NT, Do you agree/believe in the Death Penalty?

[gello 201]

Originally Posted by duke4005

Originally Posted by Gello 201

Death penalty is not cost effective, it DOES NOT deter crime, and when people get life sentences they get put on suicide watch most of the time because they WANT to die. By giving some "sicko's" the death penalty, you are giving them what they want in some instances. If someone does something so horrifying, they deserve the worst, no? 100 year sentence of solitary IS the worst thing possible. And sicko's are exactly that, mentally sick. You cant tell me rational people do things to children or eat people (etc), so in essence, you are killing mentally challenged people. They should be removed from the society, not from the earth. Oh yeah, and not to mention wrongful convictions. DNA is the most foolproof method we have, AND THATS NOT foolproof. Imagine the methods 40 years ago.

Your arguments are all reason sin my mind FOR the death penalty. It does deter crime - they can not commit any more, and we all have read the recidivism rates of felons. That is aht the sickos want - then give it to them. Mentally sick to the point of eating children? They will never get better, and will always be a threat to themselves or others. Wrongful convictions? That is why I said absolute proof or water-tight confession. Person sitting in floor holding bloody knife, screaming I did it, I am sorry = death penalty.

Im sorry but i have to cut you off on a few things. If person X is put to death, it statistically does not stop person y, and z from committing the same crime.There is no water tight confession, the burden of proof in criminal court is 99.9% guilty. The 'mentally challenged' we are going back and forth aboutare to be removed from society permanently. They can be studied to hopefully find major or even minor breakthroughs to prevent future crimes. It is also costeffective to keep them locked up forever, as opposed to putting them to death. On a side note, I am thoroughly enjoying this discussion.

 

[eleet1]

Rapist and child molesters/rapists need to be shot in the head.

 

[aka king arthur]

Originally Posted by J Burner

Originally Posted by AKA King Arthur


no I dontit is no mans right to take another human life.

So then why should people who take another person's life be allowed to live? Or did you forget that the person being executed took another person's life, and in some cases took multiple lives. I'll say it again:

If God did the job, we wouldn't have to. So we are supposed to let murderers and child rapists frollick and be merry until the day they die, and hope that they are judged accordingly by a God that may or may not exist, and then sent to a mythical place called Hell, whose existence also can not be confirmed by any living person. No thanks, I'll take actual justice.

Thank god our justice system takes extordianry stepts to keep religion out of the court room (and fam just so you know this God you speak of could not be real)

In America we have the best Justice system in the world. Sure it is an inperfect system but is as good as it can be.

I dont condone murder at all. But in this country we have a system in place to punish people who commit crimes like this. They are not "merry until theday they die" they are in prison with their liberty and freedom stripped away. And that feeling my friend is far from merry

 

[iiceman83]

AKA. So no man should take another mans life unless its defence of a nation?

What about defending the public from a murderer??

Defending a nation with war is also the murdering of millions of innocent men, women and children!!

If ur stance is truely " no man has the right to take another mans
life". Let is be universal. Otherwise its contradiction

 

[j burner]

Originally Posted by AKA King Arthur

Originally Posted by J Burner

Originally Posted by AKA King Arthur


no I dontit is no mans right to take another human life.

So then why should people who take another person's life be allowed to live? Or did you forget that the person being executed took another person's life, and in some cases took multiple lives. I'll say it again:

If God did the job, we wouldn't have to. So we are supposed to let murderers and child rapists frollick and be merry until the day they die, and hope that they are judged accordingly by a God that may or may not exist, and then sent to a mythical place called Hell, whose existence also can not be confirmed by any living person. No thanks, I'll take actual justice.

Thank god our justice system takes extordianry stepts to keep religion out of the court room (and fam just so you know this God you speak of could not be real)

In America we have the best Justice system in the world. Sure it is an inperfect system but is as good as it can be.

I dont condone murder at all. But in this country we have a system in place to punish people who commit crimes like this. They are not "merry until the day they die" they are in prison with their liberty and freedom stripped away. And that feeling my friend is far from merry

Again, you're thinking with the mind of a normal person, you're assuming the mind of a violent criminal works the same as yours. How do you know asociopath is not perfectly content to live in jail? Some of these people are treated better in jail than they are in the streets. These people build lives inprison, become rulers of the domain, some of them even get special treatment from the C.O.'s. People who know they have no chance of ever leaving prisoncan have a mindset of being able to do whatever they want, because they know there is nothing more you can do to them, there is no more consequence. Whats thenext punishment after life in prison?

