FIFA Confederations Cup 2009 in South Africa

[babam11218719]

Yeah I think we would have to leave Dempsey in. I mean who would we put in for him? He hasn't played great I don't think but it has not been terrible.I agree with everyone that the tactics have been bad. I would say that we give up the ball way too easily though. We are up 1-0 in the beginning of the secondhalf and we just keep throwing the ball away and letting it get stolen at bad spots.

 

[gabers]

Originally Posted by Craftsy21

Originally Posted by gabers

Originally Posted by rothypejc

^ I think the tactics are Bob's fault. We use the long ball too much under him and he loves the two d-mids in the middle.

Yup got Altidore upfront by himself just launching balls in the air in his direction is not gonna cut it. Bradley needs to either
switch up the formation or at least a tweak of it.They need to start laying more balls to the feet so guys can run at people
only thing u can really do with a ball played in the air is settle it then either hold it or pass it back. And that doesn't work
at all imo.

Dempsey

dude has been invisible for like the last 3 USNT games i've seen him playing in. He might need
to find a seat on the bench next to Beasley if his horrible play continues.

No way - Dempsey is one of the only dependable guys we have out there at making offensive chances happen... he's one of the few guys with real ball skills on the team, and he is extremely creative which I can't say about ANYONE else on the team.

Oh yeah he's one of the few if not only guys on the team that has real ball skills. But tell me just from the game today, what offensive
chances did he create with his ball skills. Only thing that pops up in my head is in the 1st half where he wasted that free kick
(mostly donovan's fault for that horrible pass) & once in the 2nd half where he combined with feilheiber i think it was and wound
up dribbling into a crowd and got dispossessed.

He balls out for Fulham always taking dudes on and going at them and taking shots on goal, but it usually never happens on US duty
at least from what i've seen.

 

[babam11218719]

I agree with that. He always plays way better at Fulham than he does for the USMNT. He definitely needs to step it up. He was one of the best players onFulham last year on a team that got to Europe. We need to start seeing that on US duty for sure.

 

[platinumfunk]

Originally Posted by PersiaFly

Originally Posted by PlatinumFunk

Originally Posted by PersiaFly

Originally Posted by babam11218719

Off the top of my head

Ronaldo
Messi
Kaka
Iniesta
Xavi
Gerrard
Torres

Pirlo is good and had a great game today. He is no where near the best player in the world anymore. Come on.

Ronaldo, Messi, and Kaka, I will concede. But there is at least an argument for Pirlo against any of the other players. Iniesta and Xavi are good, but they have each other to take defenders off of them. They also play behind the best striker in the world. Pirlo doesn't have another top-notch midfielder next to him, and he doesn't have a world-class striker in front of him. But he still gets the same results. Who do you think was the most instrumental player in Italy's WC win? Gerrard is vastly overrated and has done nothing on an international stage. His team didn't even make Euro 2008. Disqualified. Torres is a striker and I would hesitate to put him in this conversation to begin with, because he doesn't create for other players the way midfielders do. Would you include a goalkeeper in this discussion? Why do you think Pirlo is inferior to Xavi, Iniesta, or Gerard?

. Just let it go, you made a dumb statement because you got excited, that's fine.

Just for arguments sake, you said top 5 "player", not midfielder. So I'm free to put Buffon, Julio Cesar, etc. above Pirlo if I wish in terms of value to their respective teams. Sure, Pirlo is an amazing tactical player, but at this point he's far too slow to be a legitimate threat and he's a liability on defense.

Yeah, I got really excited over a victory against the USNT.

Pirlo > Gerrard, Iniesta, Xavi, Lampard. Torres you can make an argument for. Sit down.

You got excited by a dribble. Read the rest of what I said, then come correct.

 

[stephonurkel]

Originally Posted by JJUVE

Giuseppe Rossi is example A why Italy needs to go out with the old and in with the new.

TONI out, Gilardino out, Gattuso out, Legrottaglie out, Zambrotta out.

Rossi in, Giovinco in, Cassano in, Santacrocce in, Santon in, Marchisio in, Balotelli in.

other than that i couldnt agree more

 

[persiafly]

Originally Posted by PlatinumFunk

Originally Posted by PersiaFly

Originally Posted by PlatinumFunk

Originally Posted by PersiaFly

Originally Posted by babam11218719

Off the top of my head

Ronaldo
Messi
Kaka
Iniesta
Xavi
Gerrard
Torres

Pirlo is good and had a great game today. He is no where near the best player in the world anymore. Come on.

