Is Lebron James still the best basketball player right now?

[junglejim]

Here we go with the X straight finals arguments. Please tell me what teams bron beat in the eastern conference that were note worthy to get there?

Celtics big three when they were all in their mid 30s?

If we are going to make this argument, where does Jerry west belong? Dude has damn near the same career averages as lebron before you say that's a ridiculous argument.

Point is, who gives a **** if someone goes to the finals and loses

 

[MVP]

Lol nah homie that’s exactly what YOU are doing. Any objective fan sees that Kobe doesn’t have a tangible argument over LeBron at this point. Using anecdotal straw man arguments like “stacked teams” and “iverson said Kobes better so he must be” is all you can resort too. Meanwhile every single major statistic favors LeBron over Kobe and almost everyone else. It just is what it is.

Bron at this moment doesn't have more points, steals, rings or all NBA league selections than Kobe. He doesn't have more rebounds, blocks, rings, or all NBA selections than Duncan. He doesn't have more points, rebounds, blocks, rings, MVPs, or all NBA selections than Kareem. He doesn't have more assists and rings than Magic. Those are all facts. No matter how many times you continue to say he has every stat advantage over everyone it doesn't matter. That's not changing right now.

YOU were the one that said oh 'insert legend' said Kobe was better than Bron years ago yet when evidence is brought up to refute that you move the goalposts again.

 

[hand2handking]

81

 

[wavycrocket]

Bron at this moment doesn't have more points, steals, rings or all NBA league selections than Kobe. He doesn't have more rebounds, blocks, rings, or all NBA selections than Duncan. He doesn't have more points, rebounds, blocks, rings, MVPs, or all NBA selections than Kareem. He doesn't have more assists and rings than Magic. Those are all facts. No matter how many times you continue to say he has every stat advantage over everyone it doesn't matter. That's not changing right now.

YOU were the one that said oh 'insert legend said Kobe was better than Bron years ago yet when evidence is brought up to refute that you move the goalposts again.

Sprinkle some Holy Water on em while you at it woe!

Dat Boi preaching

 

[MambaMentality824]

Bron at this moment doesn't have more points, steals, rings or all NBA league selections than Kobe. He doesn't have more rebounds, blocks, rings, or all NBA selections than Duncan. He doesn't have more points, rebounds, blocks, rings, MVPs, or all NBA selections than Kareem. He doesn't have more assists and rings than Magic. Those are all facts. No matter how many times you continue to say he has every stat advantage over everyone it doesn't matter. That's not changing right now.

YOU were the one that said oh 'insert legend' said Kobe was better than Bron years ago yet when evidence is brought up to refute that you move the goalposts again.

Lol your argument is so garbage you have to resort to cumulative statistics for players that have played 5 more seasons over LeBron and even then he’s already close in those areas. Knowing damn well LeBron final statistical spread will be by far more impressive and his averages are irrefutably superior. That’s not even taking into account the playoff statistic argument in which Bron blows Kobe out and is already more impressive than Kareem, only Jordan is on his level. Again, I’ve made my argument based on real numbers and laid them ALL OUT in one of my posts while you continue to scream rings and a few all nba selections that you damn well know Bron will also pass. Whatever though I’m done with this argument I’ve made my case, you can continue to fan boy all you want.

 

[MVP]

Lol your argument is so garbage you have to resort to cumulative statistics for players that have played 5 more seasons over LeBron and even then he’s already close in those areas. Knowing damn well LeBron final statistical spread will be by far more impressive and his averages are irrefutably superior. That’s not even taking into account the playoff statistic argument in which Bron blows Kobe out and is already more impressive than Kareem, only Jordan is on his level. Again, I’ve made my argument based on real numbers and laid them ALL OUT in one of my posts while you continue to scream rings and a few all nba selections that you damn well know Bron will also pass. Whatever though I’m done with this argument I’ve made my case, you can continue to fan boy all you want.

Unless Bron plays another decade he ain't passing Duncan, Kobe, or Kareem in all league selections as he's 11 behind Duncan, 8 behind Kobe, and 7 behind Kareem. Also not winning any more rings or MVPs. So again you're wrong.

He's doesn't have the best scoring, rebound, assist average among any of those players. You talk about playoff stats and use totals but I can't do it in regular season? Hell KD is nipping right at his heels basically tied regular season and playoff points.

I'm glad you're done though for the umpteenth time. I'm tired of schooling you.

 

[wavycrocket]

Unless Bron plays another decade he ain't passing Duncan, Kobe, or Kareem in all league selections as he's 11 behind Duncan, 8 behind Kobe, and 7 behind Kareem. Also not winning any more rings or MVPs. So again you're wrong.

If Bron stays in Cleveland, The next few years are going to be spent with Bron putting up gaudy numbers, while playing no defense and chasing statistical milestones due to his longevity and stamina. Him beating the likes of the pacers and raptors....while not being able to secure anymore meaningful awards that ultimately count in these discussions going forward (MVPs, Finals MVPs, Championships etc) wont matter to the people who already decided he’s “GOAT”. He’ll just keep losing, racking up counting stats, and we’ll marvel and continue elevating him without him clearly surpassing those who’ve accomplished more than him already.

