The MMA Thread: DON'T ASK 4 STREAMS & NO GIFS- Cannonier, Imavov, Reyes, Rosas on NOW

[spiderjericho]

Leites and Maia (sp) were terrible fights that raised Dana ire.

But he was never in trouble besides the Chael 1 fight and pulled out the Hail Mary during his run.

espn got to do a better job promoting

Sounds like a lot of providers want a discount on the sports brick. They may need to get hungry and a new street team especially if all the providers get off and Disney sells them.

 

[blackcease]

The fact that Izzy is gonna have to live with that performance for the rest of his life is going to take away from his greatness.

I never watched Anderson in his prime but did he ever have a title fight like last night? This was stylistically the easiest opponent Izzy has faced and he got beat at his own game. There was no dog in him. He knew he needed a finish in the fifth and went out there and continued to run the entire round is just embarrassing man.

Anderson has had plenty of horrible title fights

He's clearly the MW goat but let's not act like Anderson didn't have many stinkers

Anderson never had a performance like that, ever. Never was he dropped, outclassed and defeated by a mid contender during his title reign. He had boring fights that he was never in danger of losing, but that's in no way shape or form equivalent to what we saw last night. Izzy's rep and legacy took a huge hit.

In terms of being stylistically the easiest, again, Strickland just exposed a flaw, Izzy's boxing is in question.

Folks still sleep on how effective solid fundamental boxing is as a base in MMA, maybe this might wake some people up.

 

[spiderjericho]

Folks forget GSP had a great wrestling game despite not having a high school or collegiate background. He also trained with Freddy Roach and had a laser jab.

Izzy is just a great striking specialist. Probably better than mostly everyone in his division. But if you don’t got more tools in the box or don’t have that dog in you. Things like the Jan, Alex and Strickland losses can happen.

 

[Davey Magoo]

Would this fight have been any different if it had been a kickboxing match with 4oz gloves in One FC?

I didn’t see it.

 

[Davey Magoo]

I wonder if Pereira is rethinking his decision to move up to LHW.

 

[blackcease]

Folks forget GSP had a great wrestling game despite not having a high school or collegiate background. He also trained with Freddy Roach and had a laser jab.

Izzy is just a great striking specialist. Probably better than mostly everyone in his division. But if you don’t got more tools in the box or don’t have that dog in you. Things like the Jan, Alex and Strickland losses can happen.

GSP destroyed Koscheck and broke his orbital just by having a solid jab. Dudes gotta stop sleeping.

Would this fight have been any different if it had been a kickboxing match with 4oz gloves in One FC?

I didn’t see it.

I mean that's essentially what it was. Not a single takedown was attempted I believe. Strickland just pressured and outboxed him.

Apparently Strickland actually speaks on training with boxers too, I wasn't aware. He gets into it around 40 seconds in:

 

[blackcease]

I wonder if Pereira is rethinking his decision to move up to LHW.

I mean he had his chance and got knocked out so nah.

Pereira-Strickland-Izzy might be one of the best examples of MMA Math not working and styles make fights. Crazy.

 

[Vincent Van Goat]

But those horrible title fights Anderson won right?

Izzy lost a decision to Sean where he only won one round after everyone was talking about ddp/khamzat fighting Izzy next

Clearly Anderson won those stinkers but that wasn't the question asked

Izzy clearly is the second best MW ever, we don't have to try to make it more than it is

Anderson never had a performance like that, ever. Never was he dropped, outclassed and defeated by a mid contender during his title reign. He had boring fights that he was never in danger of losing, but that's in no way shape or form equivalent to what we saw last night. Izzy's rep and legacy took a huge hit.

In terms of being stylistically the easiest, again, Strickland just exposed a flaw, Izzy's boxing is in question.

Folks still sleep on how effective solid fundamental boxing is as a base in MMA, maybe this might wake some people up.

Chael was mid and dropped Anderson and dominated him for 24.5 minutes. You can argue Chael wasn't mid but he was a journeymen going into their fight. He had double digit losses and was 14 years into his fight career

Anderson has had a number of performances like that-- it's just that his opponents were that much inferior they couldn't take advantage

Strickland is definitely mid but he has one of the best coaches in the sport and they executed a solid game plan. He wasn't scared of Izzy like Anderson's opponents were

 

[equality]

Honestly I just think Izzy lacks good boxing fundamentals. It's the biggest difference between Izzy and Anderson imo, Anderson was one of the better MMA boxers we've ever seen and Izzy's boxing is much weaker in comparison.

