Elon Musk trying to buy Twitter (edit: deal has been finalized)

[IATT]

you can make a problem worse….

 

[finessence]

You can't hold him responsible for people's behavior, but you CAN hold him responsible for NOT regulating it on his platform, or for regulating it in a way that encourage hate speech.

The previous CEOs of Twitter weren’t ever regulating it before he arrived

 

[finessence]

you can make a problem worse….

Bro all I’m saying is, hate speech and vitriol peaked on Twitter before Elon arrived. Slurs are prevalent amongst all demographics. I don’t know what else to say.

If the same users who were spewing hatred without retribution (which Twitter is notorious for picking and choosing) then I don’t know what else to tell you guys.

Those prejudice and racist users will continue do what they’ve always done

 

[IATT]

Bro all I’m saying is, hate speech and vitriol peaked on Twitter before Elon arrived. Slurs are prevalent amongst all demographics. I don’t know what else to say.

If the same users who were spewing hatred without retribution (which Twitter is notorious for picking and choosing) then I don’t know what else to tell you guys.

Those prejudice and racist users will continue do what they’ve always done

while these problems obviously existed

giving certain people another opportunity at a large platform further normalizes these terrible things (this is the biggest problem with trump)

kanye being a perfect example, he was removed from the platform for a reason

he was allowed back on the platform and his hate speech was amplified


this is another obvious example:

 

[1995]

Bro all I’m saying is, hate speech and vitriol peaked on Twitter before Elon arrived. Slurs are prevalent amongst all demographics. I don’t know what else to say.

If the same users who were spewing hatred without retribution (which Twitter is notorious for picking and choosing) then I don’t know what else to tell you guys.

Those prejudice and racist users will continue do what they’ve always done

Would you agree that prejudiced and racist users will behave more flagrantly when they're on a platform with moderation policies that give them more leniency?

 

[osh kosh bosh]

The point is that Twitter and Reddit are the closest thing we have to a virtual public square, and those who control these platforms are the gatekeepers and regulators of accepted behaviors in these spaces.


Most people don't attend public speeches, rallies, protests, and debates. This argument has never been used to loosen the standards of behavior and speech that regulate such events. Twitter and Reddit are the closest thing we have to a virtual public square, and the fact that they are immaterial (or used by a minority of the population) isn't enough of an argument to tolerate the loosening of speech standards there.

The argument that few people participate in Twitter activities is even weaker when you realize that access to the tweets is not restricted to the users of the platform. Like real-life speech transcripts and rally pamphlets, tweets and tweet screenshots get routinely shared among the larger public to support or discredit a point.

it's not a virtual public square tho,
it's a boutique social media service used by a pretty small percentage of the population.

and is dwarfed by Instagram, Facebook, Youtube, WhatsApp, Tiktok, Wechat,
Im pretty pretty sure it's smaller than even snapchat.

Reddit and Twitter, are really small and used by a very specific type of person.
they are the furthest thing from a virtual public square. it's more like a small club of weirdos.


I think right wingers hyperventilating about Hunter Biden's laptop
and people obsessed with how many problematic accounts get unbanned by Elon

are vastly overstating Twitter's impact on anything.
most people on Twitter do not consume this content,
and the people who do are highly ideological and are not pursuable in either direction.


if anything. twitter banning of right wing weirdos, helps conservatives.
it obscures the problematic elements of the right from public view.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

Call me crazy.

I don't think more exposure to Nick "having sex with women is gay" Fuentes

helps Nazi's win converts.





and any convert they win they repel 50 more.

 

[RustyShackleford]

Always funny to me how even supposed geniuses like Musk doesn't know how the 1st amendment works.

More and more I love people waking up to how full of **** he is, and how unspectacular of a business man he is.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

edit

 

[gry60]

it's not a virtual public square tho,
it's a boutique social media service used by a pretty small percentage of the population.

and is dwarfed by Instagram, Facebook, Youtube, WhatsApp, Tiktok, Wechat,
Im pretty pretty sure it's smaller than even snapchat.

