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Training camp will tell a lot. Remember rumor has it he was acting up last camp to the point where Vogel said he knew it wasn’t gonna work right away
**LA LAKERS THREAD** Sitting on 17! 2023-2024 offseason begins
- Thread in 'Sports & Training' Thread starter Started by licensed to ball,
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I mean Darvin can’t bench him when there’s no game being played
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If Russ plays better under Ham...
Maybe Frank was the problem....
Not getting my hopes up though.
Maybe Frank was the problem....
Not getting my hopes up though.
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I believe it when I see it. Russ has played for four teams in four years. You can go back and watch all of his press conferences and interviews before the seasons start. He always says the right thing but never follows through. He talks about wanting to be held accountable yet he still falls asleep on defense and refuses to move without the ball after all these years.
Russell Westbrook has played for six NBA coaches and none of them have gotten him to adjust. At a certain point, it's not the coaches it's the player.
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Hijo Del Promo
formerly xxhu5sl1npnoyxx
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82-0, yall dont know.
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In all fairness to Russ, he’s had both team and individual success in the league up until maybe the last two seasons. Not really much of a need to adapt when what you’re doing is working for the most part. During his prime I guess his offensive production was good enough where he could get a pass for his lapses on D but obviously now that’s not the case.
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Also in fairness to Russ, pelinka and Vogel had him out there with: DJ, Baze and a 19% from 3 AD.
darthska
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Nah, we were flat out TERRIBLE w/ Kobe a few seasons... because of the rest of the roster.
Our roster, as currently constructed, is disjointed, confusing, and without identity.
Trust-el Westbrook.
-foe
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all i know is westbrook shattered the record for most airballs in one season last season and you cant really blame that on anybody but westbrook himself
most of them air balls wasnt even from 3 point range either
most of them air balls wasnt even from 3 point range either
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The layups, the air balls, no defense.
But hopefully it's different under ham.
But hopefully it's different under ham.
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Nah, we were flat out TERRIBLE w/ Kobe a few seasons... because of the rest of the roster.
Our roster, as currently constructed, is disjointed, confusing, and without identity.
Trust-el Westbrook.
-foe
Exactly. Kobe had Tierre brown and chucky atkins. Team was trash. But Kobe played great.
No excuse for Russ being trash regardless of the players around him
Baze and DJ don’t make him hit the top of the board on a midrange shot. Or get lost on D 12 times per game or the TOs and bad shots and missed dunks and layups
I’m not saying he needs to elevate a trash roster to wins I’m just saying he needs to not be trash himself
darthska
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Ok to that end I gotchu. I took it with a team meaning.
I think a part of me is still a Bestbrook fan despite watching him up close and personal for a year now on my team. And I think I'm also operating from a place where I know he's most likely playing with us next season.
-foe
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Player types the Lakers should target in free agency to maximize Darvin Ham’s vision
Los Angeles Lakers head coach Darvin Ham offered a preview of his stylistic preferences during his introductory press conference on Monday.
Offensively, he wants the Lakers to deploy a four-out, one-in system, emphasizing passing, player movement off the ball and transition offense — the latter of which he mentioned multiples times in various interviews throughout the day.
“We have to get the ball on side to side,” Ham said. “You heard the term play with the pass, share the ball, make it easy on yourself. Instead of going one-on-four, one-on-five, you go play with your teammates, and also three-on-two situations, or two-on-one situations, caused you just moved the ball. You didn’t sit, hold it, dribble 18 times. Like, there has to be a rhythm of all the body movement.”
Ham, a defensive-leaning coach according to those who know him, will lead with that end of the floor. Milwaukee Bucks head coach Mike Budenholzer was notably meticulous with his defensive strategy and that quality rubbed off on his protégé.
“Defensively is where you’re gonna see our biggest leaps and bounds,” Ham said. “It starts on the defensive end, and from there, we’re gonna build back to it on offense.”
Ham’s comments offer a blueprint into the types of players the Lakers will pursue to fill out their roster. As a reminder, here are the Lakers currently projected to be on next season’s roster:
3-and-D wings
Targets: Otto Porter Jr., Bruce Brown, Nicolas Batum, T.J. Warren, Wesley Matthews, Caleb Martin, Cody Martin, Danuel House, Taurean Prince, Gary Harris, Joe Ingles, Amir Coffey
The Lakers need to add at least a couple of players — ideally, in the 6-foot-6 to 6-foot-9 range — that can defend multiple positions, make 3s at a 35-plus percent clip and help grease the wheels offensively when needed (cut, push the ball in transition, attack closeouts, crash the offensive glass, etc.).
