IS KOBE BRYANT...OVERRATED?

[iamjusayn]

how are you sure of this?

Come on guy! It's all hypothetical. It's what I feel would go down.

Jordan played second fiddle at UNC. Jordan would pass in the clutch if it was the correct Basketball play. Jordan really wasn't that selfish. Jordan had to carry those teams on his back.

I keep trying to tell ppl this. People always want to put extras on it mainly because of Jordan's early years on boo boo teams n he had to carry the whole load.

Reminds me also of my other point that bryant will end his career similar to how Mike began his.

 

[sea manup]

Shaqs fg% would skyrocket to like 75% or sth though

His offensive reb would go down because more of mjs shots would go in

And i believe mj would yell at him and make his ft% higher and he wouldn't have to shoot as many

Hack a shaq wouldn't exist

so after all these years of trying everything to become a better ft shooter, all shaq really needed was for jordan to yell at him?

i bet playing with jordan on the dream team cured magic of his HIV

 

[sea manup]

how are you sure of this?

Come on guy! It's all hypothetical. It's what I feel would go down.

Jordan played second fiddle at UNC. Jordan would pass in the clutch if it was the correct Basketball play. Jordan really wasn't that selfish. Jordan had to carry those teams on his back.

I keep trying to tell ppl this. People always want to put extras on it mainly because of Jordan's early years on boo boo teams n he had to carry the whole load.

Reminds me also of my other point that bryant will end his career similar to how Mike began his.

exactly so its what you think would happen not what would happen for sure 100% chance no room for error, nothing wrong with your opinion just dont speak in absolutes when its a hypothetical situation

 

[quik1987]

I think one of the reasons shaqs ft% is so bad is because he was the alpha

No one could or had the balls to say **** to him.

 

[darthska]

Shaqs fg% would skyrocket to like 75% or sth though

His offensive reb would go down because more of mjs shots would go in

And i believe mj would yell at him and make his ft% higher and he wouldn't have to shoot as many

Hack a shaq wouldn't exist

Shaq wouldn't be fat

Yeah, you and I are on the same side of the Kobe fence, but we definitely set up camp different.

Because you're way out of pocket with all this.

MJ would yell Shaq into improving his FT%, successfully demand that he improve both his FG% and lower his body fat, and of course be ok w/ being second fiddle (since we both agree MJ would be FMVP); that would all go down?

Way out of line with that one. You're misremembering that Shaq, or you just weren't paying attention (which would make sense considering you hate the Lakers).

*edit* Nah, man... it ain't that no one had the balls to say nothing to him; it's that he was one of those "Can't tell me nothing" types. Nobody... not Kobe, not Phil, not 1992 MJ... nobody was yelling that dude into submission.

 

[sea manup]

I think one of the reasons shaqs ft% is so bad is because he was the alpha

No one could or had the balls to say **** to him.

but you have said in the past that its all kobes fault for breaking up the kobe shaq lakers... how did he do it if he didnt have the balls to say anything to shaq?

 

[quik1987]

But he was the "can't tell me nothing" type cause he was the alpha.

Same reason why he got fat

Didn't Jordan use to crucify Horace Grant for being a fat ***?

Did he not chew out all his teammates in practice and get the best out of them?

 

[quik1987]

I think one of the reasons shaqs ft% is so bad is because he was the alpha


No one could or had the balls to say **** to him.

but you have said in the past that its all kobes fault for breaking up the kobe shaq lakers... how did he do it if he didnt have the balls to say anything to shaq?

He cried to the front office, and they sided with him, cause they though Kobe was the future.

 

[sea manup]

i also never understood why people say that shaq was "fat" by playoff time he was always in prime basketball shape and when he went to miami and they actually made him lose body fat he ended up getting hurt easier (its in his book)

 

[sea manup]

I think one of the reasons shaqs ft% is so bad is because he was the alpha


No one could or had the balls to say **** to him.

but you have said in the past that its all kobes fault for breaking up the kobe shaq lakers... how did he do it if he didnt have the balls to say anything to shaq?

He cried to the front office, and they sided with him, cause they though Kobe was the future.

jerry buss making the right choice 

 

[quik1987]

Kobe would have more rings if he played with Shaq a couple seasons longer

 

[darthska]

We all know the stories of how he berated folks like HoGrant and Wennington and Cartwright.

I've honestly never heard any stories of him stepping to Pippen or Rodman like that. I'm not saying he was afraid; I'm saying, I think he respected they were good... no, GREAT... at something, so he just let them cook.

But them other average dudes, he'd cuss them up one side of the street and down the other. Because they were average dudes.

