IS KOBE BRYANT...OVERRATED?

[essential1]

Karl Malone feud.

Some were interested in the allure of the Lakers and Phil's success but no one wanted to play with Kobe specifically. Dude gets his nose broken in All-Star games, he's a d-bag only concerned with his individual greatness.

Karl Malone was hitting on his wife...

Ron Artest disagrees with you though

 

[denni5themenace]

oh this again

 

[junglejim]

Those players listed are spot up shooters?
 

Yes Pavlovic, Gibson, Battier, Chalmers are spot up shooters. Varejao got better when Bron left.  Drew Gooden was the same player before and after he left the Cavs.  Eric Snow was a 10 and 7 player before he got to the Cavs and was a 4 and 4 player with the cavs.

Those were flocking to Kobe...or Shaq, Phil and the Lakers championship machine?

Couldn't you make that exact same argument about Lebron?  I didn't see people flocking to play with Lebron before he got 2 other All-Stars on his team.  Now that you mention it, Im pretty sure that's why he left the Cavs is it not?

 

[goldenchild9]

A spot up shooter:





Do you even watch basketball?

Chalmers a spot up shooter? Just because a player can hit a spot up jumper, they're not defined as a spot up shooter.

And even if those players were strictly spot up shooters, a great player makes spot up shooters into more effective weapons on the floor.

You can't do that if you're taking way too many shots, killing team chemistry and offensive flow like Kobe.

 

[goldenchild9]

Karl Malone feud.

Some were interested in the allure of the Lakers and Phil's success but no one wanted to play with Kobe specifically. Dude gets his nose broken in All-Star games, he's a d-bag only concerned with his individual greatness.

Karl Malone was hitting on his wife...

Ron Artest disagrees with you though

Ron Artest also sees the Kings and Bucks in the Finals within the next couple seasons.

Everything he says should be taken with a grain of salt.

 

[junglejim]

A spot up shooter:

Do you even watch basketball?

Chalmers a spot up shooter? Just because a player can hit a spot up jumper, they're not defined as a spot up shooter.

And even if those players were strictly spot up shooters, a great player makes spot up shooters into more effective weapons on the floor.

You can't do that if you're taking way too many shots, killing team chemistry and offensive flow like Kobe.

According to NBA.com 70% of Chalmers shots are around the 3 point area so yes, I would say that qualifies as a spot up shooter.

http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/201596/stats/shooting/?Season=2012-13

Pavlovic was a 40% three point shooter, but hey, you have a youtube video of a dudes highlights so that shows he isn't

The point is are your really making teammates better if you have to find teammates who fit your style of play and the ones that don't have to acquiesce to you?  Are you really helping someone improve by making them more one dimensional?

 

[fontaine]

People saying lebron didn't make wade and bosh better?



Go look at EVERY players field goal percentage before, during, and after lebron.

**** looks like a bell curve.

 

[MVP]

Them having less FGAs with Bron also factors into those numbers as well. See D-Wade. Bron dominates the
ball as well. His usage rate has been right at near the top of the league last 4 years.

 

[junglejim]

People saying lebron didn't make wade and bosh better?

Go look at EVERY players field goal percentage before, during, 36.

Chris Bosh's FG% before he got to the Heat was 51.8%.  The next year it was 49.6%.  Bell Curve

 

Also his 3 pt% was 36.4% before LeBron and 24% the season he went to the heat.

 

[fontaine]

Chris Bosh's FG% before he got to the Heat was 51.8%.  The next year it was 49.6%.  Bell Curve

lol at you forgetting where 2 of his 3 highest FG % seasons came with Lebron, including his career high

Mario Chalmers: highest with bron

Dwade: highest with Bron

Daniel Gibson, highest with lebron

Mo Williams, highest with lebron

Y'all dudes are bugging.

 

[junglejim]

lol at you forgetting where 2 of his 3 highest FG % seasons came with Lebron, including his career high

Mario Chalmers: highest with bron

Dwade: highest with Bron

Daniel Gibson, highest with lebron

Mo Williams, highest with lebron

Y'all dudes are bugging.

Ok, so the next season bosh shot 48.7.  Last season he shot 51.6%

Mo Williams shot 48% before LeBron, 46.7-38.5 with LeBron.

Mario Chalmers 40.1% before LeBron 39.9% when LeBron got there.

