Lebron in the All Star game and the Pro Bowl? maybe....

[0cks]

Nah I never said he would go HAM in the NFL, I think he could make plays here and there in certain situations... I'm not saying he would do Gates/Gonzalez numbers... but you never know

 

[i am knowledge]

Oh yeah. The Pro Bowl is a joke.

And

at what this post has turned into.  I'm a long term NT poster, but haven't spent much time in S&T.

Is just how the conversations usually go?

From Pro Bowler TE, to heart warming D-Lineman. 

And now that we are talking about LeBron getting sacks we will now have to compare him and Julius Peppers. 

 

[0cks]

I have no clue where in my post Ska got the idea that I was saying LeBron would be like Rudy... that's just being dense, I was giving an example of how in some sports you pretty much have to play the sport from childhood (baseball) while others are easily picked up later on in life (football)

Kellen Winslow Sr. didn't even let his son play Football until he was in HS... he had him play other sports he felt would prepare him for Football. There are soooo many skills from other sports that translate well to Football, not so much vice versa

 

[darthska]

Just where you finished with that question "Do you think Rudy could happen in baseball?", it seemed like you were implying two things: that LeBron could at least be Rudy, and that baseball is far more intricate than Rudy, so something like that wouldn't even be possible.

If that's not how you meant it, then, so be it. Like I said, I made a comment earlier about LeBron doing worse than MJ at baseball, which may be where your Rudy reference came from.

 

[0cks]

I was making a reference to Baseball relevant to Football... I didn't even mention LeBron in that post

Stories like Rudy = possible in football
Stories like Rudy = highly unlikely in baseball
Football = anything is possible with athleticism and a whole lotta heart

 

[darthska]

Fair enough. So with that...

0cks:

---

I was making a reference to Baseball relevant to Football... I didn't even mention LeBron in that post

Stories like Rudy = possible in football
Stories like Rudy = highly unlikely in baseball
Football = anything is possible with athleticism and a whole lotta heart
... I disagree. 'Anything is possible' provides WAY too much room for someone who just brings athleticism and heart.

With athleticism and heart, you can get your foot in the door. Past that, and I know this is becoming a broken record of mine, you need to know the game.

With talent and a whole lotta heart AND an extensive, intricate knowledge of the game, THEN anything is possible.

 

[0cks]

Originally Posted by 23ska909red02

With athleticism and heart, you can get your foot in the door. 

and from there anything is possible

 
Football is the only sport where measurables alone will get you a foot in the door. Baseball is nothing but intricacies

 

[myjaysgetrocked]

Originally Posted by aztec06jr

For the record - I'm a diehard Kobe Bryant fan so naturally I enjoy when LeBron loses in the Finals, etc. But to say that LeBron James, the greatest athlete in NBA history, would not do a 'damn thing' in the NFL when we have legit examples (Gates / Graham) of average athletes succeeding as TEs (mostly because of their combo of size/speed), is asinine.

Ska, you bring up good points...football is a tough sport but when it comes down to it, LeBron James with 1 training camp under his belt is doing work in the NFL.

Let me repeat his measurables...

6'8

265

4.4 speed

45 inch vertical

NO ATHLETE has ever had this combination of speed/size/quickness/vertical/etc. NO ATHLETE.

To say that LeBron wouldn't forcefully take playing time away from Kyle Williams (bum 3rd string WR for the 49ers) is just egregious.

We get it....You guys love to hate LeBron.

But that's like saying you wouldn't want Adrian Peterson on your rugby team because he hasn't played it in a while.

I've never done this on Niketak but I'll do it now: LOL

LeBron f'n James. Size of Karl Malone, speed of Derrick Rose, vertical of James White, strength of a Ben Wallace. And he couldn't get burn in the NFL. Again, LOL. Don't forget he can also throw a football, WR pass anybody?

N ll K 3 - Cosign everything you said. You've brought up legit examples, you destroyed the elitist mod's opinion that MJ w/ a bat > LeBron running a fade (again, LOL).

Sincerely,
Kobe fan / man of logic / 49er fan who hates Kyle Williams / guy who understands that LeBron is a once in a lifetime athlete 

Take it easy Stephen A. Smith.....