Reddit and Twitter, are really small and used by a very specific type of person.
they are the furthest thing from a virtual public square. it's more like a small club of weirdos.


I think right wingers hyperventilating about Hunter Biden's laptop
and people obsessed with how many problematic accounts get unbanned by Elon

are vastly overstating Twitter's impact on anything.
most people on Twitter do not consume this content,
and the people who do are highly ideological and are not pursuable in either direction.


if anything. twitter banning of right wing weirdos, helps conservatives.
it obscures the problematic elements of the right from public view.

Important Twitter Statistics​

• Twitter currently has 396.5 million users
• Twitter brought in $3.72 billion in revenue last year (2020)
• 206 million users access Twitter daily. 75% of them are not based in the US
• Twitter is most popular among users aged 25-34
• 8.85% of the worldwide social media users access Twitter
• Worldwide, men use Twitter more than women
• Quarterly Twitter revenue is over$1.1 billion as of Q2, 2021
• In the US, 92% of tweets come from the top 10% of users
• On average, Twitter US users spend 158.2 minutes per month on the app
• In the US, Twitter app was downloaded over 6 million times in Q4 2020. The vast majority of app downloads were from the App Store

25% of daily users in the US is 51 million people. There are 258 million adults in the US.

These are not "small" numbers.

 

[1995]

It is so tiresome to see this stuff constantly being downplayed because of the number of people it affects

 

[RustyShackleford]

Yeah I don't rock with osh kosh bosh argument

In a post-Charlottesville, post-Jan 6th world, and dunno how the foundation of your argument is using the median to argue against people worrying about what is happening at the margin, and both sidesing the issue. Ok, Twitter is smaller than a lot of other social media sites.....ok, so what?

Seems kinda silly to me

 

[RustyShackleford]

I noticed Alibaba Osh is here and about to drops some whiny bangers

Good morning thehealthinspector

 

[1995]

@thealtrightrespecter

 

[Mark Antony]

This fool really thinks he dropped the story of the year

Mans outchea on these e-streets like...

Sad

This is excellent, thank you Elon. Now let's get to the bottom of why no one except everyone is talking about FTX.

 

[thehealthinspector]

Good morning RustyShackleford

Just enjoying some takes on this new and improved neutral twitter that's really bothering people

 

[osh kosh bosh]

25% of daily users in the US is 51 million people. There are 258 million adults in the US.

These are not "small" numbers.

Nothing about this refutes what I said. large and small is relative.
Twitter as far as social media platforms goes is small.

and it is not a "public square" it's not a representation of the public.
it's a relatively narrow cross section of the public, that skews younger and more educated.

most people don't tweet.

we know from social science research that highly educated ideological people are some of the least persuadable people politically.
so forgive me if I don't think these moderation decisions matter that much.

 

[thehealthinspector]

@thealtrightrespecter

Yeah

Post evidence of me advocating white supremacy

I get it, you don't like me giving my takes just like you don't like certain people and or views on Twitter

But you don't make the rules

 

[osh kosh bosh]

Yeah I don't rock with osh kosh bosh argument

In a post-Charlottesville, post-Jan 6th world, and dunno how the foundation of your argument is using the median to argue against people worrying about what is happening at the margin, and both sidesing the issue. Ok, Twitter is smaller than a lot of other social media sites.....ok, so what?

Seems kinda silly to me

Im not telling you shouldn't be worried about extremists on the margin.
seems pretty worrying to me.

but I think the question of whether a slightly higher percentage of these people are allowed to tweet or not
I don't think matters much.

the problem is way bigger than twitter, and i fundamentally don't think twitter has much of an impact on it.


Also Elon still constrained by advertisers.
Ultimately he's going to end up in a similar place the old twitter did on moderation.
the difference will be marginal and will go totally unnoticed by most users.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

It is so tiresome to see this stuff constantly being downplayed because of the number of people it affects

to be clear, im not downplaying the impact of political extremism.

