Grey market discussion thread (Let's keep the discussion mature) Rules on pg 1 please read before yo

[deezrsackolishus]

Holy hell meth

Hata takashi

Totally slipped my mind. And how?


Jesus that was forver ago. Back when nt ha barely any members haha.


Hatas. How the heck did i forget? Probly cuz i never owned a pair.

I just remember back on NT then it was bred into us, to utterly hate and not endorse fakes or anythin of the such

 

[deezrsackolishus]

Hmmm...2 mods consecutively posting about the same topic, but having different stances. Intriguing.

One is more than just a mod haha

 

[ninjahood]

those XVII's would have zero problems

The hell they would.  

Any college blue XVII with a 2012 production date is obviously fake.  No consignment store worth a damn would accept them.  They'd be knowingly selling bootleg sneakers.

but they dont have a 2012 tag meth, i think you gotta lay off da vegan wardrobe swag you been on and start doing some research on whats

been going on, seeing as how your run this place im SURE people who know exactly whats going on would LOVE to put you in da loop.

these aint hatatakhasi variant we talkin bout where bootleggers reverse engineer cheap fake jordans,

this is grey market, corrupt factories who DO have authorization in making nikes ABUSING their access.and making authentic jordans

without authorization...totally different beast all together.

 

[SteveSteve72]

One is more than just a mod haha

Yup.

 

[deezrsackolishus]

but they dont have a 2012 tag meth, i think you gotta lay off da vegan wardrobe swag you been on and start doing some research on whats

been going on, seeing as how your run this place im SURE people who know exactly whats going on would LOVE to put you in da loop.

these aint hatatakhasi variant we talkin bout where bootleggers reverse engineer cheap fake jordans,

this is grey market, corrupt factories who DO have authorization in making nikes ABUSING their access.and making authentic jordans

without authorization...totally different beast all together.

Well then from the smushed 23 on the xi,
We must get all the bgrade and cgrade as grey market shoes. Haha

They give nike the best and sell the grey market the crappiest ones!

Im kidding. No clue.

But nike dont care.

Thirst higher than ever

 

[ninjahood]

peep that tag.

 

[SteveSteve72]

Hmmm...2 mods consecutively posting about the same topic, but having different stances. Intriguing.

I don't really have a different stance, I was just stating in the end these grey market shoes are illegal.

 

[deezrsackolishus]

God i remember back then dudes used to swear so hard on their fakes being real.

"Oh he can get you any color, any year jordans. Even ones they never released!"

God how many times.

How do i teeeeeach theeeeeese kiiiiiiiiiiiiidsss

 

[deezrsackolishus]

And the outsole of those xvii looks funny

Jagged
The real ones were rounded
But pics 2 n 3 look suspect to me

 

[deezrsackolishus]

Haha they did get the ****** up placement of the peel off sticker right !!!! Lol

 

[ninjahood]

God i remember back then dudes used to swear so hard on their fakes being real.

"Oh he can get you any color, any year jordans. Even ones they never released!"

God how many times.

How do i teeeeeach theeeeeese kiiiiiiiiiiiiidsss

not for nothing, those were always horrible, sadly when you go to da 3rd world countries those kind of barber shop/liquor store

fakes are EVERYWHERE... but when you options are walking barefoot cuz you dirt poor i guess da last thing on your mind

is "hey..deez j's aren't fugazi are they?" dat poverty

 

[Methodical Management]

these aint hatatakhasi variant we talkin bout where bootleggers reverse engineer cheap fake jordans,

this is grey market, corrupt factories who DO have authorization in making nikes ABUSING their access.and making authentic jordans

without authorization...totally different beast all together.

You're pretending that this is a new development.  "After hours" fakes were around before you started collecting sneakers. 

As an observer, it's easy to sit back and laugh at how Nike's infamous labor strategy is coming back to haunt them - but they aren't the biggest losers in all of this.  