 

[darthska]

aztec06jr:

---

For the record - I'm a diehard Kobe Bryant fan
So right off the bat, you've thrown yourself into a certain 'type' here on NT, so now everyone is clear.

aztec06jr:

---

Ska, you bring up good points...football is a tough sport but when it comes down to it, LeBron James with 1 training camp under his belt is doing work in the NFL.
Repeat:

aztec06jr:

---

Ska, you bring up good points...football is a tough sport but when it comes down to it, LeBron James with 1 training camp under his belt is doing work in the NFL.
And again, just to be clear:

aztec06jr:

---

Ska, you bring up good points...football is a tough sport but when it comes down to it, LeBron James with 1 training camp under his belt is doing work in the NFL.
That does say that, right? 'Is doing'? Right now? RIGHT NOW?!

And don't hide behind the literal cop-out on this one. "Well, I'm just saying, he's working out with so and so, which means he is working, and he's doing it, so he's doing work in th..."

No. You know damn well what 'doing work' means.

After 1 training camp, LeBron's doing WORK!!

aztec06jr:

---

I have heard of NO ATHLETE who has ever had this combination of speed/size/quickness/vertical/etc. NO ATHLETE that I know of.
Fixed.

aztec06jr:

---

We get it....You guys love to hate LeBron.
If that's what you're gathering, then no, you don't get it.

aztec06jr:

---

LeBron f'n James. Size of Karl Malone, speed of Derrick Rose, vertical of James White, strength of a Ben Wallace. And he couldn't get burn in the NFL. Again, LOL. Don't forget he can also throw a football, WR pass anybody?
And the knowledge of... the work ethic of... the attention to detail of...

Again with the strict adherence to athleticism and the BLATENT, almost seemingly intentional at this point, disregard for the fine tuning necessary to go into beast mode.

Answer me this: WHY is it possible for a guy in his 30s to show up at a park of high schoolers who can run WAY faster than him, jump WAY higher than his non-vertical self, quicker reflexes... all that crap that goes into a discussion of athleticism... why is it even POSSIBLE for him to show up at a park and play ball against dudes who are entirely more athletic than him, yet he continues to show up and frustrate most of them on the regular?

Why?

My contention is that he knows the game better than them (more knowledgeable; nothing to do with athleticism), he's been playing longer (experience; nothing to do with athleticism), he probably practices while they're laughing at elitist mods online or playing video games (commitment: nothing to do with athleticism), but what do YOU think is the reason?

And just stick to answering the question, please.

 "Man, is this dude saying...?" Just answer it or leave it.

aztec06jr:

---

N ll K 3 - Cosign everything you said. You've brought up legit examples, you destroyed the elitist mod's opinion that MJ w/ a bat > LeBron running a fade (again, LOL).
Elitist?! Mod?!

















I'm an admin!

 

[n ll k 3]

Originally Posted by 23ska909red02

I AM KNOWLEDGE:

---

Ska, your arguments have been pretty legit.  I just think your MJ comment was wrong / hyperbole

which took focus off of the other points you were making.

You now what, dude? I've thought a few times throughout this discussion. Every time someone brings it back up, I'm thinking "You know, maybe I shouldn't have said that."

 Which is why I haven't been going all in as far as defending/qualifying that comment. Left that one on the table a few pages back.

 *shrugs*
You probably wouldn't have even goten a response from me if you didn't throw that little nugget in at the end.

 

That's one of the most misinformed/ill-advised statements I've read in S&T for quite some time, IMO.  And I'll explain later on in this post.

I'm talking about guys who are doing something else, an NFL team gives them a look, and they end up being excellent, or even average.

What are some names that fit that bill?
Are you really that ignorant to the situation that you are arguing or are you just trying to piss people off?  Seriously question.

How many times do I have to mention his name?  Antonio Gates.

This is a man that played college basketball in the Mid Atlantic Conference at Kent State (made a nice run in the tourney).  4 year player, didn't play a down of football.  4 years w/o football.

Wouldn't get a sniff in the NBA for 2 seconds.

He ends up trying out for the NFL at 22 years old (LeBron James is 26 years old) and becomes the greatest player to ever play TE in the history of football not named Tony Gonzalez.

Athletically, LeBron makes this man look like an average joe.  As many combine terms/slang/measurables [color= rgb(255, 0, 0)]GUNNA[/color] wants to possibly question LeBron on, LeBron makes this man look just "regular".

Lebron is not a explosive coming out of stops and starts. He's not a good change of direction guy.
Then what does that make Antonio Gates?

I would post Antonio Gates Kent State highlights in here, but I can't even find them on YouTube.  Not a single video clip.  You would laugh at the way this man moved on a basketball court in comparison to LeBron.  And he was playing in the Mid Atlantic Conference, not the Olympics.

