Elementary School Shooting: Newtown, Connecticut. 28 confirmed dead, 18 were children

[CP1708]

So we want Elementary school teachers, all 5 foot 2 inches of 50 year old blue hairness pullin their glocks out and havin a shootout in the hallways complete with cross fire, bad aim and all kinda other **** goin on?

What's even worse is, today with the way money is locked up and schools are cutting back like crazy, the country can't even afford to hire a guard for schools. Someone who could do something, and even then, all he'd get is a regular pistol, he'd still be outgunned by nutjobs.


I don't know what will, or won't fix the problem. There are multiple factors at work. But I do know one thing, machine guns have no place being avaliable to regular folk. They serve ZERO ******g purpose. Wanna hunt? Have a gun. A rifle. Slow *** couple shots at a time rifle. Want a hand gun to protect yourself, and your home? Have a hand gun. 10 in the clip. 13 in the clip. 12, 15, whatever. But there is NO NEED to have an automatic machine gun with a scope and a hair trigger and 65 in the mag. **** that.

Remove those weapons, and we'll still see shooting from time to time, but we won't see 30 bodies pile up. And that's what it comes down too. If we can't prevent tragedies completely, then we have to at minimum LIMIT them as best we can. Taking these type of weapons out of the equation can only help. There is no downside to people not being able to own submachine guns, and 50 cals, and all that other Neo Matrix **** people wanna buy these days.

 

[sundoobie]

Or both parties start shooting at each other and injure other bystanders in the process.

"Them's the breaks"

 

[ar guy]

Some of you really need to stop relying on anecdotes and generalizations when formulating your arguments.
STRICTER GUN LAWS ARE ASSOCIATED WITH FEWER MURDERS-- NOT JUST AROUND THE WORLD, BUT IN THE UNITED STATES, AS WELL.
And for the reading averse:
As an important postscript, GUN CONTROL IS NOT A PANACEA. STOP FRAMING IT AS SUCH.

For the first article you posted only one study is less than 10 years old. Please try and get some more up to date info. Another funny thing about it is most of those studies were conducted during the original federal AWB.

Also if guns are the problem why is it that each year gun violence has gone down yet gun ownership up? Don't believe me check for yourself.

http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/uc...s.-2011/tables/expanded-homicide-data-table-8

http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/nics/reports/copy_of_TotalNICSBackgroundChecks.pdf

 

[andee]

how do you dismiss da fact that i said it takes courses and training to obtain these weapons, but bring it up here?

tell me something sir

if this was me in da middle of east new york, brooklyn in NYC with my random non descript thick dominican/rican shining wit glaciers on my

neck and wrist. do you really think da NYPD is gonna keep me safe? why can't i have my personal firearm to protect me from anyone that would want to harm

me?

da typical response here would be "what are you doing in that neighborhood looking like that" why does that matter is my answer, i have da right to be where ever i want.

you know what happens when da bad guys get confronted with a good guy with some firepower? they stand da **** down.

This argument is so dumb. If someone tries to rob you and you shoot them, you're still going to prison. And deservedly so. If you're in a bad neighborhood with jewelry on and get robbed, no tears will be shed for you. And no I don't think you should have the right to take a life to protect a necklace.

 

[dankenstien88]

how do you dismiss da fact that i said it takes courses and training to obtain these weapons, but bring it up here?

tell me something sir



if this was me in da middle of east new york, brooklyn in NYC with my random non descript thick dominican/rican shining wit glaciers on my

neck and wrist. do you really think da NYPD is gonna keep me safe? why can't i have my personal firearm to protect me from anyone that would want to harm

me?

da typical response here would be "what are you doing in that neighborhood looking like that" why does that matter is my answer, i have da right to be where ever i want.

you know what happens when da bad guys get confronted with a good guy with some firepower? they stand da **** down.

This argument is so dumb. If someone tries to rob you and you shoot them, you're still going to prison. And deservedly so. If you're in a bad neighborhood with jewelry on and get robbed, no tears will be shed for you. And no I don't think you should have the right to take a life to protect a necklace.

Your argument is the kind of thinking that empowers stickup kids.

Its not taking a life to "protect a necklace" its taking a life that threatened your own life.

