Why aren't convicts being used in the US military?

[dt43]

Originally Posted by WarMachine

Originally Posted by bijald0331

How you can make the assumption that these people will follow orders to fight is beyond me. Why wouldn't they desert? How are you making this leap?

Why aren't all poor people breaking laws?

Because NT is full of ******s with the notion of bootcamp changing these men into angels

 

didn't you know? anyone who goes through bootcamp, including the biggest low lifes in society, come out like this..

 

[club29]

OP throws a little hissyfit everytime someone disagrees with him

"IM RIGHT! UR WRONG! IM THE HARDEST GUY ON NT! UR ALL SCARRED LITTLE BABIES! *cry cry cry*"

stubborn !@# dudes

 

[club29]

OP throws a little hissyfit everytime someone disagrees with him

"IM RIGHT! UR WRONG! IM THE HARDEST GUY ON NT! UR ALL SCARRED LITTLE BABIES! *cry cry cry*"

stubborn !@# dudes

 

[elderwatsondiggs]

Originally Posted by WarMachine

Originally Posted by bijald0331

How you can make the assumption that these people will follow orders to fight is beyond me. Why wouldn't they desert? How are you making this leap?

Why aren't all poor people breaking laws?

Because NT is full of ******s with the notion of bootcamp changing these men into angels

 

Well genius, how about they already are letting convicted criminals, even some with felonies in. I know this for a fact, all they have to do is get what they call a moral waiver and they can get in. It's a risk they take sometimes to get the numbers. Now that the economy has turned south people have been running to join the military in droves...even people in their 30's are joining for the first time. Because they are no longer hurting for new recruits, I am sure they have curbed the amount of convicted criminals in.

I was in Iraq for 6 months last year working for the Department of Defense, this discussion has been talked about more than a few times and I've heard straight from the senior leadership mouth. I know what I am talking about.

 

[elderwatsondiggs]

Originally Posted by WarMachine

Originally Posted by bijald0331

How you can make the assumption that these people will follow orders to fight is beyond me. Why wouldn't they desert? How are you making this leap?

Why aren't all poor people breaking laws?

Because NT is full of ******s with the notion of bootcamp changing these men into angels

 

Well genius, how about they already are letting convicted criminals, even some with felonies in. I know this for a fact, all they have to do is get what they call a moral waiver and they can get in. It's a risk they take sometimes to get the numbers. Now that the economy has turned south people have been running to join the military in droves...even people in their 30's are joining for the first time. Because they are no longer hurting for new recruits, I am sure they have curbed the amount of convicted criminals in.

I was in Iraq for 6 months last year working for the Department of Defense, this discussion has been talked about more than a few times and I've heard straight from the senior leadership mouth. I know what I am talking about.

 

[flipnkraut]

Originally Posted by ElderWatsonDiggs

Originally Posted by WarMachine

Originally Posted by bijald0331

How you can make the assumption that these people will follow orders to fight is beyond me. Why wouldn't they desert? How are you making this leap?



Why aren't all poor people breaking laws?

Because NT is full of ******s with the notion of bootcamp changing these men into angels

 

Well genius, how about they already are letting convicted criminals, even some with felonies in. I know this for a fact, all they have to do is get what they call a moral waiver and they can get in. It's a risk they take sometimes to get the numbers. Now that the economy has turned south people have been running to join the military in droves...even people in their 30's are joining for the first time. Because they are no longer hurting for new recruits, I am sure they have curbed the amount of convicted criminals in.

I was in Iraq for 6 months last year working for the Department of Defense, this discussion has been talked about more than a few times and I've heard straight from the senior leadership mouth. I know what I am talking about.

While there is a moral waiver, its still not that simple. Not every single person with a record gets a moral waiver and the ones that do have records for small stuff. I highly doubt a convicted murderer has even gotten into the military.

The reason this is a stupid idea is that these people can't follow the rules of society, what makes anyone think they're going to follow the rules of the military.

 

[flipnkraut]

Originally Posted by ElderWatsonDiggs

Originally Posted by WarMachine

Originally Posted by bijald0331

How you can make the assumption that these people will follow orders to fight is beyond me. Why wouldn't they desert? How are you making this leap?



Why aren't all poor people breaking laws?

Because NT is full of ******s with the notion of bootcamp changing these men into angels

 

Well genius, how about they already are letting convicted criminals, even some with felonies in. I know this for a fact, all they have to do is get what they call a moral waiver and they can get in. It's a risk they take sometimes to get the numbers. Now that the economy has turned south people have been running to join the military in droves...even people in their 30's are joining for the first time. Because they are no longer hurting for new recruits, I am sure they have curbed the amount of convicted criminals in.

