***Official Political Discussion Thread***

[blastercombo]

McDonald's labor costs are well over $1B and a $15 minimum wage would probably increase those costs by hundreds of millions. Corporate executives make far too much money but the excess is taken from stockholders, not the workers

I think we all agree there's a wage level that optimizes the earnings of those subject to the minimum wage. I just don't think we know what that is, or that we should be looking at the minimum wage as an anti-poverty policy

there are better ways at attempting to increase the well-being of those at the bottom end of the income distribution. direct cash assistance is better, the earned income tax credit (basically the same thing as direct cash assistance) is better, wage supports are better

with that said i haven't seen anything to suggest that $15 is the wrong number; it's certainly closer to the right number than $7

Yeah I’m with you on this. CEO will make 5.287 billion instead of 5.3 billion isn’t sending him to the poor house (made that number up). The rich will stay rich no matter what. Let’s also take into account these people don’t provide any type of health benefits, pension, etc. 15 min wage is the complete minimum number.

 

[maq25060]

I'm starting to think thr only logical thing a person of color could do is leave this place. Let those who think this is their land and only their land have it. **** it up. Kill each other. And we watch them do it from afar.

Let them create a new group of undesirables. Tired of it being me. ******* with my mental reading the different set of rules for the others.

 

[storm2006]

The GOP establishment to 45 like

at Trump truly expecting loyalty among a group of thieves, scumbags and ego maniacs who he has denigrated since he started campaigning five years ago.

 

[blastercombo]

These people are turning on trump because they lost a lot of money backing him. No reason other than that, period.

 

[storm2006]

McDonald's labor costs are well over $1B and a $15 minimum wage would probably increase those costs by hundreds of millions. Corporate executives make far too much money but the excess is taken from stockholders, not the workers

I think we all agree there's a wage level that optimizes the earnings of those subject to the minimum wage. I just don't think we know what that is, or that we should be looking at the minimum wage as an anti-poverty policy

there are better ways at attempting to increase the well-being of those at the bottom end of the income distribution. direct cash assistance is better, the earned income tax credit (basically the same thing as direct cash assistance) is better, wage supports are better

with that said i haven't seen anything to suggest that $15 is the wrong number; it's certainly closer to the right number than $7

Yeah I’m with you on this. CEO will make 5.287 billion instead of 5.3 billion isn’t sending him to the poor house (made that number up). The rich will stay rich no matter what. Let’s also take into account these people don’t provide any type of health benefits, pension, etc. 15 min wage is the complete minimum number.

Great posts by both you. I will say though blastercombo , I don’t know what % of a fast food company’s employees are minimum wage but doubling those labor costs will have a palpable effect on the CEOs salary but to your point, he’ll still be making millions. heelsandeers raised another good point that I failed to mention in my previous post - stockholders. With increased labor costs, they won’t just take it out of compensation at the top. They’ll also look at slowing down or eliminating stock buybacks or dividends, if they have them which will subsequently affect their stock price as well. I would love to be a fly on the wall in their strategy meetings about how they plan to address this if/when it goes through.

 

[had pants]

 

[storm2006]

These people are turning on trump because they lost a lot of money backing him. No reason other than that, period.

That and I think because they want to use this as an opportunity to make it look like they were on the right side of history.

 

[dinyc3st]

don’t forget that Fast Food Chains installing self order booths too in order to hire less staff. So in reality, who’s really taking the L here?

 

[dinyc3st]

That and I think because they want to use this as an opportunity to make it look like they were on the right side of history.

I believe this plays a huge part.

I also believe that not all Trump supporters are bigots at the same time all bigots are trump supports.

There’s also those that are super conservative and they take in so much pride, they’ll vote for Trump simply because he’s in the GOP.

 

[blastercombo]

don’t forget that Fast Food Chains installing self order booths too in order to hire less staff. So in reality, who’s really taking the L here?

I personally don’t see machines taking over customer service. Large companies big be into it but lots of ideas come and go with the times. I’d love to see the number of items lost daily with Walmart self checkout. Above all, automated customer service just sucks. Any type of problem comes up and you’re screwed.

this is why I’m also willing to pay more for a quality experience and food.

had a kinda similar experience with Amazon. I have about 5 people using my account.Lots of little things get bought but lots of things get sent back too. Got an email the other day about the frequency of returns. I told them 1. Your automated service accepts them so I’m not breaking any rules and 2. Most of the items they sell are cheap crap and they know it. They ended up sending me 15 store credit for the troubles.

either stand by quality and what it costs to keep it or kick rocks

 

[storm2006]

I personally don’t see machines taking over customer service. Large companies big be into it but lots of ideas come and go with the times. I’d love to see the number of items lost daily with Walmart self checkout. Above all, automated customer service just sucks. Any type of problem comes up and you’re screwed.

this is why I’m also willing to pay more for a quality experience and food.

You’ll always need people...just fewer of them. Like even now they’ll still have regular checkout like but even at self checkout there always seems to be a steward to help if folks run into any issues. And in that sense, personally, I think of automation as a supplement not a replacement.

 

[dacomeup]

And they’ll probably still own illegally.

 

[blastercombo]

You’ll always need people...just fewer of them. Like even now they’ll still have regular checkout like but even at self checkout there always seems to be a steward to help if folks run into any issues. And in that sense, personally, I think of automation as a supplement not a replacement.