YOU ARE.  You're the one sitting there pretending that a bunch of moldy sneakers in your closet have been appreciating in value all these years, and yet you still haven't managed to realize that you're advocating the very thing that would decimate the value of your collection and turn the entire endeavor into an absolute joke.

If everyone thought "after hours fakes" were "just as good" as authentic pairs, the value of every single pair in your closet would be effectively flattened.  All those hours you spent waiting in line or online?  A waste.  Spending 1999 dollars on 1999 sneakers?  That's as sound an investment as keeping all your money in your mattress.  If anyone can buy any pair at any time for retail illegally and consider it "just as good," your collection could be duplicated by any kid with a summer job.  

Call them authentic.  Call them just as good.  You're turning every minute and every penny you spent on those "limited" sneakers into a complete and utter joke.  Doesn't hurt me.  My collection isn't my retirement fund.  Doesn't hurt Nike much.  They're still saving more on cheap labor than they're losing out on.  It's only hurting you - and the one and only thing protecting the value of your precious collection is the cachet that comes from owning 100% authentic, authorized products.  

So much for your "Porsche money."  

 

[anthracite8s]

peep that tag.

how do you know that the maker didn't take an image of a real tag and use it to make them seem more legit? do you think it's really that hard to print any old black font on a tag? I don't put much thought into tags or production dates anymore because clearly they can and have been using phony dates. the grey market space jams use phony dates obviously for the same reasons these ones do. frankly, the tag is the EASIEST thing on the entire shoe to get right.

 

[uknowbigearl]

Factories who make authentic pairs is still able to continue making shoes without Nike's approval. There's nothing nike can do about it because if they go to another factor they will do the same. That's why if anything we can only consider them as B grades. There is very little inspection to none for the end product. Just because nike doesn't authorize or give approval it doesn't mean its fake. Some of you guys need to understand how the economy and business work in this world. People are not gonna pay close to retail if they are fake! You can only ask for close to retail pricing if the material and the quality is identical. Take the shoe game out of context and think about it.... makes sense. 

In the end it's up to you whether or not to buy it.  

 

[ninjahood]

these aint hatatakhasi variant we talkin bout where bootleggers reverse engineer cheap fake jordans,

this is grey market, corrupt factories who DO have authorization in making nikes ABUSING their access.and making authentic jordans

without authorization...totally different beast all together.

You're pretending that this is a new development.  "After hours" fakes were around before you started collecting sneakers. 

As an observer, it's easy to sit back and laugh at how Nike's infamous labor strategy is coming back to haunt them - but they aren't the biggest losers in all of this.  

YOU ARE.  You're the one sitting there pretending that a bunch of moldy sneakers in your closet have been appreciating in value all these years, and yet you still haven't managed to realize that you're advocating the very thing that would decimate the value of your collection and turn the entire endeavor into an absolute joke.

If everyone thought "after hours fakes" were "just as good" as authentic pairs, the value of every single pair in your closet would be effectively flattened.  All those hours you spent waiting in line or online?  A waste.  Spending 1999 dollars on 1999 sneakers?  That's as sound an investment as keeping all your money in your mattress.  If anyone can buy any pair at any time for retail illegally and consider it "just as good," your collection could be duplicated by any kid with a summer job.  

Call them authentic.  Call them just as good.  You're turning every minute and every penny you spent on those "limited" sneakers into a complete and utter joke.  Doesn't hurt me.  My collection isn't my retirement fund.  Doesn't hurt Nike much.  They're still saving more on cheap labor than they're losing out on.  It's only hurting you - and the one and only thing protecting the value of your precious collection is the cachet that comes from owning 100% authentic, authorized products.  

So much for your "Porsche money."  

*cracks fingers*

1. you must think im one of these sneakercon/hypebeast/collecter cats waiting in line for hours for shoes or something

boy you get me ALL eff up in da game b.