I was in Iraq for 6 months last year working for the Department of Defense, this discussion has been talked about more than a few times and I've heard straight from the senior leadership mouth. I know what I am talking about.

While there is a moral waiver, its still not that simple. Not every single person with a record gets a moral waiver and the ones that do have records for small stuff. I highly doubt a convicted murderer has even gotten into the military.

The reason this is a stupid idea is that these people can't follow the rules of society, what makes anyone think they're going to follow the rules of the military.

 

[highrep87]

Hmmm let's have some criminal who might of murdered someones parent, kid, or loved one... just join the army instead of paying for what they did

 

[highrep87]

Hmmm let's have some criminal who might of murdered someones parent, kid, or loved one... just join the army instead of paying for what they did

 

[elderwatsondiggs]

Originally Posted by FlipnKraut

Originally Posted by ElderWatsonDiggs

Originally Posted by WarMachine

Originally Posted by bijald0331

How you can make the assumption that these people will follow orders to fight is beyond me. Why wouldn't they desert? How are you making this leap?



Why aren't all poor people breaking laws?

Because NT is full of ******s with the notion of bootcamp changing these men into angels

 

Well genius, how about they already are letting convicted criminals, even some with felonies in. I know this for a fact, all they have to do is get what they call a moral waiver and they can get in. It's a risk they take sometimes to get the numbers. Now that the economy has turned south people have been running to join the military in droves...even people in their 30's are joining for the first time. Because they are no longer hurting for new recruits, I am sure they have curbed the amount of convicted criminals in.

I was in Iraq for 6 months last year working for the Department of Defense, this discussion has been talked about more than a few times and I've heard straight from the senior leadership mouth. I know what I am talking about.

While there is a moral waiver, its still not that simple. Not every single person with a record gets a moral waiver and the ones that do have records for small stuff. I highly doubt a convicted murderer has even gotten into the military.

The reason this is a stupid idea is that these people can't follow the rules of society, what makes anyone think they're going to follow the rules of the military.

Well you do know that there are other types of criminals than convicted murderers. The idea may or may not be stupid, that can be debated...but the FACT of the matter is that convicted criminals and even some felons have been allowed in. As a matter of fact around 900 felons were allowed in around 2003.

 

[elderwatsondiggs]

Originally Posted by FlipnKraut

Originally Posted by ElderWatsonDiggs

Originally Posted by WarMachine

Originally Posted by bijald0331

How you can make the assumption that these people will follow orders to fight is beyond me. Why wouldn't they desert? How are you making this leap?



Why aren't all poor people breaking laws?

Because NT is full of ******s with the notion of bootcamp changing these men into angels

 

Well genius, how about they already are letting convicted criminals, even some with felonies in. I know this for a fact, all they have to do is get what they call a moral waiver and they can get in. It's a risk they take sometimes to get the numbers. Now that the economy has turned south people have been running to join the military in droves...even people in their 30's are joining for the first time. Because they are no longer hurting for new recruits, I am sure they have curbed the amount of convicted criminals in.

I was in Iraq for 6 months last year working for the Department of Defense, this discussion has been talked about more than a few times and I've heard straight from the senior leadership mouth. I know what I am talking about.

While there is a moral waiver, its still not that simple. Not every single person with a record gets a moral waiver and the ones that do have records for small stuff. I highly doubt a convicted murderer has even gotten into the military.

The reason this is a stupid idea is that these people can't follow the rules of society, what makes anyone think they're going to follow the rules of the military.

Well you do know that there are other types of criminals than convicted murderers. The idea may or may not be stupid, that can be debated...but the FACT of the matter is that convicted criminals and even some felons have been allowed in. As a matter of fact around 900 felons were allowed in around 2003.

 

[elderwatsondiggs]

Just so y'all don't think I'm talking out of my +%%, here is a source. I know what I am talking about. I am not advocating for criminals to be in the military and I'm not advocating against it, I am just saying that it does happen.

The New York Times ran a lead editorial today suggesting that to keep its ranks full, the US military is digging more deeply into the available American labor pool than it perhaps should and has already issued more than 125,000 "moral waivers" to new enlistees.

The article suggests that in some cases, the military is putting weapons into the hands of serious criminals.