Ronaldo, Messi, and Kaka, I will concede. But there is at least an argument for Pirlo against any of the other players. Iniesta and Xavi are good, but they have each other to take defenders off of them. They also play behind the best striker in the world. Pirlo doesn't have another top-notch midfielder next to him, and he doesn't have a world-class striker in front of him. But he still gets the same results. Who do you think was the most instrumental player in Italy's WC win? Gerrard is vastly overrated and has done nothing on an international stage. His team didn't even make Euro 2008. Disqualified. Torres is a striker and I would hesitate to put him in this conversation to begin with, because he doesn't create for other players the way midfielders do. Would you include a goalkeeper in this discussion? Why do you think Pirlo is inferior to Xavi, Iniesta, or Gerard?

. Just let it go, you made a dumb statement because you got excited, that's fine.

Just for arguments sake, you said top 5 "player", not midfielder. So I'm free to put Buffon, Julio Cesar, etc. above Pirlo if I wish in terms of value to their respective teams. Sure, Pirlo is an amazing tactical player, but at this point he's far too slow to be a legitimate threat and he's a liability on defense.

Yeah, I got really excited over a victory against the USNT.

Pirlo > Gerrard, Iniesta, Xavi, Lampard. Torres you can make an argument for. Sit down.

You got excited by a dribble. Read the rest of what I said, then come correct.

I've been here for 10+ years and I've seen countless non-soccer fans come in to soccer threads during big tournaments and state their vanillamainstream opinions about the game. It's always the flavor of the moment. Iniesta and Xavi just won the CL with Barcelona, so let's label them the bestin the world.

I got excited by a dribble.

I've been watching soccer for far too long to get "excited" by a win or a dribble. Pirlo has beencontrolling his teams from the midfield for years better than few other players. Xavi and Iniesta combined do what Pirlo does for Italy and Milan. Except histeams aren't the flavor of the month so you dismiss him. ****.

 

[jjuve]

Originally Posted by StephonUrkel

Originally Posted by JJUVE

Giuseppe Rossi is example A why Italy needs to go out with the old and in with the new.

TONI out, Gilardino out, Gattuso out, Legrottaglie out, Zambrotta out.

Rossi in, Giovinco in, Cassano in, Santacrocce in, Santon in, Marchisio in, Balotelli in.

other than that i couldnt agree more

Luca Toni has turned into a certified BUM when playing for the national team. Yes he plays well for Bayern during the season, and he was a HUGE part of Italywinning WC '06, but so was Marco Materazzi. Materazzi is out and Toni needs to be to. he is in the game for his size and strength in the air, but he is nolonger effective.

all he seems to do is rise up over a defender a couple of times a game and head the ball wide of the goal or directly into the keepers gloves, then proceeds toover dramatically react like "how could i have missed that". im sick of it, get him out, he has no skill on the ball and if he's not going to beeffect in the air then let Iaquinta (didnt play well today but was MUCH more of a well rounded game and works so much harder) play. If Iaquinta doesnt get thejob done there are plenty of young Italian who can. Luca Toni thanks for you contributions to the national team and for the world cup, but he is finished.
/rant

 

[babam11218719]

Originally Posted by PersiaFly

Originally Posted by PlatinumFunk

Originally Posted by PersiaFly

Originally Posted by PlatinumFunk

Originally Posted by PersiaFly

Originally Posted by babam11218719

Off the top of my head

Ronaldo
Messi
Kaka
Iniesta
Xavi
Gerrard
Torres

Pirlo is good and had a great game today. He is no where near the best player in the world anymore. Come on.

Ronaldo, Messi, and Kaka, I will concede. But there is at least an argument for Pirlo against any of the other players. Iniesta and Xavi are good, but they have each other to take defenders off of them. They also play behind the best striker in the world. Pirlo doesn't have another top-notch midfielder next to him, and he doesn't have a world-class striker in front of him. But he still gets the same results. Who do you think was the most instrumental player in Italy's WC win? Gerrard is vastly overrated and has done nothing on an international stage. His team didn't even make Euro 2008. Disqualified. Torres is a striker and I would hesitate to put him in this conversation to begin with, because he doesn't create for other players the way midfielders do. Would you include a goalkeeper in this discussion? Why do you think Pirlo is inferior to Xavi, Iniesta, or Gerard?

