**NBA FINALS THREAD - RAPTORS DEFY GRAVITY**

[youngwolf]

.

He's back.

 

[youngwolf]

nightmare beginning but very possible.

Just wait on it. Rockets will lead the majority of the game until the refs put their whistles away, then the game will get tight all the way until the end.

 

[ballinsam23]

Bucks by 20

 

[BIG LEEMELONE]

Strictly basketball and not refs, yall think the rockets would win this one?

 

[junglejim]

 

[second2nonee]

All that’s fair. I will admit that I’m bothered by the whole concept of doing a report like that since a basketball game is such a fluid thing, in which so many variables can contribute to the outcome. So, unless the Rockets report accounts for changes in all potential variables that could have impacted that series, it seems like cherry-picking certain things to support a narrative. But I’m by no means a math or science expert, so I give my opinion on this with that qualifier.

And it’s weird to me to some extent to try attach a point value to particular calls by refs. A call or non-call going a different way could have triggered a totally different sequence of events from what actually happened. Which is, again, why I basically reject the idea of going back an dissecting an already completed game. Same reason I no longer pay any attention to the last two minute officiating reports that come out about Clippers games.

i think you're misinterpreting why they did that. it has very little to do with the butterfly effect. that's what sensationalist headlines and the narrative would have you believe.

all they did was show you the EV and net impact of all the wrong calls that were made (for both teams). and they used the nba's logic of assigning value to calls also. this is all neutral data as well, provided by the nba.

of course morey and his guys have the agenda because they want it to be in the rockets favor, but the bigger point is showing how the NBA themselves need to be held accountable. and this goes for both teams. but the NET rating was in our favor. that's it. they just want consistency, like everyone does.

they never concluded with 100% certainty they would win, but changing the EV of +93 in a 7 game series is factually correct, given the evidence provided by the OWN league

 

[BIG LEEMELONE]

i think you're misinterpreting why they did that. it has very little to do with the butterfly effect. that's what sensationalist headlines and the narrative would have you believe.

all they did was show you the EV and net impact of all the wrong calls that were made (for both teams). and they used the nba's logic of assigning value to calls also. this is all neutral data as well

They. Missed. Twenty. Seven. Consecutive. 3s. They shot 15% from deep. They lost by 9. That's why the whole thing is ridiculous. The refs didn't lose the game. The Rockets did

 

[second2nonee]

They. Missed. Twenty. Seven. Consecutive. 3s. They shot 15% from deep. They lost by 9. That's why the whole thing is ridiculous. The refs didn't lose the game. The Rockets did

i don't care and they didn't say that. hell, most of us don't even say that. i'm simply providing context because you guys don't read and don't understand math

they should've played and shot better where the refs didn't matter. refs ain't lose them the game. but they're just showing you how dumb it is to act like the refs weren't wrong. but they're using the nba's own logic + math against them.

same method but different approach to teams sending "tapes" complaining about how a certain player guards kevin durant

 

[BIG LEEMELONE]

i don't care and they didn't say that. hell, most of us don't even say that. i'm simply providing context because you guys don't read and don't understand math

Bruh. There is no context. They lost because they didn't play well enough. No book report is making their bricks go in. It's pitiful that they would even resort to this . And yes that's exactly what they said, that the refs cost them a trip to the finals

"Referees likely changed the eventual NBA champion," says the memo, addressed to Byron Spruell, the NBA's president of league operations. "There can be no worse result for the NBA."

 

[lawdog1]

i think you're misinterpreting why they did that. it has very little to do with the butterfly effect. that's what sensationalist headlines and the narrative would have you believe.

all they did was show you the EV and net impact of all the wrong calls that were made (for both teams). and they used the nba's logic of assigning value to calls also. this is all neutral data as well, provided by the nba.

of course morey and his guys have the agenda because they want it to be in the rockets favor, but the bigger point is showing how the NBA themselves need to be held accountable. and this goes for both teams. but the NET rating was in our favor. that's it. they just want consistency, like everyone does.

they never concluded with 100% certainty they would win, but changing the EV of +93 in a 7 game series is factually correct, given the evidence provided by the OWN league

If all that’s true, then the Rockets’ report is much more reasonable and objective than its being portrayed. I still have my issues with it, but I no longer think it was a ridiculous thing for them to do.

 

[second2nonee]

If all that’s true, then the Rockets’ report is much more reasonable and objective than its being portrayed. I still have my issues with it, but I no longer think it was a ridiculous thing for them to do.

it looks bad, i agree. i don't think anyone is excusing them from missing so many damn open shots in game 7. they could've won in spite of some egregious reffing.

it doesn't really matter honestly. it's annoying to even talk about at this point. those on either side of the debate will forever be stubborn. and those on the neutral side can look at thru which ever lens they went. but the numbers are all there.

none of this should be a big deal but the nba brought it onto themselves, for better or worse.

 

[second2nonee]

Bruh. There is no context. They lost because they didn't play well enough. No book report is making their bricks go in. It's pitiful that they would even resort to this . And yes that's exactly what they said, that the refs cost them a trip to the finals

"Referees likely changed the eventual NBA champion," says the memo, addressed to Byron Spruell, the NBA's president of league operations. "There can be no worse result for the NBA."

of course they themselves BELIEVE that. but they never stated it.

"likely" is not the same thing. a +93 EV is a logical conclusion in pretty much any 7 games series

and you're still missing the big picture

 

[BIG LEEMELONE]

of course they themselves BELIEVE that. but they never stated it.

