DC Studios THREAD - GunnVerse Begins - The Penguin out 9/19 then every Sunday on MAX

Fresh Like Will said:
I don't see how this is a "bad" movie though. I'm someone who prefers Marvel's characters and stories way more than DC and I really enjoyed this film. And if we're just going on films in general and removing the comic book superhero aspect, it's nowhere near as bad as actual bad films are.

From the outside looking in, it looks like DC was in a no-win situation. If you guys wanted good for the franchise, it's definitely hard to tell. You want an actual bad movie, watch Jack and Jill with Adam Sandler.
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because the franchise it comes with naturally comes with higher expecations than an adam sandler movie

i dont care if an adam sander movie or michael bay transformers movie is terrible, I never expected them to be good 

batman v superman has potential to be one of the greatest superhero movies ever just because of the characters involved. because of this it's not just a bad movie but an offensively bad movie.

same with the starwars prequels. I really dont care if jupiter ascending is bad, i fully expected that movie to be bad. but the star wars prequels had real potential to add another great chapter to an already legendary franchise. so, liked BvS when the prequels were complete garbage it was so much more disappointing than your average january throw away movie being garbage because it is wasted potential for a great movie. 
 
SNKRFollower said:
Nah. Here's the deal: Marvel started the MCU with Iron Man while DC was in the middle of a planned Nolan Bat trilogy. Marvel fans pee'd themselves with excitement (and rightfully so), and ALL comics fans were pumped to see whole crossover story-arcs planned for multiple movies. Meanwhile, Marvel released more than their share of terrible movies, too: IM 2 & 3, Thor 2 (and Tom Hiddleston rescues Thor 1 from being trash, too), and honestly, I thought Avengers AoU wasn't all that great either. But people don't rip them apart because they're "fun" and take place in the daytime, I suppose. They're all pretty vapid, very repetitive and are doing their best to drag out the Thanos angle for so long that nobody even cares about him anymore.

However, as soon as MoS was announced and word got out that a DCCU was going to be launched, a lot of people (and I'll say especially Marvel fans) started criticizing WB and DC for trying to "copy" Marvel's plans. And then when the movies turned out to be more "dark & gritty" the complaints were amplified by the mainstream film critics who are basing their reviews in the context of "light & fun" Marvel movies. And then the Marvel fans take to forum boards in droves to bash the DC films over and over and over again.

Do the DC movies have flaws - of course they do. All movies do, including all of the Marvel movies. I love IM 1, but honestly, it gets slow in the second half, and like I said 2 & 3 blow. The Thor movies are pretty boring, and the supporting characters around Thor & Loki are pretty useless (including Natalie Portman, who stinks in these movies, and Idris Elba who is woefully underused). GotG was really good, and was a great change of pace from the rest of the repetitive Marvel movies. Ant Man was pretty good, but most of that is because of Paul Rudd and the sidekicks. The story was pretty dumb. The Cap movies are great, especially the first one. Avengers 1 was good as an action movie, but had no story and a pretty weak "bad guy" (Loki and his swarm of invading aliens). Ultron was a good character in Avengers 2, as he increased his awareness, but holy crap the movie was a total slog, with an even sloggier 20 minute "Hey look, Hawkeye has a family" break in the middle.

My point is, DC fans (or at least me and my friends who are also DC fans) don't go online to attack the Marvel movies for DAYS after they release, and don't keep hammering on them after that, even if we really fon't like them. But Marvel fans do. They don't just say "Eh, the movie was slow, I still don't like Lois and Eisenberg stinks as Lex." They go after the people who say the do like it by calling out their integrity as cinephiles and trying to force them to defend WHY they like the movies. FOH with that crap. I say I like BvS and all the sudden I must be Zack Snyder, or I'm just a fanboy, or I don't know good movies. Because someone else doesn't like the movie's "pacing" or "editing."

Meanwhile the movie (just like MoS) is gonna make a buttload of money, and so too will the rest of the DCCU movies. And on top of that, the DCTVU shows are enormous, while AoS is dull as hell and Agent Carter stunk up its second season so badly it won't be renewed. However, boy do people just love the "dark & gritty" Netflix shows, huh? The ones that always take place at night, and where the hero breaks the villain's neck at the end? And take 10-13 hrs to tell a single story.

It's just obnoxious to have people constantly rag on something I actually DO like over and over and over again. Don't like the movie? Cool, man. Tell us why you didn't like it and then go watch something else. Hop on out and maybe pop back in after you watch the next movie. But this movie is making HUGE $$$ and has a 75% fan approval on RT. 3 outta 4 people who saw it liked it. I'm gonna go see it at least one more time.

