THEE OFFICIAL 2019-2020 NBA OFFSEASON THREAD: VICTORY LAP

[Based Jesus]

This is where me an wavycrocket are in lock step. There's CLEARLY a standard and precedent that's been set. Everybody trying to move whatever goalposts are necessary to try and make it look like Lebby has a case is just ridiculous. There's too much evidence against him. Just let him be a top 5 player and leave it at that.

***** beats up a weak *** east to barely struggle out some wins against the West and that somehow makes him the GOAT.

Memba when he could take any team to the playoffs? Then he went to the Lakers and didn't, even after activating playoff mode. Shame he didn't just have it active when the season started. Yall might have made it. Probly was too busy playing with the ESPN trade machine tho. I get it.

 

[friscostylez]

Or it’s because he never faced a team as good as the 73-9 Warriors

bulls didn’t have the best record in the league every year

lol at you getting caught for name calling & now you are trying to play nice. are we gonna act like the Bulls don't have 3 of the top 4 most won seasons (67, 69, and 72). We are talking about dominating your competition since you keep glossing over this & keep talking ONE finals series.

 

[pmatic]

 

[HIM]

To be fair, based on my eyes Jordan is the GOAT but it’s because he’s the greatest two way player of all time and there’s no one better that can take and make tough shots Better than anyone

but The 6/6 stuff FOR ME gets dicey because the teams bron is playing in the finals are CLEARLYsuperior than anything the bulls were facing. Butttt the East is comically weak for most of Bron’s reign. Idk

This is almost my exact argument. Except I have Bron as the GOAT but how could I be mad at someone saying Jordan is the GOAT?

Jordan beat lesser teams once (utah twice) and people then turn around and say he stopped x player from winning a championship. That and the 6/6 thing don’t sit well with me. Beating Barkley in one series does not mean you’re the reason he doesn’t have a ring. Beating GP and Kemp (in a series you were HEAVY favorites) doesn’t mean you’re the reason they never won in their career (i know GP got one on the way out.)

The 90’s were a perfect time for Jordan to become Jordan. The sports world wasn’t as cynical as we are today. Look at Based Jesus post dissecting all those series, inclduding wins. OKC was young. Ray allen hit a 3. Kyrie went off. then look st Jordan. Even when we talk about the Kerr shot, people don’t give Kerr credit. They give Jordan credit for telling Kerr to be open . The man is Paul Bunyan

 

[osh kosh bosh]

Now do this with Bron 3 rings......

And then play the tape of 2011

The horror.

I don't understand what point you're making.


I will say this it's funny how narratives work

It's seen as a testament to MJ's greatness that he was able finally able to learn to trust his teammates, play in the triangle and share the basketball.


but it's an indictment upon Lebron when he finally learned not trust his teammates too much and take control of the team and the game.



if you decide that MJ's early selfishness is better than Lebron's early passiveness, okay I might agree, but I don't understand people who act like it isn't a close call.

 

[MVP]

We all know Bron ain't touching MJ in the winning category but just who he had to go up against at one point or another in route to getting there and then finally breaking through and almost never looking back.

Bird/McHale
Zeke
Magic
Barkley
Drexler
Ewing
Shaq
Payton
Miller
Stockton/Malone

Bron has
Duncan
KG
Pierce
Ray
Dirk
KD
Steph

Like even the journey to get to dominance and then do it, the road was a lot tougher for MJ.

 

[Based Jesus]

This is almost my exact argument. Except I have Bron as the GOAT but how could I be mad at someone saying Jordan is the GOAT?

Jordan beat lesser teams once (utah twice) and people then turn around and say he stopped x player from winning a championship. That and the 6/6 thing don’t sit well with me. Beating Barkley in one series does not mean you’re the reason he doesn’t have a ring. Beating GP and Kemp (in a series you were HEAVY favorites) doesn’t mean you’re the reason they never won in their career (i know GP got one on the way out.)

The 90’s were a perfect time for Jordan to become Jordan. The sports world wasn’t as cynical as we are today. Look at Based Jesus post dissecting all those series, inclduding wins. OKC was young. Ray allen hit a 3. Kyrie went off. then look st Jordan. Even when we talk about the Kerr shot, people don’t give Kerr credit. They give Jordan credit for telling Kerr to be open . The man is Paul Bunyan

 

[niceshoes247]

 

[lawdog1]

This is almost my exact argument. Except I have Bron as the GOAT but how could I be mad at someone saying Jordan is the GOAT?

Jordan beat lesser teams once (utah twice) and people then turn around and say he stopped x player from winning a championship. That and the 6/6 thing don’t sit well with me. Beating Barkley in one series does not mean you’re the reason he doesn’t have a ring. Beating GP and Kemp (in a series you were HEAVY favorites) doesn’t mean you’re the reason they never won in their career (i know GP got one on the way out.)

The 90’s were a perfect time for Jordan to become Jordan. The sports world wasn’t as cynical as we are today. Look at Based Jesus post dissecting all those series, inclduding wins. OKC was young. Ray allen hit a 3. Kyrie went off. then look st Jordan. Even when we talk about the Kerr shot, people don’t give Kerr credit. They give Jordan credit for telling Kerr to be open . The man is Paul Bunyan

You’re acting like LeBron doesn’t also get credit for everything when his teams win...

