STAY/GET BACK IN SHAPE VOL 3.0 -- A New Niketalk = A New Thread

[nealraj006]

I'm going to try out that hook grip on DLs. Any other lifts that I should be using the hook grip on?

Olympic lifts are the only lifts that are traditionally taught with the hook grip. You can use them on deadlift variations, but it's not necessary. You shouldn't need it for other movements.

 

[timbo109]

Today was back & bi's. So I'm basically in love with trap-bar deadlifts. Lately I noticed that I haven't really been "training" i should say, more like "testing" myself on how much i could do. Its been like this the last 3 weeks or so. Started out on the trap-bar dl's 135x10, 225x8, 315x6, 405x4, 455x2. Then i started seeing how much i can actually do, i did 475x3. In my head im like "I can def get 495" and i did. Then im like F it, im gonna do 500. I got way overzealous and f'ed up my right shoulder. I swear it felt like it popped out of socket then went right back in. Hurt like a *****. 

Finished the rest of my workout but took it easy, i couldnt go as heavy as my shoulder was just   in pain. 

Ive been weight training for 7 years, should of known better. SMH @ myself. 

So you love trap bar deadlifts because they got you hurt? K...

Trying to eat big is such a job!

It's way easier than cutting. More expensive but easier and more fun.

Any snack ideas I can eat while at work? Im eating Almonds but im getting bored, and my stomach is killing me

Greek yogurt (plain, 0%), veggies, other nuts, hard boiled eggs, have another meal...

Thanks to this thread and the comments you get, you've got a few tubs but pales in comparison to what's in my cupboard...

and closet.

Variety is the spice of life, is it not?


Anywho, since re-introducing carbs, i've been getting my first case that I can remember of these protein-farts. WOW, they suck (or blow?)

Gotta up my psyllium intake, again

Sitting down to take a dump after you a day of back squats, hang power cleans and 400m sprints

 

[r-man jam]

So you love trap bar deadlifts because they got you hurt? K...
 

Thats not what i said at all. 

 

[djyoung08]

You guys do realize that no one in this thread really cares about your bowel movements, right?

Do you even realize one of the replies you quoted was replying to someone else's bowel movement thus proving yourself incorrect?

Just because you don't care, doesn't mean nobody cares.

let the dudes live. lol

 

[durden7]

The hook grip took a LOT of time getting used to it. My thumb hurts for hours after I do anything hook gripped.

 

[jewbacca]

Big muscles move slow

FALSE

 

[manthonyb]

The hook grip took a LOT of time getting used to it. My thumb hurts for hours after I do anything hook gripped.

tape helps when you do use it. you'll build a tolerance to it (and calluses). it's good to build the tolerance up w/ the barbell only, 95#, 115#, 135# etc. once you get the hang of it, its magical lol..i've DL 500#+ w/ a hook grip 

my thumbs look like absolute death tho and i literally hook grip everything...barbell or not (like grabbing the steering wheel)

 

[T Lo Sweater]

just bought straps on the ebay. cant do that mixed grip anymore

last week i did mixed grip deadlift and banged out 245 easy for 5 reps

today i could only do 225 3 reps. cant wait til they come in. itching to go for 265

 

[legendairy stinson]

Big muscles move slow

It's more like big muscles makes you exhausted quicker.

 

[ootherocoo]

Got my DL up to 275lb for 10 reps.  Feels good

 

[based mod]

Big muscles move slow

FALSE

i'm not sure this guy's ever seen a sprinter's physique

 

[luckyluchiano]

i'm not sure this guy's ever seen a sprinter's physique

lol Hell or even an NFL player like Vernon Davis or TO

 

[bigboss]

Big muscles move slow? Do you live under a rock?

I can provide so many examples to prove that wrong but 3 letters will do the trick....N F L.

No hate but that was a dumb comment.

 

[Peep Game]

^Yea I had to burst out laughing at that. Pretty sure Lebron, Nate Robinson, and Paul George don't have any problem with their speed in relation to their size.

 

[jecca650]

Funny you guys mentioned Vernon I ran into him over the weekend while I was in Las Vegas and dude is HUGE.

 

[ksteezy]

So you love trap bar deadlifts because they got you hurt? K...
It's way easier than cutting. More expensive but easier and more fun.
Greek yogurt (plain, 0%), veggies, other nuts, hard boiled eggs, have another meal...