So don't try to presume why I don't dislike the film. Dislike it yourself, but let the people who do like it, like it. You do you, let us do us.
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Bruh , this analysis is spot on. I agree 100%
 
It sounds like BVS's main problem is trying to do too much in it's limited runtime and (again) it's portrayal of Supes. Which I completely understand, but I still don't agree with it being a 30% movie. That's just over-exaggeration. It sounds like an unfair grading curve. It's either perfect or deplorable. :stoneface:

I understood everyone's motives except for Lex. His character to me was the only one who just seemed to be angry for no reason. Lex was also the character that was going to be hard for me to like from the get-go.
 
Fresh Like Will said:
It sounds like BVS's main problem is trying to do too much in it's limited runtime and (again) it's portrayal of Supes. Which I completely understand, but I still don't agree with it being a 30% movie. That's just over-exaggeration. It sounds like an unfair grading curve. It's either perfect or deplorable.
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I understood everyone's motives except for Lex. His character to me was the only one who just seemed to be angry for no reason. Lex was also the character that was going to be hard for me to like from the get-go.
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what were superman's motives?

batman spends the entire movie preping for superman and superman spends the entire movie trying to get articles written about this bat character. they are both supposed to be smart logical dudes, yet in the two confrontations they have with eachother before they fight they refuse to talk at all. then "martha" and they are suddenly bffs.

all that fighting because of a misunderstanding, nothing to do with the two core ideologies that these two characters represent.

now if you look at a studio that knows how to write quality screenplays, you have cap and iron man fighting because they understand each other's position fully yet after all the talking they still cant see eye to eye. THAT is real motivation that addresses the core values of both characters, its why people in the marvel thread type essays on who's right and who's wrong which side are you on. 

none of that happens for this movie because the plot is so empty, the character motivations are so shallow. do you agree with batman or do you side with superman? I dont side with either because they both don't have a defined position on an even more undefined problem. 
 
and to clarify, the average critic rating is 5/10

30% just means 70% of critics thought the movie was trash, not that they thought it was 3/10 of a movie 
 
amel223 said:
I think you've missed the point of what I was trying to say. Marvel fans do criticize their own movies. We nitpick our movies to death and we argue among ourselves in our movie thread all the time. It's not really circle jerk in there nor do we always put our movies on a pedestal. Guys like OKB and Zik or Semanup, when they heavily criticize a DC movie, they're not doing anything different that they wouldn't do if they see flaws in a Marvel movie. I think that's just cuz the Marvel universe has already launched. Marvel has already put out a line of movies consistently so it ain't no thing if a particular movie gets picked apart. Once the DCU verse gets to that point, it'll be the same with you guys. No being defensive ej. ''You guys are marvel fanboys! ' 'Quit trolling us!' Instead of whining, it'll be 'I highly disagree. Here's why...' It'll just be back and forth with arguments and counterarguments instead of defaulting to 'Let us do you. We'll do us Let us live. Why you a hater.'
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Gotcha. That makes sense. My problem is this: I came in here last night and was posting til 2am why I liked the movie (and yes, defending it from some of the criticisms that I felt were misplaced). I come back this afternoon and the same dudes who had already slagged the movie last night (and for god knows how long before that) are STILL going on and on and on. It's like cool, we get it, you (not you personally, the rhetorical "royal you") didn't like it, and you explained why (pace, characters, editing, whatever). I don't get what leads to someone go ham for 24 hrs+ about something they don't like. I know if I rant about something once I feel the catharsis of venting my frustration. I don't hang around in a thread posting repeatedly about it. I mean, if I hated something THAT much, I'd take the time to direct my criticisms toward the filmmakers themselves, not at dudes posting on a sub-sub-thread of a sneaker community forum board. Just seems like a weird thing to do IMO.
 
sea manup said:
what were superman's motives?

batman spends the entire movie preping for superman and superman spends the entire movie trying to get articles written about this bat character. they are both supposed to be smart logical dudes, yet in the two confrontations they have with eachother before they fight they refuse to talk at all. then "martha" and they are suddenly bffs.

all that fighting because of a misunderstanding, nothing to do with the two core ideologies that these two characters represent.

now if you look at a studio that knows how to write quality screenplays, you have cap and iron man fighting because they understand each other's position fully yet after all the talking they still cant see eye to eye. THAT is real motivation that addresses the core values of both characters, its why people in the marvel thread type essays on who's right and who's wrong which side are you on. 

none of that happens for this movie because the plot is so empty, the character motivations are so shallow. do you agree with batman or do you side with superman? I dont side with either because they both don't have a defined position on an even more undefined problem. 
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Batman 100% explained his reasoning for wanting to kill Superman. Completely laid it out. Based off his conclusion, there was no discussion to be had. Superman didn't actually want to fight and actually did try to have a conversation until he was put in survival mode. Why do you keep bringing up the irrelevant Avengers example?
 