 

[thepointgod]

For the first article you posted only one study is less than 10 years old. Please try and get some more up to date info. Another funny thing about it is most of those studies were conducted during the original federal AWB.
Also if guns are the problem why is it that each year gun violence has gone down yet gun ownership up? Don't believe me check for yourself.
http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/uc...s.-2011/tables/expanded-homicide-data-table-8
http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/nics/reports/copy_of_TotalNICSBackgroundChecks.pdf

Are you a moron? Did you even read the note at the bottom of the chart you provided? It explicitly says that the figures do not correspond to actual numbers of guns sold, but only to background checks, which proves the exact opposite of your argument.

Background checks for guns (a form of gun control) have increased over time and has led to a decrease in gun violence.

Please try and get some more up to date info.

Please try to read things thoroughly and carefully, especially things you present, before attempting to post them to make a point.

 

[andee]

Your argument is the kind of thinking that empowers stickup kids.

Its not taking a life to "protect a necklace" its taking a life that threatened your own life.

... because you had a necklace on. So you trying to stunt doesn't empower stick up kids? Backwards AF.

Your decision to wear the necklace caused you to get stuck up. Period.

 

[dankenstien88]

Your argument is the kind of thinking that empowers stickup kids.

Its not taking a life to "protect a necklace" its taking a life that threatened your own life.

... because you had a necklace on. So you trying to stunt doesn't empower stick up kids? Backwards AF.

Your decision to wear the necklace caused you to get stuck up. Period.

Ok... so someone that regularly steals peoples stuff at gunpoint with the intent to kill them if they dont give it up is A-OK in your book .... But because Im wearing a necklace I deserve it and dont have the right to defend myself ? ****OHWTBSAH

 

[ninjahood]

how do you dismiss da fact that i said it takes courses and training to obtain these weapons, but bring it up here?

tell me something sir

if this was me in da middle of east new york, brooklyn in NYC with my random non descript thick dominican/rican shining wit glaciers on my

neck and wrist. do you really think da NYPD is gonna keep me safe? why can't i have my personal firearm to protect me from anyone that would want to harm

me?

da typical response here would be "what are you doing in that neighborhood looking like that" why does that matter is my answer, i have da right to be where ever i want.

you know what happens when da bad guys get confronted with a good guy with some firepower? they stand da **** down.

This argument is so dumb. If someone tries to rob you and you shoot them, you're still going to prison. And deservedly so. If you're in a bad neighborhood with jewelry on and get robbed, no tears will be shed for you. And no I don't think you should have the right to take a life to protect a necklace.

sike, its called self defense.

umm what do you think brinks truck cats do for a living, they are paid to take lives if you mess with their money truck..

da libs in this thread is ridiculous.

 

[celticsfan9783]

So we want Elementary school teachers, all 5 foot 2 inches of 50 year old blue hairness pullin their glocks out and havin a shootout in the hallways complete with cross fire, bad aim and all kinda other **** goin on?
What's even worse is, today with the way money is locked up and schools are cutting back like crazy, the country can't even afford to hire a guard for schools. Someone who could do something, and even then, all he'd get is a regular pistol, he'd still be outgunned by nutjobs.
I don't know what will, or won't fix the problem. There are multiple factors at work. But I do know one thing, machine guns have no place being avaliable to regular folk. They serve ZERO ******g purpose. Wanna hunt? Have a gun. A rifle. Slow *** couple shots at a time rifle. Want a hand gun to protect yourself, and your home? Have a hand gun. 10 in the clip. 13 in the clip. 12, 15, whatever. But there is NO NEED to have an automatic machine gun with a scope and a hair trigger and 65 in the mag. **** that.
Remove those weapons, and we'll still see shooting from time to time, but we won't see 30 bodies pile up. And that's what it comes down too. If we can't prevent tragedies completely, then we have to at minimum LIMIT them as best we can. Taking these type of weapons out of the equation can only help. There is no downside to people not being able to own submachine guns, and 50 cals, and all that other Neo Matrix **** people wanna buy these days.

Agreed. People aren't grasping this very simple concept. If it reduces the number of mass shootings or homicides by .0001%, then it's worth it. A lot of folks are stuck on the "well it will still happen..." train of thought. That may be true. But if it REDUCES the amount of instances, then what's the downside?

 

[ninjahood]

Your argument is the kind of thinking that empowers stickup kids.

Its not taking a life to "protect a necklace" its taking a life that threatened your own life.

... because you had a necklace on. So you trying to stunt doesn't empower stick up kids? Backwards AF.

Your decision to wear the necklace caused you to get stuck up. Period.

this is da same logic that idiots use in cases of rape "oh well if she didn't wear that provocative outfit she would've of gotten rape..she had it coming"

fools.

