Question for Christians: Why is your "God "respected while Lucifer is not?

[darthska]

wawaweewa:

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The question is what are they hiding and for what reason?

Of course I have no evidence for this as we can only speculate but both Islam and Judaism have major mystical components. I can't really speak on Islam but in Judaism, Kaballah is the mystical component of Judaism and in reality it can be thought of as a very advanced (and "higher") knowledge of Judaism (In fact men under 40 who don't have a thorough knowledge of the "written" texts aren't even allowed to study it Kaballah texts are available and the general outline is known but the true meanings behind them are mostly passed down verbally from scholar to scholar). The mystical component also holds many of the esoteric meanings of the religion.

I'd bet that many of the texts that the Vatican hides do explain this more mystical side of Christianity and that it creates a far less dogmatic Christianity than many Christians follow today.
A question like Andre's (whether it was posed to Christians, Moslems, or Christians) would be best answered by the mystical scholars of the religion in question.
I've always felt like the Vatican's hidden texts would cause many of the surface level believers on God to hop off the bandwagon (to putit in layman's terms). Nearly every Jew and Muslim I have ever met (and I've known hundreds) are VERY knowledgeable towards their religion, and theytake it very VERY seriously.

I had a friend my sophomore year that said he was a vegetarian. I saw him eating meat once in the cafeteria and I laughed with him about it; "I thoughtyou were a vegetarian, homey?" He replied without hesitation, "Oh, I'm like a Catholic vegetarian; sometimes I am, sometimes I'm not."

Sure, there is an element of humor there, but there is also an element of unfortunate truth there. A very large majority of those who follow Christ (be theyCatholic or Protestant; doesn't matter to this particular point) do so on a surface level, practicing a very insincere form of following God.

Those that fit that description, I think that the Vatican has things locked up that would cause those people to turn away from their shallow beliefs, and theCatholic/Protestant numbers would take a DRASTIC hit.

Me? I'd be glad for it, because I wish more followers of God were as sincere and educated towards religion as those that practice other religions, namelyIslam and Judaism.

I think what the Vatican is hiding is texts do explain things that they feel are better left unexplained, and possibly even present some of the mysticalaspects of Christianity that have been left undiscussed, like you've alluded to. I think the one possibility that intrigues me the most is the presumedbook written my Mary Magdalene. I think what she would have to say, and the fact that she even wrote a text in the first place, would shake the core of a verylarge percentage of 'believers'. Me? I want to read it. It wouldn't change a single thing about how I believe, because my belief system isn'thinged on certain things taught to be facts.

 

[rome357]

You know what's funny. When the op asks a question everyone tells him to keep his views to himself, and do him. Now when we have a Real Id, New worldorder, or horrible economy thread; you've got all kind of people saying mark of the beast, get with god or get left behind, and the bible says this andthat. Why is that ok?

 

[iloveshoes]

Originally Posted by amos1321

Originally Posted by RKO2004

Originally Posted by I R Andre

Originally Posted by 23ska909red02

I R Andre:

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brooklynnyc3000:

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If you don't believe in God or anything to do with Christianity, keep it to yourself.

You sound mildly upset, I asked a question I have yet to get an answer to. Hopefully Ska sees this and can explain it to me.

I dont have an answer

fixed.


Why has no one answered the question seriously I want to know.

Look at what we've become? Look at what we've allowed this world to become? Look at the pain we cause? For us to be so smart we are very dumb. I'm sure God had great plans for us but that got nixed. Why do great things for people who can't follow basic instructions? Satans' goal was not to open our eyes for the good. He knew what we would become. He knew what God knew. God told Adam and Eve to stay away from the fruit not because He wanted them to be "dumb", but because He knew what it would lead to. Think about for a second? Satan. A being who wants to have Gods power and is a hater. He was mad about the attention and praise God was getting. So in return he got in some of the angles ear and turned them against God. He was cast down to hell along with the angles. Do you honestly think someone like Satan really had our best interest at heart when he was telling Adam and Eve what to do?