2. yes we DO agree that nike's outsourcing practice is coming back to bite em in da ***, last time i checked i didn't work

for nike, in fact outsourcing cost a couple of my family members jobs and pushed em to early retirement

3. you think i CARE about da value of my sneakers after i bought them?

as da great Juelz Santana said when asked about

his jewelry and asked if he trades in his older pieces of new ones "spend money is spent money baby, we dont trade and sell

our old **** to get more ****, we buy new ****" i never copped sneakers for a fake resell hustle like some of these unemployed cats

up in here, im a fly dude, i work hard, so i spend harder

4. as you can already tell im a straight shooter w/ it, this ain't no advocacy of supporting "fakes" this is telling it how it is,

truth hurts baby, so when i say "yes those space jams that were grey market i held are identical to my retail pairs" its because

its da truth, eff sugar coating da truth because i have retail pairs..i dont care about that AT ALLLLLLLLLL, im about da TRUTH.

you must think i'm depending on these sneakers as my "retirement fund" da fact of da matter is im GREAT financially so i can

piss away "porsche money" on nikes & jordans AND i can tell people those grey market pairs are just as good as da pairs i dropped

retail for in brick and mortar stores...its da truth, i dont run away from da truth because its inconvenient to me, this is why my armor

is so bulletproof on this website, and in life in general. when your baseline is da truth, you can't go no where but up

5.meth you a vegan, your ATTEMPT to come at me because your assumption that i dont drive rings hollow, especially when i KNOW

u aint touching anything that involves your cute farm animal friends being lead to slaughter, that involves anything with 4 wheels and a engine.

unless you doubling back on your abstinence on vegan free products

 

[ninjahood]

Factories who make authentic pairs is still able to continue making shoes without Nike's approval. There's nothing nike can do about it because if they go to another factor they will do the same. That's why if anything we can only consider them as B grades. There is very little inspection to none for the end product. Just because nike doesn't authorize or give approval it doesn't mean its fake. Some of you guys need to understand how the economy and business work in this world. People are not gonna pay close to retail if they are fake! You can only ask for close to retail pricing if the material and the quality is identical. Take the shoe game out of context and think about it.... 

this is what i've BEEEEEN saying.

 

[Methodical Management]

Originally Posted by ninjahood  
 

*cracks fingers*

*rolls eyes*

I haven't seen anybody arguing this hard against their own interests since Uncle Ruckus.  

1. you must think im one of these sneakercon/hypebeast/collecter cats waiting in line for hours for shoes or something 

Gee, I wonder how someone could've gotten that impression.  

you think i CARE about da value of my sneakers after i bought them?

Yes, actually, considering you brag about it to anyone who'll listen.  

You've posted pictures of your closet several times in this thread alone.  

But why bother?  You could've just uploaded some pictures of a superior collection, like Pat's or Ijapino's, and claimed it as your own.  I mean, if nobody would ever know the difference, pretending to have something you really don't isn't a problem, right?  

Anyone working at the local print shop can have a degree from Harvard.

you must think i'm depending on these sneakers as my "retirement fund" da fact of da matter is im GREAT financially so i can

piss away "porsche money" on nikes & jordans AND i can tell people those grey market pairs are just as good as da pairs i dropped

retail for in brick and mortar stores

I don't have to say a word about your financial position.  We've all seen the video.  We know how you live.  It's not relevant to the discussion at hand and I've no need to insult you. 

Everyone here knows you care about your sneaker collection, and it's patently obvious that the widespread acceptance of illegitimate "after hours" fakes would render that collection all but worthless.  If you think otherwise, you're only fooling yourself.

There's a fundamental similarity between someone who buys cheap fakes and someone who buys "grey market" fakes.  Both are just trying to fool people into thinking that they own 100% legitimate pairs. 

If they were really "just as good," you wouldn't mind paying $2,000 for "grey market" Yeezys or $10,000 for "grey market" metallic Air Jordan I's.  Somehow, I doubt that's the case.

when your baseline is da truth, you can't go no where but up 

Isn't that the same thing people say when they hit rock bottom?  "There's nowhere to go but up?"  