. Just let it go, you made a dumb statement because you got excited, that's fine.

Just for arguments sake, you said top 5 "player", not midfielder. So I'm free to put Buffon, Julio Cesar, etc. above Pirlo if I wish in terms of value to their respective teams. Sure, Pirlo is an amazing tactical player, but at this point he's far too slow to be a legitimate threat and he's a liability on defense.

Yeah, I got really excited over a victory against the USNT.

Pirlo > Gerrard, Iniesta, Xavi, Lampard. Torres you can make an argument for. Sit down.

You got excited by a dribble. Read the rest of what I said, then come correct.

I've been here for 10+ years and I've seen countless non-soccer fans come in to soccer threads during big tournaments and state their vanilla mainstream opinions about the game. It's always the flavor of the moment. Iniesta and Xavi just won the CL with Barcelona, so let's label them the best in the world.

I got excited by a dribble.

I've been watching soccer for far too long to get "excited" by a win or a dribble. Pirlo has been controlling his teams from the midfield for years better than few other players. Xavi and Iniesta combined do what Pirlo does for Italy and Milan. Except his teams aren't the flavor of the month so you dismiss him. ****.

I understand that dude may have come at you wrong and I do understand your opinion. But you said a top 5 player in the world RIGHT NOW. Thensaid name 5 better like dude was out of line for even questioning it. I have not heard anyone say that Pirlo was a top 5 player in AT LEAST 2-3 years. Iwould debate that he was a top 5 player then but that is my opinion. We are not talking about WC2006 or even the 07 Champions League. We are talking rightnow. Why are you trying to discount what Iniesta and Xavi are doing? I have heard many people around the game that have said that one or the other were thebest players in the world right now. I have heard that for Xavi as well as after the Final, Rooney said that he thought Iniesta was the best player in theworld even with playing and seeing Ronaldo on a day to day basis.. There are too many great players out there to have this debate because we would probablyoverlook someone. Also I don't know why you want to discount everyone but midfielders. Again you keep claiming what Pirlo has done for Milan and Italy. I will say this. With Pirlo, what have both Milan and Itlay done since '07? Not much on a big stage so we cannot get on Gerrard for that but then sayPirlo does not have talent around him.

 

[jjuve]

Originally Posted by babam11218719


Italy are not worth being referred to as the Champions of the world.

like it or not, Italy are the world champions and they deserve it. are they the best team in the world rite now? no, mostly because the age of the WC winningsquad has caught up to them.

they went into Germany in '06 and did not concede a goal from open play, just an own goal vs USA, and Zidan's penalty in the final. so until someoneknocks them out of WC'10 in South Africa, they are the very worthy World Champions

 

[babam11218719]

woah I never said that. I don't know how my name got quoted with that. They are Champions of the world because they won the last WC.

 

[carlos tevez]

"Ronaldo, Messi, and Kaka, I will concede. But there is at least an argument for Pirlo against any of the other players. Iniesta and Xavi are good, butthey have each other to take defenders off of them. They also play behind the best striker in the world. Pirlo doesn't have another top-notch midfieldernext to him, and he doesn't have a world-class striker in front of him."

I really dont understand this comment. When AC Milan were doing very well in Italy and the UCL a few years back didn't Pirlo have Seedorf and Gattusso nextto him? Seedorf is an extremely good midfielder and Gattusso is a bulldog in the middle. Pirlo also had Kaka in front of him and Shevchenko (in his prime)scoring tons of goals. How about Crespo and Inzaghi also scoring tons of goals for Milan? So to say that Pirlo hasn't had much support in midfield and/orup front is completely untrue. This is the same AC Milan team that was consistently going deep in the UCL for around a 5 year span...Pirlo was not the only onecarrying this team.

As for Italy...Toni and Gilardino are crap, Lippi is going to have to find a better mix of young and old before 2010...this Italian team is too old.

 

[stephonurkel]

Originally Posted by JJUVE

Originally Posted by StephonUrkel

Originally Posted by JJUVE

Giuseppe Rossi is example A why Italy needs to go out with the old and in with the new.

