose not to stop the robber. The person being robbed doesn't give up their money. The robbers shoots them and kills them.

Can you really say that you are still a good person after letting that person die, even though you deliberately chose not to save them? I definitely can't.

Can you say you're still good?


So how can a Christian say God is all-good when God has the power to stop evil, but purposely chooses not to stop it?

Furthermore, if you were raised without being taught that God is all-good, would you really say that God is all-good after growing up and seeing the kinds of things happen in this world?

god doesn't say he's good.

also humans have a thing called free-will. look it up. we bring everything upon ourselves.

The whole "worship me" thing has "I'm better than you" connotations, I think. If all people in the entire human race (including people like Mother Theresa and Ghandi) are inferior enough that we're supposed to bow down to Him, He's saying He's a pretty awesome dude, IMO.

i don't remember ghandi or mother theresa ever saying that because of our inferiority we are supposed to bow down to him. we are made in hislikeness.

ghandi was hindu btw. although hiduism lends itself most open to duality in religions it also like all religions preaches good will towards fellow man.

perhaps atheists resent the elitist attitude of more assertive religious people. i was going down that road. i too get annoyed with singers and athletesthanking god and those that say it's "HIS" way or no way.

Jesus accepted all and in my eyes was a friend to all. Very hippie like and that's the way I choose to see my god. Plus if he made all our judgements forus there would be no fun in that.

 

[born tuesday]

Originally Posted by ACE BOMBER

I wasn't gonna add anything when I first clicked this thread but there are some seriously piss poor arguments against religion in here... (I don't "believe" btw)

The whole story that this thread was based on is a HORRIFIC example

A couple of yall are making some solid points though (Joe Camel and Galvelocity) I like to see/hear a good religious discussion where both sides can keep their cool and not start making personal attacks on the other side. It just really baffles me how many people believe in god. Not that it is a bad thing, I just personally could never do it. There is so much unknown that I can never look past... I'm gonna throw something out there that most of you, I would imagine, have already seen.� If you have not, I would appreciate responses from people who are christian to please tell me what goes through your mind when you see information like this... This movie has plenty of bs in different parts so I am just posting the first segment of the religion topic. Feel free to watch the second and third parts if you wish



Also, if anybody can disprove these claims I would love to hear it... (I'm really not trying to be sarcastic even though it may be coming across that way)

That video was very interesting and brought up a lot of good points, some of which I have never heard before.

But I don't know how this video would lead you not to believe in GOD. I understand if you don't believe in Religion or the existence of Jesus becauseof this video. What in this video says that they're is no Higher Being?

One of my favorite Professors, who was agnostic and very knowledgeable about almost everything, said that Scientists have traced everything from creation downto the the very first reaction or hydrogen particle (I can't remember which on it was). With that being said, he said scientist can not explain what causedthat initial reaction or particle to be there.

IDK I'm just curious to hear why you don't believe in any higher being.

 

[retro23j]

Originally Posted by Prostaffer

i'd rather die believing in god and finding out he doesn't exist instead of choosing not to believe in him only to find out i'm wrong when i meet him.

WHO YOU TELLIN!

 

[Tummy Arashikage]

It's interesting how a lot of you who were raised catholics/roman catholics became atheist/agnostic/whatever happens, happens. It kind of tells you thehypocrisy as well as the manipulative hold catholicism has and how it twisted the bible's true teachings so that a lot of people just totally got disgustedfrom it and just totally lost interest. Well I'm glad I am a christian who was never raised a catholic... Knowing is one thing believing is another, youcan't push or intimidate people to join your religion or believe in your God. It's just up to an individual to find it himself,
If you don't believe in anything and just want to live life a good person that is awesome, I wish more higher than thou religious idiots were like that.They should look at themselves first before judging others. God judges at the end not a person. That is why people hate and blame god even more is becauseradicals regardless of which way you bow is exaggerating and making God in their image and people start to not believe because they don't get their way soit's easy to say yeah it's Gods fault. You can blame him for natural disasters or the badness of people and the ruination of human society and lettingthe Devil do what he pleases and this and that and on and on. But hell how old do you think you'll be when you die because we all are imperfect and guesswhat imperfection means death so regardless of what happens you still die right? Even Jesus had to die on earth. No one lives forever just yet, I don'tbelieve in miracles and I won't give none of that BS but I know god listens when I need him, so keep knockin he'll open... Be realistic money don'tgrow on trees...

 

[ace bomber]

Originally Posted by Born Tuesday

That video was very interesting and brought up a lot of good points, some of which I have never heard before.

But I don't know how this video would lead you not to believe in GOD. I understand if you don't believe in Religion or the existence of Jesus because of this video. What in this video says that they're is no Higher Being?

One of my favorite Professors, who was agnostic and very knowledgeable about almost everything, said that Scientists have traced everything from creation down to the the very first reaction or hydrogen particle (I can't remember which on it was). With that being said, he said scientist can not explain what caused that initial reaction or particle to be there.

IDK I'm just curious to hear why you don't believe in any higher being.

I suppose I should've clarified that a bit... That video did not lead me to not believe in a higher being. To me, the whole thought of it justseems unbelievable. I can't buy into that whole idea. It is just too outlandish (IMO). I like to have things justified and reasons for things. If Idon't, I won't put much faith in it... That goes for all facets of my life, not just religion.

BTW I watched a couple response videos to Zeitgeist and some of the religion similarities are either a far reach or just plain incorrect. I will need to dosome research myself and try to find out what I can. I definitely don't like endorsing lies.