"Authenticity" is a subjective term.  The only thing truthful in all of this is that the pairs we're discussing are illegal and, therefore, illegitimate.  Call them whatever the hell you like, the truth is that if everyone thought the way you did then your hobby of sneaker collecting would become a joke. 

This is like saying that a Honus Wagner card spit out of a laser printer at the Topps factory (if such a thing still exists) is "just as good" as one that was printed in 1914, because in 100 years nobody will be able to tell the difference.  Now you can be silly and say something ridiculous like "bad analogy, sneakers don't come with gum", but any reasonable person understands exactly what's at issue here.  

"Vintage" sneakers hold historical value in the minds of collectors.  By your logic, a beat up pair of aftermarket Air Jordan XIVs in size 13.5 would be "just as good" as the game worn sneakers MJ used to clinch his sixth championship as long as the average person would never know the difference.  Product origins may not matter in the grand scheme of things, but they've always mattered to collectors.  

If you choose to turn your back on that, it says more about your authenticity than the product's.

meth you a vegan, your ATTEMPT to come at me because your assumption that i dont drive rings hollow

Nobody assumed you didn't drive.  (Nobody cared.)  What I implied is that the "Porsche money" in your closet is worthless if you insist on characterizing illegal, illegitimate reproductions as "authentic."  The only thing ringing hollow here is the bluster and braggadocio. 

I don't care about budget balling.  In truth, I don't really care about whether or not vintage shoes hold their value.  I do, however, care about integrity.

My stake in all of this is simple:  NikeTalk has never tolerated counterfeiting.  We're going to continue to uphold the rules as we always have and remove anyone who engages in or promotes criminal activity.  Make sure you're not on the wrong side of that line.

 

[anthracite8s]

This is like saying that a Honus Wagner card spit out of a laser printer at the Topps factory (if such a thing still exists) is "just as good" as one that was printed in 1914, because in 100 years nobody will be able to tell the difference.  Now you can be silly and say something ridiculous like "bad analogy, sneakers don't come with gum", but any reasonable person understands exactly what's at issue here.  

Pretty much sums up the entire thread

 

[mr marcus]

 

[dro3000]

*rolls eyes*

I haven't seen anybody arguing this hard against their own interests since Uncle Ruckus.  

Gee, I wonder how someone could've gotten that impression.  

Yes, actually, considering you brag about it to anyone who'll listen.  


You've posted pictures of your closet several times in this thread alone.  


But why bother?  You could've just uploaded some pictures of a superior collection, like Pat's or Ijapino's, and claimed it as your own.  I mean, if nobody would ever know the difference, pretending to have something you really don't isn't a problem, right?  


Anyone working at the local print shop can have a degree from Harvard.


I don't have to say a word about your financial position.  We've all seen the video.  We know how you live.  It's not relevant to the discussion at hand and I've no need to insult you. 


Everyone here knows you care about your sneaker collection, and it's patently obvious that the widespread acceptance of illegitimate "after hours" fakes would render that collection all but worthless.  If you think otherwise, you're only fooling yourself.



There's a fundamental similarity between someone who buys cheap fakes and someone who buys "grey market" fakes.  Both are just trying to fool people into thinking that they own 100% legitimate pairs. 


If they were really "just as good," you wouldn't mind paying $2,000 for "grey market" Yeezys or $10,000 for "grey market" metallic Air Jordan I's.  Somehow, I doubt that's the case.


Isn't that the same thing people say when they hit rock bottom?  "There's nowhere to go but up?"  



"Authenticity" is a subjective term.  The only thing truthful in all of this is that the pairs we're discussing are illegal and, therefore, illegitimate.  Call them whatever the hell you like, the truth is that if everyone thought the way you did then your hobby of sneaker collecting would become a joke. 



This is like saying that a Honus Wagner card spit out of a laser printer at the Topps factory (if such a thing still exists) is "just as good" as one that was printed in 1914, because in 100 years nobody will be able to tell the difference.  Now you can be silly and say something ridiculous like "bad analogy, sneakers don't come with gum", but any reasonable person understands exactly what's at issue here.  

