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Considering Beerus is here they're going to have to amp him to beyond God status, which yes, is ridiculous for a villain that died years ago and has been washed everytime since.
Official DragonBall Z Thread. R.I.P Akira Toriyama. You will be missed
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Didn't gohan have a tail?
antidope
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Gohan did have a tail. Piccolo cut it off after he went Great Ape while they were training them.
I've already resigned to the fact that the explanation for Frieza being on the level of the Z fighters is gonna be stupid, I'm not gonna let it get me mad.... I hope
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I don't think it's inconceivable that freiza comes back stronger. Villains/heroes do it all the time in DBZ. I remember hearing something about him actually training for once? Training seems to be the miracle cure in DBZ. Maybe it has to do with a wish from shenron? But I don't think he'll be on the level of Bills. I'm assuming those symbols on vegeta and gokus clothing probably
Mean they were being trained by who's/bills during the time gap between BoG and this movie. Considering bills and whis's attitudes and personalities there's no way they play an active roll in this fight/movie. More than likely bills will say something a long the lines of "I don't involve myself in earthly affairs." Or "this will be entertaining, I won't step in".
If bills played an active role in fighting freiza we'd have two outcomes. 1. He's not stronger than bills and freiza gets washed by goku/vegeta 2. Freiza is stronger than bills and whis washes him or the DBZ universe is destroyed.
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No, they really don't. Freiza did it once after the events on Namek, as a cyborg, whereupon he was instantly washed. Cell did it once at the climax of the Cell Games, which was due to his Saiyan DNA and how that works, and was killed shortly after by a stronger character. Buu then never did it. And unlike Frieza, Cell wasn't dead, nor was Freiza actually dead the first time. I suppose you could also throw in Vegeta during the Namek Saga, who did it for the same reason as Cell, and was again not dead.
Honestly, whether he's stronger than Bills or not isn't a major issue for me, as even being strong enough to compete with Goku, Vegeta, or Gohan at this point would be putting him at Super Buu/SS3/Mystic/SS-God levels, which is only a step down from Bills as it is. That's a ridiculous powerjump from him being washed by SS-Trunks, who wasn't even the strongest SS at the end of things. However i'm betting he's going to be stronger than Bills.
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Thats what I mean how can you logically even by DBZ standards get him tl a level that woulda actually pose any type of threat to goku/vegeta/gohan?
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I didn't necessarily mean they died and then came back. I mean they were defeated and came back stronger. Not that the act of dying made them stronger but after being defeated (some died) they all came back with a boost in power for whatever reason. Whether or not they got washed afterwards is inconsequential.
antidope
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See man we're reading too much into it. We're all going to hate this move once it starts solely because of Friezas power jump.
We gotta let it go so we can enjoy the movie.
We gotta let it go so we can enjoy the movie.
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Again, you have Freiza. You have Cell. And you have Vegeta if you want to stretch it. That's not villains doing it all the time, and none of the powerjumps are as large, and ridiculous, as what Freiza would need to even be a credible threat in this film. The point is again that unlike even all those other times, the characters have all grown far beyond him in strength now, unlike after Namek, where no one but Goku could even beat Freiza as he was on Namek anyways. And notably, Gohan was still able to beat Cell, and would've had an easier time had his arm not been wrecked right beforehand.
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I'm sure they'll figure something out. A wish, fusion, sucking someone up through a tail (cell), eating a damb fruit lol I'm sure dragon ball z can make up another way to raise someone's power level exponentially
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Maybe it's a freiza clone? Whatever the case if this movie is canon I'm sure they'll be able to explain it once the movie comes out. Or maybe some hyperbolic time chamber deal is going on. Who knows. But the fact that he got stronger by whatever magnitude doesn't surprise me.
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I'm certain there will be an explanation. I just don't think its going to be a good one.
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Whether or not he's stronger than bills idk. If he's stronger than bills I don't see much of a chance for vegeta and goku.
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Seeing how bills is in the movie I bet he makes a deal with him and sleeps in his chamber thing or something. If not that when he gets wished back maybe they wish him stronger? Or, maybe in hell he meets something that trains him or some sort. This is DBZ. How can you complain about things getting stronger after being washed when thats the exact formula that happens literally EVERYTIME?
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thats what I'm doing. i don't expect much from DBZ anymore but sitting back and being able to enjoy a new film is enough to make me happy
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They tarnished Freezas rep once they made him the wash rag of the series.
With the reputation he had around the universe and his big role in the birth of the series, Freeza should have been the ultimate enemy, final boss figure.
They honestly ruined his character by making him the weakest of the villains.
The androids and cell should have been before Freeza, from DB to DBZ the Dr Gero comeback could have been played in before freeza and the Namek saga. Also, Buu could have been a movie and not canon. That whole saga was drawn out too long and it could have just been fat Buu/ kid Buu in 2 movies.