YOU HAVE A RIGHT TO SELF EXPRESSION, and you have da RIGHT TO SELF DEFENSE.

 

[hometownhero]

thread about victims of a tragedy is now a gun control thread with imaginary scenarios that have every one with a gun....okay.

thoughts and prayers go out to those affected.

 

[dankenstien88]

how do you dismiss da fact that i said it takes courses and training to obtain these weapons, but bring it up here?

tell me something sir



if this was me in da middle of east new york, brooklyn in NYC with my random non descript thick dominican/rican shining wit glaciers on my

neck and wrist. do you really think da NYPD is gonna keep me safe? why can't i have my personal firearm to protect me from anyone that would want to harm

me?

da typical response here would be "what are you doing in that neighborhood looking like that" why does that matter is my answer, i have da right to be where ever i want.

you know what happens when da bad guys get confronted with a good guy with some firepower? they stand da **** down.

This argument is so dumb. If someone tries to rob you and you shoot them, you're still going to prison. And deservedly so. If you're in a bad neighborhood with jewelry on and get robbed, no tears will be shed for you. And no I don't think you should have the right to take a life to protect a necklace.

But what if your wearing jewelry in an affluent suburb ?


Are you saying hard working people in the hood dont deserve to keep their nice things ?

 

[andee]

this is da same logic that idiots use in cases of rape "oh well if she didn't wear that provocative outfit she would've of gotten rape..she had it coming"

fools.

YOU HAVE A RIGHT TO SELF EXPRESSION, and you have da RIGHT TO SELF DEFENSE.

Self expression is not a right. If I want to express myself by running around naked, I will be caught up quick.

And it's really ironic that you bring up rape at all, considering you are CONSISTENTLY the first one to blame the female victim whenever a rape thread pops up on here, "Oh it was probably da train and she got has buyer's remorse."

You don't even believe some of the analogies you try to use.

 

[Maximus Meridius]

So we want Elementary school teachers, all 5 foot 2 inches of 50 year old blue hairness pullin their glocks out and havin a shootout in the hallways complete with cross fire, bad aim and all kinda other **** goin on?

Im saying. He's just talking crazy. I understand where ninja is coming from he's just going to far with it. That is NOT the solution at all for stuff like this.


Havent been watching the news over the weekend cause this stuff is just to sad but can anybody clear up some questions I have.


Who was the dude they arrested in the woods? Last thing I heard was it was his brother.


Who did he kill at his house? I've heard it was mother but on Friday the news said his mother was one of teachers that died.

 

[dankenstien88]

Your argument is the kind of thinking that empowers stickup kids.

Its not taking a life to "protect a necklace" its taking a life that threatened your own life.

... because you had a necklace on. So you trying to stunt doesn't empower stick up kids? Backwards AF.

Your decision to wear the necklace caused you to get stuck up. Period.

By that same logic it was stickup kids decision to try and take my necklace (threatening my life in the process) that left him leaking on the pavement. Period.

 

[newmoanyuh]

View media item 174859

 

[ksteezy]

Sons I've been alive in this earth for 30 years and have never been in a situation that required me to think..."damb I need an assault rifle" I grew up in the Bronx of all places, chances are if everyone was allowed to carry, I still won't, having a gun on you is giving you the option to pull the trigger on another human being, perhaps in a panic shoot an innocent bystander...life isn't a first shooter video game, these games have affected your reality and so long as Zombies are not walking this earth, I'll stick to not owning a gun...some of ya sound so eager to just have an excuse to walk around holding heat...it's not paranoia or safety, lettuce be cereal of what the real reason is.

 

[celticsfan9783]

This argument is so dumb. If someone tries to rob you and you shoot them, you're still going to prison. And deservedly so.

Not necessarily true. There's a thing law enforcement uses called the use of force continuum that often applies to regular citizens. You can use the amount of force needed, no more, to defend yourself. If you rightfully believe your life is in danger (say for instance someone robs you at gunpoint or comes at you aggressively wielding a knife), you can legally defend yourself with as much force needed. Of course these laws vary by state and many situations are very open to interpretations. But if someone is robbing you at gunpoint or knife point and you are a licensed gun owner and you stop your assailant via gunshots, chances are you won't be charged in criminal court.

 

[ksteezy]

By that same logic it was stickup kids decision to try and take my necklace (threatening my life in the process) that left him leaking on the pavement. Period.

Try and practice common sense, you can't think for others...stickup boys will do what they do, be aware of your sorroundings and don't walk around with a stack of hundred and a 70k chain on through hostile grounds, because at this point you become as responsible as the aggressor for the end result of what may transpire.