"Vintage" sneakers hold historical value in the minds of collectors.  By your logic, a beat up pair of aftermarket Air Jordan XIVs in size 13.5 would be "just as good" as the game worn sneakers MJ used to clinch his sixth championship as long as the average person would never know the difference.  Product origins may not matter in the grand scheme of things, but they've always mattered to collectors.  

If you choose to turn your back on that, it says more about your authenticity than the product's.


Nobody assumed you didn't drive.  (Nobody cared.)  What I implied is that the "Porsche money" in your closet is worthless if you insist on characterizing illegal, illegitimate reproductions as "authentic."  The only thing ringing hollow here is the bluster and braggadocio. 


I don't care about budget balling.  In truth, I don't really care about whether or not vintage shoes hold their value.  I do, however, care about integrity.



My stake in all of this is simple:  NikeTalk has never tolerated counterfeiting.  W
e're going to continue to uphold the rules as we always have and remove anyone who engages in or promotes criminal activity.  Make sure you're not on the wrong side of that line.

QFT because this man gets it!

Thank you

 

[ninjahood]

"Authenticity" is a subjective term.  The only thing truthful in all of this is that the pairs we're discussing are illegal and, therefore, illegitimate.  Call them whatever the hell you like, the truth is that if everyone thought the way you did then your hobby of sneaker collecting would become a joke. 



This is like saying that a Honus Wagner card spit out of a laser printer at the Topps factory (if such a thing still exists) is "just as good" as one that was printed in 1914, because in 100 years nobody will be able to tell the difference.  Now you can be silly and say something ridiculous like "bad analogy, sneakers don't come with gum", but any reasonable person understands exactly what's at issue here.  

"Vintage" sneakers hold historical value in the minds of collectors.  By your logic, a beat up pair of aftermarket Air Jordan XIVs in size 13.5 would be "just as good" as the game worn sneakers MJ used to clinch his sixth championship as long as the average person would never know the difference.  Product origins may not matter in the grand scheme of things, but they've always mattered to collectors.  

If you choose to turn your back on that, it says more about your authenticity than the product's.

like i said before, i AGREE that they're made illegally made if we're using american copyright laws, this has been ESTABLISHED

since page 1, but like i said before, you must got me ALLLL effed up in da game.

like i said before

if these grey market sneakers are being made by da EXACT people who are making da ones sold by footlocker/champssports/finishline

then they're AUTHENTIC, no ifs, ands, or buts about it, thats da truth... PERIOD.

at this point what you're splitting hairs about is something we like to call "context" ill use you're example of game worn products...

i own this...

     its a game worn Charles Barkley procut jersey from da 1994-1995 season, its made by Champion and made in da USA..if someone

decided to power up da old machines that made these back in da day and start selling em again, they're authentic, there's just no

way to cut it any other way...sure it

it wouldn't be "game worn" but thats a context which has no bearing on da physicality of da jersey.. because this is EXACTLY how mitchell and ness got into business. *ahem*

In 1985, a customer walked into the store and asked if M&N could repair his 1960 Pirates game-worn vest, and his 1949 St Louis Browns game-worn shirt. They were both made of wool flannel as all baseball uniforms had been. Mitchell & Ness found that it could do it, and with the realization that M&N was capable of this task, an idea was born: Reproduce historically accurate wool-flannel baseball uniforms.
Mitchell & Ness recruited history buffs and sports gurus. They dug through old newspapers, periodicals, books, programs, and old film footage. They consulted vintage uniform collectors throughout the country and visited the archives at the Baseball Hall of Fame in Cooperstown, NY.
Major League Baseball teams had stopped wearing wool flannel jerseys by 1972. Teams now wear double-knit polyester jerseys. In a dusty warehouse in North Philadelphia, Mitchell & Ness discovered rolls of old baseball flannel from 50 years earlier. They were still carefully wrapped, untouched, and in like-new condition ready to be cut and sewn.
The flannel was sewn. The lettering and patches were recreated and applied. The jerseys were completed, and they were offered for sale. The first shirts sold almost overnight. So did the second batch of a dozen or more. In time, Mitchell & Ness attracted customers from across the United States. Sports Illustrated wrote a flattering piece about M&N in June 1987. The New York Times wrote about the company two years later.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitchell_&_Ness

