Offical 2009-10 NBA Season Thread

[Deleted member 38182]

Originally Posted by BangDak


If the Cavs didnt have the #1 pick, then they wouldnt be irrelevant.

 

[bhzmafia14]

I'm not talking about "if" Cleveland got the no.1 pick. Or if Charlotte didn't trade Kobe.

My case isn't what "if" OKC didn't get the no.2 pick. My case is what they could've done with the 5th pick and future drafts which was in their control.

But, if everyone thought Green was a great pick up for OKC at that time then so be it. I don't believe it though, I wasn't actively posting on here at the time.

I never said they didn't draft fine. Presti is just overrated by the national media at this point and I want to see what he will do this off-season to take this team to the next level.

Nobody around the league valued Joakim Noah as a Top 5 pick. Nobody. So stop that nonsense right now. If they had reached and drafted him you'd sit here today and tell us that Presti overdrafted him and got lucky it worked out.
My main argument isn't based on the luck of the franchise. Everybody gets lucky. People say we got lucky by getting Marc in that Pau deal. Hell, we were one pick away from grabbing Lebron in 2003 if that Thorpe trade wasn't made. But, this isn't about luck. I'm simply stating, did he really know what he was doing when he drafting basically two SF's in the same draft? Sure Durant played some two in college, but there was no way in hell he saw him playing SG in the league.

I just never saw Green turning out the way he has. I always knew Noah would be a good rebounder and hustle player. Its not like it was out of the question on what he could become. Finding solid bigs are hard to find moreso combo forwards. That's how I looked at it.

But, I'll end it there. No need to keep going on and on about it and nothing is getting accomplished.

 

[westcoastsfinest]

Originally Posted by BangDak

If the Cavs didnt have the #1 pick, then they wouldnt be irrelevant.

dont you mean they WOULD stay irrelevant?

If Charlotte never traded Kobe to LA, then they wouldnt have as many rings as he did, blah blah blah.


there wouldnt be much kobe haters and kobe stans plus eddie jones would probably still be a Laker

  

 

[mronegative]

If the Knicks would've got Stephen Curry, LeBron would be a lock and we'd be in the playoffs.

 

[bangdak]

Originally Posted by bhzmafia14

I'm not talking about "if" Cleveland got the no.1 pick. Or if Charlotte didn't trade Kobe.

My case isn't what "if" OKC didn't get the no.2 pick. My case is what they could've done with the 5th pick and future drafts which was in their control.

Is there a damn difference? its still hypothetical.




And, i meant relevant

 

[banks2pierce]

Originally Posted by Nowitness41Dirk

Nobody around the league valued Joakim Noah as a Top 5 pick. Nobody. So stop that nonsense right now. If they had reached and drafted him you'd sit here today and tell us that Presti overdrafted him and got lucky it worked out.

I don't know about this. Celtics had that 5th pick and worked him out twice and I wouldn't have been mad at all if we took him that year. It was pretty much expected that his draft range was 3-10. Hell, he was possibly going to go number 1 if he declared a year earlier.

And Westbrook was a damn good draft pick and where Presti earned a lot of my respect.

 

[i nasmatic i]

I still remember that Draft thread. A lot of us were bashing Presti for taking Antonio Daniels 2.0 and passing on Jerryd Bayless.

Brook Lopez wasn't even in the conversation because of how poorly he did in athletic drills.

 

[al3xis]

So you basically expect Presti to be flawless to garner any praise.


Maybe I'm being a homer, but Jeff Green vs Joakim Noah is a toss up at this point and Jeff's certainly had a better start to his career for the first 3 years. Who's even been better outa that draft so far? KD, Horford...and?


The Westbrook pick was GREAT. And bold.

 

[koolbarbone]

Originally Posted by DatZNasty

Originally Posted by koolbarbone

Originally Posted by Nowitness41Dirk

Originally Posted by bhzmafia14

I've already told you who he could've taken. Give me Durant / Brewer or Noah in 2007. Give me Lopez in 2008. Give me Curry in 2009. Its not like there wasn't a big debate on who they should take during the 2008 draft anyway. As a matter of fact, give me Noah in 2007. Durant was more than likely gonna be a SF in the league anyway, so why not build on your frontline? In 2008, Westbrook was a good pick. I still give him that, but how about having your frontline set by getting Love or Lopez? Once that's done, you know your only piece to add is a PG in a PG heavy draft. If Green ends up being the odd man out anyway to bring in a big man (maybe in a sign and trade), then it all goes back to those drafts.

I'm not knocking who he drafted because he did a good job, but would we be sitting here talking about them needing to add a legitimate big this off-season if they would've made those moves? I don't think so. Not only would they probably been just as good as they are now, but they would've been set for years without having to make any moves to their starting five. Just saying.

If they draft Love or Lopez instead of Russ, we're sitting here talking about them needing to find a PG... If they draft Corey Brewer instead of Green, we're talking about them needing to find an upgrade at SG because Corey Brewer wouldn't start for damn near any playoff team.

