2014 NBA Draft Thread

[fourtyeight48]

pretty much what the 76ers will do.

 

[jay y kay]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Your comparing a team with Klay, Curry, Iggy, Lee, Bogut a playoff team.

To a team with only Kyrie.

I let my eyes do the talking. Watch Barnes in the games. He is nice. You must've not seen him in the 2013 Playoffs I'm guessing???

He was killing for Warriors.

I've seen him play, and came away with a different conclusion.

He doesn't have a go-to move yet, doesn't have reliable enough shots from outside, and although he is pretty athletic, he doesn't have the explosiveness to blow by defenders.

Yes he can develop more moves and shots, but so far is more of a complimentary player than a No. 1 or No. 2 scoring option.

As for him playing well in playoff, yes he played well when they played small ball with him sliding to 4, but he won't be able to do that consistently because he isn't big enough to play full time 4.

Barnes playing behind all those guys proves my point that he is not a reliable scoring option yet.

I'm also wondering how much you've seen Dion play. You said he is Nick Young, then failed to provide much detail after that. A lot of posters here have fallen in love with Barnes since his HS because of the hype and have yet to wake up from that after quite a while, similar with Mayo, Beasley, etc.

Barnes is a good player. So is Dion. I don't think Barnes is much better than Dion at all, if not worse. But you are talking like Dion is nowhere close to Barnes, which is just plain stupidity. That is my point.

 

[fourtyeight48]

 

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Your comparing a team with Klay, Curry, Iggy, Lee, Bogut a playoff team.

To a team with only Kyrie.

I let my eyes do the talking. Watch Barnes in the games. He is nice. You must've not seen him in the 2013 Playoffs I'm guessing???

He was killing for Warriors.
 

I've seen him play, and came away with a different conclusion.

He doesn't have a go-to move yet, doesn't have reliable enough shots from outside, and although he is pretty athletic, he doesn't have the explosiveness to blow by defenders.

Yes he can develop more moves and shots, but so far is more of a complimentary player than a No. 1 or No. 2 scoring option.

As for him playing well in playoff, yes he played well when they played small ball with him sliding to 4, but he won't be able to do that consistently because he isn't big enough to play full time 4.

Barnes playing behind all those guys proves my point that he is not a reliable scoring option yet.

I'm also wondering how much you've seen Dion play. You said he is Nick Young, then failed to provide much detail after that. A lot of posters here have fallen in love with Barnes since his HS because of the hype and have yet to wake up from that after quite a while, similar with Mayo, Beasley, etc.

Barnes is a good player. So is Dion. I don't think Barnes is much better than Dion at all, if not worse. But you are talking like Dion is nowhere close to Barnes, which is just plain stupidity. That is my point.

K

 

[Platinum State]

Cavs not taking Andrew Wiggins #1 will haunt them for decades... Just got a guy feeling he'll end up being a superstar. Uber athletic Guys that can score off the bounce, flourish on the break and play great defense on the perimeter usually translate well to the NBA. I can't believe folks are comparing him to Tony Allen.

I share the same sentiment. I wish he ends up in Philly though. A much healthier situation than the Cavs locker room. Remember what Luol Deng said
I watched Wiggins play a lot this year and there's just something special in him when you see him play. A ton of potential, good kid, he just needs to want to improve and he'll be an all star.

 

[rook]

As a philly fan, id be delighted with bari or wiggins man. Both guys imo will be superstars someday.

If i had to choose, im going wiggins though

 

[jay y kay]

With Embiid injury situation, I think No. 1 pick is Wiggins to lose. I also have a feeling that e can become a superstar if given the right situation and development.

Since he won't be asked to be the number one scoring option in Cavs, he can focus on playing great D and run the break, while steadily developing other parts of his game.

 

[fourtyeight48]

The interior defense on Cleveland will be weak.

They won't make the playoffs potentially earning another lottery pick in next years Draft.