Shaq... early 00s... not so average. No part of me buys that MJ would have berated him into doing ANYTHING different. Shaq was who he was because that's who he was, and my team was all the better for it, no doubt. But the personality he displays even now on TNT, always 'Me, me, me,' gets all hot under the collar when he's made fun of (whereas Chuck and Kenny get made fun of all the time, and they just laugh it off)... that personality was there in the early 00s as well; he didn't just develop it since retirement.

He wasn't the "Can't tell me nothing" type because he was the alpha; they are unrelated.

He was that way because that's his personality; he was the alpha because he was dominant.

 

[Jordan8]

jerry buss making the right choice 

The right choice would be to keep both and tell them to suck it up.

They sucked for a minute after Shaq left....they had to draft another "7 footer" and pull off the crime I mean trade of the century to give Kobe another ship.

Crying like a diva and demanding a trade because he "needed help" after getting rid of "the help" years earlier

They could have saved money and won more ships if Buss (RIP) would have just told both parties to **** and play ball.

Keeping both was the right choice.

 

[sea manup]

Kobe would have more rings if he played with Shaq a couple seasons longer

yeah, and shaq would have more rings if he played with kobe a couple seasons longer. whats your point?

 

[quik1987]

Kobe would have more rings if he played with Shaq a couple seasons longer

yeah, and shaq would have more rings if he played with kobe a couple seasons longer. whats your point?

So the Lakers took the L and it wasn't the right choice

 

[sb]

I might need your help here, stay with me a minute.

Everyone, don't blow up. Stay cool. This is a legit, honest question, no one go crazy. Think, and speak honestly.


All the jokes the last few pages, everyone trolling around, here's a real one.

Take Mike, PRIME Mike, and drop him in LA 2000-02 with Shaq. PRIME Shaq.

Does Shaq drive the bus, or does Mike? IE, Finals MVP with Shaq and Mike, would Mike still get all the hardware, or does Shaq?

93 Mike on 2000 LA with Shaq.

What do you guys think?


I kind of think Mike would get or even average triple doubles, but Shaq would still be in the 30/14/4 range, Mike's points would come down, but his other numbers would go, Rondoish type 24/12/13 type averages. I'm talkin 93 Mike, not 98. By then he was fading (for him) as a player, but that Suns series, Mike was flat out stupid.


Ska, Allen, Trust, Nako, quik, what do you guys think? In real terms, what would that combo look like, numbers wise?

shaq would win mvp. prime shaq was too dominant.

 

[quik1987]

Kobe would have more rings if he played with Shaq a couple seasons longer

yeah, and shaq would have more rings if he played with kobe a couple seasons longer. whats your point?

So the Lakers took the L and it wasn't the right choice

keeping them both was not an option so when choosing between kobe and shaq they made the right choice. can i talk to an adult or at least a highschooler about this? its really not that hard to understand

I'm not the only one that has said that.

Resort to name calling though, very mature.

 

[CP1708]

People that think Kobe and Shaq would have won MORE than where they finished at 4-5, are just......

You people have literally no ******g idea what you are talking about.

NONE.


Guys, Shaq was ******g DONE 2.5 years after he left. He was DONE.

His first year in Miami was solid.
His second year they won the title*
His third year they were SWEPT IN THE FIRST ******G ROUNDDDDDDDDDD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

IT WAS OVER. Shaq, had done all that he could. They were NOT winning 6-7-8 titles had he stayed. It would NOT have happened.

What you are asking is not for 2000 Shaq to play 100 games per season, you would be asking 35 and 36 year old, 350 pound Shaq to play 100 games per season.

MULTIPLE TIMES.


Could they have gotten 4 together? Yes. They could have. Maybe in 05, or maybe in 06. But they were not going to win with Shaq's advancing age, weight, and contract adding up. That was absolutely, NOT happening.

Why, and I mean honestly, WHY the **** do you people not get that thru your God damn thick skulls? Why is it so hard to grasp?

Miami TRADED Shaq 3 years after getting him. Do you freaking people only remember the 2000 Finals or something? Is it so difficult to use your brain, you can't function without the answers already in your face?

The best chance they would have had to get 4-5-6 would have been to improve the roster in 2003 KNOWING they were going for a 4-peat, something not done since the league was 10 teams and only one playoff round per season. (60's Celtics) That 03 roster was on FUMES. Had they improved it, maybe they sneak an added one in there.