 

[aka king arthur]

IICEMAN83 wrote:

---

AKA. So no man should take another mans life unless its defence of a nation?

What about defending the public from a murderer??

Defending a nation with war is also the murdering of millions of innocent men, women and children!!

If ur stance is truely " no man has the right to take another mans
life". Let is be universal. Otherwise its contradiction
you are right it would be contraditary

and I said i dont believe in war. I was just giving an example

The real point is what is murder. If you are a soilder in war and you are in battle and kill a man that is not murder. Just like if your family is beingattacked and you defend them and kill someone. That again is not murder.

What I beleive we are talking about is do you beleive a murder, convicted under law, should be killed by the state or federal government.

My answer to that question is no. To be more specific I dont beleive it is any mans right to take the life of another esspically to prove a point or set anexample.

The problem with the death penitly is that it is unreverable and innocent people have been "murdered" under it.

I stand by what I said that I dont believe that it is any mans right to take the life of another. However with that said I understand in the imperfect world welive in that very specific and certain exceptions to that rule can and will be made

 

[baalnood]

They been doing that since the day of Jesus.

 

[rossh123]

yes

 

[derek916]

Originally Posted by AKA King Arthur

Originally Posted by J Burner

Originally Posted by AKA King Arthur


no I dontit is no mans right to take another human life.

So then why should people who take another person's life be allowed to live? Or did you forget that the person being executed took another person's life, and in some cases took multiple lives. I'll say it again:

If God did the job, we wouldn't have to. So we are supposed to let murderers and child rapists frollick and be merry until the day they die, and hope that they are judged accordingly by a God that may or may not exist, and then sent to a mythical place called Hell, whose existence also can not be confirmed by any living person. No thanks, I'll take actual justice.

Thank god our justice system takes extordianry stepts to keep religion out of the court room (and fam just so you know this God you speak of could not be real)

In America we have the best Justice system in the world. Sure it is an inperfect system but is as good as it can be.

I dont condone murder at all. But in this country we have a system in place to punish people who commit crimes like this. They are not "merry until the day they die" they are in prison with their liberty and freedom stripped away. And that feeling my friend is far from merry

it costs $2 million to house an inmate in prison on top of the fact that we have so many prisoners we pay to have private companies run prisons,that to me doensn't sound like the best justice system in the world and I don't support $2 million to house an inmate for the rest of his life it becheaper to let them rehab and free them or kill them (only if crime was really bad)

 

[aka king arthur]

Originally Posted by J Burner

Originally Posted by AKA King Arthur

Originally Posted by J Burner

Originally Posted by AKA King Arthur


no I dontit is no mans right to take another human life.

So then why should people who take another person's life be allowed to live? Or did you forget that the person being executed took another person's life, and in some cases took multiple lives. I'll say it again:

If God did the job, we wouldn't have to. So we are supposed to let murderers and child rapists frollick and be merry until the day they die, and hope that they are judged accordingly by a God that may or may not exist, and then sent to a mythical place called Hell, whose existence also can not be confirmed by any living person. No thanks, I'll take actual justice.

Thank god our justice system takes extordianry stepts to keep religion out of the court room (and fam just so you know this God you speak of could not be real)

In America we have the best Justice system in the world. Sure it is an inperfect system but is as good as it can be.

I dont condone murder at all. But in this country we have a system in place to punish people who commit crimes like this. They are not "merry until the day they die" they are in prison with their liberty and freedom stripped away. And that feeling my friend is far from merry

Again, you're thinking with the mind of a normal person, you're assuming the mind of a violent criminal works the same as yours. How do you know a sociopath is not perfectly content to live in jail? Some of these people are treated better in jail than they are in the streets. These people build lives in prison, become rulers of the domain, some of them even get special treatment from the C.O.'s. People who know they have no chance of ever leaving prison can have a mindset of being able to do whatever they want, because they know there is nothing more you can do to them, there is no more consequence. Whats the next punishment after life in prison?

so we should assume that every person who commits a violent crime is certifiably crazy?