Wiggins = Jimmy Butler.

I just nailed it.

 

[jpzx]

FourtyEight is an instinct analyst and excellent at spelling out numbers.

 

[pmatic]

Pelton:

History of Joel Embiid's injury

Because they are so infrequent, injuries to the navicular bone aren't dreaded the same way as ACL and Achilles injuries, or microfracture knee surgery. But for a big man, there's no worse sentence than the one Joel Embiid received Thursday: a stress fracture to the navicular bone in his right foot, for which he'll undergo surgery immediately.

Recurring navicular injuries ended Yao Ming's career prematurely, and kept Bill Walton on the sidelines for much of his prime years. Now, teams considering drafting Embiid must weigh his potential against the possibility that he suffers a similar fate.

Past precedent

My research turned up four big men who have suffered navicular injuries in addition to Walton and Yao: Curtis Borchardt, Brendan Haywood, Zydrunas Ilgauskas and Kevin McHale. There have also been a handful of perimeter players with navicular fractures, including Michael Jordan, during his second season, and Philadelphia 76ers guard Andrew Toney, who missed nearly the entire 1985-86 campaign and was never the same again.

Despite Toney's example, navicular injuries have been more problematic for big men because of the additional weight and pressure they put on their feet. Discounting Hayward, who missed all of last season after undergoing surgery in October for a stress fracture of his navicular, the other five post players missed an average of 47.5 percent of their teams' scheduled games in seasons after the injury.

Taking each player case-by-case reveals the wide range of possible outcomes for Embiid.

Curtis Borchardt (played 83 of a possible 328 games)

Like Embiid, Borchardt first experienced problems with his navicular bone before entering the NBA. He missed portions of his freshman and sophomore seasons with stress fractures, undergoing surgery the second time and returning for a healthy junior season when he averaged 16.9 points and 11.4 rebounds per game. On the strength of that performance, the Utah Jazz traded up to draft Borchardt 18th overall in 2002.

With the Jazz, Borchardt suffered a recurrence that wiped out his entire rookie season and he missed much of his second season due to a fractured wrist before playing 67 games in his only full campaign, the 2004-05 season. Borchardt was subsequently traded to the Boston Celtics, and his NBA career was finished when the Celtics waived him during training camp, though he was able to play overseas through 2012.

Zydrunas Ilgauskas (played 756 of a possible 902 games)

Ilgauskas offers perhaps the most hopeful outcome for Embiid. Ilgauskas' navicular injury -- which kept him from playing during 1996-97, his rookie season -- was again suffered five games into the 1998-99 season, limited him to 29 games over the next three seasons.

But remarkably, after returning to the court in December 2001, Ilgauskas played at least 78 games each of the following five seasons, moving past his foot issues to become a two-time All-Star. He remained a contributor through his retirement in 2011 at age 36.

Kevin McHale (played 419 of a possible 492 games)

A broken navicular bone was the injury McHale famously played through during the 1987 playoffs, helping the Boston Celtics get to the NBA Finals before losing to the L.A. Lakers. McHale underwent surgery over the summer, which cost him the first month of the 1987-88 season. Thereafter, he played in 64 of 68 games, and missed just four total over the following two seasons. He made the All-Star team four times after the navicular injury before slowing down and retiring at 35.

Bill Walton (played 259 of a possible 738 games)

While playing through pain in the 1978 playoffs, Walton fractured his navicular bone in Game 2 of the Portland Trail Blazers' series with the Seattle SuperSonics -- the last he'd play for the Blazers. After sitting out the entire 1978-79 season, Walton signed with the San Diego Clippers, for whom he'd play just 169 games over six years, missing all of 1980-81 and 1981-82.

Following surgery to reshape his arch, Walton was eventually able to contribute to the 1986 champion Celtics and win the NBA Sixth Man Award. That would prove his last hurrah, as Walton played just 10 games during the following season, his last in the NBA, before being diagnosed with another navicular fracture -- one that, ironically, prompted McHale to play through the same injury.