You're nitpicking. Plain and simple.

Not if they trade for Maynor - or any other serviceable point guard - and then draft Curry. Or they could just let Curry man the point.

You're telling me this lineup:
Maynor
Curry
Durant
Green/Noah
Lopez

isn't better than this lineup:
Westbrook
Durant
Green
Harden
Kristic

Even if you think it isn't better, they are in a lot better position to improve the team come free agency than the current team, particularly because good big men are hard to find. Obviously, the team can't complain with their current position, but it's not nitpicking to think about moves they could have made to help the team. That's often the difference between a championship and an exit in the conference finals.

That lineup sucks. And I don't think you even know the Thunder well because we start Thabo at the 2. But again, Maynor sucks. Well sucks is strong, but if he has to be a significant part of what you do, generally doesn't bode well. Curry has no doubt shown he can be a starting NBA PG, but coming into the draft that was certainly in question so that would have been a huge risk on both counts, and neither of those 2 and anywhere near the defender Westbrook is. Curry and Maynor ever on the court together is getting raped on D, definitely by the other team's 2 guard but bigger points like Deron Williams, Jason Kidd, Chauncy Billups, etc. would also go out them (and do to Maynor) in the post.

End of the day, we're talking about a team that won 23 games last yr winning 50 this yr, and even had an outside shot at the 2 seed, up until about game 78-79. Biggest 1 season turn around in history. It's hard to be mad at that

I disagree with Maynor, particularly since he is a rookie. But start Curry at PG and have Maynor back him up or don't even make that trade.

Regardless, no one is questioning the turnaround or saying Presti isn't a good GM. The point of all this hypotheticals is, aside from the fun of it, to show that the team could be in a much different sitution come free agency.

Nobody around the league valued Joakim Noah as a Top 5 pick. Nobody. Sostop that nonsense right now. If they had reached and drafted him you'dsit here today and tell us that Presti overdrafted him and got lucky itworked out.
And that's the whole point. If you are a good talent evaluator then you either take the player you want at your position, or you trade down to get him, thereby improving your team through a trade and getting the guy you want. You're crazy if you think Noah would go 9 if that draft was done over again so I wouldn't call it "nitpicking" to discuss where a blossoming post player could have helped the Thunder.

Anyway, in the big picture, Presti has done far more right than wrong and these hypotheticals could be applied to every other team. However, I think that it would be far easier to improve a team that already has a low-post presence and a serious outside threat to compliment Durant than the current lineup.

 

[banks2pierce]

Originally Posted by Al3xis

Maybe I'm being a homer, but Jeff Green vs Joakim Noah is a toss up at this point and Jeff's certainly had a better start to his career for the first 3 years. Who's even been better outa that draft so far? KD, Horford...and?


The Westbrook pick was GREAT. And bold.

Yea, Chicago would laugh OKC off the phone with that offer so it is not a toss up.

Everyone called OKC out at the time for KD and Jeff playing the same position and it is still the issue today. Green just can't guard 4's.

Westbrook and Ibaka picks were great.

 

[Deleted member 38182]

Originally Posted by Al3xis

The Westbrook pick was GREAT. And bold.

I absolutely thought Westbrook would be a big fat bust

boy was I wrong

 

[billy hoyle]

Scott Brooks wins Coach of the Year

 

[billy hoyle]

bhzmafia14 wrote:

Scott Brooks will be named COY this afternoon.




Somehow, Lionel Hollins must have been snubbed.
  I figured he would win over Skiles regardless of how well the Bucks played because the media is in love with OKC. He did a great job, but I don't see how a lottery bound team in Milwaukee can win 46 games like that with a rookie PG, Bogut and role players.
you love to hate on OKC, OKC had a way better season than the Bucks so stop it. Skiles did a great job but he didnt deserve it over Brooks.

 

[banks2pierce]

I've been reading a lot lately that QRich complains about Pierce so much because Pierce smashed Brandy.

 

[JD617]

Originally Posted by Banks2Pierce

I've been reading a lot lately that QRich complains about Pierce so much because Pierce smashed Brandy.

  

 

[N41D]

Meh... Green is a more skilled player than Noah and I think he brings more to the table from an all-around standpoint... Noah rebounds and blocks a shot or two. That's it. He brings nothing to the table offensively other than cleaning up around the rim...

I just don't buy that Noah is some difference maker. Guys like him aren't all that difficult to find...

 

[westcoastsfinest]

Originally Posted by Billy Hoyle

bhzmafia14 wrote:

Scott Brooks will be named COY this afternoon.




Somehow, Lionel Hollins must have been snubbed.