Yeah for sure. The number of checkout people at Walmart looks like it hasn’t changed at all. Difference is now you can do it yourself if you want. Walmart always has 30 checkout lines and 4 that are actually open

same with a McDonald’s. Still 2-3 registers open. You can now just do it yourself on the side

 

[dinyc3st]

You’ll always need people...just fewer of them. Like even now they’ll still have regular checkout like but even at self checkout there always seems to be a steward to help if folks run into any issues. And in that sense, personally, I think of automation as a supplement not a replacement.

Also don’t forget the delivery services from UberEats, DD etc.

machines aren’t gonna take over.. Not until at least another 10-20 years imo but even then it’s just technology growth.

 

[heelsandeers]

there is the theory that the minimum wage will work like free-trade agreements, displacing some low-skill workers but leading to better opportunities for semi- or high-skilled workers

it seems plausible but I suspect the effect would be less pronounced since the automation products themselves are produced with a high degree of automation

it's somewhat ironic to apply this sort of logic to the minimum wage debate, which is supposed to be about helping the least-skilled workers who have been left behind in the high tech economy

if the minimum wage produces winners and losers and the losers are poor people who now can't find work at any price, I wonder if the issue hasn't gotten confused somewhere along the way

I grant that there isn't much evidence to suggest that $15 is too high but i do think it's worse to err on the high side than the low side

 

[storm2006]

Yeah for sure. The number of checkout people at Walmart looks like it hasn’t changed at all. Difference is now you can do it yourself if you want. Walmart always has 30 checkout lines and 4 that are actually open

same with a McDonald’s. Still 2-3 registers open. You can now just do it yourself on the side

Also don’t forget the delivery services from UberEats, DD etc.

machines aren’t gonna take over.. Not until at least another 10-20 years imo but even then it’s just technology growth.

dinyc3st , I was typing this right as you posted : the other thing that’s big (and a game changer IMO) is app ordering (not even delivery but the direct apps). Just pre-order, walk-in, confirm your order and walk out. And like you said, they’ll never fully take over, it’s impossible but they’ll replace a portion of the workforce for sure.

if the minimum wage produces winners and losers and the losers are poor people who now can't find work at any price, I wonder if the issue hasn't gotten confused somewhere along the way

This. And that’s my fear. Corporations are ruthless, bro. You can’t leave it up to them to make the right choice as long as they are held accountable to shareholders.

 

[Nujavez]

.

 

[Upptempo]

The thing with self checkout is that we use it. If they installed checkout machines and they were barely used then the companies would be forced to minimize how many are installed. But most of us younger generation shoppers will walk into a place and see 7 people on a line or 2 people at the self checkout and we're like **** that line. I'll just checkout myself.

 

[dinyc3st]

The thing with self checkout is that we use it. If they installed checkout machines and they were barely used then the companies would be forced to minimize how many are installed. But most of us younger generation shoppers will walk into a place and see 7 people on a line or 2 people at the self checkout and we're like **** that line. I'll just checkout myself.

Did that at rite aid yesterday. While people waiting in line for TWO WHOLE cashiers lmao

 

[storm2006]

The thing with self checkout is that we use it. If they installed checkout machines and they were barely used then the companies would be forced to minimize how many are installed. But most of us younger generation shoppers will walk into a place and see 7 people on a line or 2 people at the self checkout and we're like **** that line. I'll just checkout myself.

Did that at rite aid yesterday. While people waiting in line for TWO WHOLE cashiers lmao

Not to mention - even if there is a line to use self checkout, there’s multiple machines that can open up as opposed to a cashier where you’re waiting for one slot. I don’t see any problem with it. I’m just trying to get in and out as soon as possible. They call it a convenience story for a reason, right?

 

[blastercombo]

Don’t think app ordering changes anything. It takes a human to make the order and another to drop it off. If anything it adds to a workforce

 

[blastercombo]

The thing with self checkout is that we use it. If they installed checkout machines and they were barely used then the companies would be forced to minimize how many are installed. But most of us younger generation shoppers will walk into a place and see 7 people on a line or 2 people at the self checkout and we're like **** that line. I'll just checkout myself.

Generation antisocial loves the self anything.



with this all said, Japan and China are heavy on the automation. Don’t know about China but I know Japan is big on suicide. I wonder how much antisocial activity built into their everyday lives builds towards that

 

[storm2006]

Don’t think app ordering changes anything. It takes a human to make the order and another to drop it off. If anything it adds to a workforce

I meant app ordering in terms of picking it up, not delivery. I don’t know enough about the work flow and pain points of fast food service to appropriately comment but I would have to think there’s some sort of benefit to having a larger percentage of folks just come in and pick up their order rather than having long lines, especially at peak hours. It’s definitely added convenience for the customer but the restaurant...IDK.

 

[Upptempo]

Generation antisocial loves the self anything.

that's true too. That's why apps like Grubhub exploded. People at first were like "$5 delivery fee!? If I call the pizzeria and order it's free!!" Now people are like "**** that. I don't wanna talk to the dude that works at the pizzeria. I'll pay the $5"

 

[blastercombo]

I meant app ordering in terms of picking it up, not delivery. I don’t know enough about the work flow and pain points of fast food service to appropriately comment but I would have to think there’s some sort of benefit to having a larger percentage of folks just come in and pick up their order rather than having long lines, especially at peak hours. It’s definitely added convenience for the customer but the restaurant...IDK.

Yeah you’re right. My personal beef with delivery is that you get old *** food haha. Pretty much paying for leftovers aged food. I’m not down for that