***Official Political Discussion Thread***

[heelsandeers]

I think people have the right to be both disappointed with the scope of the plan and support those that will receive a huge benefit from it.

I guess my question for these people would be - What is the scope they were hoping for from an EO, that would not only hold up with the Supremes, but also not be a political loser for Dems in the mid terms?

I just don't know what that looks like. I think they landed on a fairly reasonable and politically neutral answer that will help a lot of people

 

[sonoftony]

So I don't have to pay back Sallie Mae 10k? Thanks Brandon

 

[gry60]

Dems simply can't behave like the GOP in some areas to accomplish their goals. They don't have the political luxury to do so.

They could if they were willing to come live in towns of 100 to 100k people. Instead, they cluster in small areas of the country, while doing their best to forget that until the electoral syst changes, land occupancy matters more than popular support in this country.

Imagine how well a Democratic-led campaign with the live among cows, save democracy slogan would go in democratic strongholds

 

[kdawg]

My SiL is a teacher in Northern California. Got a Pell grant but in 2021 did a bunch of overtime due to staff quitting - so apparently made just over $125k. So she gets nothing?

Doesn’t seem fair. We have 2 ways here for that sort of thing - one is a hard cap where over it you get nothing and the other phases out - if you’re 5k over you get 5k less and that seems more fair. Wouldn’t make that much difference I suppose - but it does to her.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

Dem accomplishments on Race?

...and I need to get acquainted with reality?

Word?

what does this mean?

 

[biggie62]

I would think that the grant is based on AGI so I’d look at your 2021 tax return and see what the actual AGI was. You can easily massage that number with 401k/403b contributions along with HSA.

My take on this is based on how the Covid payments were determined.

 

[Present]

what does this mean?

"engineering democratic loses by ****ting on dem accomplishments"

Define "dem accomplishments" as it relates to racism against black people...specifically.

 

[Nike Jordan]

Bipartisanship is a myth.

 

[RustyShackleford]

They could if they were willing to come live in towns of 100 to 100k people. Instead, they cluster in small areas of the country, while doing their best to forget that until the electoral syst changes, land occupancy matters more than popular support in this country.

Imagine how well a Democratic-led campaign with the live among cows, save democracy slogan would go in democratic strongholds

One of the least covered stories about Dems loses in rural areas is how hostile rural Republicans are to their presence.

There was an article about Fetterman campaigning during the primary in rural areas. And I was taken aback at how casually people discuss the open harassment people face for have a Biden sticker on their car or a BLM poster.

In Nevada, most volunteers refuse to go to rural Nevada to knock of doors because they have to face crap like cars following them, getting yelled at them constantly and threatened with guns.

On some level I don't blame libs for not want to live in rural areas. Unless you are rich, it is mostly a sad inconvenient stressful life being a lib in rural America.

If you are a black person living in the rural south, you neighbors might be black, but the state takes zeroes interest in your community. They will sabotage you trying to get a sewage system built.

If libs are gonna be convinced to move, we need large Metro is Mountain west states and South Carolina.

 

[gry60]

"engineering democratic loses by ****ting on dem accomplishments"

Define "dem accomplishments" as it relates to racism against black people...specifically.

This is a statement made in bad faith.

The cost of education is an issue that predominantly affects those who don't have the ability to lean on generational wealth to support their studies.

Who is that supposed to be in the US?

 

[osh kosh bosh]

"engineering democratic loses by ****ting on dem accomplishments"

Define "dem accomplishments" as it relates to racism against black people...specifically.

They have done plenty of things that will help black Americans.

I'm confused so you want the Democrats to solve racism?

What legislative mechanism could they use to accomplish this?

 

[Present]

This is a statement made in bad faith.

The cost of education is an issue that predominantly affects those who don't have the ability to lean on generational wealth to support their studies.

Who is that supposed to be in the US?

A degree is the answer to racism?

Word?

 

[RustyShackleford]

A degree is the answer to racism?

Word?

You really seem not interested to discuss this topic in good faith.

 

[red dune]

I guess my question for these people would be - What is the scope they were hoping for from an EO, that would not only hold up with the Supremes, but also not be a political loser for Dems in the mid terms?

I just don't know what that looks like. I think they landed on a fairly reasonable and politically neutral answer that will help a lot of people

Well for me it's that they still haven't made discharge of student loan debt tax-free for all loans. After doing the math, dropping the overall amount charged on a yearly basis down to 5% is reasonable given my circumstances. Removing the possibility of a huge tax liability for the 20 and 25 year loans is the other half of the pie; at least as far as the minimum I've wanted.

If you have both of those, then loans are basically 5% over the life of the loans until its time to forgive the remainder without putting me in financial peril. Yeah, you end up paying more than the loans principle, but at a trickled amount.

I'd also like to see rules that bolster and protect borrowers who get lied to or mislead by the loan holder company. I hold a real bias against whichever side is the more sophisticated becaause people rely on their word to make important life decisions. Their mess should not be our mess.

 

[Present]

They have done plenty of things that will help black Americans.

I'm confused so you want the Democrats to solve racism?

What legislative mechanism could they use to accomplish this?

Nah -

You claimed I was "sh%#$ on dem accomplishments"

I'll spot you an Anti Lynching Bill that took over 100 years to pass but c'mon fam.

You cant be so obtuse as to wonder why a lot of young black voters are apathetic.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

Nah -

You claimed I was "sh%#$ on dem accomplishments"

I'll spot you an Anti Lynching Bill that took over 100 years to pass but c'mon fam.