imagine if jersey collector zealots decided that Mitchell & Ness were making "fake jerseys" since those jerseys weren't from da actual

game worn era

 and as far as "vintage shoe collectors" lemme tell you my opinion about those guys and they're collections, if you can't wear a sneaker

its WORTHLESS to me, i dont care if its a 1 of 1 Jordan was taking a crap in da middle of half time while he was rocking em, i look at

its manufacturing origin. if da SAME people who made that pair made, decided "hey you know what Jordan exploded in that game, we're

gonna make more of em" then you can't say those same shoes aren't SAME sneakers Jordan was wearing, they may not hold da same

CONTEXT,( and ill admit, context is important to alot of things) but you can't say

they aren't da same thing if we're talking about SNEAKERS here, thats da bottom line.

this is why these are LABELED grey market jordans, because da truth, whether anybody here likes it or not is that whoever is in charge

of making da ones we buy in retail stores are also now behind selling em thru da backdoor. yes they're illegitimate, but you can't say

they're not authentic...like i told everyone else, i seen da space jams in person, held them, compared them to mine..they were made

EXACTLY da same way...da truth hurts, but da truth has to be told, because if you was REALLY about integrity, then sugar coating

da truth to protect da interests of "vintage shoe collectors" isn't part of it in da grand scheme...

 i dont care if da "flattens out" da value of w/e i've bought, you know why? because sneakers dont last forever,

sneakers are made to be worn, i bought everything i ever had sneaker wise cuz im a sports fan and i like being fly.

i dont ever plan on getting rid of anything i bought so i dont care about da ramifications of these grey markets

on da sneaker world, because at da end of da day, they're made to be worn,and i intend to wear ever pair.

 

[deezrsackolishus]

But u can alway tell the dofference. Theres always something

 

[dankenstien88]

"Authenticity" is a subjective term.  The only thing truthful in all of this is that the pairs we're discussing are illegal and, therefore, illegitimate.  Call them whatever the hell you like, the truth is that if everyone thought the way you did then your hobby of sneaker collecting would become a joke. 

Unlike the term "real" the term "authentic" is not subjective. By text book definition the term "authentic" means "legal, adhering to all laws and formality's"

"Authenticity" is a subjective term.  The only thing truthful in all of this is that the pairs we're discussing are illegal and, therefore, illegitimate.  Call them whatever the hell you like, the truth is that if everyone thought the way you did then your hobby of sneaker collecting would become a joke. 





This is like saying that a Honus Wagner card spit out of a laser printer at the Topps factory (if such a thing still exists) is "just as good" as one that was printed in 1914, because in 100 years nobody will be able to tell the difference.  Now you can be silly and say something ridiculous like "bad analogy, sneakers don't come with gum", but any reasonable person understands exactly what's at issue here.  


"Vintage" sneakers hold historical value in the minds of collectors.  By your logic, a beat up pair of aftermarket Air Jordan XIVs in size 13.5 would be "just as good" as the game worn sneakers MJ used to clinch his sixth championship as long as the average person would never know the difference.  Product origins may not matter in the grand scheme of things, but they've always mattered to collectors.  

If you choose to turn your back on that, it says more about your authenticity than the product's.

like i said before, i AGREE that they're made illegally made if we're using american copyright laws, this has been ESTABLISHED


since page 1, but like i said before, you must got me ALLLL effed up in da game. like i said before


if these grey market sneakers are being made by da EXACT people who are making da ones sold by footlocker/champssports/finishline


then they're AUTHENTIC, no ifs, ands, or buts about it, thats da truth... PERIOD.

