Finally told my parents I dont believe in god and that im agnostic.

[thorrocksjs]

Ive had the same teachings as you I just dont care for it I dont need to reassure my self that I can do bad things and get away with it just because im human and god knows this.Your using god as a crutch for your own lack of self control,perservance and morality.The chick who was a **** on the outside knows well she can easily refuse sex but doesnt because she enjoys it no amount of religious teaching is gonna stop her from being a **** because she chooses to be one and thinks she can getaway with itThat lack of self control and discipline and hypocrisy is one of the few reasons why I chose to stop being a christian.

 

[relli45]

Ive had the same teachings as you I just dont care for it I dont need to reassure my self that I can do bad things and get away with it just because im human and god knows this.Your using god as a crutch for your own lack of self control,perservance and morality.The chick who was a **** on the outside knows well she can easily refuse sex but doesnt because she enjoys it no amount of religious teaching is gonna stop her from being a **** because she chooses to be one and thinks she can getaway with itThat lack of self control and discipline and hypocrisy is one of the few reasons why I chose to stop being a christian.

But just like I'm making an assumption about you your doing the same about her.  She was on meth from the time she was 13 till she was 20.  So since puberty till the age of 20 she was on meth.  What do you know about meth?  It gives you a hyper sex drive.  She doesn't know why she is the way she is.  Just maybe it has to do with that fact that she has been on a extreme sexual stimulant since puberty.  She knows sex from the beginning of her drug use(age13), and after the drug use has been non exist in her life for the past 10 years some of those drug user habbits stick around.  Just like a girl that has been molested since the age of 6 sex is what she has known to be reality since that age .  So of course she may just **** around alot because sex has been a way of life for her since she was 6. 

You get what I'm saying?  You've allowed the actions of someone else that you really have no clue about their life or their struggle bend your faith.  How does that make any type of sense to you, and what does someone else being a hypocite have to do with you and your faith.  Is that why you don't believe in God?  Don't get me wrong religion and being a believer are two different things.  But I refuse to ever let some religious person determine my beliefs. 

And we all lack self-control in one way or another.  How pairs of sneakers do you own or aspire to own?  You can be a hypocrite and not even believe in God.  Being a hypocrite is being a hypocrite there are no two ways around it.  

So what I've gotten from you guys is the root reason you don't believe is because humans are being humans.  You guys live your life according to the actions of others.  If it makes since in your world run with it.  But I really can't expect nothing less from a bunch of guys trying to debate about a book they have clearly not read.

 

[shoelyesses]

But just like I'm making an assumption about you your doing the same about her.  She was on meth from the time she was 13 till she was 20.  So since puberty till the age of 20 she was on meth.  What do you know about meth?  It gives you a hyper sex drive.  She doesn't know why she is the way she is.  Just maybe it has to do with that fact that she has been on a extreme sexual stimulant since puberty.  She knows sex from the beginning of her drug use(age13), and after the drug use has been non exist in her life for the past 10 years some of those drug user habbits stick around.  Just like a girl that has been molested since the age of 6 sex is what she has known to be reality since that age .  So of course she may just **** around alot because sex has been a way of life for her since she was 6. 

You get what I'm saying?  You've allowed the actions of someone else that you really have no clue about their life or their struggle bend your faith.  How does that make any type of sense to you, and what does someone else being a hypocite have to do with you and your faith.  Is that why you don't believe in God?  Don't get me wrong religion and being a believer are two different things.  But I refuse to ever let some religious person determine my beliefs. 

And we all lack self-control in one way or another.  How pairs of sneakers do you own or aspire to own?  You can be a hypocrite and not even believe in God.  Being a hypocrite is being a hypocrite there are no two ways around it.  

So what I've gotten from you guys is the root reason you don't believe is because humans are being humans.  You guys live your life according to the actions of others.  If it makes since in your world run with it.  But I really can't expect nothing less from a bunch of guys trying to debate about a book they have clearly not read.

Agreed but the thing is and you said it perfectly humans will be humans and ppl are ppl. But according to go this isnt so because christians arent just ppl... they are not like man and their mind body and soul is of god. So the notion of all ppl a subjected to the same behaviors etc... isnt so... If it were there would be no need to confess jesus is your personal savior and that the first step is to let jesus take over your mind body and soul and minister the word by placing his spirit inside you. The idea that humans are humans is what god according to the word and christians is what seperates the two and is the first step to becoming a christian. So essentially again according to the word of god that would still not make you a christian. And as far as not read the book i have posted scriptures and passages from the bible to support my claims.The bible states that christians are to be outside as far as actions etc of every other man aka non believers. So while a do agree with what you said... the bible doesnt and therefore kinda places your claim as null and void well atleast according to the word. Corinthians states that we all fall short to the glory of god, but it also states that the word of god and the light of jesus should shine from within you in a round about way without stating or overly showing you are a christian. So according to the word its you actions and your lifestyle that should be different from non believers so much so that ppl no you are a person in christ, not by what you say... or your outer appearance...