TONI out, Gilardino out, Gattuso out, Legrottaglie out, Zambrotta out.

Rossi in, Giovinco in, Cassano in, Santacrocce in, Santon in, Marchisio in, Balotelli in.

other than that i couldnt agree more

Luca Toni has turned into a certified BUM when playing for the national team. Yes he plays well for Bayern during the season, and he was a HUGE part of Italy winning WC '06, but so was Marco Materazzi. Materazzi is out and Toni needs to be to. he is in the game for his size and strength in the air, but he is no longer effective.

all he seems to do is rise up over a defender a couple of times a game and head the ball wide of the goal or directly into the keepers gloves, then proceeds to over dramatically react like "how could i have missed that". im sick of it, get him out, he has no skill on the ball and if he's not going to be effect in the air then let Iaquinta (didnt play well today but was MUCH more of a well rounded game and works so much harder) play. If Iaquinta doesnt get the job done there are plenty of young Italian who can. Luca Toni thanks for you contributions to the national team and for the world cup, but he is finished.
/rant

wow... i aint even mad for that explanation of why he should be out

buttt... hes still 6'5 and makes defenders work... this is the part of soccer that often goes unnoticed... how hard a player makes the opposition work...

when u have a man thats 6'5 like 215 jus his body leaning and pushing and jostling n the box wears on defenders eventually leaving them more succeptable...also he is still very good n the air, granted ribery serving up crosses is like spoon feeding... saying he "has no skill on the ball" tho

he still makes things happen on his own from time to time at Bayern.

All in all...whatever... i could care less about the italian national team because usually when i watch them i can configure my own starting 11 (fifa09)

 

[jjuve]

Originally Posted by babam11218719

woah I never said that. I don't know how my name got quoted with that. They are Champions of the world because they won the last WC.

my bad man, i was trying to delete all the other stuff that was said in quotes by other people and i must have left yours in by mistake

 

[platinumfunk]

Originally Posted by PersiaFly

Originally Posted by PlatinumFunk

Originally Posted by PersiaFly

Originally Posted by PlatinumFunk

Originally Posted by PersiaFly

Originally Posted by babam11218719

Off the top of my head

Ronaldo
Messi
Kaka
Iniesta
Xavi
Gerrard
Torres

Pirlo is good and had a great game today. He is no where near the best player in the world anymore. Come on.

Ronaldo, Messi, and Kaka, I will concede. But there is at least an argument for Pirlo against any of the other players. Iniesta and Xavi are good, but they have each other to take defenders off of them. They also play behind the best striker in the world. Pirlo doesn't have another top-notch midfielder next to him, and he doesn't have a world-class striker in front of him. But he still gets the same results. Who do you think was the most instrumental player in Italy's WC win? Gerrard is vastly overrated and has done nothing on an international stage. His team didn't even make Euro 2008. Disqualified. Torres is a striker and I would hesitate to put him in this conversation to begin with, because he doesn't create for other players the way midfielders do. Would you include a goalkeeper in this discussion? Why do you think Pirlo is inferior to Xavi, Iniesta, or Gerard?

. Just let it go, you made a dumb statement because you got excited, that's fine.

Just for arguments sake, you said top 5 "player", not midfielder. So I'm free to put Buffon, Julio Cesar, etc. above Pirlo if I wish in terms of value to their respective teams. Sure, Pirlo is an amazing tactical player, but at this point he's far too slow to be a legitimate threat and he's a liability on defense.

Yeah, I got really excited over a victory against the USNT.

Pirlo > Gerrard, Iniesta, Xavi, Lampard. Torres you can make an argument for. Sit down.

You got excited by a dribble. Read the rest of what I said, then come correct.

I've been here for 10+ years and I've seen countless non-soccer fans come in to soccer threads during big tournaments and state their vanilla mainstream opinions about the game. It's always the flavor of the moment. Iniesta and Xavi just won the CL with Barcelona, so let's label them the best in the world.

I got excited by a dribble.

I've been watching soccer for far too long to get "excited" by a win or a dribble. Pirlo has been controlling his teams from the midfield for years better than few other players. Xavi and Iniesta combined do what Pirlo does for Italy and Milan. Except his teams aren't the flavor of the month so you dismiss him. ****.