 
I think you've missed the point of what I was trying to say. Marvel fans do criticize their own movies. We nitpick our movies to death and we argue among ourselves in our movie thread all the time. It's not really circle jerk in there nor do we always put our movies on a pedestal. Guys like OKB and Zik or Semanup, when they heavily criticize a DC movie, they're not doing anything different that they wouldn't do if they see flaws in a Marvel movie. I think that's just cuz the Marvel universe has already launched. Marvel has already put out a line of movies consistently so it ain't no thing if a particular movie gets picked apart. Once the DCU verse gets to that point, it'll be the same with you guys. No being defensive ej. ''You guys are marvel fanboys! ' 'Quit trolling us!' Instead of whining, it'll be 'I highly disagree. Here's why...' It'll just be back and forth with arguments and counterarguments instead of defaulting to 'Let us do you. We'll do us Let us live. Why you a hater.'
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Gotcha. That makes sense. My problem is this: I came in here last night and was posting til 2am why I liked the movie (and yes, defending it from some of the criticisms that I felt were misplaced). I come back this afternoon and the same dudes who had already slagged the movie last night (and for god knows how long before that) are STILL going on and on and on. It's like cool, we get it, you (not you personally, the rhetorical "royal you") didn't like it, and you explained why (pace, characters, editing, whatever). I don't get what leads to someone go ham for 24 hrs+ about something they don't like. I know if I rant about something once I feel the catharsis of venting my frustration. I don't hang around in a thread posting repeatedly about it. I mean, if I hated something THAT much, I'd take the time to direct my criticisms toward the filmmakers themselves, not at dudes posting on a sub-sub-thread of a sneaker community forum board. Just seems like a weird thing to do IMO.
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Evolution Fight said:
Master Zik said:
Yall dudes are just sour at this point.
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the exact thing can be said about the people in here nitpicking every little insignificant thing.
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Nah they seem pretty energetic and playful about it. It's like they hate what Snyder did so much they're laughing about it now.
Post your review and move on
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You should stick to comment sections then.

This is a discussion forum. If you don't' want to discuss though, don't. Complaining about those that do is *** backwards.
 
I think the nitpicking is a bit much. It has felt a bit like a bash fest in here. Just saying.

Probably because I don't think the movie was half as bad as people are saying. I just spent a good half hour watching Daredevil. Now that is a bad superhero movie.:lol:

I really don't get if people rate movies against one another or in a vacuum based on expectations. It's all expectation with this movie. This movie was better than TDKR IMO.
 
mgrand15 said:
 
sea manup said:
what were superman's motives?

batman spends the entire movie preping for superman and superman spends the entire movie trying to get articles written about this bat character. they are both supposed to be smart logical dudes, yet in the two confrontations they have with eachother before they fight they refuse to talk at all. then "martha" and they are suddenly bffs.

all that fighting because of a misunderstanding, nothing to do with the two core ideologies that these two characters represent.

now if you look at a studio that knows how to write quality screenplays, you have cap and iron man fighting because they understand each other's position fully yet after all the talking they still cant see eye to eye. THAT is real motivation that addresses the core values of both characters, its why people in the marvel thread type essays on who's right and who's wrong which side are you on. 

none of that happens for this movie because the plot is so empty, the character motivations are so shallow. do you agree with batman or do you side with superman? I dont side with either because they both don't have a defined position on an even more undefined problem. 
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Batman 100% explained his reasoning for wanting to kill Superman. Completely laid it out. Based off his conclusion, there was no discussion to be had. Superman didn't actually want to fight and actually did try to have a conversation until he was put in survival mode. Why do you keep bringing up the irrelevant Avengers example?
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"if there is even a 1% chance we have to treat it as an absolute certainty" 
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if that passes for a legitimate reason for you then good for you. I think it's terrible writing that doesnt make much sense.

and two movies from two iconic franchises about their two headlining heros fighting eachother are coming out in the span of 2 months. of course the two movies are going to be compared. but regardless of that, anything brought up as an example of why something can be better is relevant, as it is an example of how it is possible to tell a good story with many of the same elements. "that's irrelevant" is just lazy talk for people who are not capable of articulating coherent counterpoints. 
 
