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Come on man, that's a child's butt you're posting. Spidey's too.
WELCOME TO THE MARVEL MULTIVERSE -*RIP STAN LEE & Boseman* - Agatha All Along new ep every Wednesday
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Bend_The_Knee
formerly gotholesinmysocks
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eh TWS should be higher
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Damn, this is the first reply that actually makes me rethink my entire view on the ending (I wasn't a fan personally).
I mean, if you were tell me that there would be no more MCU films after Infinity War and it all ended with the bad guy winning,,, my god,, it wouldn't be my favourite MCU movie or even my favourite comic book movie. It might be one of my favourite movies period!
We may be the minority here but I'm with you on this. Thanos didn't wipe out civilization completely or destroy science, technology or knowledge. Hell, his Black Order were killed so why not some of the 'good guys'.
In my honest opinion a proper sequel to this movie should take place several years at the very minimum after these events however it will in all likelihood not be the case due to Fury paging Captain Marvel.
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LOL it's a fun idea. Like having the Empire win at the end of the Star Wars trilogy or having Sauron get a hold of the One Ring.
But this is, at the end of the day, a kids property. And most importantly, a cash cow the likes of which the cinematic world has ever seen. So,, no way MCU gets buried like this.
Although could you imagine the reactions of the all the middle-aged men if Feige were to announce that there would be no more MCU movies after IW? rofl
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pretty close lol
- Infinity War
- Captain America: Civil War
- Spider-Man: Homecoming
- Guardians of the Galaxy Vol. 2
- Iron Man
- Black Panther
- Thor: Ragnarok
- Guardians of the Galaxy
- Captain America: The Winter Soldier
- The Avengers
- Doctor Strange
- Avengers: Age of Ultron
- Iron Man 2
- Ant-Man
- Iron Man 3
- Thor
- Captain America: The First Avenger
- Thor: The Dark World
- The Incredible Hulk
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Ronda Rousey has better cake
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if you told me her and brie were sisters i'd believe you.
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Thor fragglerock should be #1
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It’s Time to Talk About Marvel’s Gamora Problem
https://www.tor.com/2018/05/17/its-time-to-talk-about-marvels-gamora-problem/
https://www.tor.com/2018/05/17/its-time-to-talk-about-marvels-gamora-problem/
I find myself, for the most part, in the minority of people who didn’t quite enjoy Avengers: Infinity War.
To be clear, this is not me saying that that the movie is bad, or unenjoyable in a general sense. The action was engaging for the most part, and there are some character progressions that I think elicited real dramatic effort from the film. I like how it sets up Tony Stark’s pained, traumatic franchise-long journey from selfish, egotistical brat to responsible, self-sacrificing, if conflicted leader, which I hope they go all in on in upcoming installments. Thor, being my absolute favourite character from the franchise in general, has one really committed throughline, from losing everything that ever mattered to him in two back-to-back genocides to literally taking a beam of white-hot suffering through his body just to regain trust in his own heroic potential. Individual moments, like when Captain America, Black Widow, and Falcon have their first fight with Thanos’ Black Order goons in Scotland, are delightful to look at, visually. And some of the more unlikely on-screen team-ups, like Tony with Doctor Strange, or Thor with Rocket, actually make room for really interesting dialogue.
But ultimately, there’s one aspect of the film that I simply can’t get past. We need to talk about what happens to Gamora.
Sure, there are plenty of other issues and complaints that can and have been addressed elsewhere, but I’m not going to talk about how this shift away from Thanos’ comic-book intentions made his villainy seem weaker to me. I’m not going to talk about how frustrating it is that a villain’s intentions are to save the universe from resource depletion by reassembling the forces that created that very universe and insisting upon destruction, while no one even tries to suggest that he could just as simply create more resources with the same infinite power, and how refusing to do so makes the entire story feel hollow and mindlessly plot-driven instead of legitimately challenging. I’m not going to talk about how many of the character deaths are meaningless and adds no emotional value or weight to the movie—like how T’Challa says all of six lines of dialogue, more than half of which are comical, in the movie where his entire nation sacrifices their lives for the sake of the world; or how Vision spends most of the film reduced to a sentient MacGuffin.
Instead, I’m going to just talk about Gamora.
Just Gamora. Because all the rest of these problems pale in comparison to her treatment in this film.
Going all the way back to the first Guardians of the Galaxy film, the promise has been built into the narrative: clearly, Gamora’s toxic, abusive ‘family’ relationship with Thanos would be one of the dramatic concerns of the franchise. We knew on some level that the two would have to confront each other, and that it makes sense that this moment would occur in the lead-up to the fulfilment of Thanos’ grand scheme.