The editorial, in part, reads:
To keep filling the ranks, the Army has had to keep lowering its expectations. Diluting educational, aptitude and medical standards has not been enough. Nor have larger enlistment bonuses plugged the gap. So the Army has found itself recklessly expanding the granting of "moral waivers," which let people convicted of serious misdemeanors and even some felonies enlist in its ranks.
Last year, such waivers were granted to 8,129 men and women -- or more than one out of every 10 new Army recruits. That number is up 65 percent since 2003, the year President Bush ordered the invasion of Iraq. In the last three years, more than 125,000 moral waivers have been granted by America's four military services.

Most of last year's Army waivers were for serious misdemeanors, like aggravated assault, robbery, burglary and vehicular homicide. But around 900 -- double the number in 2003 -- were for felonies. Worse, the Army does no systematic tracking of recruits with waivers once it signs them up, and it does not always pay enough attention to any adjustment problems.

 

[elderwatsondiggs]

Just so y'all don't think I'm talking out of my +%%, here is a source. I know what I am talking about. I am not advocating for criminals to be in the military and I'm not advocating against it, I am just saying that it does happen.

The New York Times ran a lead editorial today suggesting that to keep its ranks full, the US military is digging more deeply into the available American labor pool than it perhaps should and has already issued more than 125,000 "moral waivers" to new enlistees.

The article suggests that in some cases, the military is putting weapons into the hands of serious criminals.

The editorial, in part, reads:
To keep filling the ranks, the Army has had to keep lowering its expectations. Diluting educational, aptitude and medical standards has not been enough. Nor have larger enlistment bonuses plugged the gap. So the Army has found itself recklessly expanding the granting of "moral waivers," which let people convicted of serious misdemeanors and even some felonies enlist in its ranks.
Last year, such waivers were granted to 8,129 men and women -- or more than one out of every 10 new Army recruits. That number is up 65 percent since 2003, the year President Bush ordered the invasion of Iraq. In the last three years, more than 125,000 moral waivers have been granted by America's four military services.

Most of last year's Army waivers were for serious misdemeanors, like aggravated assault, robbery, burglary and vehicular homicide. But around 900 -- double the number in 2003 -- were for felonies. Worse, the Army does no systematic tracking of recruits with waivers once it signs them up, and it does not always pay enough attention to any adjustment problems.

 

[ac4three]

Criminals generally can't be trusted, and now you want to send them overseas with deadly weapons?

 

[ac4three]

Criminals generally can't be trusted, and now you want to send them overseas with deadly weapons?

 

[elderwatsondiggs]

@ Peeps in here thinking that this thing called war is black and white. If only y'all knew.

 

[elderwatsondiggs]

@ Peeps in here thinking that this thing called war is black and white. If only y'all knew.

 

[bijald0331]

I don't really care that it has been done/will be done. Just talking about why it isn't such a great idea and isn't as simple as some people in this thread make it seem. People are acting like its not messed up. It is messed up but it has to be done to keep the numbers up.

 

[bijald0331]

I don't really care that it has been done/will be done. Just talking about why it isn't such a great idea and isn't as simple as some people in this thread make it seem. People are acting like its not messed up. It is messed up but it has to be done to keep the numbers up.

 

[theoriginal]

some don't deserve to be in jail so why get drafted to the army

 

[thewealth]

Originally Posted by ninjallamafromhell

The ignorance and the stupidity in this thread is thick.  These aren't hardened criminals being given this option.  These are people getting busted with pot repeatedly and charges of the same magnitude.

 

[theoriginal]

some don't deserve to be in jail so why get drafted to the army

 

[thewealth]

Originally Posted by ninjallamafromhell

The ignorance and the stupidity in this thread is thick.  These aren't hardened criminals being given this option.  These are people getting busted with pot repeatedly and charges of the same magnitude.

 

[elderwatsondiggs]

Originally Posted by bijald0331

I don't really care that it has been done/will be done. Just talking about why it isn't such a great idea and isn't as simple as some people in this thread make it seem. People are acting like its not messed up. It is messed up but it has to be done to keep the numbers up.

And I'm saying it's not that cut and dry...not so black and white...war and military is rife with gray area ideals. If you haven't been exposed to it at a certain level then I can understand why you wouldn't understand. I would go more into it and give specific examples for clarity, but I simply cannot do so.

 

[elderwatsondiggs]

Originally Posted by bijald0331

I don't really care that it has been done/will be done. Just talking about why it isn't such a great idea and isn't as simple as some people in this thread make it seem. People are acting like its not messed up. It is messed up but it has to be done to keep the numbers up.

And I'm saying it's not that cut and dry...not so black and white...war and military is rife with gray area ideals. If you haven't been exposed to it at a certain level then I can understand why you wouldn't understand. I would go more into it and give specific examples for clarity, but I simply cannot do so.