There’s no way I can put Bron over Kareem, MJ, Magic and Duncan. They’ve literally done everything he’s done, lost less....and more for clearly 3 of them.

That’s not unreasonable. Bron playing with house money in the “legacy” game right now. Everything he does is going to be spun into a plus. Whether he ultimately wins or loses. First time he hasn’t had the deck stacked in almost a decade and he’s become a marty for “lack of help” in the Eastern Conference.

Crazy

 

[Lovetohate3000]

Facts wavy.
Once again LeBron is Peyton manning. All the stats but more to the game then just stats.

Pro LeBron dudes flip the narrative so much .
" They've played way longer. "
Jordan played two less years and is way more accomplished yet they are just always so quick to try to pull the " LeBron is going to own all the records when he retires he has to be in the convo with Mike or be better "

Recency bias is real. Lot of prisoner of the moments

 

[ForNarnia]

I don’t think LeBron will have that much a cakewalk in the East for the remainder of his career as people seem to think.

East has the younger talent and will be much more competitive for years to come. We all know the Warriors and Rockets run the West right now but Celtics, 6ers and Bucks will be making some noise these next few years. Who knows what moves Raptors make given that they just failed big time.

 

[JD617]

34-9-9 on 63% TS, multiple game-winning shots at the buzzer, and the Skip Bayless clones are still wearing their keyboards out. That’s impressive.

 

[tekthemaestro]

Lol your argument is so garbage you have to resort to cumulative statistics for players that have played 5 more seasons over LeBron and even then he’s already close in those areas. Knowing damn well LeBron final statistical spread will be by far more impressive and his averages are irrefutably superior. That’s not even taking into account the playoff statistic argument in which Bron blows Kobe out and is already more impressive than Kareem, only Jordan is on his level. Again, I’ve made my argument based on real numbers and laid them ALL OUT in one of my posts while you continue to scream rings and a few all nba selections that you damn well know Bron will also pass. Whatever though I’m done with this argument I’ve made my case, you can continue to fan boy all you want.

hold on.... so NOW you acknowledge that certain people have better stats only because they played more seasons? how does that not apply to lebron playing more seasons/games than the people yall say hes better than? all of these playoffs records only coming cuz hes played more games and more minutes than ANYONE EVER.... but u dont acknowledge that. as for the rest...

boy....

 

[ForNarnia]

hold on.... so NOW you acknowledge that certain people have better stats only because they played more seasons? how does that not apply to lebron playing more seasons/games than the people yall say hes better than? all of these playoffs records only coming cuz hes played more games and more minutes than ANYONE EVER.... but u dont acknowledge that. as for the rest...

boy....

It’s not that he’s played more seasons it’s that he’s HEALTHY pretty much EVERY season. That’s whats impressive. He got miles on his legs and body but he’s still putting up numbers in year 15. Probably still has 2 years of his absolute prime left.

His production at this stage of his career is way more impressive than Jordans. Who knows if KD or Steph or whoever will even be this productive in their 15th year

 

[wavycrocket]

34-9-9 on 63% TS, multiple game-winning shots at the buzzer, and the Skip Bayless clones are still wearing their keyboards out. That’s impressive.

Yeah man....that’s impressive. But that doesn’t move the needle at all when in these “all time discussions”. He does that in a finals WIN....Moves the needle. Just how 2016 FIRMLY moved him into the 4-8 range.

That’s how this works.

 

[tekthemaestro]

It’s not that he’s played more seasons it’s that he’s HEALTHY pretty much EVERY season. That’s whats impressive. He got miles on his legs and body but he’s still putting up numbers in year 15. Probably still has 2 years of his absolute prime left.

His production at this stage of his career is way more impressive than Jordans. Who knows if KD or Steph or whoever will even be this productive in their 15th year

....
so now you're moving the goal posts to the next field and saying hes the greatest cuz hes been playing for so long and is still doing better than expected for his tenure? when you say someone is the BEST BASKETBALL PLAYER or that theyre the GREATEST OF ALL TIME.... you cant stand on what might happen in the future, or give participation trophies. they either are or they arent. people say lebron jumped over mj in the goat conversation cuz of all the records lebron has broken. they ignore the ridiculous difference in games played between the two.

example: "Lebron has officially passed scottie pippen for most postseason steals" everyone goes crazy. completely ignores that pippen played 208 games. Lebron by that night had playd 237. Thats nearly THIRTY more games, to accomplish the same feat.

example: "Lebron has now passed Jordan in FG made in post season" everyones like "ZOMG hes beat jordan in yet ANOTHER category! GOAT!" completely ignores that Jordan played only 179 post season games in his career.... by the time lebron passed him, he was in game 218.

At this point, we're giving lebron the "tried the hardest for the longest period of time" award and saying thats good enough to be equal to or better than "best to ever do it." CUT IT OUT

 

[SplinterMatic319]

Per game>totals

Lebron is no goat

 

[hennessy beach]

People only like Kobe because he was a variant version of Jordan.