If people want to say, oh a tiny percentage of high volume twitter addicts are seeing more hate speech on the platform.
im sure that's true and would probably agree.

but I see much stronger claims being made that I find totally preposterous given the size of twitter, and it's user base.

 

[RustyShackleford]

Im not telling you shouldn't be worried about extremists on the margin.
seems pretty worrying to me.

but I think the question of whether a slightly higher percentage of these people are allowed to tweet or not
I don't think matters much.

the problem is way bigger than twitter, and i fundamentally don't think twitter has much of an impact on it.


Also Elon still constrained by advertisers.
Ultimately he's going to end up in a similar place the old twitter did on moderation.
the difference will be marginal and will go totally unnoticed by most users.

I think there is not a single person that takes right-wing extremists seriously, in the general public, on NT, and definitely not gry60 that restricts their concerns to just Twitter though

I think they realize it goes way beyond Twitter. Hell Fox News has probably been the biggest recruitment tool for the far right.

But extremists on the margin see Twitter as an outlet to spread their message, so I think it is fair if someone worries about what impact letting them run wild on Twitter will have.

 

[osh kosh bosh]

I think there is not a single person that takes right-wing extremists seriously, in the general public, on NT, and definitely not gry60 that restricts their concerns to just Twitter though

I think they realize it goes way beyond Twitter. Hell Fox News has probably been the biggest recruitment tool for the far right.

But extremists on the margin see Twitter as an outlet to spread their message, so I think it is fair if someone worries about what impact letting them run wild on Twitter will have.

Sure but it seems to me that people fixtae on twitter because they are genuinely mistaken about the size of twitter, it's impact

And the composition of it's audience.

like if you told me I could turn twitter a zero moderation hell scape

But Sinclair Media and Fox News became left wing propagandists.

I would do that trade 1000x it's not even slightly close.

Twitter just doesn't matter that much.
And because it's audience is so political it's the worst platform to pursuade anyone of anything they don't already agree with.

 

[RustyShackleford]

I too think this ends with Twitter becoming generally what it was before Musk bought it

But that is if Musk finally starts taking this situation seriously

Elon Musk seems like the biggest fanboy of Elon Musk, completely bought into the myth of his next-level intelligence, and until he starts acting like the regular old capitalist that he has always been, he will continue to embarrass himself.

 

[thehealthinspector]

How is that message being spread other than people saying

"look at these insults I deliberately looked for and found"

Of course you found them, you were looking for them

The opinion that they shouldn't exist at all on the platform is just an opinion

Twitters stance is that that will only apply to threats of violence

 

[RustyShackleford]

Sure but it seems to me that people fixtae on twitter because they are genuinely mistaken about the size of twitter, it's impact

And the composition of it's audience.

like if you told me I could turn twitter a zero moderation hell scape

But Sinclair Media and Fox News became left wing propagandists.

I would do that trade 1000x it's not even slightly close.

Twitter just doesn't matter that much.
And because it's audience is so political it's the worst platform to pursuade anyone of anything they don't already agree with.

-Again, I see this as a median vs. margin

I think people are aware of what little impact Twitter has on the median person (in the public and on Twitter). But as we have seen in recent years, you don't need to convince the median person for things to go bad.

The concern is not about persuading someone to flip political sides, or flipping on an issue.

But more about convincing the partisan (mostly male) that generally agrees with you, that they need to escalate the situation.

I think Twitter can still be a tool to send people down rabbit holes that leads to really bad places. Ideologically staying the same, but making them more reactionary

I think it was Steve Bannon that said it one time, that he isn't really trying to make people change their worldview. He is just trying to convince some people to cross a few lines.

-But of course, I would do that trade you mentioned before. Because Fox News, Sinclair, and AM radio move the median. Which at the end of the day has way more impact on democracy.

But worrying about how **** like Qanon and Pizzgate spread is now part of our political reality too. I don't think people realizing that makes them lose sight of the bigger engines driving extremist