You guys do realize that no one in this thread really cares about your bowel movements, right?

shut up.

 

[JCMojica24]

shut up.

Ditto

 

[951guero]

mightbe a stupid question but do you guys drink while doing a shred?

 

[panaricanretro]

If you mean alcohol, it's not going to help at all.

 

[picasso swerve]

^Yea I had to burst out laughing at that. Pretty sure Lebron, Nate Robinson, and Paul George don't have any problem with their speed in relation to their size.

And I had to burst out laughing at those 3 terrible examples. Lebron is actually pretty slim, he doesnt really have "big muscles". Same goes for Paul George. Nate is ripped, I woudnt exactly call him big.

NFL players are better examples of big muscle guys who can move quick.

 

[digital022]

Funny you guys mentioned Vernon I ran into him over the weekend while I was in Las Vegas and dude is HUGE.

ayo?!

 

[41239]

Figured id share my experience from my last show (NPC KY Muscle) from a couple weeks ago..
This was my 2nd show ever with the 1st one bein last year when i competed in Physique..so this year i decided to compete in the BB'n class seein as i gained about 15 lbs..

This show was alot more fun then the 1st mostly because i already knew what to look for and what to expect..
The crowd was amazing tho with over 1000 people there it was pretty exciting..
My next show may be in August..if not then itll be in Nov..
I highly recommend doin this if any1 on here is thinkin about doin it..alotta fun

I'm 6'1'' 220-225 lbs normally but my show weight here was around 208 lbs

hey bro, you got the tan stuff in your hair

just thought you should know

alright

no but seriously, was that a 6' and up comp or something?

 

[41239]

but money may is frail too tho. and like 140 lbs at 5'7. That's tiny. it works for him, of course, but that's far from the body I want.

i boxed for years. LOTS of calisthenics, all different angles of pushups and whatnot. and heavy bag work. the heavy bag, IS the weight lifting aspect. you use so much of your body to put the poundage to the bag. Lots of working with body weight, but we def used some actual weights too, just functional lifting, to strengthen certain parts, shrugs, shoulder work, leg work for the punching power. punching in the pool. Forget about the smaller guys and look more at the higher weight classes, many of them lift weights, especially the power hitters, its just lighter, not bodybuilding/weightlifter type regimes. Plus lower body fat %'s will make you look bigger as well which most fighters have.

young Tyson didn't lift, older tyson did tho. Holyfield lifted. bernard hokins and pacman too.

super middleweight and light heavyweight are no joke man

those guys are big AND fast

i wanted to get into boxing and i found out my natural/best size is 175/180, i would get mopped, thats got to be the most dangerous weight class

 

[41239]

Is it true that dead lifts make you more prone to injury?

i dont think so man

dead lifts are a staple for american football players, so i would imagine it makes you stronger and depending on how you perform the dead lift more explosive

if anything, compound lifts like the dead lift, squat, clean are more dangerous because people tend to go heavy and mess their **** up

 

[Nujavez]

mightbe a stupid question but do you guys drink while doing a shred?

maybe every once a 3-4 weeks for me...

Might give you that "whoosh" effect when your weight loss has stalled for a couple weeks and the next day after you drink all the water weight thats been masking your fat loss, has dropped.

leangains.com article about

http://www.leangains.com/2010/07/truth-about-alcohol-fat-loss-and-muscle.html

The Truth About Alcohol, Fat Loss, Muscle Growth
56k warning, large wall of text

Spoiler

Saturday, July 17, 2010
The truth about alcohol, fat loss and muscle growth
12:04 PM | Posted by Martin Berkhan
I've been getting tons of questions relating to alcohol and fat loss lately. Happens every time summer rolls around. Outdoor parties, clubbing, vacations and the whole shebang. Alcohol is a key ingredient. What people want to know is basically how fattening alcohol is, how it affects protein synthesis, how to make it work with their diet, and what drinks to go for at the club.

I think this is very good topic to cover today, since we're right in the middle of summer and all, because most people involved in the fitness and health game tend to miss out on a lot of fun due to avoiding alcohol. I know a lot of peeps who'd rather stay home and manage their diet than go out and have a few drinks. Sad, really, because it's all for the wrong reasons. I don't blame them though. Read the mags or listen to the "experts" and you'll soon be believing that a few drinks will make your muscles fall off, make you impotent, and leave you with a big gut. It's mostly ********, of course. No big surprise when we're dealing with the alarmist fitness mainstream that can't seem to put things in the right perspective if their life depended on it.