Kickboxing base and boxing base ain't the same. Izzy does way too much dancing around and point fighting with kicks because he lacks a significant advantage when staying in the pocket. He got beat tonight by a guy that simply came forward and worked behind a jab. Also Gastelum is a solid MMA boxer with fast hands and he gave Izzy. serious problems. In the Jan fight Jan was winning alot of the standup with Izzy by simply outboxing him. And Poatan I believe has better hands as well.

I think Izzy's strength is not trading in the pocket, it's a weakness for him, which is why he tends to fight in his point fighting style. And tonight it bit him in the *** because he was fighting a guy who kept pressuring and fought behind a jab. Strickland did nothing spectacular, just the basics, and Izzy just couldn't find enough openings to offset the basic work that was getting done.

This. I'm an Izzy fan and this fight really showed his weakness in boxing.
He's still and always will be a kickboxer to the core. Also 34 is around the age when athletes who have significant speed advantages start losing that advantage. Not sure where Izzy goes from here but this fight really got to be worse than the loss to Alex.

 

[Vincent Van Goat]

This. I'm an Izzy fan and this fight really showed his weakness in boxing.
He's still and always will be a kickboxer to the core. Also 34 is around the age when athletes who have significant speed advantages start losing that advantage. Not sure where Izzy goes from here but this fight really got to be worse than the loss to Alex.

Chimaev is a completely different matchup but this is exactly why I don't see Izzy fairing well if they end up meeting

Chimaev is going to go forward and not care or worry.. while Izzy is a sniper he isn't a one shot kill with his hands. Chimaev gonna just bring pure brute force and chaos in a way no other opponent can

If DDP implements a similar game plan to Strickland... sheesh. DDP is only 29...

MMA isn't real a lot of times, reality shifts weekend to weekend month to month

 

[xbiker47]

Legacy wise I just think this performance really hurts Izzy. Would have been one thing had Sean got the flash ko in the first, but he dominated for full 25 mins.

I’m a big izzy fan but man last night hurts. Just felt like I watched a completely different fighter in there then the guy who’s been fighting the last 5 years

 

[equality]

Chimaev is a completely different matchup but this is exactly why I don't see Izzy fairing well if they end up meeting

Chimaev is going to go forward and not care or worry.. while Izzy is a sniper he isn't a one shot kill with his hands. Chimaev gonna just bring pure brute force and chaos in a way no other opponent can

If DDP implements a similar game plan to Strickland... sheesh. DDP is only 29...

MMA isn't real a lot of times, reality shifts weekend to weekend month to month

Yep. Even if Izzy beat Strickland I though Chimaev would've beat him.

 

[Vincent Van Goat]

100% Izzy's legacy in terms of ever being considered the goat MW is cooked

Other than that he has #2 locked up pretty safely

Honestly kinda hard to look past this loss and the Alex loss and still believe izzy can be considered the MW goat

He would have to really go on another run with killers

 

[Davey Magoo]

I mean he had his chance and got knocked out so nah.

Pereira-Strickland-Izzy might be one of the best examples of MMA Math not working and styles make fights. Crazy.

Pereira knocked them both out.

 

[blackcease]

Clearly Anderson won those stinkers but that wasn't the question asked

Izzy clearly is the second best MW ever, we don't have to try to make it more than it is

Chael was mid and dropped Anderson and dominated him for 24.5 minutes. You can argue Chael wasn't mid but he was a journeymen going into their fight. He had double digit losses and was 14 years into his fight career

Anderson has had a number of performances like that-- it's just that his opponents were that much inferior they couldn't take advantage

Strickland is definitely mid but he has one of the best coaches in the sport and they executed a solid game plan. He wasn't scared of Izzy like Anderson's opponents were

Chael was not even close to mid in that era and he was a stylistic mismatch for Anderson (strong wrestler with boxing, just like Weidman).

Chael beat Okami, Marquardt, Bisping, Stann, his only loss in the UFC middleweight division was to Demian Maia, another title challenger and perpetual top 5 guy. who was also undefeated at the time they fought Also, it was confirmed Anderson had a broken rib the first match and Chael is also a confirmed cheater that popped for insane levels of test in that very fight when he almost beat Anderson. And Anderson still won regardless. Then whooped him in the rematch. This is nothing like Izzy vs Strickland.

