"The Last Dance" Michael Jordan & Chicago Bulls Docuseries

[Barbados Slim]

Who's denying he was sick???? We're talking about the pizza bois knowing what PARTICULAR ROOM MJ was staying in AND...that the pizza was for HIM to eat.

Why is it important that they had to know it was for MJ? They could have assumed it was for any bulls player, said F the bulls, farted on the pizza or whatever, and it just happened to go to Jordan's room. There a bunch of players that could have got sick and given the Jazz a potential advantage.

 

[KHUFU]

Mario Chalmers was Lebby's punching bag the entire Healthes run but sure "feelings matter"

I think that you did not understand my post. I was discussing abusive coaches, and how that system has been upended by modern players and parents due to societal changes. People will always fight and yell. However the abuse coming from above is what is no longer acceptable.

 

[1978S]

I am saying that I don't think it is far fetched to think Grover/Jordan created the details of the pizza story.

Him eating pizza and getting sick sounds more plausible than the story Grover told.

So we've been agreeing the whole time. Got it.

 

[1978S]

Why is it important that they had to know it was for MJ? They could have assumed it was for any bulls player, said F the bulls, farted on the pizza or whatever, and it just happened to go to Jordan's room. There a bunch of players that could have got sick and given the Jazz a potential advantage.

Because Jordan was the one and only person who supposedly ate this phantom pizza. And the documentary is about Michael Jordan. And Michael Jordan is the person we are discussing here. This is all about Michael Jordan if you haven't noticed.

 

[Barbados Slim]

Because Jordan was the one and only person who supposedly ate this phantom pizza. And the documentary is about Michael Jordan. And Michael Jordan is the person we are discussing here. This is all about Michael Jordan if you haven't noticed.

Come on brah. You know I meant why MJ in context of the pizza situation. Not the documentary. You asked "How did the pizza guys know what room MJ was in?". I'm saying they didn't have to. They could have tried to poison anyone and it happened to be MJ.

 

[1978S]

I'm saying they didn't have too. They could have tried to poison anyone and it happened to be MJ.

But what are the chances they roll the dice to spike a pizza for the Bulls, and it just happens to be for the GOAT. The story is too much.

 

[KHUFU]

... as if LeBron ain’t NEVER verbally abused his teammates. Abuse is STILL highly prevalent in our society. Ya’ll just be saying anything.

LeBron has cursed out and embarrassed many a coaches. Look how he treated Blatt and Ty Lue

The point is that a Bobby Knight does not exist today, and for good reason. It it seems that you are missing that point. The change in coaching and communication will not go from 100 to zero overnight. But the system thst produced Jordan, the normalization of a coach throwing chairs and choking players, should have never been acceptable. Jordan telling that stewardess not to serve Horace Grant any food on that flight, is an example of such normalization. Horace was right in wanting to kick his ***.

 

[Master Zik]

With all that said if this is stemming from the comparison and differences of MJ and LeBron, MJ never had an abusive coach in his time on the NBA.

Not whoever was coaching when he first got to the Bulls, definitely not Doug Collins who was a player's coach and certainly not Phil Jackson who while stern and authoritative had a completely different approach to the game.

I'm not sure the difference matters as much. As things are now, there's an argument that with the power an agency star players have now its given them room to be just as abusive to coaches, players and mangement.

Also I find it flat out wrong to say that system produced Michael. No reason to place the blame elsewhere. Jordan was an a-hole and he would be one in this generation all the same.

 

[doublemesh96]

They could’ve been on the phone ordering and said “mike, what you want on the pizza” then papa heard them on the other end and was like

thats very plausible

 

[walkingBred]

 

[sooperhooper]

LeBron is from a different generation, a different athlete. His personality was formed through different societal norms, where feelings matter. Being a parent of two in their twenties, I saw the difference once my daughters got into school. That said, LeBron is exactly who he should be as is DRose, Steph Curry, DWade as well. Jordan came from a generation that normalized abuse, especially abuse coming from coaches. It did not make you tougher, it simply made you insensitive, numb to the feelings of others. So in the doc, then seeing his present day issues with Barkley, Pippen, and other athletes, it shows that Jordan still has deep seeded issues, mad insecurities, even though he has those six rings. LeBron is going to be way ahead of Jordan in this regard, especially when his career ends.

VERY insightful and accurate call out. Profound even. It's a self-serving, narcissistic mentality and yes, being a more considerate individual is definitely more encouraged nowadays.

 

[KHUFU]

I remember the first time that Jordan ran upon a player that did not come through those ranks of abuse, when he drafted Kwame Brown out of high school. He called Brown a gay slur during practice, then lost him forever. Jordan did come through that system of abuse, where it was thought that this is how you made players tougher both physically and mentally. There is a different energy in LeBron telling off the establishment, than it is punching Steve Kerr in the eye, or bullying teammates like Scott Burrell because you find them to be too nice. This is exactly why Bill Cartwright told him that he’ll break Jordan’s legs. LeBron’s generation is indeed different about such an approach, albeit not being totally erased as of yet.

