The 2014-2015 NBA Season Thread. Lock It Up Please: The Golden State Warriors Are The Champions
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keel252
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How can the jury still be out on a 6-6 guy who sets up and gets his team in the offense. I mean the kid avg 16, 6 & 6. Where is this so called jury?
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I love analytics in basketball. I need to know the speed in which players run and how it correlates to the in-arena temperature by the start of the 3rd quarter.
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Some of the analytics are good, but I'd rather go by the eye test first.
They did lose me when they said JJ redick was a ball stopper thoigh.
They did lose me when they said JJ redick was a ball stopper thoigh.
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While I think MCW is quite good and has a bright future, he does have questions in regards to his finishing ability, perimeter shooting and just how good he is because he IS using a lot of possessions inefficiently to get his 16, 6 and 6.
But context is everything. See below.
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Ehhh. Makes sense to me.
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do work son
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Technically.... He is. Only because his role odd to catch and shoot lol
everysingletime
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Advanced stats only work in combination with the eye test.
If you go by advanced metrics alone then nash's suns were a great defensive team and James Harden shoots great from the field
(there was an article once that actually argued that the suns played great D if you accounted for pace, and harden's going to the line skews everything)
If you go by advanced metrics alone then nash's suns were a great defensive team and James Harden shoots great from the field
(there was an article once that actually argued that the suns played great D if you accounted for pace, and harden's going to the line skews everything)
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keel252
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all things he can get better at...i thought somebody was gonna say hes too slow to guard pgs or he cant create for himself or others.
kid is a fulltime 1 in the nba.
lawdog1
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No, but what does that have to do with someone saying now that he's not going to be a good player? I'm failing to see the connection.
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In regards to the SSOL Suns, they were always been painted middle of pack defensively in advanced stats like Def Rtg.
As for Harden, he's a great from the field (eFG%, not to be confused with TS%) because he shoots about 40% of his shots are from the most efficient areas on the floor, the three point line and basket area each and he converts them at a league average rate.
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You're such a stat nerd PMatic 
I like it though.
I like it though.
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Funny thing is I hated math in school.
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But we can both agree that catch and shooting doesn't equal ball stopping. It's the position the coach puts you in. The original stat was putting Klay and JJ in the same breath as the carmelo Anthony's of the world.
lawdog1
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Since I don't really pay attention to advanced analytics, I have a question. How often do what the analytics say diverge that significantly from what the eye test tells us? The same players/teams that look to the eye like the best in the game also usually measure pretty favorably in statistical categories, right?
big j 33
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As for per 36, sure sometimes it's interesting to try to predict future numbers from young guys who are only getting limited minutes... but don't most use per 36 as a way of comparing players?
Player A is a starter but averages 34 minutes a game... Player B is a starter who averages 38 minutes a game. So you use per 36 as a way of fairly comparing their stats. Obviously it's not perfect, but that's how I use it.
There's a compromise to be had. You don't have to sound like the old fogies on Open Court when it comes to advanced stats. You also don't have to be a "stat nerd" who tries to predict and analyze the entire game simply by the numbers. Advanced stats have served a purpose in team building, in scouting, in evaluating, and in enjoying basketball. Some things just make logical sense. Rebounding or assists, for example, the simple box scores don't account for pace, numbers of shots, etc.. So obviously a player who is in a faster system or who plays for a team that shoots a low % will have more opportunities for rebounds. So you look at rebounding % for a different way of comparing rebounds because the traditional stats might not tell the whole story.
Player A is a starter but averages 34 minutes a game... Player B is a starter who averages 38 minutes a game. So you use per 36 as a way of fairly comparing their stats. Obviously it's not perfect, but that's how I use it.
There's a compromise to be had. You don't have to sound like the old fogies on Open Court when it comes to advanced stats. You also don't have to be a "stat nerd" who tries to predict and analyze the entire game simply by the numbers. Advanced stats have served a purpose in team building, in scouting, in evaluating, and in enjoying basketball. Some things just make logical sense. Rebounding or assists, for example, the simple box scores don't account for pace, numbers of shots, etc.. So obviously a player who is in a faster system or who plays for a team that shoots a low % will have more opportunities for rebounds. So you look at rebounding % for a different way of comparing rebounds because the traditional stats might not tell the whole story.
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lawdog1
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Jamal Crawford weighs in --
Jamal Crawford @JCrossover 11h11 hours ago
Watching " open court" I'm more of a fan of the eye test vs analytics..
Jamal Crawford @JCrossover 11h11 hours ago
Watching " open court" I'm more of a fan of the eye test vs analytics..
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do work son
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antidope
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Does anyone really expect a player/former player to say otherwise? The eye test is all they know and just how they've always done it.
This conversation is also going in two different directions. Some people are talking about which is better between the two and some people are saying that analytics are worthless
This conversation is also going in two different directions. Some people are talking about which is better between the two and some people are saying that analytics are worthless
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I won't say it is crap, but it can't be the only thing tat is used. #'s never tell the full story. There are intangibles that cannot be measured, only observed.
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why does it have to be eye test vs analytics? why can't people understand analytics is just another method to help out the team's strategy
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They almost lost me when they said Mike Conley was one of the best ISO scorers in the league.
Dude was in the middle of the pack in terms of attempts. it's about context.
I do, however like the advanced shot charts and what synergy offers.
Dude was in the middle of the pack in terms of attempts. it's about context.
I do, however like the advanced shot charts and what synergy offers.
lawdog1
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Jamal Crawford weighs in --
Jamal Crawford @JCrossover 11h11 hours ago
Watching " open court" I'm more of a fan of the eye test vs analytics..
Yeah, I'd figure @JCrossover isn't a big beneficiary of analytics. Whether he knows that or not, I couldn't say. But he probably does.
Jamal Crawford @JCrossover 11h11 hours ago
Watching " open court" I'm more of a fan of the eye test vs analytics..
The irony
Yeah, I'd figure @JCrossover isn't a big beneficiary of analytics. Whether he knows that or not, I couldn't say. But he probably does.
lawdog1
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What? That was real? I thought BHZ just made that up.
do work son
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All stats are about context though. You can really skew **** depending on how you frame it all
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