I was particularly looking forward to that confrontation going into this film, but I was also looking forward to getting further insight into Gamora’s past, and further context for their relationship. Remember, everything we know about Gamora and Nebula’s relationship with Thanos has been delivered entirely through dialogue up to this point, and most of it has been centred around their communion as sisters more than its been about Thanos at all. Which makes sense up to this point, but I was hoping that Infinity War would properly establish for the audience that these two women have suffered unspeakable trauma as children as a result of their very proximity to him.
Instead, the movie gives us but one momentary glimpse into that past trauma: the day that Thanos murdered half the people of Gamora’s homeworld. I want to make clear that I’m not saying that this scene doesn’t add any additional context to Gamora’s pain. However, between that moment and the events of Infinity War lie decades of torture, mental and emotional manipulation, and servitude to Thanos. Expanding on the true extent of her trauma would have been much more useful than this single scene.
But then again, considering how their confrontation ultimately ends, it seems Gamora’s experience and suffering was far from the film’s primary concern. Or even, arguably, a concern at all.
Which… troubles me. (I could use so many other words than “troubles,” but I’ll be generous for now.)
Let’s trace out Gamora’s entire plot strand, as briefly as possible: after rescuing Thor from his destroyed ship, the Guardians split into two groups: Groot and Rocket go to help the God of Thunder forge a new weapon, and the others head to Knowhere in hopes of retrieving the Reality Stone before Thanos arrives. Before they get there, Gamora gravely and urgently asks Peter Quill for his promise, if things go wrong, to make a demanding sacrifice—to kill her if Thanos captures her, because only she knows where the Soul Stone is, and would rather lose her life than share that knowledge. Surprising no one, Thanos does capture her, after using the Reality Stone to convince her that she had finally succeeded in killing her tormentor once and for all. Thanos disappears with his adoptive daughter (read: orphan hostage) and the stone in one fell swoop.
After displaying the barest modicum of compassion for her by offering a bowl of food, he asks Gamora to finally share the location of the Soul Stone, and she insists she knows nothing about it. Thanos’ ace in the hole waits behind a door on his ship: Nebula, her sister-in-trauma, being tortured—slowly and painfully disassembled—as a final attempt to compel Gamora to confess the location of the stone. She does, and the two venture to the planet Vormir to retrieve it.
Apparently, Vormir has rules. A spectral Red Skull appears at the summit of a mountain to relay the terms to Thanos and his captive: the world will only bestow the Soul Stone to someone who sacrifices the person they love most. Gamora, in hesitant but unreserved schadenfreude, finally faces her abuser in triumph. “You love nothing,” she hisses. After his entire crusade, the fact of his own essential, all-consuming malevolence has finally laid him low. Or so we think, momentarily.
When Thanos turns, he is crying. Gamora scoffs. A hulking, powerful Titan, driven to tears because he doesn’t get what he wants?
Red Skull corrects her. Apparently, somehow, that’s not why he’s crying.
Thanos is crying over the terrible sacrifice he’s about to make.
This singular moment, of all the elements and choices in this film that disappointed me, is the one that truly incensed me. (Again, “incensed” is another overly-generous word choice, here, in terms of describing my feelings.) Thanos doesn’t even hesitate to throw the woman he claims to love as his own child off the edge of a cliff in order to gain power. He doesn’t pause. He gives no consideration to Gamora’s feelings, and uses the taste of infinite power he already wields to prevent her from fighting back. It happens in an instant, as a single, salty tear runs down his pastel purple cheek, accompanied by the painful, buffered wailing of his victim as she falls to her doom.
Follow my train of thought for a moment:
We’re supposed to believe that a man can tear apart, physically and emotionally abuse, psychologically torture, and utterly break someone’s spirit over the course of their entire childhood, and accept that the name for what he feels for is victim is “love”? When Thanos is called upon to make this sacrifice, and is somehow able to do so without ever taking stock of his own cruelty or facing the horror that he has put Gamora through, I submit that what he feels for her should never be described as anything approximating love.
That’s obsession. That’s manipulation, and oppression. That’s egomania.
That’s abuse.
And you mean to tell me that, in this universe—that is, both the cosmos of this story and the Marvel Cinematic Universe as constructed by writers Christopher Markus and Stephen McFeely—we’re supposed to accept that this somehow counts as “love”? That just because Gamora is, in some intensely twisted fashion, the person Thanos somehow meant to hurt the least, their relationship (at least on his end) qualifies as genuine compassion or devotion?
Because I’m not frickin’ buying it.
When you make the case through your work that all that matters for a relationship to be considered one of sincere love is that an abuser believes that he or she is in the right, you teach viewers that all kinds of terrible behaviour is acceptable, irreparably and irresponsibly blurring the lines between victimization and affection. The fact that so many of the people seem to consider Thanos’ behaviour in the film “reluctant” or “pained” already says a lot to me in terms of how easily the media, and society at large, writes off the actions and consequences of abuse.