I can not agree that the products in question are "authentic" because as I said earlier "authentic" Is NOT a subjective term. Legally, "authentic" is not a term that refers to build quality or manufacturing techniques.... its a term used to note that all paperwork and approval processes are in proper order

Authentic, Certified, Approved, Official,.... these are all objective terms set in stone. These are the terms company's use to legally designate a products status of legitimacy. Without "official" paperwork "approved" Nike and final "certification" of Govt.... the shoes in question can NOT be "authentic".



I mean.... They're called GREY markets for crying out loud.... Not fake.... but not def "authentic"

 

[ninjahood]

But u can alway tell the dofference. Theres always something

unless you wanna pitch in and buy da NT community a carbon dating machine that tells you how old material is then no.

nike better start thinking about how they want to continue to do business, if it matters to them, if not hey, its not my company,

im just a consumer at da end of da day, but as it stands, those grey markets are exactly da same thing thats being sold in stores..shame

on nike for letting da situation get to this point, cuz i definitely ain't gonna blame anyone who decided to buy those grey markets

instead of paying reseller prices on da same exact sneaker made by da same exact folks to save a few bucks.

 

[ninjahood]

"Authenticity" is a subjective term.  The only thing truthful in all of this is that the pairs we're discussing are illegal and, therefore, illegitimate.  Call them whatever the hell you like, the truth is that if everyone thought the way you did then your hobby of sneaker collecting would become a joke. 


 

Unlike the term "real" the term "authentic" is not subjective. By text book definition the term "authentic" means "legal, adhering to all laws and formality's"

"Authenticity" is a subjective term.  The only thing truthful in all of this is that the pairs we're discussing are illegal and, therefore, illegitimate.  Call them whatever the hell you like, the truth is that if everyone thought the way you did then your hobby of sneaker collecting would become a joke. 





This is like saying that a Honus Wagner card spit out of a laser printer at the Topps factory (if such a thing still exists) is "just as good" as one that was printed in 1914, because in 100 years nobody will be able to tell the difference.  Now you can be silly and say something ridiculous like "bad analogy, sneakers don't come with gum", but any reasonable person understands exactly what's at issue here.  


"Vintage" sneakers hold historical value in the minds of collectors.  By your logic, a beat up pair of aftermarket Air Jordan XIVs in size 13.5 would be "just as good" as the game worn sneakers MJ used to clinch his sixth championship as long as the average person would never know the difference.  Product origins may not matter in the grand scheme of things, but they've always mattered to collectors.  

If you choose to turn your back on that, it says more about your authenticity than the product's.

like i said before, i AGREE that they're made illegally made if we're using american copyright laws, this has been ESTABLISHED


since page 1, but like i said before, you must got me ALLLL effed up in da game.

like i said before


if these grey market sneakers are being made by da EXACT people who are making da ones sold by footlocker/champssports/finishline


then they're AUTHENTIC, no ifs, ands, or buts about it, thats da truth... PERIOD.



 

I can not agree that the products in question are "authentic" because as I said earlier "authentic" Is NOT a subjective term. Legally, "authentic" is not a term that refers to build quality or manufacturing techniques.... its a term used to note that all paperwork and approval processes are in proper order

Authentic, Certified, Approved, Official,.... these are all objective terms set in stone. These are the terms company's use to legally designate a products status of legitimacy. Without "official" paperwork "approved" Nike and final "certification" of Govt.... the shoes in question can NOT be "authentic".



I mean.... They're called GREY markets for crying out loud.... Not fake.... but not def "authentic"

  and hey i agree with you 100%, but you're confusing da word "authentic" with "legitimate". these sneaker are definitely not legitimate,

same way kids born out of wedlock when a man or women cheats on their spouse are illegitimate children, but you can't call those

kids "fake" they were made da way that couple made children when they were married.

and thats da point i've ALWAYS held on da matter of grey markets...they're unauthorized, they're illegitimate authentic jordans, which

is what grey markets are...they aren't fake, but they're definitely unauthorized and illegitimate.