I DIDN'T MENTION ANY OF THSOE PEOPLE. See who you're quoting fam. It's clear the memories of what Pirlo COULD do are still fresh inyour memory... There's a reason no one is after him, he no longer is worth his pricetag. Please don't call me a vanilla fan when you're followingteams that don't even play in your continent.

 

[airjordanseattle23]

people acting like the usnt had a real chance. maybe if rossi had decided to play for them.

and i agree xavi and iniesta are some of the best in the world. maybe not top 5 but some of the best. xavi was a beast in the euros last year.

 

[craftsy21]

people acting like the usnt had a real chance
chance at what? winning today? Well let's see.. they were up 1-0 with over half the game gone... i'd say that was a pretty good chance.

we get it, you like Man U... so US soccer sucks..

 

[krispacinla]

Originally Posted by Craftsy21

people acting like the usnt had a real chance

chance at what? winning today? Well let's see.. they were up 1-0 with over half the game gone... i'd say that was a pretty good chance.

we get it, you like Man U... so US soccer sucks..

QFT. Dude is a RONEY STAN SMH lmao

 

[deepinthajeep]

Originally Posted by AirJordanSeattle23

people acting like the usnt had a real chance. maybe if rossi had decided to play for them.

and i agree xavi and iniesta are some of the best in the world. maybe not top 5 but some of the best. xavi was a beast in the euros last year.

Considering we were just starting to find spaces and play w/ confidence before Ricardo got sent off, I'd hardly say we "didn't have a realchance."

+$*+* w/ that BS

 

[craftsy21]

Originally Posted by KRISPACINLA

Originally Posted by Craftsy21

people acting like the usnt had a real chance

chance at what? winning today? Well let's see.. they were up 1-0 with over half the game gone... i'd say that was a pretty good chance.

we get it, you like Man U... so US soccer sucks..

QFT. Dude is a RONEY STAN SMH lmao

I've always gotten along with him in the past - i'll just never understand how an American, who goes so far as to claim Seattle in his handle here -can be such a huge English football fan that he can bag on his own countries team like that.

He must just live in constant envy of every living European person for not having to claim such a football team as our own USMNT.

 

[airjordanseattle23]

well seeing as i dont like any of the players on the usnt does that make me a traitor? hardly. i just dont find the usmnt fun to watch. so im a commie orsomething? please. i love my country. i love man utd. %%++ i even like the sounders. im just not a huge usmnt fan. i'll support them in the wc. i neversaid i didn't want them to win. shoot i hate the azurri. i was with mobs of dutch fans rooting AGAINST them in amsterdam last summer. I just didn't andstill dont think the usmnt have much of a chance this tourny. its been 7 years since 2002. and i support the english national team because my mom, nana, andmost of my fam were born there or live there. and i spend a heck of alot of time there. theres a fine line between not thinking the usmnt has a chance androoting against them or saying "us soccer sucks" sure its not of the quality of the european game imo. dont get your panties in a not.

 

[airjordanseattle23]

I'll correct myself there actually. i think howard is a quality goalkeeper and wasn't given a huge chance at united. i also think altidore and edu havepotential. as a follower of hearts of midlothian fc i dont like that he plays for 'gers though.

if anyone wants to take their hate to a game of xbl fifaor football manager pm me.

 

[socluis90]

i didn't know there were so many US haters in here. Funny how most of these "fans" have probably never stepped foot outside the US and theysupport teams they've never seen play in person or have no national ties to.

 

[rothypejc]

before clark got sent off, i thought the us definitely had a shot at getting a draw in this game...

obviously italy and brazil are the favorites to go through from the group but the game was fairly even up to that red card

 

[airjordanseattle23]

Originally Posted by socluis90

i didn't know there were so many US haters in here. Funny how most of these "fans" have probably never stepped foot outside the US and they support teams they've never seen play in person or have no national ties to.

dunno if your refering to me but i already clarified i dont hate the us team or the us. and i already explained my ties to england. dunno why imgetting attacked blatantly for stating my opinion. sorry if i offended anyone by it. i still stand by it though.

 

[babam11218719]

I don't know if he is directly attacking you but there was a lot of hate in this thread about USMNT in general. Although I think a lot of people aregetting upset over crticism of the team that has been warranted from their play of late. I have gotten the feeling that a lot of people in here are living inthe US and yet fans over other countries for various reasons.