Get knocked out in 04, regroup, longer offseason, maybe Shaq tries to get in shape for a final run, and MAYBE they try to get #5 and somehow get a 6, but I highly highly doubt that would be possible. Shaq was not Scottie, or Mike, or Kobe. Guys in prime shape at all times. Shaq took a pounding, every game of his life, and was wearing down big time. You guys thinking it would be so easy to add another 1-2 Finals runs into June absolutely do not get the NBA, at all. It takes a tremendous toll on a team to play in June 2-3 years straight, to ask for another 2-3 is just plain being ridiculous.

I wish someday people would figure that out. It's incredibly insulting to watch so many people say stupid garbage like "oh, they shoulda won 3 more, they could have easy" Yeah, cuz winning just 1 is soooooo easy, winning 3 is a downright breeze.

 

[al3xis]

See, I think they could have if you also include/pretend that they would be on good terms - if they had a solid relationship I do not see the 2004 team being strained to the point that they don't take care of the Pistons. And then they could have won in '05 or '06 while Shaq takes on a lesser role and Kobe hits his individual peak. (Kobe was/is/always will be superior to Wade) also while adding better/younger parts to the roster.

They could have definitely got to 5 in my mind. 6 is a reach but not totally improbable..

 

[CP1708]

One last thing on Shaq/Mike.

Could they have co-exsisted?

Would MJ be ok with Shaq taking months off, etc? Or would they have worn on each other?

Shaq feuded with everyone he played with, Penny, Kobe, Wade, Nash. Not early, but all at the end. Would that have happened with Mike?

 

[mister friendly]

jerry buss making the right choice 

The right choice would be to keep both and tell them to suck it up.

They sucked for a minute after Shaq left....they had to draft another "7 footer" and pull off the crime I mean trade of the century to give Kobe another ship.

Crying like a diva and demanding a trade because he "needed help" after getting rid of "the help" years earlier

They could have saved money and won more ships if Buss (RIP) would have just told both parties to **** and play ball.

Keeping both was the right choice.

Revisionist history

Kobe and Shaq could not co-exist anymore. What dont you nderstand about this?

Also stop acting like getting Gasol was the trade of the centuy

Gasol went one All Star game before Kobe

 

[alphawolf]

Remember this quote from kobe.

"we're all surrounded by idiots"

lol

and this thread is an example 

 

[CP1708]

See, I think they could have if you also include/pretend that they would be on good terms - if they had a solid relationship I do not see the 2004 team being strained to the point that they don't take care of the Pistons. And then they could have won in '05 or '06 while Shaq takes on a lesser role and Kobe hits his individual peak. (Kobe was/is/always will be superior to Wade) also while adding better/younger parts to the roster.

They could have definitely got to 5 in my mind. 6 is a reach but not totally improbable..

That's the point tho, Kobe/LA has 5. These dudes in here sayin it would be more than 5 if Shaq stayed. 6 wasn't happenin. Unless they started in 99 when Shaq was younger, got to 5 in 04 and went for 2 more years to get 1. But that's erasing tons of stuff. Phil's year off, lockout, etc.

 

[nako xl]

Shaq's apex > Kobe's. Kobe's longevity > Shaq's. two guys can BOTH be great.

I might need your help here, stay with me a minute.

Everyone, don't blow up. Stay cool. This is a legit, honest question, no one go crazy. Think, and speak honestly.


All the jokes the last few pages, everyone trolling around, here's a real one.

Take Mike, PRIME Mike, and drop him in LA 2000-02 with Shaq. PRIME Shaq.

Does Shaq drive the bus, or does Mike? IE, Finals MVP with Shaq and Mike, would Mike still get all the hardware, or does Shaq?

93 Mike on 2000 LA with Shaq.

What do you guys think?


I kind of think Mike would get or even average triple doubles, but Shaq would still be in the 30/14/4 range, Mike's points would come down, but his other numbers would go, Rondoish type 24/12/13 type averages. I'm talkin 93 Mike, not 98. By then he was fading (for him) as a player, but that Suns series, Mike was flat out stupid.


Ska, Allen, Trust, Nako, quik, what do you guys think? In real terms, what would that combo look like, numbers wise?

Shaq is one of the most dominant players in history.  And in the triangle at his peak (2000-2001)?  Jordan woulda put up numbers, but Shaq was just unstoppable the first two years of that three-peat and Jackson always said he wanted a center in Chicago to play through.  Shaq still gets the MVP trophies and accolades.

 

[denni5themenace]

Kobe would have more rings if he played with Shaq a couple seasons longer

yeah, and shaq would have more rings if he played with kobe a couple seasons longer. whats your point?

So the Lakers took the L and it wasn't the right choice

only in a kobe is overrated thread will you see people criticize the lakers front office and maintain they didn't make the right choice of keeping shaq eem after the lakers reached the finals 3 times and winning 2 within the 7 years of shaq being traded