RKO2004 - you my friend are a smart man

/thread game.set.match.

 

[im a helion]

Originally Posted by ROME357

You know what's funny. When the op asks a question everyone tells him to keep his views to himself, and do him. Now when we have a Real Id, New world order, or horrible economy thread; you've got all kind of people saying mark of the beast, get with god or get left behind, and the bible says this and that. Why is that ok?

I can't figure out what you're asking. Are you asking why can people speak their mind aboutBible prophecy, when the OP gets shut down for askin a question?

 

[rome357]

/\ Yes

I don't mean any disrespect, but I would like to know.

 

[im a helion]

Originally Posted by ROME357

/\ Yes

I don't mean any disrespect, but I would like to know.

Don't worry, I feel the same way as you. I mean, this IS a messageboard, and that's kinda thepoint...to ask questions and have different opinions. I think Ska came at him the way he did because I R Andre asked the question in a narrow-mindedcondescending way, according to Ska.

I personally, Ska, most most of the other Christians on this board haveabsolutely no problem with people asking questions about what we believe in. So if you have any, shoot away.

 

[jdmevoixmr]

Originally Posted by DAYTONA 5000

If Satan already knows what is written and that he's going to be condemned to hell, why doesn't he repent?

He had already hardened his heart against God, and God hardened his heart to the point of no return. He cannot repent, he is forever doomed, in the end, hewill always lose. He is incapable of repenting.

 

[itsaNYthing]

And the serpent said unto the woman, Ye shall not surely die:

For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil.


Before we ate the fruit, we had the capacity to do good, meaning we'd still have the capacity to make music, create pieces of art, and think and discussphilosophy. You think we were just dumb before that, knowing absolutely nothing? Now after eating it and falling into sin, we now have the capacity to do evil.Look at the world today with the killing, stealing, sexual immorality, deceit, etc. Did Lucifer really "improve" us?

 

[i r andre]

Originally Posted by RKO2004

Originally Posted by I R Andre

Originally Posted by 23ska909red02

I R Andre:

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brooklynnyc3000:

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If you don't believe in God or anything to do with Christianity, keep it to yourself.

You sound mildly upset, I asked a question I have yet to get an answer to. Hopefully Ska sees this and can explain it to me.

I dont have an answer

fixed.


Why has no one answered the question seriously I want to know.

Look at what we've become? Look at what we've allowed this world to become? Look at the pain we cause? For us to be so smart we are very dumb. I'm sure God had great plans for us but that got nixed. Why do great things for people who can't follow basic instructions? Satans' goal was not to open our eyes for the good. He knew what we would become. He knew what God knew. God told Adam and Eve to stay away from the fruit not because He wanted them to be "dumb", but because He knew what it would lead to. Think about for a second? Satan. A being who wants to have Gods power and is a hater. He was mad about the attention and praise God was getting. So in return he got in some of the angles ear and turned them against God. He was cast down to hell along with the angles. Do you honestly think someone like Satan really had our best interest at heart when he was telling Adam and Eve what to do?

How is knowing that there's more to the world than what god is telling you not opening your eyes? Adam and Eve had no idea what was outside ofthe world until they ate the fruit. Therefore the root behind all creativity and everything that basically wasn't in the garden of eden originally startswith Lucifer putting the human race onto a higher way of thinking. You can't just focus on all the bad things, because if you really think about hes alsoresponsible for all the good things that happened post garden of eden as well because with out him tempting humans it would've never happened. Heessentially lit a fire in the minds of the human race by making them eat the fruit.

Before we ate the fruit, we had the capacity to do good, meaning we'd still have the capacity to make music, create pieces of art, and think and discuss philosophy. You think we were just dumb before that, knowing absolutely nothing? Now after eating it and falling into sin, we now have the capacity to do evil. Look at the world today with the killing, stealing, sexual immorality, deceit, etc. Did Lucifer really "improve" us?
Yeah but none of that happened, all adam and eve did was have unprotected sex all day most likely. No music, art, or philosophy happened. Youdon't know what we know before that and neither do I, I can only go by what's in the bible and no art, music, or philosophy was ever created by thempre- Lucifer. Basically if you go by what the bible says hes responsible for all ways of thinking and creativity in the world.