I have no doubt in my mind that Thanos thinks he is motivated by some aggressively misplaced sense of fatherly affection. I’m sure that’s what he thought about murdering half the people on Gamora’s home planet, too. But when you take away the Infinity Gauntlet and the extra body mass and the stone throne and the silly cosmic crusade, what you have left is a man saying that he killed a woman because he truly cared about her—and the universe rewarding him for doing so.
Infinity War, to me, is laden with moments where characters pick up the Idiot Ball just because the plot requires momentum. This plot thread is more than that. Every part of this reads like the worst parts of Idiot Plot combined with a core misunderstanding of the character stakes that previous movies established, and a lack of empathy or introspection in general.
I already expect that by the next Avengers film, or possibly even before, many of the more intense elements of Infinity War will be swiftly walked back. The dead will rise from their graves, the hard work will all have somehow paid off, the good guys will have their chance to watch the sun set on a grateful universe.
But no matter what, this happened to Gamora. A lifetime of torment and victimhood, all leading up to the horror of her final moments—her horrified realization that her tormentor is able to use her broken body as the gateway to his ultimate desire because what he feels for her is truly love.
The film accepts this, never questions it, even creates its own tortured reasoning for it, and asks you to trust that reasoning.
I don’t. And I think it’s beyond troubling or offensive to ask us to do so—it’s dangerous.
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fat honda can be cast as the blob.
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I didn’t read that **** but my main gripe with Ethering Gamora is that they got rid of the one Platano in the flick. Maybe she comes back like Cano after the 80 game ban but who knows.
everysingletime
formerly amel223
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I wish I could comment on this lady's article... No one is asking anyone to take Thano's abuse of Gamora as acceptable.. Sometimes I feel like people have comprehension issues...It’s Time to Talk About Marvel’s Gamora Problem
https://www.tor.com/2018/05/17/its-time-to-talk-about-marvels-gamora-problem/
everysingletime
formerly amel223
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Don't think she was ethered.... She's one woman against someone as strong as the Hulk.. And that's before he got the stones... There was nothing she could've done in the movie.
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It’s Time to Talk About Marvel’s Gamora Problem
https://www.tor.com/2018/05/17/its-time-to-talk-about-marvels-gamora-problem/
My exact sentiments and the reason why I have a strong disdain for this film. It lacks no conviction in anything it does. It just does **** for shock value. You never once showed the extent of Gamora and Thanos’ relationship sans some weak Swiss Army knife he gave her and we’re supposed to buy Thanos’ emotion in having to kill her? A being that wants to commit universal genocide? Thanos crying because he has to kill to get what he wants when he’s been doing that this whole time? Ridiculous. This movie spent so much time telling cringe jokes so it could avoid an actual plot. 18 films of universe building should have had a real emotional payoff for everyone. Instead we’re forced to cheer because Thor got his eye back and Spider-Man played the little kid crying cause he doesn’t want to die game AGAIN. This movie broke my heart in the worst way.
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I mean at least Shazam isn't set in the 90s or they opted to focus on Mary Marvel (totally guessing that's her name).
I was struggling a few times when they pitted Ragnarok, GotGv2, and Homecoming
BP and IW was over just about everything.
On the flip it was hard deciding which I liked less among the first two Thors, IM2, and Cap1.
MalcolmNewton
formerly ironstark
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It’s Time to Talk About Marvel’s Gamora Problem
https://www.tor.com/2018/05/17/its-time-to-talk-about-marvels-gamora-problem/
What does she want, a full length movie about Gamora and Thanos playing hide and go seek and teaching her how to ride a bike? All of Thanos "feelings" are twisted, love to him is not choking you to do death, or dusting you instead instead of putting you through painful agony. "Saving" a universe that didn't ask to be saved. He's has twisted logic and twisted emotions. That author suffers from classic case of thinking too hard. It's a super hero movie, not Gone With the Wind.
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you also get a glimpse of what the relationship is like in GOTG 1 and 2.
him loving or having admiration for his daughter wasn't really that farfetched
him loving or having admiration for his daughter wasn't really that farfetched
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Yeah as much as I felt the film had flaws,,, Thanos "sacrificing" Gamora for the stone is far, far down in my list as one of those flaws.
Sure, they could have expanded on it a bit more than the Swiss army knife (as Lame calls it) but I can't complain too much. Besides, it can all be explained away by Thanos' insanity. He's LITERALLY called the Mad Titan.
Sure, they could have expanded on it a bit more than the Swiss army knife (as Lame calls it) but I can't complain too much. Besides, it can all be explained away by Thanos' insanity. He's LITERALLY called the Mad Titan.
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I think yall missed the part where vormir the actual sentient planet rewarded thanos for his abuse
And yall saying she, its a dude lol
And yall saying she, its a dude lol
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Y'all I just spit la croix all over my keyboard dammit!
