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AA is a necessary system right now, nowhere near perfect, but niether is society. But AA has plenty of flaws and not being 100% on board does not make you'racist or ignorant'
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Originally Posted by eNPHAN
Originally Posted by moonmaster3
Originally Posted by ICUP
If you do not value Diversity then you will not understand the importance of AA. Its not all about having the best people statistically because then you may end up with the same people with the same experiences. Being in law school, I have seen that a group with diversity in experiences is better than a group with the same experiences.
AA just makes sure that there is diversity in experience in a work or college setting.
Can't you make a case that this is just reverse racism then? In the name of "diversity", Asians and whites, who are qualified and sometimes more qualified than the other candidates, are being denied simply because of their skin color or socioeconomic background., if they're so over-qualified, they'll get into a good school, somewhere...
it's not like over-qualified whites and asians don't have vast opportunity.....
@I CANT HOST KEGGERS WITH GREG AND CHET AT THE LAMBDA HOUSE?
BUMMMMMMMERRRRRRRRR
Originally Posted by moonmaster3
Originally Posted by ICUP
If you do not value Diversity then you will not understand the importance of AA. Its not all about having the best people statistically because then you may end up with the same people with the same experiences. Being in law school, I have seen that a group with diversity in experiences is better than a group with the same experiences.
AA just makes sure that there is diversity in experience in a work or college setting.
Can't you make a case that this is just reverse racism then? In the name of "diversity", Asians and whites, who are qualified and sometimes more qualified than the other candidates, are being denied simply because of their skin color or socioeconomic background.
Originally Posted by eNPHAN
Originally Posted by moonmaster3
Originally Posted by ICUP
If you do not value Diversity then you will not understand the importance of AA. Its not all about having the best people statistically because then you may end up with the same people with the same experiences. Being in law school, I have seen that a group with diversity in experiences is better than a group with the same experiences.
AA just makes sure that there is diversity in experience in a work or college setting.
Can't you make a case that this is just reverse racism then? In the name of "diversity", Asians and whites, who are qualified and sometimes more qualified than the other candidates, are being denied simply because of their skin color or socioeconomic background., if they're so over-qualified, they'll get into a good school, somewhere...
it's not like over-qualified whites and asians don't have vast opportunity.....
@I CANT HOST KEGGERS WITH GREG AND CHET AT THE LAMBDA HOUSE?
BUMMMMMMMERRRRRRRRR
The point isn't that they can't get into a good school, the fact that any school would do that is in my opinion, wrong. Who cares if they can get into another school? What if the school they got rejected to was the school they wanted to go to all their life? Because they are qualified to go to other schools isn't an argument to deny them admissions to any one specific school that they are qualified for but were not admitted to because of their skin color.
Its not about hiding behind diversity as another term for reverse racism. It simply is not. There is value in diversity but you may have notjust experienced it. For example, have you ever been in an all white race and politics class? What value would a class discussion be? Would you feel cheatedbecause your class has no one that has experienced what is to be a minority (race wise)? How about a Poverty and Economics class? How about a one sided AAdiscussion? There is no value in talking about things without diversity of experience and opinion.
I majored in economics and political science so I've been that token minority in those type of race discussions. Did I grow up in the ghetto, no. Is myfamily poor? no. However because of my race, I experienced things that they would never have the opportunity to experience. I analyze things through myexperiences and can enlighten them. Moreover, there is a huge difference from growing up with black parents who were immigrants from the Carribean, thangrowing up in a white family. Our cultures not only differ but our values differ also. There are differences between men and women in experiences. Somethings that are common knowledge for women are things that I as young man would never think about.
Was in college based on AA? Naw I was well qualified, but I did get a minority scholarship.If AA increases diversity then it is a good program. Also if it were not forthe government or other business pressures then most business wouldn't give a rats about hiring diverse people. For example the legal field, it wasn'tuntil big clients like Wal-mart starting saying we need your firms to be more diverse if you want to keep Wal-Mart, Inc. as your client. Then thats when youstarted seeing more firms start recruiting from black law student associations and stuff. If there was no AA then most people would not have gotten theopportunity to understand the value in diversity.
how about getting into NO schools because of your skin color?Originally Posted by moonmaster3
Originally Posted by eNPHAN
Originally Posted by moonmaster3
Originally Posted by ICUP
If you do not value Diversity then you will not understand the importance of AA. Its not all about having the best people statistically because then you may end up with the same people with the same experiences. Being in law school, I have seen that a group with diversity in experiences is better than a group with the same experiences.
AA just makes sure that there is diversity in experience in a work or college setting.
Can't you make a case that this is just reverse racism then? In the name of "diversity", Asians and whites, who are qualified and sometimes more qualified than the other candidates, are being denied simply because of their skin color or socioeconomic background., if they're so over-qualified, they'll get into a good school, somewhere...
it's not like over-qualified whites and asians don't have vast opportunity.....
@I CANT HOST KEGGERS WITH GREG AND CHET AT THE LAMBDA HOUSE?
BUMMMMMMMERRRRRRRRR
The point isn't that they can't get into a good school, the fact that any school would do that is in my opinion, wrong. Who cares if they can get into another school? What if the school they got rejected to was the school they wanted to go to all their life? Because they are qualified to go to other schools isn't an argument to deny them admissions to any one specific school that they are qualified for but were not admitted to because of their skin color.
So true.Originally Posted by dmxfury
AA is a necessary system right now, nowhere near perfect, but niether is society. But AA has plenty of flaws and not being 100% on board does not make you 'racist or ignorant'
You do realize that the group most negatively affected by AA are Asians when it comes to grad, law, and medical schools.
I know this already.
...still doesn't change my mind about it
Originally Posted by eNPHAN
how about getting into NO schools because of your skin color?
aka before AA....
why you think HBCU's had to be founded?