It should have been Saiyan Saga to introduce the rest of the race, Vegeta leaves and trains in space. Then Androids, where the dragonballs are used to wish Goku back to life to help with the fight. Then A Broly saga, where he comes and washes everyone and is beaten by the spirit bomb.
Then finally the Freeza saga/Namek saga where everything if brought back full circle. Vegeta returns, everyone is older and more powerful, but power levels aren't OD, and Freeza is the big boss that everyone has to team up to beat.
Goku goes Ssj and beats Freeza
End of series.
Time jump, Android/Cell movie. Future trunks comes back to warn everyone that Gero had one last super android that they forgot years ago and it's more powerful than anything they've ever seen blah blah blah. Cell only has one form which is his perfect form, and he washes everyone until Goku goes SSJ a one more time and finishes him off.
Goku is the only person to go SSJ a and Freeza isn't a scrub. Nobody needs to be nerfed, and Vegeta doesn't go out like a punk.
With the reputation he had around the universe and his big role in the birth of the series, Freeza should have been the ultimate enemy, final boss figure.
They honestly ruined his character by making him the weakest of the villains.
The androids and cell should have been before Freeza, from DB to DBZ the Dr Gero comeback could have been played in before freeza and the Namek saga. Also, Buu could have been a movie and not canon. That whole saga was drawn out too long and it could have just been fat Buu/ kid Buu in 2 movies.
It should have been Saiyan Saga to introduce the rest of the race, Vegeta leaves and trains in space. Then Androids, where the dragonballs are used to wish Goku back to life to help with the fight. Then A Broly saga, where he comes and washes everyone and is beaten by the spirit bomb.
Then finally the Freeza saga/Namek saga where everything if brought back full circle. Vegeta returns, everyone is older and more powerful, but power levels aren't OD, and Freeza is the big boss that everyone has to team up to beat.
Goku goes Ssj and beats Freeza
End of series.
Time jump, Android/Cell movie. Future trunks comes back to warn everyone that Gero had one last super android that they forgot years ago and it's more powerful than anything they've ever seen blah blah blah. Cell only has one form which is his perfect form, and he washes everyone until Goku goes SSJ a one more time and finishes him off.
Goku is the only person to go SSJ a and Freeza isn't a scrub. Nobody needs to be nerfed, and Vegeta doesn't go out like a punk.
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To my knowledge the series was supposed to end with namik but due to popularity continued
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i like this idea. honestly after seeing goku transform for the first time I never got hyped for any other transformations and my favorite fight from dbz has always been goku vs vegeta. No need for extra nerfed up super powers or transformations anyhow, Frieza terrorized the universe. Would've been a good last fight but eventually every other villain ends up terrorizing the universe, and the kai's and etc. nothing new each saga.
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yeah goku was supposed to die a legend and thats how it would've ended and toriyama wanted to push Gohan as the main protagonist after the cell saga as well. if that happened or what Prime said i think the series would've been even better
antidope
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Yup. It was supposed to end there, Goku was supposed to die, and Gohan would become the heir to the savior of the universe mantle. Then he continued and intentionally brought that idea to fruition with the Cell Saga. Then people cried over Goku being dead and we ended up with the nonsense that was the Buu Saga
It's a good idea but one person going ssj would have been eh. We'd still have the scaling issues cause only Goku would be about to handle things.
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Everything yall are saying about Toriyama's "intended" endings are pretty much unsubstantiated rumors. HE NEVER SAID ANYTHING ABOUT ENDING AT FREEZA.
I implore yall to please read this.
http://www.kanzenshuu.com/intended-end/
I implore yall to please read this.
http://www.kanzenshuu.com/intended-end/
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As you just said about Freiza gaining a powerup, if they're going to think of one they can think of multiple.
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True. It's all speculation at this point until more details are revealed. I personally don't think bills is going to have an active roll in the fight at all. And I don't think that neither freiza, vegeta, nor goku will be stronger than bills. I think he's going to be a spectator for this fight. But again, that's just me speculating.
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antidope
I think one SSJ would keep the allure of it being "legendary". As the series carried n it seemed like everyone could go super. Kids got the power without even putting in work. If anyone else could go, it should be future trunks and Broly. Maybe even vegeta. But tbh it would be better if there was only Broly and Goku. It would force the series to give the non Asians some spotlight. Krillin, Piccolo, Yamcha, Tien, etc. it would allow them to have more influence on the outcome of battles.
Instead of everyone standing back watching Goku fight all the time
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i would like that idea. i dont mind vegeta and gohan reaching it tho. vegeta through constantly pushing himself to try and become stronger than goku and govan's rage when pushed to the brink make reaching SSJ seem fitting for them imo. but i wish the other Z Fighters had played a more important role besides Krillin and Piccolo