It’s difficult to find players for the taxpayer midlevel exception that check every box. Half of the above players will likely make more than that. But the Lakers need to prioritize this archetype after striking out so badly this season. They can offer a starting frontcourt spot, significant playing time and exposure that most playoff teams can’t match.
Part of the reason for the drop-off in last season’s defense was losing Kentavious-Caldwell Pope, Kyle Kuzma and Alex Caruso — players that fit this skill set, to varying degrees. This is the lifeblood of the new NBA. Look at the teams that made the conference finals: The Golden State Warriors, Boston Celtics, Miami Heat and Dallas Mavericks. They each have multiple 3-and-D players and small-ball lineups that are versatile and switchable.
The Lakers just don’t have those types of players. Their current wings can’t shoot and/or are undersized.
James fits the mold, of course, but he’s overqualified, will be 38 years old next season and has to carry a heavy scoring and playmaking load. Davis can slide down and defend wings — as he’s done against the Clippers’ Kawhi Leonard and Paul George — but that often takes him away from the paint, where he’s a monster help defender, and it’s physically taxing.
They need help. The Lakers need better wings.
Stretch-5s
Targets: Mo Bamba, Chris Boucher, Bobby Portis, Dewayne Dedmon, Thomas Bryant, Jeff Green, Serge Ibaka, Nemanja Bjelica, Mike Muscala, Gorgui Dieng
With three scorers that live in the paint — James, Davis and Westbrook — one of the easier ways to create driving lanes and maintain spacing is with a stretch-five. A four-out, one-in offense doesn’t have to mean only Davis on the interior. It can also be James, who’s a mismatch nightmare in the post, or Westbrook, who can still expose smaller guards and weaker wings. A stretch big is an easy way to open up the floor.
Aside from Marc Gasol, the Lakers haven’t had a stretch-five in the James-Davis era. They’ve trended toward more athletic, rim-running bigs. The blueprint worked in 2019-20 with JaVale McGee and Dwight Howard but fell flat in 2020-21 with Andre Drummond and 2021-22 with a washed-up DeAndre Jordan and an older Howard. Perhaps it’s time to rethink their approach.
Depending on who they’re able to sign, this type of player could potentially start alongside Davis, allowing the Lakers to keep him at power forward while remaining bigger defensively. But the key, in that case, is finding a player who could protect the rim, too. Not all of the above names can do that — in fact, some are defensive liabilities.
The Lakers have limited spending power, though. Barring Myles Turner or Brook Lopez becoming available via trade, L.A. will likely be adding a fringe starter or third/fourth big.
Mobile/athletic bigs
Targets: Kevon Looney, Nic Claxton, JaVale McGee, Isaiah Hartenstein, Damian Jones, Bismack Biyombo
This is the type of big the Lakers have preferred in the James-Davis era, as they’re traditionally better at finishing in the paint, rebounding and protecting the rim than the stretch-five archetype (there are exceptions, of course).
Assuming Davis starts at center as the primary “in” player in Ham’s offense, their backup center may be the only traditional center on the roster. The Lakers can still make these types of players work within Ham’s system, but they’ll need younger, more athletic and more effective options than Jordan and Howard.
At a minimum, they need one athletic, defensive-minded backup center as Davis insurance.
Defensive-minded guards
Targets: Gary Payton II, Victor Oladipo, Ricky Rubio, Delon Wright, Jevon Carter, Austin Rivers
The Lakers’ backcourt heavily trends toward scoring. Westbrook, Nunn and Horton-Tucker are shoot-first ballhandlers and playmakers. Reaves is the only plus-defender, and even then, with his current frame, there are certain matchups he can’t hold up in.
Los Angeles needs better backcourt defense. It’s more of a secondary need than a primary need, as Reaves and Johnson — and possibly Nunn or Horton-Tucker — can use their length against smaller and quicker ballhandlers. But there will come a time when the Lakers need a specialist who can lock in for at least 15 to 20 minutes a night against a star ballhandler or a spark-plug scorer.
As Ham said in his introduction, good defense generates good offense and vice versa. If the Lakers can add a player or two who can pressure the ball, play passing lanes and generally wreak havoc, they’ll have a shot to recreate the fast-breaking identity that made them so imposing during their championship season.