Ninja, that puffy example sucks....he's a celeb, find any pic of him in public and you'll find a 350lb 6'5 bald white dude behind him, who I'm sure is packing and doing it legally...Puff has his protection...he's not stupid, you want to parade with that type of jewelry on you around east New York, you have issues fam...you went out there looking for trouble.

 

[SoleByThePound]

Sons I've been alive in this earth for 30 years and have never been in a situation that required me to think..."damb I need an assault rifle" I grew up in the Bronx of all places, chances are if everyone was allowed to carry, I still won't, having a gun on you is giving you the option to pull the trigger on another human being, perhaps in a panic shoot an innocent bystander...life isn't a first shooter video game, these games have affected your reality and so long as Zombies are not walking this earth, I'll stick to not owning a gun...some of ya sound so eager to just have an excuse to walk around holding heat...it's not paranoia or safety, lettuce be cereal of what the real reason is.

Who is making an argument for people being able to walk around strapped like this is the old west though? I know that it's nearly impossible for a regular civilian to posses a concealment permit in California & if I am not mistaken New York state is as strict as they come.

 

[rellireloaded]

Please explain the relevance of this

 

[True Blues]

For the first article you posted only one study is less than 10 years old. Please try and get some more up to date info. Another funny thing about it is most of those studies were conducted during the original federal AWB.
Also if guns are the problem why is it that each year gun violence has gone down yet gun ownership up? Don't believe me check for yourself.
http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/uc...s.-2011/tables/expanded-homicide-data-table-8
http://www.fbi.gov/about-us/cjis/nics/reports/copy_of_TotalNICSBackgroundChecks.pdf

Are you a moron? Did you even read the note at the bottom of the chart you provided? It explicitly says that the figures do not correspond to actual numbers of guns sold, but only to background checks, which proves the exact opposite of your argument.

Background checks for guns (a form of gun control) have increased over time and has led to a decrease in gun violence.

Please try and get some more up to date info.

Please try to read things thoroughly and carefully, especially things you present, before attempting to post them to make a point.

Moreover, simply stating "get some more up-to-date info" is a pretty weak line of argument given:

a) the temporal constraints associated with obtaining recent data
b) the vast empirical literature suggesting a correlation between gun control and a decline gun-related violence
c) most of the studies I presented are longitudinal (employ time-series data)
d) you presented an even weaker counter

But I'll indulge you with a few, anyways.

Gun control and suicide: The impact of state firearm regulations in the United States, 1995–2004 (2011)
Antonio Rodríguez Andrésa, , , Katherine Hempsteadb, 1,

Objective
To empirically assess the impact of firearm regulation on male suicides.

Method
A negative binomial regression model was applied by using a panel of state level data for the years 1995–2004. The model was used to identify the association between several firearm regulations and male suicide rates.

Results
Our empirical analysis suggest that firearms regulations which function to reduce overall gun availability have a significant deterrent effect on male suicide, while regulations that seek to prohibit high risk individuals from owning firearms have a lesser effect.

Conclusions
Restricting access to lethal means has been identified as an effective approach to suicide prevention, and firearms regulations are one way to reduce gun availability. The analysis suggests that gun control measures such as permit and licensing requirements have a negative effect on suicide rates among males. Since there is considerable heterogeneity among states with regard to gun control, these results suggest that there are opportunities for many states to reduce suicide by expanding their firearms regulations.

Firearm legislation reform in the European Union: impact on firearm availability, firearm suicide and homicide rates in Austria (2007)
Nestor D. Kapusta, MD
Elmar Etzersdorfer, MD
Christoph Krall, PhD
Gernot Sonneck, MD

Abstract

Background The availability of firearms in homes and at aggregate levels is a risk factor for suicide and homicide. One method of reducing access to suicidal means is the restriction of firearm availability through more stringent legislation.

Aims To evaluate the impact of firearm legislation reform on firearm suicides and homicides as well as on the availability of firearms in Austria.

Method Official statistics on suicides, firearm homicides and firearm licences issued from 1985 to 2005 were examined. To assess the effect of the new firearm law, enacted in 1997, linear regression and Poisson regressions were performed using data from before and after the law reform.

Results The rate of firearm suicides among some age groups, percentage of firearm suicides, as well as the rate of firearm homicides and the rate of firearm licences, significantly decreased after a more stringent firearm law had been implemented.