Yao Ming (played 82 of a possible 246 games)

At 7-foot-6, Yao had already dealt with foot and knee trouble, including a fractured fifth metatarsal bone in his foot, when he was diagnosed with a stress fracture of his navicular bone in February 2008. The Houston Rockets hoped at the time that they'd caught the injury early enough to prevent it from becoming a problem, and Yao returned from surgery to play in the Beijing Olympics and 77 games in 2008-09, when they won their first playoff series since 1997.

During the conference semifinals against the Lakers, however, Yao reinjured the navicular bone. He underwent reconstructive surgery and was ruled out for the entire 2009-10 season before attempting to return the following season. Another stress fracture to his ankle suffered after five games led to Yao's retirement at age 30.

Embiid impact

When considering the impact of Embiid's navicular injury on his draft stock, the severity is hard to overstate. Not only could it potentially keep him off the floor all of next season, the chance of recurrence will always linger. There's a hope that, like Ilgauskas, he could eventually enjoy a long and productive career. But teams picking at the top of the draft must also be prepared for the possibility that Embiid misses multiple seasons or even has his career cut short.

 

[pmatic]

Former doctor of the Rockets (thus Yao Ming), Dr. Mark Adickes:

Could Embiid suffer Yao's fate?

The news that Joel Embiid was diagnosed with a stress fracture in his right foot is troubling, but it isn't a career death sentence for the Kansas center.

Indeed, the history of big men with foot problems is somewhat foreboding, as Kevin Pelton indicates, but I believe Embiid still will be able to a fruitful NBA career after undergoing surgery on Friday.

Having served as one of the Houston Rockets' team physicians from 2006-10, I am very familiar with this injury. During that time, Rockets All-Star center Yao Ming was plagued by fractures of his left foot's navicular bone. So I saw firsthand the problems that can arise from this injury. Embiid's news certainly conjures visions of a hobbled big man such as Yao, but Yao's fate isn't necessarily what awaits Embiid.

Yao's troubles

In December of the 2005-06 season, Yao developed osteomyelitis (a bone infection) of his left big toe. He returned after missing 21 games and played well but later developed his first navicular stress fracture in April 2006. The navicular bone resides on the inside of the foot, above the big toe at the level of the arch of the foot.

This first navicular fracture was treated by placing him on crutches and in a cast, and he required six months to heal. Yao returned without incident and played well enough during the 2006-07 season to be named second-team All-NBA. But the next season, Yao would miss the remainder of 2007-08 with another stress fracture of his navicular bone. This second injury to the navicular bone was treated by placing screws into the bone to facilitate healing and was performed by world renowned foot and ankle specialist Dr. Thomas Clanton.

Yao healed well and quickly and was able to compete in the Olympics for the Chinese national team in August 2008. The 2008-09 season saw Yao play the entire season without incident, but he reinjured his left foot's navicular bone in the second-round playoff series against the Los Angeles Lakers. Yao had a second surgery and missed the entire 2009-10 season. Upon his return, he developed a left-ankle stress fracture, which eventually led to his retirement.

So what can be expected for Embiid and his NBA career? Although there are similarities between Yao and Embiid, there are also a number of key differences.

First, Embiid is 6 inches shorter and about 70 pounds lighter than Yao, placing markedly reduced forces on his feet. He is also six years younger than Yao was when his foot-injury odyssey began.

Another key difference is mileage. Yao had played eight pro seasons prior to his injuries, five in China and three in the NBA. Yao also played extensively for the Chinese national team. Embiid does not have near the wear and tear on his body and, at 20 years old, should be able to heal this fracture uneventfully.

Finally, Yao had extremely high arches in his feet, which, when placed under stress, compressed his navicular bone like a nutcracker. While I have neither examined nor seen the X-rays of Embiid, it is highly unlikely that he has similar anatomy as Yao.