 

[sooperhooper]

You're on to something, let's talk about this.

Exactly! I think about this all the time and even considered making a video about the empath/narcissist scale: what causes someone to care/not care about others and the side-effect of each.

No offense but I always looked at KHUFU 's posts as extreme and honestly wasn't sure if he was playing a character (similar to aepps). But dude definitely unpacked some wisdom in that tidbit and I'm glad I didn't miss it bc I skim through this thread.

 

[Barbados Slim]

But what are the chances they roll the dice to spike a pizza for the Bulls, and it just happens to be for the GOAT. The story is too much.

I agree chances are low but not zero. I'm just saying the pizza guys didn't have to know it was for MJ. Word travels in any smaller city of what hotel athletes are staying in. Especially in fast food delivery, so the chances it's going to anyone on the bulls team or staff isn't that crazy. They could have been trying to get any other player or players sick. Doesn't have to be some big conspiracy.

 

[wavycrocket]

Bron cutthroat as a teammate too . He a great dude....but you disposable to him, as soon as it looks like you can’t help him.

“LeBron is going to trade you”.....gotta be one of the funniest rants I’ve ever heard in my life . The passive aggressive stuff is OD too.

It be yo own *****s.

 

[sooperhooper]

I remember the first time that Jordan ran upon a player that did not come through those ranks of abuse, when he drafted Kwame Brown out of high school. He called Brown a gay slur during practice, then lost him forever. Jordan did come through that system of abuse, where it was thought that this is how you made players tougher both physically and mentally. There is a different energy in LeBron telling off the establishment, than it is punching Steve Kerr in the eye, or bullying teammates like Scott Burrell because you find them to be too nice. This is exactly why Bill Cartwright told him that he’ll break Jordan’s legs. LeBron’s generation is indeed different about such an approach, albeit not being totally erased as of yet.

Bro, in the closing scene of episode 7, you can tell that he knows his method wasn't perfect but it's how he was raised and it worked in the end. Him getting teary-eyed and emotional said a lot. Similar to a parent that was abused as a child unleashing that same abuse on their kids; deep down they know it's not right but in the end it works, but they still carry a guilt. This is thread worthy bro.

 

[doublemesh96]

Jordan is mean and a bully so lebron is better. Ok.

 

[sooperhooper]

When Jordan was rocking out with the headphones on the bus, and someone asked who he was listening to, I just knew it was gonna be something we didn't expect. I knew it wasn't gonna be snoop or 2pac. Mike just seemed too mature for that.

 

[kingjay718]

Utah jazz still deserve some roses. Swept the 61-win lakers team that had 4 all stars, ended the Houston Rockets big three in back to back season, they were the class of the West despite the west having the flashier teams. And Karl Malone took home two mvp’s. Respect.

 

[sooperhooper]

Jordan is mean and a bully so lebron is better. Ok.

I don't think that's the point that he's making. Not a better basketball player, but a more personable human being. I'm a huge Jordan fan on the court and I've never liked LeBron on the court, but if given the chance to meet one, I'd pick Bron.

I remember someone saying LeBron didn't even like to talk trash when he first came in the league; he just laugh it off.

 

[Fozz]

MJ putting Byron Russell on his list the moment he questioned his retirement lmaooooo

 

[SoleByThePound]

For those of you casting doubt on the Pizza story, take these things into account. The pizza was ordered late, possibly when they were closing up. I imagine the staff was pissed and decided to take it out on the order (think the movie Waiting). The odds of the employees knowing it was for someone on the Bulls is probably slim, however maybe whoever ordered the pizza had to name drop in order for them to take the order in the first place. Now according to the episode, 5 people showed up to deliver the pizza. Now either they were all in on it or maybe they knew that’s where the Bulls were saying and were hoping to catch a glimpse of anyone at that hotel.

The story is plausible and actually makes more sense than him having the flu.

 

[doublemesh96]

I don't think that's the point that he's making. Not a better basketball player, but a more personable human being. I'm a huge Jordan fan on the court and I've never liked LeBron on the court, but if given the chance to meet one, I'd pick Bron.

I remember someone saying LeBron didn't even like to talk trash when he first came in the league; he just laugh it off.

idk why people even speak on it. If you’ve followed jordan all these years it’s no secret he’s an *******.its not even up for debate.

 

[s-blaze]

Exactly! I think about this all the time and even considered making a video about the empath/narcissist scale: what causes someone to care/not care about others and the side-effect of each.

No offense but I always looked at KHUFU 's posts as extreme and honestly wasn't sure if he was playing a character (similar to aepps). But dude definitely unpacked some wisdom in that tidbit and I'm glad I didn't miss it bc I skim through this thread.

It's something there, just needs to be expounded on.

Jordan is mean and a bully so lebron is better. Ok.

I don't think this is where it's going.

 

[sooperhooper]

idk why people even speak on it. If you’ve followed jordan all these years it’s no secret he’s an *******.its not even up for debate.

They speak on it because they probably haven't followed him and it's news to them. They just know him as a great athlete.