Conclusions Our findings provide evidence that the introduction of restrictive firearmlegislation effectively reduced the rates of firearm suicide and homicide. The decline in firearm-related deaths seems to have been mediated by the legal restriction of firearm availability. Restrictive firearm legislation should be an integral part of national suicide prevention programmes in countries with high firearm suicide rates.

State background checks for gun purchase and firearm deaths: An exploratory study (2012)
Bisakha Sena, , , Anantachai Panjamapiromb,

Objective
This study examines the relationship between the types of background-information check required by states prior to firearm purchases, and firearm homicide and suicide deaths.

Methods
Negative binomial models are used to analyze state-level data for homicides and suicides in the U.S. from 1996 to 2005. Data on types of background information are retrieved from the Surveys of State Procedures Related to Firearm Sales, and the violent death data are from the WISQARS. Several other state level factors were controlled for.

Results
More background checks are associated with fewer homicide (IRR:0.93, 95% CI:0.91–0.96) and suicide (IRR:0.98, 95% CI:0.96–1.00) deaths. Firearm homicide deaths are lower when states have checks for restraining orders (IRR:0.87, 95% CI:0.79–0.95) and fugitive status (IRR:0.79, 95% CI:0.72–0.8. Firearm suicide deaths are lower when states have background checks for mental illness (IRR:0.96, 95% CI:0.92–0.99), fugitive status (IRR:0.95, 95% CI:0.90–0.99) and misdemeanors (IRR:0.95, 95% CI:0.92–1.00). It does not appear that reductions in firearm deaths are offset by increases in non-firearm violent deaths.

Conclusions
More extensive background checks prior to gun purchase are mostly associated with reductions in firearm homicide and suicide deaths. Several study limitations are acknowledged, and further research is called for to ascertain causality.

An evaluation of state firearm regulations and homicide and suicide death rates (2005)
Rosengart, M.ab , Cummings, P.ce, Nathens, A.cd, Heagerty, P.f, Maier, R.d, Rivara, F.ceg

Objective: To determine if any of five different state gun laws were associated with firearm mortality: (1) "shall issue" laws permitting an individual to carry a concealed weapon unless restricted by another statute; (2) a minimum age of 21 years for handgun purchase; (3) a minimum age of 21 years for private handgun possession; (4) one gun a month laws which restrict handgun purchase frequency; and (5) junk gun laws which ban the sale of certain cheaply constructed handguns. Design: A cross sectional time series study of firearm mortality from 1979 to 1998. Setting: All 50 states and the District of Columbia. Subjects: All residents of the United States. Main outcome measures: Firearm homicides, all homicides, firearm suicides, and all suicides. Results: When a "shall issue" law was present, the rate of firearm homicides was greater, RR 1.11 (95% confidence interval 0.99 to 1.24), than when the law was not present, as was the rate of all homicides, RR 1.08 (95% CI 0.98 to 1.17), although this was not statistically significant. No law was associated with a statistically significant decrease in the rates of firearm homicides or total homicides. No law was associated with a statistically significant change in firearm suicide rates. Conclusion: A "shall issue" law that eliminates most restrictions on carrying a concealed weapon may be associated with increased firearm homicide rates. No law was associated with a statistically significant reduction in firearm homicide or suicide rates.

 

[ninjahood]

By that same logic it was stickup kids decision to try and take my necklace (threatening my life in the process) that left him leaking on the pavement. Period.

Try and practice common sense, you can't think for others...stickup boys will do what they do, be aware of your sorroundings and don't walk around with a stack of hundred and a 70k chain on through hostile grounds, because at this point you become as responsible as the aggressor for the end result of what may transpire.

Ninja, that puffy example sucks....he's a celeb, find any pic of him in public and you'll find a 350lb 6'5 bald white dude behind him, who I'm sure is packing and doing it legally...Puff has his protection...he's not stupid, you want to parade with that type of jewelry on you around east New York, you have issues fam...you went out there looking for trouble.

i rest my case.

what give puffy da right to shine, and not me? he's got legally armed goons, why can't i be legally armed?

 

[ksteezy]

Who is making an argument for people being able to walk around strapped like this is the old west though? I know that it's nearly impossible for a regular civilian to posses a concealment permit in California & if I am not mistaken New York state is as strict as they come.

Well apparently the pro gunners think loosening the knot on gun control is the answer...those who want guns get them one way or the other now...changin the law to make them more accessible will do what exactly?...put more guns out on the streets....in a state of paranoia that the US lives in, this will be a catastrophe. How none of you can grasp this is mind blowing.