IS KOBE BRYANT...OVERRATED?

[shoeking2101]

Couple more all-star selections makes him better?

That's still 8 players
which is 3 more than you asked, and 5 more than you orginally claimed
How do they fall short? 
each player has at the minimum 2 rings and 2 finals mvps, Each have an MVP, Bird, Magic, Wilt all have multiple. 
each have played over 1,000 games which is plenty of sample size. 

I don't have any narrative. Kobe is a great player top 10 of all-time, and top 5 I've ever actually been able to see with my own eyes but to come in and he is top 3 undisputed? C'mon fam

I only mentioned Kobe's ASG appearances because dude mentioned duncan's.

Because All of those players either don't have Kobe's team success, Kobe's longevity, or his individual success. That's how they fall short. I'm going off of simply facts. And when you factor all of those in, they fall short relative to Kobe. That can't be argued unless you're putting your own bias in.

 

[sea manup]

why would you call kobe voldemort?

you do know that he is one of the most powerful and skilled wizards in the harry potter universe right? 

 

[CP1708]

View media item 1266015

Spreadsheet I keep. Basically the top of the top. I don't have things like All Star, or seasons, but it's about as defined as you can get without adding a billion more numbers.

This is the company he keeps. Not sure how one of them is overrated, but the rest are just fine.

......."Spreadsheet i keep"

you have got to be ******* kidding me



ladies and gentleman
the president of the Voldermort fan club is among us!

Yeah, I also have one on NFL QB's, the New England Patriots draft picks, NBA Salaries, the Cubs, the top Movie Box Office, Oscars, and about 25 other spreadsheets.

Would you like to view any of them? PM me your email address and I can send you a couple.

 

[dmxfury]

Well to be fair you are going off stats which are viewed and weighed differently by all

 

[dmxfury]

CPs spreadsheets

 

[goldenchild9]

That his career is not undisputed top 3 and that he is overrated by too many people that think like you.

The hell are you talking about man THAT IS THE VERY DEFINITION OF UNDISPUTED

I rest my case with you.

You conveniently ignore Duncan's defensive domination, rebounding numbers, edge in regular season and Finals MVP (which mean MUCH more than All-Star games) and act like Kobe's career is undisputedly better than Timmy's.

Just like dude posting up his scoring achievements like that proves the point. Too many fans are blinded by scoring. That's only one aspect of the game.

I can post up a litany of Iverson scoring records and feats, it doesn't mean much.

Only Wilt, Bron, Kobe, MJ and Oscar reached 20,000 points before Melo, he'll probably retire with the very similar averages to Kobe....he top 10?

Scoring is just one aspect of all around greatness.

 

[shoeking2101]

Well to be fair you are going off stats which are viewed and weighed differently by all

That's fine. But what are we going off of if we don't go off of "stats"?

I too see what you are saying with respect to the validity of stats but they are what they are. If you're going to call Bean overrated, then call him overrated in the face of what he's done. You can't argue the production, the success, and how long he's done it. You can't.

 

[CP1708]

CPs spreadsheets

Thank you.

Not sure how a spreadsheet with the top NBA players of all time makes me a president of Kobe fan club, but ok.

Irony being that Laker fans were wanting me dead the past 8 months for speaking out against Kobe. But hey. *shrugs*

 

[sea manup]

bringing up rebounding numbers when comparing kobe to duncan 

what about assists 

 

[hometownhero]

Dudes saying Kobe a role player on teams with Shaq?!

If serious?

Yall doing too much. Getting ****** and still making the 2nd Team All NBA and he a role player. Man, yall crazy. 

 

[shoeking2101]

I rest my case with you.

You conveniently ignore Duncan's defensive domination, rebounding numbers, edge in regular season and Finals MVP (which mean MUCH more than All-Star games) and act like Kobe's career is undisputedly better than Timmy's.

Just like dude posting up his scoring achievements like that proves the point. Too many fans are blinded by scoring. That's only one aspect of the game.

I can post up a litany of Iverson scoring records and feats, it doesn't mean much.

Only Wilt, Bron, Kobe, MJ and Oscar reached 20,000 points before Melo, he'll probably retire with the very similar averages to Kobe....he top 10?

Scoring is just one aspect of all around greatness.

Not ignoring anything. If you're going to go that route then Kobe was a better scorer and playmaker than duncan was. But I'm not going off of anything other than what these guys accomplished. Simply because anything else leaves room for bias.

Stick with the facts.

I'm not even focusing on Kobe's scoring i'm focusing on his career to date fully. When you factor in all he's done, he's been superior than Wilt, Bron, Oscar, Melo, and Duncan.

 

[shoeking2101]

bringing up rebounding numbers when comparing kobe to duncan 

what about assists 

Just mentioned that

 

[goldenchild9]

Kobe is putting up some of the best numbers of his career right now, he's only lost a but of explosiveness but he still has enough physicality to be elite for another 3 years or so.

Look at yourself.

Dude, he's in his 19th season, coming off an achilles and a broken kneecap, and you are trying to spin me he can play til he's 39, years 20-21-22 IN THE NBA.


Be real man.

If he's playing at the level that he's playing this season and slightly lower.

Definitely.

Stop. Just stop. He is no where close to the player he was 2-3 years ago. 99-13 is his 15 year peak. He blew his achilles, and then his knee. He is not the same player, and never will be again.