Daniel Gibson doesn't show up on espn and im too lazy to look elsewhere

 

 

[fontaine]

Ok, so the next season bosh shot 48.7.  Last season he shot 51.6% and had 2 of his top 3 best fg % seasons including his 1st and 3rd best seasons

Mo Williams shot 48% before LeBron, 46.7-38.5 with LeBron. it dipped 13 basis points, but his 3 pt FG% was a career high. i was looking at the wrong column

Mario Chalmers 40.1% before LeBron 39.9% when LeBron got there. then went on to a career high of 45% twice

Daniel Gibson doesn't show up on espn and im too lazy to look elsewhere  shot a career high and then fell off the plane when bron left

bruh.

fixed


also, cavs and as a team had their best seasons with bron... best pace, offensive efficiency, and field goal %

its all on basketball reference.

you aint gotta like bron... but to say he doesn't make people better... you cant even find flukey stats on that.

 

[fontaine]

i completely forgot about DWADE...

shot his top 3 fg % seasons w/ bron...

 

[denni5themenace]

A spot up shooter:





Do you even watch basketball?

Chalmers a spot up shooter? Just because a player can hit a spot up jumper, they're not defined as a spot up shooter.

And even if those players were strictly spot up shooters, a great player makes spot up shooters into more effective weapons on the floor.

You can't do that if you're taking way too many shots, killing team chemistry and offensive flow like Kobe.

kobe's sasha > lebron's sasha

 

[sea manup]

The Machine 

kobe would only have 3 rings if it wasnt for him 

 

[dmxfury]

Before I can determine if I think he is overrated I need to know his rating to begin with. Someone tell me and then I'll decide

 

[sea manup]

Before I can determine if I think he is overrated I need to know his rating to begin with. Someone tell me and then I'll decide

i would put him somewhere between nick young and clark kent 

 

[goldenchild9]

The premise was that he is top 10 all-time, second best after MJ or the best ever as some delusional fans will offer.

 

[CP1708]

Before I can determine if I think he is overrated I need to know his rating to begin with. Someone tell me and then I'll decide

I can help.

The OP posted an article by a guy saying Kobe was overrated.

A page or two later, someone found another article by the SAME EXACT AUTHOR calling Kobe the best player of the 2000's era.

Same, writer.


As for overall, he's easily had one of the ten best careers in NBA history. Somewhere in the 7-10 range depending on what/how you value.

 

[cedric ceballos]

Hard to view this as impartial and not being agenda driven.

Stuff such as "mr. 30+ shots, and 20+ losses" and "do you even watch basketball" comes across as arguing off emotion.

 

[sea manup]

my personal rankings

people that are clearly above kobe:

kareem

mj

russell

people that can be argued to be better or worse than kobe

magic

bird

duncan

kobe

wilt

lebron (IF he is able to win another chip)

people that are slightly not on the same level as kobe

hakeem

shaq

lebron (if he finishes with 2 rings)

 

[darthska]

Because I'm a Laker fan who frequently posts in the Laker thread, I probably shouldn't post my rankings.

Spoiler

Magic
Shaq
Bird
Iverson
TMac
Jesus
Mike
Duncan
Bron
Kidd
KAJ
Wilt
Dirk
Pierce
Dream
Pip

You take any of those guys and remove them from the way we know them, and give them Phil + a dominant complimentary teammate + shooters for at least 9 years, I believe any of those guys would do as good as 5 chips in 7 tries; I believe some would do better.

 

[Deleted member 37467]

Only 3 players clearly above Kobe?

 

[sea manup]

Because I'm a Laker fan who frequently posts in the Laker thread, I probably shouldn't post my rankings.

Spoiler

Magic
Shaq
Bird
Iverson
TMac
Jesus
Mike
Duncan
Bron
Kidd
KAJ
Wilt
Dirk
Pierce
Dream
Pip

You take any of those guys and remove them from the way we know them, and give them Phil + a dominant complimentary teammate + shooters, I believe any of those guys would do as good as 5 chips in 7 tries; I believe some would do better.

"Phil + a dominant complimentary teammate + shooter"

so would you say the same thing about jordan then? 

 

[darthska]

Not sure where you're going w/ this, but Phil + Pip + shooters = 6 Finals w/ 6 FMVPs, and no Finals losses.