Los Angeles Lakers head coach Darvin Ham offered a preview of his stylistic preferences during his introductory press conference on Monday.
Offensively, he wants the Lakers to deploy a four-out, one-in system, emphasizing passing, player movement off the ball and transition offense — the latter of which he mentioned multiples times in various interviews throughout the day.
“We have to get the ball on side to side,” Ham said. “You heard the term play with the pass, share the ball, make it easy on yourself. Instead of going one-on-four, one-on-five, you go play with your teammates, and also three-on-two situations, or two-on-one situations, caused you just moved the ball. You didn’t sit, hold it, dribble 18 times. Like, there has to be a rhythm of all the body movement.”
Ham, a defensive-leaning coach according to those who know him, will lead with that end of the floor. Milwaukee Bucks head coach Mike Budenholzer was notably meticulous with his defensive strategy and that quality rubbed off on his protégé.
“Defensively is where you’re gonna see our biggest leaps and bounds,” Ham said. “It starts on the defensive end, and from there, we’re gonna build back to it on offense.”
Ham’s comments offer a blueprint into the types of players the Lakers will pursue to fill out their roster. As a reminder, here are the Lakers currently projected to be on next season’s roster:
- Anthony Davis
- Wenyen Gabriel
- LeBron James
- Stanley Johnson
- Austin Reaves
- Talen Horton-Tucker
- Kendrick Nunn
- Russell Westbrook
3-and-D wings
Targets: Otto Porter Jr., Bruce Brown, Nicolas Batum, T.J. Warren, Wesley Matthews, Caleb Martin, Cody Martin, Danuel House, Taurean Prince, Gary Harris, Joe Ingles, Amir Coffey
The Lakers need to add at least a couple of players — ideally, in the 6-foot-6 to 6-foot-9 range — that can defend multiple positions, make 3s at a 35-plus percent clip and help grease the wheels offensively when needed (cut, push the ball in transition, attack closeouts, crash the offensive glass, etc.).
It’s difficult to find players for the taxpayer midlevel exception that check every box. Half of the above players will likely make more than that. But the Lakers need to prioritize this archetype after striking out so badly this season. They can offer a starting frontcourt spot, significant playing time and exposure that most playoff teams can’t match.
Part of the reason for the drop-off in last season’s defense was losing Kentavious-Caldwell Pope, Kyle Kuzma and Alex Caruso — players that fit this skill set, to varying degrees. This is the lifeblood of the new NBA. Look at the teams that made the conference finals: The Golden State Warriors, Boston Celtics, Miami Heat and Dallas Mavericks. They each have multiple 3-and-D players and small-ball lineups that are versatile and switchable.
The Lakers just don’t have those types of players. Their current wings can’t shoot and/or are undersized.
James fits the mold, of course, but he’s overqualified, will be 38 years old next season and has to carry a heavy scoring and playmaking load. Davis can slide down and defend wings — as he’s done against the Clippers’ Kawhi Leonard and Paul George — but that often takes him away from the paint, where he’s a monster help defender, and it’s physically taxing.
They need help. The Lakers need better wings.
Stretch-5s
Targets: Mo Bamba, Chris Boucher, Bobby Portis, Dewayne Dedmon, Thomas Bryant, Jeff Green, Serge Ibaka, Nemanja Bjelica, Mike Muscala, Gorgui Dieng
With three scorers that live in the paint — James, Davis and Westbrook — one of the easier ways to create driving lanes and maintain spacing is with a stretch-five. A four-out, one-in offense doesn’t have to mean only Davis on the interior. It can also be James, who’s a mismatch nightmare in the post, or Westbrook, who can still expose smaller guards and weaker wings. A stretch big is an easy way to open up the floor.
Aside from Marc Gasol, the Lakers haven’t had a stretch-five in the James-Davis era. They’ve trended toward more athletic, rim-running bigs. The blueprint worked in 2019-20 with JaVale McGee and Dwight Howard but fell flat in 2020-21 with Andre Drummond and 2021-22 with a washed-up DeAndre Jordan and an older Howard. Perhaps it’s time to rethink their approach.
Depending on who they’re able to sign, this type of player could potentially start alongside Davis, allowing the Lakers to keep him at power forward while remaining bigger defensively. But the key, in that case, is finding a player who could protect the rim, too. Not all of the above names can do that — in fact, some are defensive liabilities.