Anderson did not have a number of performances like that,. Outside of Chael which I already explained (and Anderson won the fight anyway), there's not a single fight during his title reign where he was getting dropped and outclassed and was anywhere close to being in danger of losing. Anderson never got exposed by a mid contender like that, ever. Izzy did. It is what it is.

 

[blackcease]

Pereira knocked them both out.

And then got knocked out in the rematch. He had his chance and it didn't go his way. And he moved up because he thought the weight cut was too much, which it probably was.

 

[Davey Magoo]

I despise Sean Strickland’s racist, homophobic rhetoric.

But I have to admit, there’s a part of me that’s happy for the guy.

He grew up with s***…and now he has something.

Maybe this will change him for the better.

 

[Davey Magoo]

And then got knocked out. in the rematch. He had his chance and it didn't go his way.

So what?

Izzy got KOed twice and then beat him in the rematch.

So how is Pereira out of the mix, given that he’s 3-1 against Izzy and 1-0 against Strickland?

 

[Vincent Van Goat]

Chael was not even close to mid in that era and he was a stylistic mismatch for Anderson (strong wrestler with boxing, just like Weidman).

Chael beat Okami, Marquardt, Bisping, Stann, his only loss in the UFC middleweight division was to Demian Maia, another title challenger and perpetual top 5 guy. who was also undefeated at the time they fought Also, it was confirmed Anderson had a broken rib the first match and Chael is also a confirmed cheater that popped for insane levels of test in that very fight when he almost beat Anderson. And Anderson still won regardless. Then whooped him in the rematch. This is nothing like Izzy vs Strickland.

Anderson did not have a number of performances like that,. Outside of Chael which I already explained (and Anderson won the fight anyway), there's not a single fight during his title reign where he was getting dropped and outclassed and was anywhere close to being in danger of losing. Anderson never got exposed by a mid contender like that, ever. Izzy did. It is what it is.

And yet Chael lost to a number of no names. As you referred to- he was a cheater, which supports my claim

He was mid and had to use PED's to even the playing field and close the talent gap

Anderson had more than lackluster fights with Cote, Leites and Maia. Was his rib broken in those fights too?

Those dudes were just shook and had nothing for Anderson to take advantage

Strickland for sure had a great moment in that knockdown, no debating that. But let's not act like Izzy was getting beat to a pulp the rest of the fight. He got jabbed not battered

 

[steevoo1]

Anderson NEVER had an *** whooping like that during his prime. The first Chael fight was more just getting controlled. Big difference between putting on a stinker and just getting your *** beat pillar to post for 25 minutes.

This definitely takes away from Izzys all time greatness. He's still the 2nd best MW but he can never reach all time great anymore. The all timers are the ones who can come in on their worst days and their opponents best, then still somehow find a way to win.

Izzy was broken after the first. Anderson, Jose, JJ, and DJ never had that happen to them during their runs.

 

[Vincent Van Goat]

Y'all are overstating just how much Strickland "beat up" Izzy, like he had to go to the hospital. But go off

 

[blackcease]

I despise Sean Strickland’s racist, homophobic rhetoric.

But I have to admit, there’s a part of me that’s happy for the guy.

He grew up with s***…and now he has something.

Maybe this will change him for the better.

Man I really don't keep up with these guys much outside of the fights but is Strickland on some racist and homophobic stuff still?

The only interview I ever saw with him was the first one with Ariel where dude admitted that he grew up on some American History X ****, his uncle and family members were neo-nazis and he was on it too. But I thought I remembered him specifically saying in that interview that he did a 180 and realized how backwards they were, and basically disavowed all that. But again I don't follow too closely, maybe I'm missing some things.

The way some of y'all feel about Strickland is basically what I think about Dricus. Strickland on the other hand just seems like a loudmouth who's kinda playing up a character nowadays.

 

[Davey Magoo]

Izzy almost got stopped by Kelvin Gastelum.

…people forget that.

 

[Vincent Van Goat]

Izzy almost got stopped by Kelvin Gastelum.

…people forget that.

He also got cracked by Yoel and for whatever reason Yoel stopped fighting after that

 

[equality]

Izzy almost got stopped by Kelvin Gastelum.

…people forget that.

What? This is some fake news. He got rocked with a head kick but wasn't even close to sniffing a stoppage cause KG went for a takedown and Izzy recovered.
I get you're trying to make a point but come on man, that was a close fight but the only time it nearly got stopped was end of the 5th round when Izzy kept dropping KG.