  I figured he would win over Skiles regardless of how well the Bucks played because the media is in love with OKC. He did a great job, but I don't see how a lottery bound team in Milwaukee can win 46 games like that with a rookie PG, Bogut and role players.
you love to hate on OKC, OKC had a way better season than the Bucks so stop it. Skiles did a great job but he didnt deserve it over Brooks.



not to mention OKC was a 23 win team last season and now theyre a 50 win team and giving the defending champs a run for their money

yup id say thats coach of a year material right there
  

 

[bhzmafia14]

If so many people thought OKC was gonna make the playoffs or be good this season anyway, what's the point?

I'm not the only one who felt Skiles should've won mainly because of the team he was coaching. The only thing that hurt him was the fact that the Bucks won like 32 games last season so their win increase wasn't that big even though they traded away one of their top scorers in Jefferson last year and were without Redd for 90% of the season.

Got no reason to "hate" on a team, just pointing out the facts. I guess you can he deserves it since they went from 23 to 50 wins because Hubie did it with Memphis back in 03-04 and he won. But, I don't know if there was another team like Milwaukee that was in the conversation as well during that time.

 

[banks2pierce]

Originally Posted by Nowitness41Dirk

Meh... Green is a more skilled player than Noah and I think he brings more to the table from an all-around standpoint... Noah rebounds and blocks a shot or two. That's it. He brings nothing to the table offensively other than cleaning up around the rim...

I just don't buy that Noah is some difference maker. Guys like him aren't all that difficult to find...

This is nonsense. He is a top 5 center. The toughest position in the league to fill. It really looks like you haven't been checking out Bulls games lately. His offense has improved a ton. He beats guys off the dribble now and racks up the points each game by smoking opposing centers up the court.

And I would hope a guy who is a 3/4 tweener would be more skilled than a CENTER.

 

[N41D]

Originally Posted by Banks2Pierce

Originally Posted by Nowitness41Dirk

Meh... Green is a more skilled player than Noah and I think he brings more to the table from an all-around standpoint... Noah rebounds and blocks a shot or two. That's it. He brings nothing to the table offensively other than cleaning up around the rim...

I just don't buy that Noah is some difference maker. Guys like him aren't all that difficult to find...

This is nonsense. He is a top 5 center.

Oh boy...

 

[koolbarbone]

Originally Posted by Banks2Pierce

Originally Posted by Al3xis

Maybe I'm being a homer, but Jeff Green vs Joakim Noah is a toss up at this point and Jeff's certainly had a better start to his career for the first 3 years. Who's even been better outa that draft so far? KD, Horford...and?


The Westbrook pick was GREAT. And bold.

Yea, Chicago would laugh OKC off the phone with that offer so it is not a toss up.

Everyone called OKC out at the time for KD and Jeff playing the same position and it is still the issue today. Green just can't guard 4's.

Basically.

Noah was a project coming out of college and everyone knew it, only now is he coming into his own. And the player that he is now would be far more complimentary to Durant than Green currently is. That's not saying that Green isn't good, but he certainly isn't indispensable.

Meh... Green is a more skilled player than Noah and I think he bringsmore to the table from an all-around standpoint... Noah rebounds andblocks a shot or two. That's it. He brings nothing to the tableoffensively other than cleaning up around the rim...

I just don't buy that Noah is some difference maker. Guys like him aren't all that difficult to find...
Rebounding and blocking "a shot or two" is what gets centers like Diop and Gortat $30 million contracts. Add consistent double-digit scoring and I'd say that is pretty hard to find. At the very least, it would prevent them from spending a pretty hefty portion of their cap space trying to fill their center position.

 

[clevelandsprince23]

Originally Posted by Nowitness41Dirk

Originally Posted by Banks2Pierce

Originally Posted by Nowitness41Dirk

Meh... Green is a more skilled player than Noah and I think he brings more to the table from an all-around standpoint... Noah rebounds and blocks a shot or two. That's it. He brings nothing to the table offensively other than cleaning up around the rim...

I just don't buy that Noah is some difference maker. Guys like him aren't all that difficult to find...

This is nonsense. He is a top 5 center.

Oh boy...

 come on B2P.  You know better than throwin' this ##$+*%*! out there. 
Noah is good.  top 5?  let's be real.  that's nonsense right there.

 

[al3xis]

Noah, a project? Hardly.


Howard
Duncan
Bogut
Camby
Kaman
Lopez
Gasol
Horford

c'mon...

 

[koolbarbone]

Originally Posted by Al3xis

Noah, a project? Hardly.

Offensive game, shooting form, shooting range, low-post footwork, frame - these were all concerns of Noah heading into the draft. If that's not a project, I don't know what is.

Now instead of drafting him, there's talk of Green coming off the bench because he plays the same position as Durant; disappointment over Camby re-signing in Portland; talk of signing someone like Bosh, who may or may not mesh with the team, to a major deal. It's not like things haven't worked out to get them where they are at, but to look past previous draft moves is extremely short-sighted. Simply drafting Noah would have gotten rid of these concerns.

 

[franchise3]

Aaron Brooks wins Most Improved Player