Lebron is a guy who doesn't shake and blow by players who CAN'T use their hands, now yall want him to blow by guys who are gonna stab him in the chest every snap. OKay.
And Antonio Gates, an undersized PF couldn't blow by wings that played in the MAC.  Seems like a good point now, right?  This is filled with such ignorance it's astounding.

Hitting a baseball is the hardest thing to do in sports.  The NFL is the easiest professional league to not only play in, but DOMINATE there is w/o even playing a down in 5 years at any level.  You don't even need to play a down of college ball.

But I'm to believe Michael Jordan, a man that was never a serious pro prospect at any point in his life could hit a baseball in the Major Leagues (hardest thing to do in sports) better than a man that was offered a full scholarship by Jim Tressel at Ohio State at 15 years old (unprecedented) and has been compared to some of the greatest players to ever play football by football Hall of Famers.

I had a teammate (w/o playing a single down of football in his entire life, mind you) who started at MLB for a team ranked in the top 10 in the country by USA Today.

This kid is now playing in the MLS, but that's besides the point.

Now answer me this, what sport can you start and excel on a nationally ranked quality high school team w/o ever playing in your life?

I don't want to hear "it's HS!".  Football is the same damn sport w/ the same damn rules regardless of what level it's being played on.

What other sport would a kid be able to pull that off in?

I rest my case.

 

[dajondondo]

Not saying he will be successful but not saying he will be a failure. Just saying he could make a team. You guys think he is gonna be a super hero cuz his height and speed. Relax. What he does in basketball isnt what he is doing in Football. This will never even happen EVER!!!!!... unless he takes a year off from the NBA and goes to the NFL... still not happening.

 

[darthska]

Trying to piss people off?

Never that. The hell I look like trying to piss off some dude I will most likely never, ever meet? And if you did know me in person, you'd definitely know the answer to that, because I'm not the 'push buttons' type.

But anyways, have you mentioned Gates already? Maybe I missed it, because I was seriously asking for a list of players who had taken a sabbatical (sp?) from a sport for an extended period of time, then returend and maintained at least a C grade.

So am I to understand that Gates NEVER played football in college? But played in HS? Because I know who he is in the NFL, obviously.

There are still A LOT of attributes I would pin his success on other than athleticism, which you guys simply can't let go of.

And I can't let go fo the importance of non-athletic elements I've already beaten to death in here.

 

[theblackhole76]

I generally agree with 23ska here but the MJ-with-bat line just threw this conversation all outta whack. MJ-with-a-bat is almost the lowest standard imaginable (sorry, hyperbole) and to say he wouldn't even sniff THAT standard? Uhh can't agree with that...
There are two points being made here in this thread:

1. Lebron would have the ability to make the Pro Bowl in the NFL

2. Lebron would have the ability to beat MJ's baseball career

I may be wrong, but it just seems like 23ska and N II K 3 are arguing two different points here... (okay at least initially, I'm getting confused as to what exactly is getting argued now

)

 

[aztec06jr]

Originally Posted by N ll K 3

Originally Posted by 23ska909red02

I AM KNOWLEDGE:

---

Ska, your arguments have been pretty legit.  I just think your MJ comment was wrong / hyperbole

which took focus off of the other points you were making.

You now what, dude? I've thought a few times throughout this discussion. Every time someone brings it back up, I'm thinking "You know, maybe I shouldn't have said that."

 Which is why I haven't been going all in as far as defending/qualifying that comment. Left that one on the table a few pages back.

 *shrugs*

You probably wouldn't have even goten a response from me if you didn't throw that little nugget in at the end.

 

That's one of the most misinformed/ill-advised statements I've read in S&T for quite some time, IMO.  And I'll explain later on in this post.

I'm talking about guys who are doing something else, an NFL team gives them a look, and they end up being excellent, or even average.

What are some names that fit that bill?
Are you really that ignorant to the situation that you are arguing or are you just trying to piss people off?  Seriously question.

How many times do I have to mention his name?  Antonio Gates.

This is a man that played college basketball in the Mid Atlantic Conference at Kent State (made a nice run in the tourney).  4 year player, didn't play a down of football.  4 years w/o football.

Wouldn't get a sniff in the NBA for 2 seconds.

He ends up trying out for the NFL at 22 years old (LeBron James is 26 years old) and becomes the greatest player to ever play TE in the history of football not named Tony Gonzalez.