This is a definitive primer on the effects of alcohol on all things someone interested in optimizing body composition might be interested in. At the end of this article I'm also going to show you how a hopeless drunk like myself can stay lean while drinking on a regular basis.

C'mere and lemme me tell you my secretz...*hick*


Alcohol and thermogenesis

There's been an ongoing debate for years whether alcohol calories "count" or not. This debate has been spurred on by the fact that drinkers weigh less than non-drinkers and studies showing accelerated weight loss when fat and carbs are exchanged for an equivalent amount of calories from alcohol. The connection between a lower body weight and moderate alcohol consumption is particularly strong among women. In men it's either neutral or weak, but it's there.

How can this be explained, considering that alcohol is a close second to dietary fat in terms of energy density per gram? Not to mention the fact that alcohol is consumed via liquids, which doesn't do much for satiety?

Alcohol is labeled as 7.1 calories per gram, but the real value is more along the lines of 5.7 calories due to the thermic effect of food (TEF) which is 20% of the ingested calories. This makes the TEF of alcohol a close second to protein (20-35% depending on amino acid composition). The heightened thermogenesis resulting from alcohol intake is partly mediated by catecholamines.

Is higher TEF a reasonable explanation for lower body fat percentage in regular drinkers? We need to consider that alcohol does not affect satiety like other nutrients. The disinhibition of impulse control that follows intoxication may also encourage overeating. Ever come home from a party in the middle of the night and downed a box of cereals? That's what I mean.

It's unlikely that the effect of alcohol on body weight in the general population can be attributed solely to the high TEF of alcohol. An alternative explanation is that alcohol consumption decreases food intake in the long term.

Another explanation is that regular alcohol consumption affects nutrient partitioning favorably via improvements in insulin sensitivity.


Alcohol, insulin sensitiviy and health

Moderate alcohol consumption improves insulin sensitivity, lowers triglyceride concentrations and improves glycemic control. Not only in healthy folks, but also in type 2 diabetes. There is no clear consensus on the insulin sensitizing mechanism of alcohol, but one viable explanation may be that alcohol promotes leanness by stimulating AMPK in skeletal muscle. It's not a stretch to assume that this might have favorable effects on nutrient partitioning in the longer term.

If the effect of alcohol consumption on insulin sensitivity doesn't impress you, then consider the fact that studies have consistently shown that moderate drinkers live longer than non-drinkers. This can be mainly attributed to a lowered risk of cardiovascular disease. However, alcohol also contributes to a healthier and disease-free life by protecting against Alzheimer's disease, metabolic syndrome, rheumatoid arthritis, the common cold, different types of cancers, depression and many other Western diseases. The list goes on and on.

It can almost be said beyond doubt that moderate alcohol consumption is healthier than complete abstinence. With this in mind, it's strange that the fitness and health community shun alcohol. This irrational attitude seems to be grounded in the beliefs that alcohol is fattening and will hamper muscle gains. So let's take a look at that.


Alcohol, hormones and training

You've probably heard that alcohol intake lowers testosterone. While this is true, the actual impact has been widely exaggerated. A three-week study that had men and women consume 30-40 g alcohol per day, showed a 6.8% reduction in testosterone for the men and none for the women at the end of the study-period. That's three beers a day for three weeks and a measly 6.8% reduction in testosterone for the men. What kind of an effect would you think a few beers on an evening once or twice a week would have? Hardly any.

For alcohol to significantly lower testosterone, you need to do some serious drinking. ~120 g alcohol, the equivalent of 10 beers, will lower testosterone by 23% for up to 16 hours after the drinking binge. If you drink so goddamn much that you are admitted to the hospital, you get a similar effect with a reduction of about -20%.

A few studies have looked at alcohol consumption in the post-workout period. One study examined the hormonal response to post-workout alcohol consumption using 70-80 g alcohol, equivalent to 6-7 beers. Talk about "optimizing" nutrient timing. Anyway, despite this hefty post-workout drinking binge, no effect on testosterone was found and only a very modest effect on cortisol was noted. The latter is as expected, considering the effect of alcohol on catecholamines. Citing directly from this paper, this quote sums up the scientific findings regarding the effects of alcohol on testosterone:

"Although the majority of studies involving humans show no ethanol effect on serum luteinizing hormone (LH), some data have demonstrated an increase while others have supported a decrease"

- Koziris LP, et al (2000).