Stop trying to use his currently tanking team, and his shell of his former self as some sort of indictment on the rest of his career. It's see through, and ESPN worthy of trolling. Which is why you bumped this old *** thread in the first place.

He's had a top 10 career, we've established that, nothing he does now changes any of that.

He's a shell of his former self?...and he has the same averages as his championship years?

You need to cut it out.

 

[shoeking2101]

He's a shell of his former self?...and he has the same averages as his championship years?

You need to cut it out.

But...does he have the same averages as his championship years though ?

 

[CP1708]

He has to be trolling, right?

Calls dude overrated, then in here hypin his play this year for scoring averages and that he can play another 3 full years.

Ignoring the injuries he just returned from, or the lack of defense he can no longer sustain, or even the ability to move like he once did.

 

[dmxfury]

The difficulty of comparing different positions and players. Some value certain stats more than others. Preference and bias always affect how we view and present stats, that was my point. You can yell 'facts' and 'no bias' but there is still a subjective element to statistics. Sometimes the easiest way to compare a career is to think of your favorite team and just ask the simple question of ''which player would I have rather had play their career out for my team'?

Between Kobe and TD, it is TD for me. And I can think of at least a few others in NBA history who I would've rather had. Again thiugh, some are acting like having Kobe a top ten all time is a slight towards him. Hardly

 

[toolazy21]

Because All of those players either don't have Kobe's team success, Kobe's longevity, or his individual success. That's how they fall short. I'm going off of simply facts. And when you factor all of those in, they fall short relative to Kobe. That can't be argued unless you're putting your own bias in.

 Pretty much your argument is, I'm right and if you don't agree your bias 

They absolutely can be argued which is why it's not unanimous that Kobe is a top 3 player of all time. 

 

[dmxfury]

and just to add there are certainly some elements and aspects of the game that aren't recorded as 'stats'. To ignore those is short sighted IMO as well

 

[goldenchild9]

That doesn't mean he's a shell of himself. That's natural. MJ lost a couple steps in 98 too but he wasn't a shell of himself.

You're being dramatic.

And he is clearly overrated when you have people like dude in here screaming that he is top 3 undisputed, others calling him the GOAT, top 5 undisputed etc.

I'm not a hater, I got him in my top 12/13 and he's still playing at an elite level. He just forces too many bad shots and lacks leadership as he always has. He's still a top individual talent in the game today.

But he's not the Best, the second best after MJ, top 3 undisputed, clearly top 5 or even top 10 (my personal opinion, got him around 12) like so many people claim.

 

[sea manup]

The difficulty of comparing different positions and players. Some value certain stats more than others. Preference and bias always affect how we view and present stats, that was my point. You can yell 'facts' and 'no bias' but there is still a subjective element to statistics. Sometimes the easiest way to compare a career is to think of your favorite team and just ask the simple question of ''which player would I have rather had play their career out for my team'?

Between Kobe and TD, it is TD for me. And I can think of at least a few others in NBA history who I would've rather had. Again thiugh, some are acting like having Kobe a top ten all time is a slight towards him. Hardly

everyone has different criteria and values stats in different ways so a no bias evaluation of a players career with your definition of all time great will probably be different from mine

with that being said, a lot of people in here going out of their way making random reasons to hate kobe

i disagree about TD over kobe but i dont think the notion is ludicrous or anything, TD is an amazingly talented and successful player

 

[dmxfury]

I just love the way he plays and as a teammate he seems like the best dude. Just a great player to be the cornerstone of a franchise

 

[tay1]

That doesn't mean he's a shell of himself. That's natural. MJ lost a couple steps in 98 too but he wasn't a shell of himself.

You're being dramatic.

And he is clearly overrated when you have people like dude in here screaming that he is top 3 undisputed, others calling him the GOAT, top 5 undisputed etc.

I'm not a hater, I got him in my top 12/13 and he's still playing at an elite level. He just forces too many bad shots and lacks leadership as he always has. He's still a top individual talent in the game today.

But he's not the Best, the second best after MJ, top 3 undisputed, clearly top 5 or even top 10 (my personal opinion, got him around 12) like so many people claim.

Kobe is undisputed top 10

 

[shoeking2101]

This is dumb. I don't even know why I posted in a Kobe bryant is overrated thread.

How can someone with over 31k points 5 rings and 2 finals mvps be overrated. The ***** put up 27 6 and 6 in his 18th year. Y'all ignorant as hell for entertaining this.

Y'all have fun being stupid, calling Kobe overrated and what not. You can't name 3, let alone 5 guys with a better career than his. But he's overrated. I'm out. Peace. One Love.

 

[dmxfury]

Depending on your definition of overrated the premise of the thread may not be that ludicrous. certainly some outlandish things but all in all it could make sense. Heck Peyton had the same type of thread made for him

 

[seasoned vet]

Yeah, I also have one on NFL QB's, the New England Patriots draft picks, NBA Salaries, the Cubs, the top Movie Box Office, Oscars, and about 25 other spreadsheets.

Would you like to view any of them? PM me your email address and I can send you a couple.

you sound like a real ladykiller

do you keep hardcopies with you as well?

no matter what spreadsheet you have Kobe is still known as a cancer and team killer that no one want to play with

you got a stat for that?