Athletically, LeBron makes this man look like an average joe.  As many combine terms/slang/measurables [color= rgb(255, 0, 0)]GUNNA[/color] wants to possibly question LeBron on, LeBron makes this man look just "regular".

Lebron is not a explosive coming out of stops and starts. He's not a good change of direction guy.
Then what does that make Antonio Gates?

I would post Antonio Gates Kent State highlights in here, but I can't even find them on YouTube.  Not a single video clip.  You would laugh at the way this man moved on a basketball court in comparison to LeBron.  And he was playing in the Mid Atlantic Conference, not the Olympics.

Lebron is a guy who doesn't shake and blow by players who CAN'T use their hands, now yall want him to blow by guys who are gonna stab him in the chest every snap. OKay.
And Antonio Gates, an undersized PF couldn't blow by wings that played in the MAC.  Seems like a good point now, right?  This is filled with such ignorance it's astounding.

Hitting a baseball is the hardest thing to do in sports.  The NFL is the easiest professional league to not only play in, but DOMINATE there is w/o even playing a down in 5 years at any level.  You don't even need to play a down of college ball.

But I'm to believe Michael Jordan, a man that was never a serious pro prospect at any point in his life could hit a baseball in the Major Leagues (hardest thing to do in sports) better than a man that was offered a full scholarship by Jim Tressel at Ohio State at 15 years old (unprecedented) and has been compared to some of the greatest players to ever play football by football Hall of Famers.

I had a teammate (w/o playing a single down of football in his entire life, mind you) who started at MLB for a team ranked in the top 10 in the country by USA Today.

This kid is now playing in the MLS, but that's besides the point.

Now answer me this, what sport can you start and excel on a nationally ranked quality high school team w/o ever playing in your life?

I don't want to hear "it's HS!".  Football is the same damn sport w/ the same damn rules regardless of what level it's being played on.

What other sport would a kid be able to pull that off in?

I rest my case.

My man...came with the logic.

 @ "Lebron is not a explosive coming out of stops and starts. He's not a good change of direction guy" then 

 at "What does that make Antonio Gates?" 

Ska is coming off as just ignorant and Gunna is coming off as bitter/senile.

Again: 6'8, 260, 45 inch vertical, 4.4 40 time and you guys don't think he'd do work in the NFL. 

Do you guys think God/Jesus/Zeus could crack an NFL roster?

What next...LeBron wouldn't have been good if he played college bball? 

...The scary part is, I think Ska or Gunna might actually think that. 

Ska - for the sake of logic, please close this thread with your admin/mod abilities...

P.S. "Lebron is not a explosive coming out of stops and starts. He's not a good change of direction guy" 

 

[darthska]

^ Translation: "I have nothing intelligent to add, so I'll just dub NIIK3's words as logic since I agree w/ them, and scoff at ska/GUNNA, since I disagree with."

 

[n ll k 3]

Trying to piss people off?

Never that. The hell I look like trying to piss off some dude I will most likely never, ever meet? And if you did know me in person, you'd definitely know the answer to that, because I'm not the 'push buttons' type.
I know you're a relatively bright guy and are the anti-troll, that's why I got so heated.  If you weren't aware of Antonio Gates' background (or lack thereof), no biggy.

MJ-with-a-bat is almost the lowest standard imaginable
That's what fired me all up.  Comparing the background of MJ's (baseball - was he even good at any point in his life?) and Bron (football - I've beaten a dead horse in here) alternate sports and the difficulty in their alternate sports (baseball - hardest, football - easiest), leaves me to believe that you're a pure Bron hater (why I called you out at one point) or someone who has literally no clue what they're talking about on this matter (and I mean that in a nice way).  I'm gonna say you fall into the latter. 

And I'm trying not to be condescending in anyway.  You yourself said football is not your thing compared to hoops and baseball.  Football happens to be one of my passions.

No biggy, each and everyone of us have said some dumb %##! (or multiple times) on NT if you've been on here long enough.

There are two points being made here in this thread:

1. Lebron would have the ability to make the Pro Bowl in the NFL

2. Lebron would have the ability to beat MJ's baseball career

I may be wrong, but it just seems like 23ska and N II K 3 are arguing two different points here... (okay at least initially, I'm getting confused as to what exactly is getting argued now

)


All I've argued initially was the MJ claim.  Then I argued he'd be the biggest threat in the red zone on the Cleveland Browns within a year of quitting hoops and focusing on football.