Moreover than that should we also assume that any and every person who commits a violent crime will live a prosperous life in jail and enjoy themselves?

your arguement is a "straw man". I dont want to argue with you pal. And I trust we can do this civilly. But what you just said is untrue and can notbe taken seriously

 

[bwoodfolkgd74]

Originally Posted by wawaweewa

No.
One innocent person killed as a result of the death penalty negates all of its positive effects.

best answer

 

[jimmybeanz]

i believe in it. i think serial killers and rapists should face the death penalty.

 

[danny tanner]

Originally Posted by SiMPLYDiMPLY

i used to but now i think death is the easy way out. let them suffer here on earth with the rest of us. just suffer slightly more without any freedoms.

This.

 

[aka king arthur]

For any and all people who are saying it is too expensive to keep people in jail i ask this

How much are their lives worth to you?

now that you have that number ask yourself this

How much is your life worth?

because once you put a number on any mans life there is no telling where and when to draw the line.

 

[duke4005]

Originally Posted by Gello 201

Originally Posted by duke4005

Originally Posted by Gello 201

Im sorry but i have to cut you off on a few things. If person X is put to death, it statistically does not stop person y, and z from committing the same crime. There is no water tight confession, the burden of proof in criminal court is 99.9% guilty. The 'mentally challenged' we are going back and forth about are to be removed from society permanently. They can be studied to hopefully find major or even minor breakthroughs to prevent future crimes. It is also cost effective to keep them locked up forever, as opposed to putting them to death. On a side note, I am thoroughly enjoying this discussion.

But does it stop person X from getting out on a technicality and doing it again? From spending 12 years in prison and getting out on a "goodbehavior" stint and going back into it? Yes. So then if person Y and Z do the same thing, strap them down and get it over with. And yes, if you have aperson, let's say McVeigh, who admits he did it, waves appeals, and let's the trial go the way it goes naturally, that to me is water-tight. I stilldon't see why it is cost-effective to keep them locked up forever. I believe the figures were $44,000 a year to keep them locked up, and $1 million for thedeath penalty. In 25 years that is equal. Most are on death row for half that (except in Texas), so in reality it does cost more. The secret is to stream-linethe process. If there is any possible doubt (if the person did not outright confess, have the body with them/lead authorities to it, videotape of the murderand knowledge of why it occured), then the death penalty is not an option. Eye-witness accounts are not enough to warrant it, unless corroborated by theperpetrator. And yes, I am enjoying this also. Ususally I am stuck in Shoe Reviews or S&T, so this is good.

 

[j burner]

Originally Posted by AKA King Arthur

Originally Posted by J Burner

Originally Posted by AKA King Arthur

Originally Posted by J Burner

Originally Posted by AKA King Arthur


no I dontit is no mans right to take another human life.

So then why should people who take another person's life be allowed to live? Or did you forget that the person being executed took another person's life, and in some cases took multiple lives. I'll say it again:

If God did the job, we wouldn't have to. So we are supposed to let murderers and child rapists frollick and be merry until the day they die, and hope that they are judged accordingly by a God that may or may not exist, and then sent to a mythical place called Hell, whose existence also can not be confirmed by any living person. No thanks, I'll take actual justice.

Thank god our justice system takes extordianry stepts to keep religion out of the court room (and fam just so you know this God you speak of could not be real)

In America we have the best Justice system in the world. Sure it is an inperfect system but is as good as it can be.

I dont condone murder at all. But in this country we have a system in place to punish people who commit crimes like this. They are not "merry until the day they die" they are in prison with their liberty and freedom stripped away. And that feeling my friend is far from merry

Again, you're thinking with the mind of a normal person, you're assuming the mind of a violent criminal works the same as yours. How do you know a sociopath is not perfectly content to live in jail? Some of these people are treated better in jail than they are in the streets. These people build lives in prison, become rulers of the domain, some of them even get special treatment from the C.O.'s. People who know they have no chance of ever leaving prison can have a mindset of being able to do whatever they want, because they know there is nothing more you can do to them, there is no more consequence. Whats the next punishment after life in prison?

so we should assume that every person who commits a violent crime is certifiably crazy?