It seems that the fitness mainstream, which has been most adamant about propagating the "alcohol-zaps-testosterone-myth", have cherry-picked a bunch of studies to base their claims on. Well, no big surprise there. We've been through this many times before with meal frequency and countless other diet myths.

When it comes to recovery after strength training, moderate alcohol consumption (60-90 g alcohol) does not accelerate exercise-induced muscle damage or affect muscle strength.

However, the research is a bit mixed on this topic. One study, which used a very brutal regimen of eccentric training only, followed by alcohol intakes in the 80 g range (1 g/kg) noted impaired recovery in the trained muscles. I should note that eccentric training is hard to recover from and the volume used here was pretty crazy.

Another study looked at exhaustive endurance training followed by post-workout alcohol intakes in the 120 g range (1.5 g/kg) and saw significant suppression of testosterone that carried over to the next day.

The common denominator among these two studies is either extremely tough training or unusually high alcohol intakes in the post-workout period. Unless you're in the habit of going bar-hopping after 50 reps of eccentric leg extensions to failure, this stuff does not apply to you. Yet it's studies like these that gets the attention among the alcohol-alarmist fitness crowd.

What about protein synthesis? Strangely enough, the acute effects of alcohol on muscle protein synthesis in normal human subjects are non-existent in the scientific litterature. It has only been studied in chronic alcoholics, which have reduced rates of muscle protein synthesis. Chronic alcoholic myopathy, which causes muscle loss, is one unfortunate side-effect of alcohol abuse. However, this study showed that alcoholics without myopathy had lower body fat percentage and the same amount of lean mass as non-drinkers. So much for the argument that alcohol makes all your muscles fall off.

If you put any stock in rat studies, it's clear that alcohol affects protein synthesis negatively. Then again, results from rat studies are almost never directly applicable to human physiology. There are profound differences in how humans and rodents cope with macronutrients and toxins.

Absolut Turnover is is my favorite drink right now. You need a shot of Absolut Vanilia and one lime wedge dipped in cinnamon and brown sugar. Drink, bite and enjoy.


Alcohol and fat storage

Let's quickly review how nutrients are stored and burned after a mixed meal.

1. Carbs and protein suppress fat oxidation via an elevation in insulin. However, these macronutrients do not contribute to fat synthesis in any meaningful way by themselves.

2. Since fat oxidation is suppressed, dietary fat is stored in fat cells.

3. As the hours go by and insulin drops, fat is released from fat cells. Fat storage is an ongoing process and fatty acids are constantly entering and exiting fat cells throughout the day. Net gain or loss is more or less dictated by calorie input and output.

If we throw alcohol into the mix, it gets immediate priority in the in the substrate hierarchy: alcohol puts the breaks on fat oxidation, but also suppresses carb and protein oxidation.

This makes sense considering that the metabolic by-product of alcohol, acetate, is toxic. Metabolizing it takes precedence over everything else. This quote sums up the metabolic fate of alcohol nicely:

"Ethanol (alcohol) is converted in the liver to acetate; an unknown portion is then activated to acetyl-CoA, but only a small portion is converted to fatty acids.
Most of the acetate is released into the circulation, where it affects peripheral tissue metabolism; adipocyte release of nonesterified fatty acids is decreased and acetate replaces lipid in the fuel mixture."

- Hellerstein MK, et al (1999).

Acetate in itself is an extremely poor precursor for fat synthesis. There's simply no metabolic pathway that can make fat out of alcohol with any meaningful efficiency. Studies on fat synthesis after substantial alcohol intakes are non-existent in humans, but Hellerstein(from quotation) estimated de novo lipogenesis after alcohol consumption to ~3%. Out of the 24 g alcohol consumed in this study, a measly 0.8 g fat was synthesized in the liver.

The effect of alcohol on fat storage is very similar to that of carbs: by suppressing fat oxidation, it enables dietary fats to be stored with ease. However, while conversion of carbs to fat may occur once glycogen stores are saturated, DNL via alcohol consumption seems less likely.