 

[osh kosh bosh]

It's pretty clear that Michael's selfishness harmed his teams performance early in his career.

It's pretty clear that Lebron passivity harmed his teams performance early in his career.


Michael learned to trust his teamates and the offense when from very good to all time great.

Lebron finally wrested full control from his teammates and the offenses went from very good to all time great.



What is really the difference between these two narratives? What makes one better or worse than the other?

To me it's basically the same.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

It's become Beatles vs. Rolling Stones

Jay-Z vs. Nas


the answer is not really about music or basketball, it's about the way you view the world.

what is a bigger sin, Passivity or selfishness?

 

[king j]

I see cats bored as hell on this beautiful Saturday

 

[QU!K]

lol at you getting caught for name calling & now you are trying to play nice. are we gonna act like the Bulls don't have 3 of the top 4 most won seasons (67, 69, and 72). We are talking about dominating your competition since you keep glossing over this & keep talking ONE finals series.

Nothing about the statement:

“Jordan never dominated a team better than the 73-9 Warriors in a playoff series”

is false.

I never said Lebron was the goat.

Lebron has the single greatest finals series performance of all-time against the team with the greatest regular season record of all-time.

that’s it.

That doesn’t mean Lebron is better than Jordan.

 

[HIM]

You’re acting like LeBron doesn’t also get credit for everything when his teams win...

You read all that and missed the argument. Incredible.

We’re too far gone to change minds. Jordan will never be topped for some. Others(I) will not be convicned tha Bron isn’t the GOAT.

 

[MVP]

It's become Beatles vs. Rolling Stones

Jay-Z vs. Nas


the answer is not really about music or basketball, it's about the way you view the world.

FOH. Unless you're blind in no form or fashion is LeBron James a better overall basketball player than Michael Jordan. MJ was a better 2 way player and accomplished more in a shorter amount of time. PERIOD. No amount of excuses or twisting the truth changes that fact.

 

[wavycrocket]

I don't understand what point you're making.


I will say this it's funny how narratives work

It's seen as a testament to MJ's greatness that he was able finally able to learn to trust his teammates, play in the triangle and share the basketball.


but it's an indictment upon Lebron when he finally learned not trust his teammates too much and take control of the team and the game.



if you decide that MJ's early selfishness is better than Lebron's early passiveness, okay I might agree, but I don't understand people who act like it isn't a close call.

Bro...all Bron had to do was play up to his standards...and 2011 is a win . Ain’t no narratives about that.

A you g Mike not trusting his teammates as much before he won and played within the triangle....is not the same as WILDY UNDERPERFORMING.

2011 is not bad, because Bron was passive. It’s bad because he didn’t play well.

 

[friscostylez]

Nothing about the statement:

“Jordan never dominated a team better than the 73-9 Warriors in a playoff series”

is false.

I never said Lebron was the goat.

Lebron has the single greatest finals series performance of all-time against the team with the greatest regular season record of all-time.

that’s it.

That doesn’t mean Lebron is better than Jordan.

so are you saying that since Lebron dominated the 73-9 warriors team, he dominated his competition better than Jordan did his? Once again, go back to see where this all started lol.

 

[QU!K]

so are you saying that since Lebron dominated the 73-9 warriors team, he dominated his competition better than Jordan did his? Once again, go back to see where this all started lol.

No I am saying Lebron James dominated a team better Jordan has ever faced in his playoff career.

 

[lawdog1]

You read all that and missed the argument. Incredible.

We’re too far gone to change minds. Jordan will never be topped for some. Others(I) will not be convicned tha Bron isn’t the GOAT.

I read it all and think a lot of what you said about Jordan can also be said about LeBron. Yes, you prefaced it by saying you’re not mad if someone thinks Jordan is the GOAT, but then made a bunch of arguments trying to undermine his case for GOAT.

Let’s just be honest that, for a lot of us, it just comes down to who we like better. A lot of the other “arguments” are just mental gymnastics that can me made to work both ways.

 

[MVP]

 

[osh kosh bosh]

FOH. Unless you're blind in no form or fashion is LeBron James a better overall basketball player than Michael Jordan. MJ was a better 2 way player and accomplished more in a shorter amount of time. PERIOD. No amount of excuses or twisting the truth changes that fact.

yeeeeah i don't agree with any of this.

I think it's pretty close but ill lean MJ.

but do you.

 

[friscostylez]

No I am saying Lebron James dominated a team better Jordan has ever faced in his playoff career.

glad that you agree with everything I originally said then.

also lol at u for catching feelings off an internet debate & resorted to name calling.

 

[QU!K]

Most ungrateful franchise of all time.

I bet they would have felt “joy” if Steph won 2 finals mvps tho.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

Bro...all Bron had to do was play up to his standards...and 2011 is a win . Ain’t no narratives about that.

A you g Mike not trusting his teammates as much before he won and played within the triangle....is not the same as WILDY UNDERPERFORMING.

2011 is not bad, because Bron was passive. It’s bad because he didn’t play well.

yeah i don't agree,

I don't think he forgot how to play basketball, I think in an adverse situation he was too passive

and deferred to Wade in a situation where he shouldn't have.

 

[storm2006]

Every time there is a LeBron or Steph debate in here the thread turns into a Royal Rumble. By the end folks are arguing about something way different than what started it