Moreover than that should we also assume that any and every person who commits a violent crime will live a prosperous life in jail and enjoy themselves?

your arguement is a "straw man". I dont want to argue with you pal. And I trust we can do this civilly. But what you just said is untrue and can not be taken seriously

Dude, I didn't say anything about being certified crazy. A sociopath is not necessarily a complete nut job. My point was that a violent criminal'smind does not operate with the same set of values as those of us in the norm, thats what makes them a sociopath. To me and you the thought of life in prisonis horrible, but a violent sociopath capable of raping, torturing, and mutilating children does not view the world in the same way you and I do, which is whythey are capable of commiting those acts in the first place. So what I'm trying to say is that a person like that does not view life in prison in the samecontext as you do. And no, not every person has a prosperous life in jail and enjoys it, but some do, which is why i used the word some when i typedit

 

[duke4005]

Y'all need to check out National Geographic next time they do an Inside show. I know alot of these criminals are acting out for the cameras, but most ofthem do NOT want out. Matter of fact, majority on camera are scared to get out and are already talking about planning crimes so they can get back in. Granted,it is not death row inmates, but they are in major prisons across the country, most in the high-level security cells. they are not right in the head,regardless of what they thinik or there lawyers tell you.

 

[aka king arthur]

Originally Posted by J Burner

Originally Posted by AKA King Arthur

Originally Posted by J Burner

Originally Posted by AKA King Arthur

Originally Posted by J Burner

Originally Posted by AKA King Arthur


no I dontit is no mans right to take another human life.

So then why should people who take another person's life be allowed to live? Or did you forget that the person being executed took another person's life, and in some cases took multiple lives. I'll say it again:

If God did the job, we wouldn't have to. So we are supposed to let murderers and child rapists frollick and be merry until the day they die, and hope that they are judged accordingly by a God that may or may not exist, and then sent to a mythical place called Hell, whose existence also can not be confirmed by any living person. No thanks, I'll take actual justice.

Thank god our justice system takes extordianry stepts to keep religion out of the court room (and fam just so you know this God you speak of could not be real)

In America we have the best Justice system in the world. Sure it is an inperfect system but is as good as it can be.

I dont condone murder at all. But in this country we have a system in place to punish people who commit crimes like this. They are not "merry until the day they die" they are in prison with their liberty and freedom stripped away. And that feeling my friend is far from merry

Again, you're thinking with the mind of a normal person, you're assuming the mind of a violent criminal works the same as yours. How do you know a sociopath is not perfectly content to live in jail? Some of these people are treated better in jail than they are in the streets. These people build lives in prison, become rulers of the domain, some of them even get special treatment from the C.O.'s. People who know they have no chance of ever leaving prison can have a mindset of being able to do whatever they want, because they know there is nothing more you can do to them, there is no more consequence. Whats the next punishment after life in prison?

so we should assume that every person who commits a violent crime is certifiably crazy?

Moreover than that should we also assume that any and every person who commits a violent crime will live a prosperous life in jail and enjoy themselves?

your arguement is a "straw man". I dont want to argue with you pal. And I trust we can do this civilly. But what you just said is untrue and can not be taken seriously

Dude, I didn't say anything about being certified crazy. A sociopath is not necessarily a complete nut job. My point was that a violent criminal's mind does not operate with the same set of values as those of us in the norm, thats what makes them a sociopath. To me and you the thought of life in prison is horrible, but a violent sociopath capable of raping, torturing, and mutilating children does not view the world in the same way you and I do, which is why they are capable of commiting those acts in the first place. So what I'm trying to say is that a person like that does not view life in prison in the same context as you do. And no, not every person has a prosperous life in jail and enjoys it, but some do, which is why i used the word some when i typed it

I dont think you can speak for every violent criminal as to their values or mind set

every person who is violet is not a sociopath

2

I think that the thought of prison to a person who rapped and killed children is horrible. Just like I think the thought of prison is horrible

 

[j burner]

Originally Posted by duke4005

Y'all need to check out National Geographic next time they do an Inside show. I know alot of these criminals are acting out for the cameras, but most of them do NOT want out. Matter of fact, majority on camera are scared to get out and are already talking about planning crimes so they can get back in. Granted, it is not death row inmates, but they are in major prisons across the country, most in the high-level security cells. they are not right in the head, regardless of what they thinik or there lawyers tell you.

This is exactly what i'm trying to point out.

 

[asilva23]

i don't know if taking another human beings life if ever ok but in some instances, i would say yes.

a murderer, child molester, or someone who knowingly wears fakes would fit the criteria.