With that being said the woman who is on meth and prostituting can you honestly say just based off her actions and way of life mannerism etc you would know she is a follower of christ... Can you honestly say that if you didnt speak of jesus... or display and outward appearance as a holy roller would ppl no you were a christian?

i have met and encountered ppl who werent toting a bible... werent rocking a jesus/cross, wasnt speaking in tongues... quoting scriptures etc every other word out of they mouth. Yet i knew based on their mannerism and ways of life etc they were a christian. How many ppl including yourself can honestly say they fall under that umbrella?

 

[thorrocksjs]

I own as many sneakers as I like because I appreciate the design,the quality of the material,the comfort etc.I Budget the money I make to buy sneakers wisely because they are a luxury not a necessity .Hinestly dude if you need Christianity to be the backbone of your moral fiber,reality,etchics than thats good for you.Its not good for me.I don't need it to For mine.If you have read my post history or looked it up you will see that I'm not some FUTUREMD clone or anything.The reason why I don't believe in god is because one I'm a person of African American descent Christianity was forced a upon my ancestors I acknowledge that say ya know what I can't believe in the religion of my oppressor .Reason 2 I find that Christianity has long gone from its base ideas and that most churches don't understand that a good majority of it is essentially symbolism for natural laws and the way the world is .Reason 3 I recognize that it's amalagation of various other solar based religions like Egytipan ,Sumerian .Reason 4 I don't believe I can discover my self in a book or any single religion so I pull teachings from everyone of them to create my own personal truth .Reason 5 The current church systems mostly prey upon peoples insecurities ,self hate money etc I can't attend a church where I hear said sermons .

 

[relli45]

Agreed but the thing is and you said it perfectly humans will be humans and ppl are ppl. But according to go this isnt so because christians arent just ppl... they are not like man and their mind body and soul is of god. So the notion of all ppl a subjected to the same behaviors etc... isnt so... If it were there would be no need to confess jesus is your personal savior and that the first step is to let jesus take over your mind body and soul and minister the word by placing his spirit inside you. The idea that humans are humans is what god according to the word and christians is what seperates the two and is the first step to becoming a christian. So essentially again according to the word of god that would still not make you a christian. And as far as not read the book i have posted scriptures and passages from the bible to support my claims.The bible states that christians are to be outside as far as actions etc of every other man aka non believers. So while a do agree with what you said... the bible doesnt and therefore kinda places your claim as null and void well atleast according to the word. Corinthians states that we all fall short to the glory of god, but it also states that the word of god and the light of jesus should shine from within you in a round about way without stating or overly showing you are a christian. So according to the word its you actions and your lifestyle that should be different from non believers so much so that ppl no you are a person in christ, not by what you say... or your outer appearance...

With that being said the woman who is on meth and prostituting can you honestly say just based off her actions and way of life mannerism etc you would know she is a follower of christ... Can you honestly say that if you didnt speak of jesus... or display and outward appearance as a holy roller would ppl no you were a christian?

i have met and encountered ppl who werent toting a bible... werent rocking a jesus/cross, wasnt speaking in tongues... quoting scriptures etc every other word out of they mouth. Yet i knew based on their mannerism and ways of life etc they were a christian. How many ppl including yourself can honestly say they fall under that umbrella?

You took something and ran with it.  I never said anything about homegirl being a prostitute.  Could you be taking the bible out of context and making assumptions just like you did here.

Jesus and God are the only one's that should be placed on a pedestal.  Being someone that has read the bible you should know that.  You live in this world and not of this world does not mean you are no longer a human being.  That means you are now equipped with something non-believers do not have access to.  Looking down on non-believers is no different then passing judgement on your fellow man.  So how you figure that was promoted and condoned in the bible then you have no understanding of what you've read at all. 

I own as many sneakers as I like because I appreciate the design,the quality of the material,the comfort etc.I Budget the money I make to buy sneakers wisely because they are a luxury not a necessity .Hinestly dude if you need Christianity to be the backbone of your moral fiber,reality,etchics than thats good for you.Its not good for me.I don't need it to For mine.If you have read my post history or looked it up you will see that I'm not some FUTUREMD clone or anything.The reason why I don't believe in god is because one I'm a person of African American descent Christianity was forced a upon my ancestors I acknowledge that say ya know what I can't believe in the religion of my oppressor .Reason 2 I find that Christianity has long gone from its base ideas and that most churches don't understand that a good majority of it is essentially symbolism for natural laws and the way the world is .Reason 3 I recognize that it's amalagation of various other solar based religions like Egytipan ,Sumerian .Reason 4 I don't believe I can discover my self in a book or any single religion so I pull teachings from everyone of them to create my own personal truth .Reason 5 The current church systems mostly prey upon peoples insecurities ,self hate money etc I can't attend a church where I hear said sermons .