 

[rko2004]

Originally Posted by JDMEVOIXMR

Originally Posted by DAYTONA 5000

If Satan already knows what is written and that he's going to be condemned to hell, why doesn't he repent?

He had already hardened his heart against God, and God hardened his heart to the point of no return. He cannot repent, he is forever doomed, in the end, he will always lose. He is incapable of repenting.

Yep.



And plus you must mention that God sent Jesus to die for our sins and give us a chance to repent and get into Heaven. Like dude came to SAVE US FROM HELL!


And to the OP I have no problem with you or anybody asking questions. It gives me a chance to see others views and also it brings a nice crowd which may holdsomeone who is smarter than me so I can also learn from them.

How is knowing that there's more to the world than what god is telling you not opening your eyes? Adam and Eve had no idea what was outside of the world until they ate the fruit. Therefore the root behind all creativity and everything that basically wasn't in the garden of eden originally starts with Lucifer putting the human race onto a higher way of thinking. You can't just focus on all the bad things, because if you really think about hes also responsible for all the good things that happened post garden of eden as well because with out him tempting humans it would've never happened. He essentially lit a fire in the minds of the human race by making them eat the fruit.

You mean opening our eyes to sin?

Whose to say God didn't have a plan to teach them so much more than what we know know? What if Him telling them notto eat the fruit was a test to see if we can handle basic instructions(more times than not we have proven its a hard task).

Can you explain a bit more? I don't think I would be giving duke credit.

 

[agentarenas]

Originally Posted by I R Andre

Originally Posted by 23ska909red02

I R Andre:

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brooklynnyc3000:

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If you don't believe in God or anything to do with Christianity, keep it to yourself.

You sound mildly upset, I asked a question I have yet to get an answer to. Hopefully Ska sees this and can explain it to me.

I dont have an answer

fixed.


Why has no one answered the question seriously I want to know.



Ska has always answered people who are genuinely interested and curious about Christianity. You are not one of those people, and its pretty obvious. Theres nopoint in him answering your question, because no matter what, you'll criticize and mock it on a elementary, immature level.

 

[jdmevoixmr]

^ Amen, we have a chance to repent, unlike Satan and people who already died and cannot repent. We should live and breathe for God, as He gave us eternal lifethrough Jesus. Immortality FTW

 

[i r andre]

Originally Posted by JDMEVOIXMR

^ Amen, we have a chance to repent, unlike Satan and people who already died and cannot repent. We should live and breathe for God, as He gave us eternal life through Jesus. Immortality FTW

 

[darthska]

^ See? You're only proving correct those that assume you to be approaching this with an immature disregard.

ROME357:

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IM A HELION:

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ROME357:

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You know what's funny. When the op asks a question everyone tells him to keep his views to himself, and do him. Now when we have a Real Id, New world order, or horrible economy thread; you've got all kind of people saying mark of the beast, get with god or get left behind, and the bible says this and that. Why is that ok?
I can't figure out what you're asking. Are you asking why can people speak their mind about Bible prophecy, when the OP gets shut down for askin a question?
Yes

I don't mean any disrespect, but I would like to know.
Nah, that's not disrespectful at all, what you're asking.

Asking questions is not disrespectful; asking questions disrespectfully is disrespectful.

Like this: driving does not make you a moron; driving like a moron makes you a moron. Playing sports does not make you a dirty cheat; playing dirty andcheating in sports makes you a dirty cheat.

Know what I mean?

But you're curious why it seems to be o.k. for people to be forceful in their approach toward spreading Christianity, but it doesn't seem to be o.k.for the OP to ask questions. The thing you're not seeing is that some of the people getting at the OP aren't even Christian. There's a reason forthat, and the reason is that he is coming across as condescending, belittling, and narrow-minded, both in this thread and in others.