 

[charmcitykid]

no, because ppl can change and realize they were wrong and repent. also, it is up to God to decide how someone will be punished. life in prison is enough timefor them to think about what they did. (in most cases)

 

[j burner]

Originally Posted by AKA King Arthur

Originally Posted by J Burner

Originally Posted by AKA King Arthur

Originally Posted by J Burner

Originally Posted by AKA King Arthur

Originally Posted by J Burner

Originally Posted by AKA King Arthur


no I dontit is no mans right to take another human life.

So then why should people who take another person's life be allowed to live? Or did you forget that the person being executed took another person's life, and in some cases took multiple lives. I'll say it again:

If God did the job, we wouldn't have to. So we are supposed to let murderers and child rapists frollick and be merry until the day they die, and hope that they are judged accordingly by a God that may or may not exist, and then sent to a mythical place called Hell, whose existence also can not be confirmed by any living person. No thanks, I'll take actual justice.

Thank god our justice system takes extordianry stepts to keep religion out of the court room (and fam just so you know this God you speak of could not be real)

In America we have the best Justice system in the world. Sure it is an inperfect system but is as good as it can be.

I dont condone murder at all. But in this country we have a system in place to punish people who commit crimes like this. They are not "merry until the day they die" they are in prison with their liberty and freedom stripped away. And that feeling my friend is far from merry

Again, you're thinking with the mind of a normal person, you're assuming the mind of a violent criminal works the same as yours. How do you know a sociopath is not perfectly content to live in jail? Some of these people are treated better in jail than they are in the streets. These people build lives in prison, become rulers of the domain, some of them even get special treatment from the C.O.'s. People who know they have no chance of ever leaving prison can have a mindset of being able to do whatever they want, because they know there is nothing more you can do to them, there is no more consequence. Whats the next punishment after life in prison?

so we should assume that every person who commits a violent crime is certifiably crazy?

Moreover than that should we also assume that any and every person who commits a violent crime will live a prosperous life in jail and enjoy themselves?

your arguement is a "straw man". I dont want to argue with you pal. And I trust we can do this civilly. But what you just said is untrue and can not be taken seriously

Dude, I didn't say anything about being certified crazy. A sociopath is not necessarily a complete nut job. My point was that a violent criminal's mind does not operate with the same set of values as those of us in the norm, thats what makes them a sociopath. To me and you the thought of life in prison is horrible, but a violent sociopath capable of raping, torturing, and mutilating children does not view the world in the same way you and I do, which is why they are capable of commiting those acts in the first place. So what I'm trying to say is that a person like that does not view life in prison in the same context as you do. And no, not every person has a prosperous life in jail and enjoys it, but some do, which is why i used the word some when i typed it

I dont think you can speak for every violent criminal as to their values or mind set

every person who is violet is not a sociopath

2

I think that the thought of prison to a person who rapped and killed children is horrible. Just like I think the thought of prison is horrible

Before you go any further, please look up the definition of sociopath. You are confusing it with the term psychopath. A violent criminal is BY DEFINITION asociopath. And if you think that a person capable of raping and murdering children views prison in the same way that you do, then all I can tell you is thatyou are very mistaken. Serial killers are a good example of this, many times they want to be caught.

 

[dathbgboy]

J Burner u seem to have it all mapped out and ur way is flawless huh? I don't have a bleedin heart so u can cut that right now. U all willie nillie for thedeath penalyty but prolly the same FOOL complainin about the state of the economy.

And lets be technical, if the executioner kills a convicted (and lets not forget that some are wrongfully convicted and executed) morally, what does that makethe executioner? Exactly, so don't run aeound like ure way is just when its more flawed than those who are against cap punishment who u keep tryna #%@+ on

 

[aka king arthur]

^ that does not necessarily man they are a sociopath

they could have a litany other things wrong with them

 

[j burner]

^^^dude, please look up the definition of sociopath. Please. NVM, here it is:

Sociopath: Someone whose social behavior is extremely abnormal. Sociopaths are interested only in their personal needs and desires, without concern for theeffects of their behavior on others.


In other words, a sociopath is someone who does not adhere to the norms of society. If the norm in society is not to kill people, then someone who killspeople is a sociopath. If the norm in society is not to rape women, and someone likes to rape women, they are a sociopath, etc....