Summary

* Moderate alcohol consumption is assocoiated with an abundance of health benefits. The long-term effect on insulin sensitivity and body weight (via insulin or decreased appetite) may be of particular interest to us.

* The thermic effect of alcohol is high and the real caloric value is not 7.1 kcal: it's ~5.6 kcal. However, it's still easy to overconsume calories by drinking. Calorie for calorie, the short-term effect of alcohol on satiety is low. Adding to this, intoxication may also encourage overeating by disinhibition of dietary restraint.

* The negative effects of alcohol on testosterone and recovery has been grossly exaggerated by the fitness mainstream. Excluding very high acute alcohol consumption, or prolonged and daily consumption, the effect is non-significant and unlikely to affect muscle gains or training adaptations negatively.

* The effect of alcohol on muscle protein synthesis is unknown in normal human subjects. It is not unlikely to assume that a negative effect exists, but it is very unlikely that it is of such a profound magnitude that some people would have you believe.

* Alcohol is converted to acetate by the liver. The oxidation of acetate takes precedence over other nutrients and is oxidized to carbon dioxide and water. However, despite being a potent inhibitor of lipolysis, alcohol/acetate alone cannot cause fat gain by itself. It's all the junk people eat in conjunction with alcohol intake that causes fat gain.


How to lose fat or prevent fat gain when drinking

Now that you understand the effect of alcohol on substrate metabolism, it's time for me to reveal how you can make alcohol work for fat loss. Alternatively, how you can drink on a regular basis without any fat gain. Without having to count calories and while drinking as much as you want.

Apply this method exactly as I have laid it out. If you've paid attention, you'll understand the rationale behind it. I've tested this on myself and on numerous clients. Rest assured that I'm not testing out some large-scale bizarre experiment here.

The rules are as follows:

* For this day, restrict your intake of dietary fat to 0.3 g/kg body weight (or as close to this figure as possible).

* Limit carbs to 1.5 g/kg body weight. Get all carbs from veggies and the tag-along carbs in some protein sources. You'll also want to limit carbohydrate-rich alcohol sources such as drinks made with fruit juices and beer. A 33 cl/12 fl oz of beer contains about 12 g carbs, while a regular Cosmopolitan is about 13 g.

* Good choices of alcohol include dry wines which are very low carb, clocking in at about 0.5-1 g per glass (4 fl oz/115ml). Sweet wines are much higher at 4-6 g per glass. Cognac, gin, rum, scotch, tequila, vodka and whiskey are all basically zero carbs. Dry wines and spirits is what you should be drinking, ideally. Take them straight or mixed with diet soda. (No need to be super-neurotic about this stuff. Drinks should be enjoyed after all. Just be aware that there are better and worse choices out there).

* Eat as much protein as you want. Yes, that's right. Ad libitum. Due to the limit on dietary fat, you need to get your protein from lean sources. Protein sources such as low fat cottage cheese, protein powder, chicken, turkey, tuna, pork and egg whites are good sources of protein this day.

* For effective fat loss, this should be limited to one evening per week. Apply the protocol and you will lose fat on a weekly basis as long as your diet is on point for the rest of the week.

Basically, the nutritional strategy I have outlined here is all about focusing on substrates that are least likely to cause net synthesis of fat during hypercaloric conditions. Alcohol and protein, your main macronutrients this day, are extremely poor precursors for de novo lipogenesis. Alcohol suppresses fat oxidation, but by depriving yourself of dietary fat during alcohol consumption, you won't be storing anything. Nor will protein cause any measurable de novo lipogenesis. High protein intake will also compensate for the weak effect of alcohol on satiety and make you less likely to blow your diet when you're drinking.

By the way, a nice bonus after a night of drinking is that it effectively rids you of water retention. You may experience the "whoosh"-effect, which I've talked about in my two-part series about water retention. That in itself can be motivating for folks who've been experiencing a plateau in their weight loss.

Apply this with good judgement and don't go out and do something stupid now. Remember, this a short-term strategy for those that want to be able to drink freely* without significantly impacting fat loss progress or causing unwanted fat gain. It's not something I encourage people to do on a daily basis, but it's one of the strategies that I apply for maintaining low body fat for myself and my clients.

* Now of course...you can always drink in moderation and make sure to not go over your calorie budget for the day. But what fun is there in that? I'd rather cheat the system with the kind metabolic mischief I've layed out above.