Superman's motivations are a result of Batman's fear and concerns and Lex's puppeteering. Batman initiates the fight. Batman saw two aliens fight and wasn't confident that the winner couldn't be a potential threat to humanity. Historically Batman has always had trust issues. This is the same guy who made a contingency plan to neutralize every member of the Justice League. His damn teammates.

Batman did change his tune very fast. I agree. I took it like he just had an epiphany after Lois explained what Supes was trying to say when Lex had Ma Kent.
 
I also think the other problem is that people are mistaking bashing of the movie and bashing of Snyder for bashing of DC.
 
HarlemToTheBronx said:
I think the nitpicking is a bit much. It has felt a bit like a bash fest in here. Just saying.

Probably because I don't think the movie was half as bad as people are saying. I just spent a good half hour watching Daredevil. Now that is a bad superhero movie.:lol:

I really don't get if people rate movies against one another or in a vacuum based on expectations. It's all expectation with this movie. This movie was better than TDKR IMO.
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One of the guys talking **** hasn't even seen it yet.

2 others were predicting doom and gloom for months.

I mean..... :lol:

We predicted it would be this way, it is.

Just read Manup say IM3 was a better movie. When Stark ditched his bulletproof suit in favor of a hoodie and some water balloons.

That was better than this, tho. :lol:
 
sea manup said:
mgrand15 said:
 
sea manup said:
what were superman's motives?


batman spends the entire movie preping for superman and superman spends the entire movie trying to get articles written about this bat character. they are both supposed to be smart logical dudes, yet in the two confrontations they have with eachother before they fight they refuse to talk at all. then "martha" and they are suddenly bffs.


all that fighting because of a misunderstanding, nothing to do with the two core ideologies that these two characters represent.


now if you look at a studio that knows how to write quality screenplays, you have cap and iron man fighting because they understand each other's position fully yet after all the talking they still cant see eye to eye. THAT is real motivation that addresses the core values of both characters, its why people in the marvel thread type essays on who's right and who's wrong which side are you on. 


none of that happens for this movie because the plot is so empty, the character motivations are so shallow. do you agree with batman or do you side with superman? I dont side with either because they both don't have a defined position on an even more undefined problem. 
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Batman 100% explained his reasoning for wanting to kill Superman. Completely laid it out. Based off his conclusion, there was no discussion to be had. Superman didn't actually want to fight and actually did try to have a conversation until he was put in survival mode. Why do you keep bringing up the irrelevant Avengers example?
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"if there is even a 1% chance we have to treat it as an absolute certainty" :rofl:

if that passes for a legitimate reason for you then good for you. I think it's terrible writing that doesnt make much sense.


and two movies from two iconic franchises about their two headlining heros fighting eachother are coming out in the span of 2 months. of course the two movies are going to be compared. but regardless of that, anything brought up as an example of why something can be better is relevant, as it is an example of how it is possible to tell a good story with many of the same elements. "that's irrelevant" is just lazy talk for people who are not capable of articulating coherent counterpoints. 
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Not when the complaints seem a bit over the top. I mean we were discussing why Batman shot a tracker on the van for like a page.:lol:

I think the Death of Superman stuff was dumb. It was way too early. I can respect nitpicking something like that.

Nitpicking Batmans motivations, though? They gave us a good half hour of Bruce running around watching his friends and employees die. Do we really not get why Batman wants Superman dead at this point?

I feel like Batman was the only one with a legitimate motivation.
 
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Fresh Like Will said:
Superman's motivations are a result of Batman's fear and concerns and Lex's puppeteering. Batman initiates the fight. Batman saw two aliens fight and wasn't confident that the winner couldn't be a potential threat to humanity. Historically Batman has always had trust issues. This is the same guy who made a contingency plan to neutralize every member of the Justice League. His damn teammates.

Batman did change his tune very fast. I agree. I took it like he just had an epiphany after Lois explained what Supes was trying to say when Lex had Ma Kent.
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sure, but what are his motivations?

like from begging to end of this movie, what did superman want what was he trying to accomplish? 

IF HE HAS TRUST ISSUES WHY DOES HE INSTANTLY TRUST WW AND GIVE HER ALL THE SUPERHERO FILES??
 
1% chance, treat it as absolute certainty is perfect reasoning from a weathered 20 year vet of crime fighting and protection.

If there is a 1% chance someone can rob you blind, lock your doors.

Keeping the world safe, from a God, little more dangerous 1% than protecting your tv's and dishes.

But yeah, terrible writing, sure.
 
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