THAT is why his questions are not being received well; not because he's asking them, but because of how.

And as far as people being forceful regarding end-times prophecies or being forceful during times of national crisis: I have a problem with those people aswell, even if they do claim to share the same beliefs as I do.

an ignorant, stubborn, belittling, narrow-minded, forceful Christian IS THE SAME AS an ignorant, stubborn, belittling, narrow-minded, forceful person of anyother belief system

 

[bamez]

Originally Posted by I R Andre

Originally Posted by seniosoul

Lucifer was the most favorite angle, but he wanted to be god but the Lord didn't stand for that so he got cast down to hell.


Lucifer came on earth in the form of a snake and tempted Eve to eat the fruit, she did and in return Adam ate the fruit also. God told them both not to eat the
fruit because it was absolutely forbidden.




My Lord is the creator of all things that's you see upon you. He deserves the highest of respect.




Lucifer does not respect Lord, Lucifer is jealous of mankind and thinks that mankind doesn't deserve life. if adamn and eve hadn't ate that apple then
they would have lived forever.




we are born into sin

It was only forbidden because your god didn't want us to be smart he originally wanted to keep us all stupid and blindly worship him. Why respect some one who originally had a plan to keep us essentially as pets with no real higher way of thinking? Essentially Lucifer was the one that lit a fire in the minds of men and is the original reason as to why humans have any sort of creativity N that born into sin stuff is ridiculous, its only "sin" because your god got his original plan of worshipers essentially ruined.

okay mr. essentially, God didn't want to essentially keep us as pets. Who knows what he would have told us or granted us, but it was a test of obedienceabout the fruit. While the story may be fictional, of course God knew that he made that fruit, who do you think put that kick in the fruit, it was more of achallenge to Adam and Eve. Like when parents try to teach their kids, don't do this, don't do that, but of course we has human beings will almostalways experiment.

 

[i r andre]

okay mr. essentially,
Stopped reading.

You mean opening our eyes to sin?
More so in the sense of opening our eyes to a world outside of the garden of eden and other ways of thinking.

Whose to say God didn't have a plan to teach them so much more than what we know know? What if Him telling them not to eat the fruit was a test to see if we can handle basic instructions(more times than not we have proven its a hard task).
We don't know if that was the plan though he could've had a plan to keep all of us ignorant forever.

Can you explain a bit more? I don't think I would be giving duke credit.
Explain to me how hes NOT tho, this entire world and everything in it basically stems from original sin if you believe in the garden of eden.Nothing on this planet today would exist if it wasn't for Lucifer tempting Adam and Eve the good and the bad.

Originally Posted by NothinAfter

satan gets no respect...because he brought sin into the world

You didn't read any thing in this post you just read the topic and then posted the first thing to come into your small brain.

 

[nothinafter]

satan gets no respect...because he brought sin into the world

 

[daytona 5000]

If God is such a forgiving and compassionate God, why wouldn't he accept Lucifer if he begged for forgiveness and truly repented?

satan gets no respect...because he brought sin into the world

No, according to the Bible sin already existed Eve brought sin into the world by disobeying God.


And do you guys even know what Amen means?

 

[darthska]

DAYTONA 5000:

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If God is such a forgiving and compassionate God, why wouldn't he accept Lucifer if he begged for forgiveness and truly repented?
I believe he would. And according to legend/the Bible/myth (whatever you want to call Biblical accounts of things), there will come a day whenSatan will drop to his knees and admit that God is the Highest Authority. I believe that if that were to happen, Satan would be once again welcomed intoheaven.

 

[i r andre]

Originally Posted by DAYTONA 5000

If God is such a forgiving and compassionate God, why wouldn't he accept Lucifer if he begged for forgiveness and truly repented?

satan gets no respect...because he brought sin into the world

No, according to the Bible sin already existed Eve brought sin into the world by disobeying God.


And do you guys even know what Amen means?

Amen was the god of all gods in Egypt, Hebrews changed the name of pharaohs to the cast of people in old testament.