The Lakers have limited spending power, though. Barring Myles Turner or Brook Lopez becoming available via trade, L.A. will likely be adding a fringe starter or third/fourth big.
Mobile/athletic bigs
Targets: Kevon Looney, Nic Claxton, JaVale McGee, Isaiah Hartenstein, Damian Jones, Bismack Biyombo
This is the type of big the Lakers have preferred in the James-Davis era, as they’re traditionally better at finishing in the paint, rebounding and protecting the rim than the stretch-five archetype (there are exceptions, of course).
Assuming Davis starts at center as the primary “in” player in Ham’s offense, their backup center may be the only traditional center on the roster. The Lakers can still make these types of players work within Ham’s system, but they’ll need younger, more athletic and more effective options than Jordan and Howard.
At a minimum, they need one athletic, defensive-minded backup center as Davis insurance.
Defensive-minded guards
Targets: Gary Payton II, Victor Oladipo, Ricky Rubio, Delon Wright, Jevon Carter, Austin Rivers
The Lakers’ backcourt heavily trends toward scoring. Westbrook, Nunn and Horton-Tucker are shoot-first ballhandlers and playmakers. Reaves is the only plus-defender, and even then, with his current frame, there are certain matchups he can’t hold up in.
Los Angeles needs better backcourt defense. It’s more of a secondary need than a primary need, as Reaves and Johnson — and possibly Nunn or Horton-Tucker — can use their length against smaller and quicker ballhandlers. But there will come a time when the Lakers need a specialist who can lock in for at least 15 to 20 minutes a night against a star ballhandler or a spark-plug scorer.
As Ham said in his introduction, good defense generates good offense and vice versa. If the Lakers can add a player or two who can pressure the ball, play passing lanes and generally wreak havoc, they’ll have a shot to recreate the fast-breaking identity that made them so imposing during their championship season.
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No **** Sherlock. ******* kuz needs to shut the **** up. I’m getting sick of this guy.
Who the **** said it was ever 4 smalls to win a title. It’s always been big wings and or bigs period.
“The other two need to be hoopers”
Whatever that means.
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Kuz an NTer confirmed
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Speaking of losers with too much time on their hands. Here’s a trade I made up:
Wiz come off Porzingus and free up cap to pair someone with Beal next summer
Wiz come off Porzingus and free up cap to pair someone with Beal next summer
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Kuz has no clue what he sayin lol...
gotta know your history. This always been a big man's game as long as your team got solid big men.
Some of the best title teams of all time ALL had size, length, and at least 2 bigs. A 4-smalls lineup will NEVER win a title, not in this sport.
Cartwright 7-0, Grant 6-10, Pippen 6-8 Jordan 6-6, Paxson 6-4
Longley 7-2, Rodman 6-8, Pippen 6-8, Jordan 6-6, Harper 6-6
Shaq 7-0, Horry 6-10, Fox 6-7, Kobe 6-6, Fish 6-2
Bynum 7-0, Gasol 7-0, Odom 6-10, Kobe 6-6, Fish 6-2
Kareem 7-2, Green 6-9, Worthy 6-9, Scott 6-4, Magic 6-9
Parish 7-0, McHale 6-10, Bird 6-9, Ainge 6-5, Johnson 6-3
Perkins 6-10, Garnett 6-11, Pierce 6-7, Allen 6-5, Rondo 6-3
Duncan 7-0, Horry 6-10, Bowen 6-7, Ginobili 6-6, Parker 6-2
Robinson 7-1, Duncan 7-0, Elliott 6-8, Elie 6-6, Johnson 5-10
McGee 7-0, Durant 6-10, Green 6-7, Klay 6-6, Curry 6-2
McGee 7-0, AD 6-10, Bron 6-8, Green 6-6, KCP 6-5
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Made me chuckle
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AD dont have a vengeful bone in his body
and if he did, itd be bruised and he'd be out for 3-4 weeks
and if he did, itd be bruised and he'd be out for 3-4 weeks
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I never liked the phrase small ball, because it’s not about putting a bunch of small dudes on the floor. It should be called skill ball, because it’s mostly about playing guys who can switch on defense and dribble/pass/shoot on offense.
I saw the Kuz tweet and posted it, but I thought his specialist comment was more geared at players like Duncan Robinson or Patty Mills…dudes who can shoot but don’t do nuch of anything else out on the floor.