"likely" is not the same thing. a +93 EV is a logical conclusion in pretty much any 7 games series

and you're still missing the big picture

What do you mean they never stated it? That was their exact statement. That the refs cost them a title. Are you really splitting hairs over the word 'likely'? C'mon bro 'There can be no worse result for the NBA'

'The Rockets never actually sent the memo to Spruell, because they ended up communicating its messages -- including that they believe officiating cost them the 2018 title -- during in-person meetings with league officials, according to multiple league sources.'

To be sure, the Rockets’ report is hilarious and (without seeing the full thing) seems wacky. The best example Lowe and Nichols share in their story: the Rockets claim that because the officials didn’t call a blocking foul on Harden in Game 7 (something the NBA report considers inconclusive in review), they cost Houston two points, or the difference between Kevon Looney’s expected point value from free throws and what actually happened (a Kevin Durant three). So somehow, this turn of events -- Harden getting the benefit of a swallowed whistle on defense -- is proof ... the officials are biased against the Rockets?

It's a complete joke.

And again like I said, there were plenty of calls against the rockets that the warriors didn't even take advantage of and the rockets still got the ball back and didn't capitalize. They lost because they weren't good enough

 

[moe200069]

i think you're misinterpreting why they did that. it has very little to do with the butterfly effect. that's what sensationalist headlines and the narrative would have you believe.

all they did was show you the EV and net impact of all the wrong calls that were made (for both teams). and they used the nba's logic of assigning value to calls also. this is all neutral data as well, provided by the nba.

of course morey and his guys have the agenda because they want it to be in the rockets favor, but the bigger point is showing how the NBA themselves need to be held accountable. and this goes for both teams. but the NET rating was in our favor. that's it. they just want consistency, like everyone does.

they never concluded with 100% certainty they would win, but changing the EV of +93 in a 7 game series is factually correct, given the evidence provided by the OWN league

rockets need a larger sample size. picking just one series, specifically a highly important and possibly franchise altering series in which they lost, is dubious as hell. why not run these analytics on the two prior series in which they went a combined 8-2? was the reffing inconsistent, as well? was there potential bias against them or Jazz or Timberwolves? what about other playoff series, was the reffing inconsistent in the ECF? it seems desperate to come up with a dissertation for the sole purpose of painting yourself as the main "victim" of inconsistent reffing.

the concept of "we had an EV of +93" is laughable. last time i checked, no team ever won a game on paper or based on analytics.

By the Rockets’ internal count from their video crew, there were eight attempted 3-pointers that should have been fouls in Game 1 – good for 24 free throw attempts that would’ve certainly decided the game.

assuming that those 3s were between EG, Harden, and CP3 who hit ~80% of their FTs, that would be an extra 20 points. so basically rockets should have won the game 120 - 104?

 

[MVP]

Rockets need to go to the G-league. This is behavior unbecoming of a professional basketball team in the best league in the world. They're embarrassing themselves. Just hoop gaddamn.

 

[Nike Jordan]

 

[second2nonee]

What do you mean they never stated it? That was their exact statement. That the refs cost them a title. Are you really splitting hairs over the word 'likely'? C'mon bro



It's a complete joke.

And again like I said, there were plenty of calls against the rockets that the warriors didn't even take advantage of and the rockets still got the ball back and didn't capitalize. They lost because they weren't good enough

you nitpicked a quote from a guy who still does not understand the math behind how they did it. congrats. i'm tired of arguing it already. you got it

there's a reason i only replied to lawdog1 at first. to give context

 

[bballkid11]

Either KD or Curry will get two early fouls, and the Rockets will be in the bonus within the first 4 minutes of the game.

The NBA is a ****ing novela.

Klay bro 2 quick ones
Like first 6 minutes quick

 

[second2nonee]

rockets need a larger sample size. picking just one series, specifically a highly important and possibly franchise altering series in which they lost, is dubious as hell. why not run these analytics on the two prior series in which they went a combined 8-2? was the reffing inconsistent, as well? was there potential bias against them or Jazz or Timberwolves? what about other playoff series, was the reffing inconsistent in the ECF? it seems desperate to come up with a dissertation for the sole purpose of painting yourself as the main "victim" of inconsistent reffing.

the concept of "we had an EV of +93" is laughable. last time i checked, no team ever won a game on paper or based on analytics.



assuming that those 3s were between EG, Harden, and CP3 who hit ~80% of their FTs, that would be an extra 20 points. so basically rockets should have won the game 120 - 104?

to be clear, i think it's a bad look and you can't really assume the outcome because there's too many factors.

the +EV of 93 is not laughable though. even if it doesn't conclude the result, they literally did it for both teams, and that was the Net outcome. i'm not sure what other analytical method you want them to come up with to get that data.

nothing is dubious about it at all. again, bigger picture...

 

[lawdog1]

Klay bro 2 quick ones
Like first 6 minutes quick

I’d have to imagine that, at least to start the game, Klay’s going to be a little more careful about where he lands on his 3 contests...but he could pick up a couple of quick ones early in other ways.

 

[buc em]

Been smashing this flight attendant and she put me on her free pass list...ya boy about to be flying out to some more games

 

[junglejim]

We are only one game into the series and we have talked non-stop about refs. This is going to be one of the least enjoyable series I can remember

 

[bostoiah]

Been smashing this flight attendant and she put me on her free pass list...ya boy about to be flying out to some more games

Pics

 

[BIG LEEMELONE]

but they're using the nba's own logic + math against them.

'In its own reports, the league does not attach point values to missed calls and non-calls.

"As we told the Rockets, we do not agree with their methodology," Mike Bass, an NBA spokesman, told ESPN on Monday'

second2nonee weren't you one of the main ones saying the rockets had no chance against the warriors last year despite having home court, winning more games, having the goat offense etc? What's the fuss about?

 

[MVP]

Been smashing this flight attendant and she put me on her free pass list...ya boy about to be flying out to some more games

Is she black?