 

[daytona 5000]

Originally Posted by 23ska909red02

DAYTONA 5000:

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If God is such a forgiving and compassionate God, why wouldn't he accept Lucifer if he begged for forgiveness and truly repented?

I believe he would. And according to legend/the Bible/myth (whatever you want to call Biblical accounts of things), there will come a day when Satan will drop to his knees and admit that God is the Highest Authority. I believe that if that were to happen, Satan would be once again welcomed into heaven.

But doesn't Satan already know that God is the Highest Authority? Like when he wanted to test job didn't he have to ask God for permissionfirst?

 

[theraygunz]

I don't know why you guys even believe any of this in the first place.

 

[nothinafter]

Originally Posted by I R Andre

okay mr. essentially,

Stopped reading.

You mean opening our eyes to sin?
More so in the sense of opening our eyes to a world outside of the garden of eden and other ways of thinking.

Whose to say God didn't have a plan to teach them so much more than what we know know? What if Him telling them not to eat the fruit was a test to see if we can handle basic instructions(more times than not we have proven its a hard task).
We don't know if that was the plan though he could've had a plan to keep all of us ignorant forever.

Can you explain a bit more? I don't think I would be giving duke credit.
Explain to me how hes NOT tho, this entire world and everything in it basically stems from original sin if you believe in the garden of eden. Nothing on this planet today would exist if it wasn't for Lucifer tempting Adam and Eve the good and the bad.

Originally Posted by NothinAfter

satan gets no respect...because he brought sin into the world

You didn't read any thing in this post you just read the topic and then posted the first thing to come into your small brain.




you must be mad

 

[916jordanboy]

Originally Posted by I R Andre

Originally Posted by DAYTONA 5000

If God is such a forgiving and compassionate God, why wouldn't he accept Lucifer if he begged for forgiveness and truly repented?

satan gets no respect...because he brought sin into the world

No, according to the Bible sin already existed Eve brought sin into the world by disobeying God.


And do you guys even know what Amen means?

Amen was the god of all gods in Egypt, Hebrews changed the name of pharaohs to the cast of people in old testament.

that's Amun, not Amen. numbnut

 

[darthska]

DAYTONA 5000:

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23ska909red02:

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DAYTONA 5000:

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If God is such a forgiving and compassionate God, why wouldn't he accept Lucifer if he begged for forgiveness and truly repented?
I believe he would. And according to legend/the Bible/myth (whatever you want to call Biblical accounts of things), there will come a day when Satan will drop to his knees and admit that God is the Highest Authority. I believe that if that were to happen, Satan would be once again welcomed into heaven.

But doesn't Satan already know that God is the Highest Authority? Like when he wanted to test job didn't he have to ask God for permission first?
Nah, Satan didn't so much ask God's permission in the story of Job.

As it goes, it was a story of God and Satan having a conversation about God's people. The story goes that God was saying that His people are loyal to Him,and Satan challenged Him by saying that the reason His people are loyal to Him is because they are protected. Job was one of the most successful known men atthe time, so Satan used him as an example, suggesting that the reason Job was such a good follower was because he was wealthy beyond all imagination.

He contended that if God would take some of his wealth away... his beautiful family possessions, everything... Job's faith would be gone.

God accepted the challenge, saying that Satan could do as he wanted with Job, except take his life.

In the story, Satan wasn't so much asking for permission so much as he was presenting a challenge.

As an aside, I want to point out that, like nearly all stories in the Bible, the less important thing is the facts contained in the story, and the mostimportant thing are the principles contained in the story. The story of Job is less about Satan, God, Job, Job's family, losses, and any other pertinentdetails. The story is more about how Godly people should be in times of trial, even losing everything, including family members. Whether or not the storyactually happened, I take from it another template of how to live my life. For a believer (like myself), I would say "Don't let failure be thefoundation for your belief in God, and don't let failure cause you to lose faith in Him"; for a non-believer, I would say "Don't let successbe the foundation for your positive thinking, and don't let failure cause you to lose all of your beliefs."