That whole appreciation of sneakers sounds real similar to what you said here.

"Your using god as a crutch for your own lack of self control,perservance and morality."

You only really need no more then three pair of shoes tops, but you've created an excuss for your lack of self-control as to why you need more.

I can understand why you think the whole oppressor thing is true, because just like you I was told the samething.  But if you believe that then you believe what our oppressor said about us being evil voodoo worshipers before they enslaved us as well.  The spread of Christainty started with Armenians migrating to Jerusalem after the crucifixion of Jesus.  The way "inlighten" black people make it seem as if the English and Irish created Christianity.  According to our oppressor all Native Americans where savage cannibals and that there was was never a massive slaughter of Native American men, women, and children.  Research the origins of things before you go off listening to uneducated bafoons trying to drop some knowledge.  There is what the biase history books in our grade schools say, and then there is what actually happened. 

Your reason number five is some true to it.  I watched the congressional black caucus convention they had about a month or two back.  This old dude said the realist thing at the end of one session about trying to rally a big following to stand against this new assault against voting, and they just straight tried to blow old dude off.  He said back in the day when he was marching with MLK in the south only about 2% of black churches where down with the cause.  I say that to say this if MLK had the mentality towards the civil rights movement that you have towards christianity, and said they some fools and threw his hands up where would we as black people be.  He didn't let the words and actions of others determine his beliefs.  But then agian your no MLK.  Yes some churches prey on the weak, but some churches focus on strengthening the weak and spreading love.

 

[snaggykicks]

You'll be fine, and have nothing to worry about.

 

[midasismusic]

S/O to FutureMD for the visuals I finally know exactly what to call myself.

- To the OP very brave thing you did there.

I read a book called the Hiram Key and it changed my life.

No matter what your beliefs this is an interesting/ informative/ entertaining debate on the existence of God
Disclaimer: its more than 2 hours long, and both presenters use Rhetoric very well so watch out for the debate tricks.

 

[futuremd]

Lets get this straight.

Being religious, isn't the same as being "good"

Being religious is simply that...being RELIGIOUS.

Morality exists without religion so at that point, if you're just going to use your own morality sculpt religion, then you might as well accept that your religion isn't worth following as is.

 

[patrick bateman]

sucks for you OP.. peace.

 

[yeold360s]

Lets get this straight.

Being religious, isn't the same as being "good"

Being religious is simply that...being RELIGIOUS.

Would the converse also be true?

"Being religious, isn't the same as being "bad""

 

[futuremd]

Lets get this straight.

Being religious, isn't the same as being "good"

Being religious is simply that...being RELIGIOUS.

Would the converse also be true?

"Being religious, isn't the same as being "bad""

1. Thats not the converse.

2. That could also be a true statement.

The point is that saying religion "helps people be good" doesn't carry weight. 

 

[yeold360s]

Inverse.  And it COULD be a true statement, or IS a true statement? Trying to clarify for my sake

 

[meek meals]

who don't like madden b

 

[midasismusic]

One of the arguments used in the video I posted states that some of the worst atrocities know to humanity were done in the name of religion- and there are examples of these cases in every religion.

Can you really say that a non religious person can't be good or do a good deed?
Can you say that a religious person is not capable of evil?

 

[champcruthik]

Without reading through the entire thread (due to time constraints), my immediate advice is to commend you for having the guts and bravery to come clean and be perfectly honest about a serious subject in most American households. Ideally, family should love and accept you no matter what. That pertains to sexual preference, religious preference, etc. However, for smaller issues I've learned at times it may be better to conceal certain thoughts or feelings. Minor ones, of course. Something as big as religion is unavoidable and best not swept under the rug. Basically my feeling is to pick your battles. The small stuff with your family, learn to let go or avoid that conservation if you feel an argument boiling under the surface. I like to streamline smoothly into other general topics when an uncomfortable one arises. For example, many young adults in their mid-20s face mounting pressure for marriage and children. When that comes up at family functions, I like to bring up the recent football game or distant cousin that couldn't attend.

 

[j2thadub]

Coming out as agnostic to parents is difficult.  You can't really reason with them, because they didn't reason themselves into believing.  Best way is to use their own logic against them.  

Tell them, "God spoke to me and gave to me tremendous revelations. I cannot associate with your religion and I am forbidden to discuss it with you or the church because you do not have true faith."

Then just shake your head and "tsk tsk" over everything they do, followed with "I will pray for you/that."

Eventually they will get sick of you and since your "faith" is stronger, they can't do anything. Tell them that their sinful church is misrepresenting God and he is angry, but says it is ok for you to go so that you know who to pray for.

Everything you say is "I am in constant communion with God on the deepest spiritual level and I will pray for you" whenever they challenge you. Scripture matters not. God is talking to you.

God? Your inner self. But don't tell them he is a troll.