I'm one of the few on here who saw Bron play football (not trying to get any cool points - it's reality), and I know what he is capable of.  I know what Brian Robiskie is capable of (seen his entire football career from Chagrin Falls HS, to Ohio State, to the Cleveland Browns).

Did anyone watch the Browns game today?  We have the worst receiving core in the league and it's probably not even close, something Brian Robiskie is a part of.

I'm not necessarily saying Bron will be a Pro Bowler.  Far from it.

I watched Antonio Gates play ball at Kent State a few times (right outside of Cleveland).

If he can enter the league at 22 (only 4 years younger than Bron is right now) after not playing a single down since high school (grant it, he was part of MSU's football program but never actually played/transferred his freshman year) and become arguably the greatest player at his position in the history of his sport (with 1/2 the athletic ability of Bron), why wouldn't Bron at least be decent?

Knowledgeable sports people thought Bron was more dominant at football than he was at hoops at one point (most hyped prep basketball player we will ever see). 

Let that sink in for a second.

That's all I've ever said at will continue to say.

 

[aztec06jr]

Originally Posted by 23ska909red02

^ Translation: "I have nothing intelligent to add, so I'll just dub NIIK3's words as logic since I agree w/ them, and scoff at ska/GUNNA, since I disagree with."

^Translation: "Damn. I should have never compared anything to Michael Jordan swinging a bat"
Let me ask it differently: Why couldn't LeBron come close to replicating Antonio Gates' success? 
Wouldn't the fact that LeBron is significantly taller, faster, quicker and possesses a significantly higher vertical, hand size, stride, etc. not increase the probability that LeBron could come close to replicating Gates or Graham?

You come off as a senile old timer. Think about what YOU said, you said LeBron on the gridiron couldn't sniff MJ with a baseball bat. Think about it man. There's not even a punchline here. It is one of the most ignorant things I've ever read on NT. 

You're clearly an open minded person (just looking at your sig, you're repping 25% of professional/college sports teams)...but to ever compare LeBron in football to MJ in baseball is just....damn, there's no emoticon for it. 

I'm hurt (

) that someone with a fully functional brain (correct me if I'm wrong) could say that. I would provide an analogy but I can't....I just want to forget this thread and pretend like it never happened 

. Please tell me you were drunk/high today..something...anything.. At least give me a reason to not stop taking you seriously..

The tallest cornerback in the league is 6'4 (he's a bum btw) but somehow LeBron couldn't go off/over/by most CBs in the league.

LeBron is a world class athlete. Once in a generation athlete. My opinion would be the same if he had 6 rings, 0 rings, -5 rings. You don't teach 6'8, 260, 4.4 40, 45 inch vertical, speed, quickness. 

We're not saying Ron Artest playing linebacker or Shaq playing DT. 

And 

 at LeBron not being tough. 5'10 cornerbacks taking down LeBron? Like the dude from Taken said, "GOOD LUCK"

Btw, Ska I almost always respect your sports opinions on this forum. But this time you're wrong. Please renege on your original stance/MJ quote and I'll stop. But I can't let this slide 

 

[5am6oody72]

Serious question, where the hell are you guys getting Lebron running a 4.4 40 from? Bleacher Report articles or something?

 

[blazinjkid]

The greatest athlete we've ever seen in one sport, who had been about as successful in another sport as you could be up to that point in their career, would have "no chance" of making it?

While I think Ska has been dodging the hell out of the Antonio Gates and Jimmy Graham examples, the root of his argument has a legitimate point: it takes A LOT of mental hardwork to be truly elite in anything, and LeBron has consistently been suspect in that respect as far as working as hard as he could to improve his game in the offseason. So in that respect, he clearly has a point as far as him getting to elite, Pro Bowler status. But NIKE is easily right IMO as far as his statements about having more of an impact than MJ in baseball or being the best WR threat on the Browns after a year of training.

Gunna makes good points, but like NIKE already said, who the *%%+ is gonna jam him at the LOS? Yes, his movement isn't at an ElderWatsonDiggs level of fluidity, but let's not act like this dude is Gheorge freakin' Muresan all of a sudden. The 6'8 center of gravity thing is a legit point, but with his athleticism and his frame, there isn't a single DB in the league who would consistently jam him up, if at all. We've heard it so much that we're sick of it, but he is a !@$%%+@ freak of nature. We're talking about a 1 in a multiple-billion specimen. As much as ESPN forces him down our throats, there is no denying that. That's the main reason why he pisses me off so much. As good as he is, it's painfully clear how much better he could be if he wasn't so immature and a mental ****** (which makes me lean toward agreeing that he wouldn't make it to an elite-level in the NFL...but to outright say there's not a chance is just foolish.)