You cant be so obtuse as to wonder why a lot of Black Dem voters are apathetic.

If your response to every dem accomplishment even if it helps black people is

"Why haven't you solved racism yet" I would say you ****ting on Democrats in a silly un productive way.


And I don't even think it's true that black voters are apathetic.

Pretty sure Black Democrats are the most consistent dem voting bloc.

 

[Present]

You really seem not interested to discuss this topic in good faith.

Good Faith would be to stay on the topic of racism and not divert to "education".

Especially when black graduates make less than their white counterparts if they can even find a job.

All this "Anti CRT" business going on in academia.

This aint about "education" just like police brutality aint about "training".

 

[gry60]

One of the least covered stories about Dems loses in rural areas is how hostile rural Republicans are to their presence.

There was an article about Fetterman campaigning during the primary in rural areas. And I was taken aback at how casually people discuss the open harassment people face for have a Biden sticker on their car or a BLM poster.

In Nevada, most volunteers refuse to go to rural Nevada to knock of doors because they have to face crap like cars following them, getting yelled at them constantly and threatened with guns.

On some level I don't blame libs for not want to live in rural areas. Unless you are rich, it is mostly a sad inconvenient stressful life being a lib in rural America.

If you are a black person living in the rural south, you neighbors might be black, but the state takes zeroes interest in your community. They will sabotage you trying to get a sewage system built.

If libs are gonna be convinced to move, we need large Metro is Mountain west states and South Carolina.

I was just thinking about that. That can be arranged with developer money.

Democratic strategists, planners, billionaires (if they exist) are not learning from urban planners of the past: they were the ones who engineered the built-in advantages of the conservative movement through geographical arrangements (from the trail of tears to redlining and the interstate project). What's to stop someone with Soros money from having a sizeable Dubai-style urban project in the isolated parts of the Dakotas and leverage remote work to draw out California liberals?

If I had Bill Gates money, I'd do this in 2-3 states (before other red state legislatures caught on). Which governor is going to say no to green money coming out of blue pockets, especially when their towns and cities are dying of old age and brain drain? I'm thinking long-term here...

 

[Present]

Pretty sure Black Democrats are the most consistent dem voting bloc.

 

[solewoman]

ill take it.

I'm broke baby.

 

[RustyShackleford]

It is not the job of the Democratic Party to change the hearts and minds of racist white people

It is the job of the Democratic Party to win majorities and use those majorities to pass policy that helps the unfairly economically and socially disadvantaged.

They are not perfect, but the mostly try to perform this job. Some of the things that come with that is hard to tolerate sometimes

Not every member of the party is a liberal and that trips things up, some members are captured by special interest, and that trips things up but those things would matter less if our electoral system have the Dems the voters that closer represent their vote share.

If the Dems had those votes, and the Supreme Court, things would be much different.

Acting like the hold up is the Democratic Party reaching a consensus not to pass economic and civil rights policy simply ignores political reality. The median Democrat in Congress supports a ton of legislation that would fundamentally improve the material conditions facing most black people. However, the median Dem's view doesn't matter. The last vote in what that matters. And they are structurally disadvantaged from making that vote liberal, and further way from progressive.

It sucks, it is frustrating, it is not fair, but it is the world we live in. And not matter how much it sucks, the answer is to try give them better majorities so they can pass better policy. So they can fill the next two SCOTUS seats that come up. Because if they fail, you won't just see less progress, you will see a reversal in many areas.

The GOP has zero interest in being responsive to the desires of most America. And they have zero interest in pretending like they do anymore much longer. I don't see the upside in empowering those people.

If they reform themselves into Niskanen Center centrist with a actual civil rights platform. Then we can talk.

 

[RustyShackleford]

Good Faith would be to stay on the topic of racism and not divert to "education".

Especially when black graduates make less than their white counterparts if they can even find a job.

All this "Anti CRT" business going on in academia.

This aint about "education" just like police brutality aint about "training".

Dude, the topic is about student loan forgiveness

You want to shift the parameters of the discussion it to make your criticism of the Dems have more sting.

And when people try to keep some perspective, you try to tug the goal post in a different direction

So yes, you aren't arguing in good faith given some of your responses.

 

[Present]

Meanwhile back at the Ranch...

The legislation, introduced by Rep. Grace Meng, D-N.Y., and Sen. Mazie Hirono, D-Hawaii, aims to make the reporting of hate crimes more accessible at the local and state levels by boosting public outreach and ensuring reporting resources are available online in multiple languages.

It also directs the Department of Justice to designate a point person to expedite the review of hate crimes related to COVID-19 and authorizes grants to state and local governments to conduct crime-reduction programs to prevent and respond to hate crimes.

POLITICS​

Harris To Asian Americans: Turn Pain And Outrage Into Political Power​

Vice President Harris introduced Biden ahead of the signing and reflected on the increase in violence against Asian Americans.

"This violence — it did not come from nowhere, and none of it is new. In my life, my lived experience, I have seen how hate can pervade our communities," she said. Harris, who is the first Asian American vice president, added, "I have seen how hate can impede our progress. And I have seen how people uniting against hate can strengthen our country."




Black People:

 

[Present]

Dude, the topic is about student loan forgiveness

You want to change it to make your criticism of the Dems have more sting.

And when people try to keep some perspective, you try to tug the goal post in a different direction

So yes, you aren't arguing in good faith

How you gonna tell me what my topic was, then proceed to....

Ohhhhhh.

Almost got me there

 

[HIM]

Happy for those who will benefit from this.