A number of studies have shown successful returns to sport after a navicular fracture. The average return is four months whether surgery is performed or the bone is allowed to heal in a cast with the athlete placed on crutches. Given Yao's troubles, it does not surprise me that Embiid's team has decided to choose surgery in an effort to reassure NBA executives that he will be ready to play by the start of the 2014-15 season.

Although it is a worrisome injury to be sure, given Embiid's age, body type and lack of mileage, I fully expect him to heal well and have a solid NBA career.

 

[ny mavurs]

Jabari should just go #1 and call it a night

 

[fourtyeight48]

FourtyEight is an instinct analyst and excellent at spelling out numbers.

The Four is the key.

 

[johnnyredstorm]

Embiid won't fall past the Lakers.

I don't even like Wiggins but to compare him to Jamario Moon, Tony Allen or Jimmy Buer is laughable. Dude's biggest knock is his motor and under Blatt that won't be an issue. He's got the intangibles to be the next great wing. Two years of developing a jumper and scoring off the dribble and he'll put up 20 a game. Right now he's a little raw and best running the floor but he's gonna develop real well. Just looking at him physically, he reminds me of Jordan early at UNC. He develops that motor and jumper and he'll be an All Star.

 

[Platinum State]

Centers always seem to get injured before their nba career can even start.
Its like they have knees made of glass. I would be too scared to draft a center, wayyy to much risk involved.

I expect Wiggins to average at least 15 & 5 in his rookie year.

 

[dacomeup]

LOL @ Nash and 7 for MCW and Thad really being an option. Philly not sold on the "Rookie of the Year" MCW at all. 

 

[buc em]

LOL @ Nash and 7 for MCW and Thad really being an option. Philly not sold on the "Rookie of the Year" MCW at all. 

Where'd you hear that?

This news on Embiid sounds reaaaaally terrible. I think somebody will still take a chance on him in the top 10 but who knows. A lot of these GM's need immediate results to save their job and waiting on a guy with an injury known to derail careers of big men is a risk I don't know if they wanna take.

 

[awwsome]

@ the Wiggins love in here, y'all boys seeing the light.

 

[awwsome]

LOL @ Nash and 7 for MCW and Thad really being an option. Philly not sold on the "Rookie of the Year" MCW at all. 

How you gonna trade your best young talent for an 80 year old man who's body is failing him?

I love Nash but that's crazy.

 

[dacomeup]

How you gonna trade your best young talent for an 80 year old man who's body is failing him?

I love Nash but that's crazy.

Rusillo reported it.

It's a salary dump by LA and Philly has plenty of cap. 

 

[doitallpaul]

5-6 years full years ain't even guaranteed for a big man with foot issues

one year fully healthy isn't guarenteed, those injuries linger back issues become a big problem with bad feert and Embid has a bad back as is

 

[doitallpaul]

Where'd you hear that?

This news on Embiid sounds reaaaaally terrible. I think somebody will still take a chance on him in the top 10 but who knows. A lot of these GM's need immediate results to save their job and waiting on a guy with an injury known to derail careers of big men is a risk I don't know if they wanna take.

if I'm philly and hes around at 10 I'd consider taking him, I know they did it on Noel but Embid is the better player coming into the draft, worse comes to worse thy can each play 24 minutes

 

[addict4sneakers]

Embiid is a lot lighter than Yao and Lopez.

Jordan had the same surgery. Maybe embiid will be alright.

 

[mr marcus]

 

5-6 years full years ain't even guaranteed for a big man with foot issues

one year fully healthy isn't guarenteed, those injuries linger back issues become a big problem with bad feert and Embid has a bad back as is

exactly

 

[pmatic]

:x at that Lakers-Sixers trade.

 

[awwsome]

Embiid is a lot lighter than Yao and Lopez.

Jordan had the same surgery. Maybe embiid will be alright.

I'm hoping man.