End of the day, GOAT conversations are subjective. Everyone will sway the needle depending on what's important to them as a basketball player.

Lebron is the GOAT imo, that's from eye test, stats, and story

Subjectively, I could care less about going 6/6 in the finals. Winning a championship in a team sport isn't a good enough barrier for how great someone is. I care about me watching the player on tv and who looks the best to me. Individually Lebron backs up what I see more (style of play, harder comp, league dynamics i.e game speed, social media era).

Just imagine what the legend of Lebron would be if he came first...

 

[wavycrocket]

HOAT

Healthiest Player of all time.

#NotMyGoat

 

[MVP]

People only like Kobe because he was a variant version of Jordan.

End of the day, GOAT conversations are subjective. Everyone will sway the needle depending on what's important to them as a basketball player.

Lebron is the GOAT imo, that's from eye test, stats, and story

Subjectively, I could care less about going 6/6 in the finals. Winning a championship in a team sport isn't a good enough barrier for how great someone is. I care about me watching the player on tv and who looks the best to me. Individually Lebron backs up what I see more (style of play, harder comp, league dynamics i.e game speed, social media era).

Just imagine what the legend of Lebron would be if he came first...

Eye test: MJ was more complete player on both ends of the court

Stats: they still favor MJ

Harder comp: laughable

It's harder to play now because of Twitter? Lmaooo

Y'all continue to say winning doesn't matter, but be honest if Bron had all his same stats, MVPs, but was devoid of a chip would he even be top 10 all time yet alone in the GOAT convo?

 

[hand2handking]

Lebron is like being given credit for a game 7 instead of never having to play a game 7

 

[SplinterMatic319]

Every player has different set of skills, its how you translate those skills to winning. For MJ, he happened to be the GOAT at Scoring and arguably perimeter defense and help defense. My eye test showed he was the most skilled scorer ever, had no flaw aside from 3pt but he hit those when he needed to. Those skills translated to 6 championships.

Lebron is #NotMyGoat

 

[Sonny Corinthos]

lol at Kobe being better than Lebron .

 

[hennessy beach]

Eye test: MJ was more complete player on both ends of the court

Stats: they still favor MJ

Harder comp: laughable

It's harder to play now because of Twitter? Lmaooo

1. I don't agree...that's why it's an eye test. This argument about Jordan being so great on D is what we would see today if Bron played with Kawhi. But it's an eye test so we just see differently...

2. 27,7,7 with better fg%, 3pt% > 30,6,5 with better ft% (my opinion of course). Also nobody will ever average 30 + for their career because the league is different where players are offsprings of Lebron not Jordan...

3. Very laughable if you think mj's comp was better

4. Not that it's harder to play but Lebron is criticized much more becasue of it. We praise Jordan because we didn't see him everyday, it was part of the allure. Similar to Michael Jackson; knowing damn well Chris Brown is a better dancer and Beyonce is a better performer, and Kanye is a bigger influence

 

[hennessy beach]

Every player has different set of skills, its how you translate those skills to winning. For MJ, he happened to be the GOAT at Scoring and arguably perimeter defense and help defense. My eye test showed he was the most skilled scorer ever, had no flaw aside from 3pt but he hit those when he needed to. Those skills translated to 6 championships.

Lebron is #NotMyGoat

I think Lebron has mastered more skills than MJ

Mj being the best at scoring isn't what won him those titles...which is why rings are bs. You put Jordan on one of the bottom seed teams in the 90's and they barely sniff the playoffs.

 

[SplinterMatic319]

It's the same way with elevating teammates. Lebron elevates by assisting. Jordan elevated by leadership, holding teammates to higher standards in practice, defense etc... and he would fight you, get in your face if you were not up to standard.

 

[ForNarnia]

....
so now you're moving the goal posts to the next field and saying hes the greatest cuz hes been playing for so long and is still doing better than expected for his tenure? when you say someone is the BEST BASKETBALL PLAYER or that theyre the GREATEST OF ALL TIME.... you cant stand on what might happen in the future, or give participation trophies. they either are or they arent. people say lebron jumped over mj in the goat conversation cuz of all the records lebron has broken. they ignore the ridiculous difference in games played between the two.

example: "Lebron has officially passed scottie pippen for most postseason steals" everyone goes crazy. completely ignores that pippen played 208 games. Lebron by that night had playd 237. Thats nearly THIRTY more games, to accomplish the same feat.

example: "Lebron has now passed Jordan in FG made in post season" everyones like "ZOMG hes beat jordan in yet ANOTHER category! GOAT!" completely ignores that Jordan played only 179 post season games in his career.... by the time lebron passed him, he was in game 218.

At this point, we're giving lebron the "tried the hardest for the longest period of time" award and saying thats good enough to be equal to or better than "best to ever do it." CUT IT OUT

MJ was not in my initial argument. It was going against people claiming LeBrons peers (KD mostly) will eventually lap LeBron in what he’s accomplished in his career “of course LeBron is breaking records, KD will get there too eventually” narrative. Which is not the case. Who knows if he and whoever else is “nipping at his heels” holds up as long as LeBron has.