To say it is out of the realm of possibility is just straight up ignoring every point NIKE brought up.

 

[ag 47]

I don't know how this can even be an argument/discussion. I am thoroughly disappointed in NT for allowing this topic to go 6 pages.

 

[buc em]

Originally Posted by 5am6oody72

Serious question, where the hell are you guys getting Lebron running a 4.4 40 from? Bleacher Report articles or something?

He ran a 4.5 when he was a sophomore in high school so I guess it's just an educated guess.

 

[loveofthegame916]

Originally Posted by SpeakUp23

Originally Posted by likethematrix

dont forget lebron is a very big man. no romo, hideo nomo and alonzo.
how big is calvin johnson? im pegging them as similar sizes.

A+ sir

 

[so slickening]

I'll defend Ska here, because I feel like I'm the only one who sees what he's saying.

In reference to the TOPIC'S TITLE.

LeBron's freak athleticism alone would not get him in the Pro Bowl. He'd have to know the things only years of playing the game could teach.

 

[jasongilmore]

UPPTEMPO8387 wrote:However, I don't see him ever taking that risk. NBA money for a star > NFL money for a receiver. He wouldn't risk his NBA career on a season of NFL football like Mike did by going to play Minor League Baseball. If Lebron gets slammed in the knees by a dude like James Harrison, his career in the NBA would never be the same


   Let him get some shine in the NFL, dudes don't take to outsiders taking their spotlight away. Bron Bron hasn't showed me that he's tough enough. He can barely take hits in the NBA and those collisions are with dudes that are running away from him. Look at how he reacts to contact now, he's on the ground for a good 30 seconds each time. That doesn't fly in the NFL.

 

[darthska]

aztec06jr:

---

23ska909red02:

---

^ Translation: "I have nothing intelligent to add, so I'll just dub NIIK3's words as logic since I agree w/ them, and scoff at ska/GUNNA, since I disagree with."
^Translation: "Damn. I should have never compared anything to Michael Jordan swinging a bat"
Well that just comes off as unoriginal and trying to keep up.

And it would have made more sense and been mildy funny if I hadn't already said that myself:

23ska909red02:

---

I AM KNOWLEDGE:

---

Ska, your arguments have been pretty legit.  I just think your MJ comment was wrong / hyperbole

which took focus off of the other points you were making.
You now what, dude? I've thought a few times throughout this discussion. Every time someone brings it back up, I'm thinking "You know, maybe I shouldn't have said that."

 Which is why I haven't been going all in as far as defending/qualifying that comment. Left that one on the table a few pages back.

 *shrugs*
Maybe you missed that the first time around. I find that hard to believe since you actually quoted me saying that in your post praising NIIK3 for 'coming with the logic', but whatever, maybe you didn't read your own post quoting me.

aztec06jr:

---

Please tell me you were drunk/high today..something...anything.. At least give me a reason to not stop taking you seriously..
Repeat:

23ska909red02:

---

I AM KNOWLEDGE:

---

Ska, your arguments have been pretty legit.  I just think your MJ comment was wrong / hyperbole

which took focus off of the other points you were making.
You now what, dude? I've thought a few times throughout this discussion. Every time someone brings it back up, I'm thinking "You know, maybe I shouldn't have said that."

 Which is why I haven't been going all in as far as defending/qualifying that comment. Left that one on the table a few pages back.

 *shrugs*
And one more time just for the hell of it:

aztec06jr:

---

Please renege on your original stance/MJ quote and I'll stop. But I can't let this slide 

Again:

23ska909red02:

---

I AM KNOWLEDGE:

---

Ska, your arguments have been pretty legit.  I just think your MJ comment was wrong / hyperbole

which took focus off of the other points you were making.
You now what, dude? I've thought a few times throughout this discussion. Every time someone brings it back up, I'm thinking "You know, maybe I shouldn't have said that."

 Which is why I haven't been going all in as far as defending/qualifying that comment. Left that one on the table a few pages back.

 *shrugs*
And we all say outlandish things from time to time, don't we?

aztec06jr:

---

Ska, you bring up good points...football is a tough sport but when it comes down to it, LeBron James with 1 training camp under his belt is doing work in the NFL.