AA was instituted to right wrongs.....
it's a shame chet can't get into state u, i mean, he's wanted to go there all his life...
but it was an equal shame that james couldnt get into any school what-so-ever before the institution of AA...
now, i think that's a stupid justification of AA, so instead of the "intent" argument, i pose this to you;
If chet didn't get into State U, why does he attribute it to a black student who did get in? why doesn't he ask himself why his other countless, white, over-qualified peers get in and he didn't?
i'll even grant you the thought that under qualified black students take places from over-qualified white kids...i'll grant you that...i disagree, but whatever, for the sake of the argument, that's exactly what happens...
If he's so over-qualified, i don't think he would have lost his place to a less qualified black kid...
if he was so over-qualified, he wouldn't be near the margin to be "replaced" by a marginal black kid
maybe, if he wanted to get into state u SOOOOOOOOOOO bad, he would have worked harder to not been in the "replace him with an under qualified black kid" margin, right?
like i said, chet may not get into his 1st choice of schools, as over-qualified as he is, but he definitely got into SOMEWHERE...
whereas, following YOUR logic (which i disagree with) the under-qualified black kids wouldn't have the opportunity at school ANYWHERE if not for affirmative action forcing the school that accepted him to meet a quota and accept them into the school, right?
isn't the point of AA to give otherwise hopeless individuals an opportunity?
isn't the point of AA to give underrepresented and historically repressed groups an equal opportunity?
hey, i'd love for this nation to not need AA, but for that to be reality, we would have needed the historical racial interaction of this country to be VASTLY different...
it's not reverse racism....no, that would be discriminating against ALL white students, not admitting ANY of them, telling them to their faces, "it's cause you're white...this here is a school for red-blooded black people", causing whites to create their own HWCUs and force their way back into mainstream schools through EXTREME OVER-QUALIFICATION.....for a couple hundred years....
that would be "the same thing"
but hey, then white people could get all the AA, and it would be us over-qualified black kids getting our spots taken by under-qualified whites, right?
I know this already.Originally Posted by Dirtylicious
You do realize that the group most negatively affected by AA are Asians when it comes to grad, law, and medical schools.
Jim Crow laws were ended in 1965.. compare that to the birth of our nation..1776...that's pretty much 190 years of racial discrimination.
I'm wholly in support of AA... but I'd say to those people who oppose it......why not keep AA for 190 years AFTER the repeal of Jim Crow laws?... so that's in 2155.
wouldn't that be somewhat fair?
wouldn't that be somewhat fair?Originally Posted by Dirtylicious
hmm.. for those against AA.
I posed this question in an older thread.
Jim Crow laws were ended in 1965.. compare that to the birth of our nation..1776...that's pretty much 190 years of racial discrimination.
I'm wholly in support of AA... but I'd say to those people who oppose it......why not keep AA for 190 years AFTER the repeal of Jim Crow laws?... so that's in 2155.
im gonna assume that your post isnt to be taken seriouslyOriginally Posted by HOVKid
Affirmative action was a great idea and I agree it was necessary at the time.
Now the President is black. I don't see any need for affirmative action anymore.
In fact, at this point some might say it's just another form of discrimination.
Originally Posted by HOVKid
Affirmative action was a great idea and I agree it was necessary at the time.
Now the President is black. I don't see any need for affirmative action anymore.
In fact, at this point some might say it's just another form of discrimination.
yeah, when obama got elected, i said to myselfOriginally Posted by Prez T
im gonna assume that your post isnt to be taken seriouslyOriginally Posted by HOVKid
Affirmative action was a great idea and I agree it was necessary at the time.
Now the President is black. I don't see any need for affirmative action anymore.
In fact, at this point some might say it's just another form of discrimination.
one of the first things i commented on about Obama becoming president is the negative side effect of people getting a false sense that racism is no longer a major issue in our country , or that AA is no longer needed
no, he's a ridiculously caked doctor, who i doubt ever lived a "humble" lifestyle....Originally Posted by SuperAntigen
Originally Posted by HOVKid
Affirmative action was a great idea and I agree it was necessary at the time.
Now the President is black. I don't see any need for affirmative action anymore.
In fact, at this point some might say it's just another form of discrimination.
Wait...aren't you a lawyer or something...and you seriously THINK THIS WAY...hot damn...
...
wouldn't that be somewhat fair?Originally Posted by Dirtylicious
hmm.. for those against AA.
I posed this question in an older thread.
Jim Crow laws were ended in 1965.. compare that to the birth of our nation..1776...that's pretty much 190 years of racial discrimination.
I'm wholly in support of AA... but I'd say to those people who oppose it......why not keep AA for 190 years AFTER the repeal of Jim Crow laws?... so that's in 2155.
Clearly rascism isn't dead, but if a black man can become President, why do we need affirmative action?
It's like you ignore your own answers to your own questions.
How come there is no affitrmative action for Jews? There are people that are rascist toward Jews, right?
Cuz unlike black ppl I can't tell a jew is a jew just by looking at them. Being jewish isn't a race, you're talking aboutantisemitism. Even with that as you go on to say Jews weren't put in an impossible situation where they couldn't achieve in this country.
Now that black people can acheive (note: Even MORE than Jews since a Jewish person has never been President), why do we need affirmative action?
So you really do believe that the accompishment of one black man changes everything for all black ppl? You must be naive, that's not how theworld works kid. The next 5 presidents could be black and we'd still need AA cuz the system still isn't fair or balanaced when it comes to equalopportunities.
I thin we should do what Dirty suggested it's more than fair. Thing is I'm sure ppl against it would bring up some can't fight fire with fireargument or some Hamurabi's Code bs about an eye for an eye leaves everyone blind.