california Mandating 1.4 million electric cars by 2025 VOL. we tell you what to drive

[0cks]

Why are ya'll in such fear of the elimination of gas guzzlers/supercars? I'm sure those cars will still be around just with some astronomically high vehicle registration dollar amounts and assuming you can afford those cars it will just be something to consider before buying...

 

[yeah]

Originally Posted by ninjahood

Originally Posted by Yeah

California is BROKE...raising taxes on everyone else to fund a goal by a unelected bureaucracy is ridiculous...and whats worse is they're gonna go crawl to da federal government with da tin can for more bailout because they

keep blowin  what they tax on stuff like this...da electric car has been out for almost as long as da car as has been out, if it was gonna be successful it would do wit without basically coercing da market into subsidizing their operation..

My plan wouldn't include raising taxes on everyone, at all. I think you misunderstood. There wouldn't be any additional tax put on at all. Rather, the idea would be to have car dealerships offer leasing options that go on for an extended period of time (let's say hypothetically speaking the average lease is 2 years at 300/month. my idea would be to offer a 3 year 250/month option.) so that 1. the California government would be able to collect taxes on a car for a longer period of time, and 2. citizens would be able to afford to lease a vehicle by prolonging the time they have to pay for it without incurring outrageous amounts of additional cost. To encourage people to buy EVs, people whose car doesn't meet emissions standards would get taxed more (like a Supercar tax.)

Also, the pure electric car has been introduced, recalled, and reintroduced into the market. Each time the electric car did pretty well, only to be recalled for mysterious reasons. Check out the documentary "Who killed the Electric Car" to get some insight on it. I fully believe that the electric car hasn't been as successful as it could have up to this point because the powers that be didn't want it to be successful. (See: Exxon, Standard Oil, etc.)

 

[mikykr20]

Never in my life will I ever buy an electrical car. Strictly SUV's for me

 

[mrbrown]

What if these new cars have the potential to out perform current models?
I don't know why people think new tech cars will be weaker when in reality they can be just as fast, No real effort has been placed on alternative fueled models so far, Id imagine that crazy innovations will unfold with the introduction of these alternative fuels...

its about time

 

[frostythepoptart]

You guys are tree hugging sheep. I respect and do my end to care for the planet but to sit here and cosign being FORCED into a purchasing decision is absolutely ridiculous. Yeah why dont we just force folks to eat vegetarian, choose greener brands of coffee, and can only run windows because macs use too much energy. Clowns.

 

[yngsimba.sneakershoebox]

 

[rawsheed]

Originally Posted by rashi

Hey, what ever happened to Global Warming? Haven't heard about it in years.

Global Warming is alive and well. The continual rise in anthroprogenic contribution of CO2 emissions and the rest of the other green house gases are apparent in the warming of our planet. a warming increase that has never been seen in the history of the Earth in such a short amount of time
Good for us for trying to make a change, not surprised at all. cars are either made to CA standards or grade (Other) standard. we are the greatest state in the union 

 

[frostythepoptart]

If you dont have any other option im pretty sure your forced.

Just cause i dont want to be a lame in a prius doesnt mean i want a hummer.

Carry on

 

[ninjahood]

Originally Posted by 0cks

Why are ya'll in such fear of the elimination of gas guzzlers/supercars?

oil is PLENTIFUL, there is no need to eliminate something that basically still plays a super important part for human civilization since da industrial revolution.

and as far as da practicality of these electric cars imma explain how uncompetitive batteries are STILL compared to good ol' gasoline...

da chevy volt's battery weighs 375lbs and has a 40 mile range going all electric

a gallon of gas weighs 6.073 pounds per US Gallon,,now let's say you have a similarly size chevy cruze and fill up da tank with a capacity of 15.4 gallons

you multiply da weight of da gas by da tank capacity and its 93.5242 lbs

so if da chevy cruze does 26 City / 38 Hwy

it'll go 400 miles in da city and 585 hwy all while being 281.4758 lbs LIGHTER then da electric battery and DWARFING da 40 mile electrical capacity...

da chevy volt cost $41,000

da chevy Cruze is $16,800

there's NO WAY you're gonna force people to buy cars like this unless you put a gun to their heads

why do you think Enviormentalist are such staunch opponents to da keystone pipe XL? it'll bring HOARDS of cheap conflict free gas from Canada into da US and make da electric car even more undesirable then

they already are.

 

[crcballer55]

Originally Posted by Yeah

Originally Posted by ninjahood

Originally Posted by Yeah

California is BROKE...raising taxes on everyone else to fund a goal by a unelected bureaucracy is ridiculous...and whats worse is they're gonna go crawl to da federal government with da tin can for more bailout because they

keep blowin  what they tax on stuff like this...da electric car has been out for almost as long as da car as has been out, if it was gonna be successful it would do wit without basically coercing da market into subsidizing their operation..

My plan wouldn't include raising taxes on everyone, at all. I think you misunderstood. There wouldn't be any additional tax put on at all. Rather, the idea would be to have car dealerships offer leasing options that go on for an extended period of time (let's say hypothetically speaking the average lease is 2 years at 300/month. my idea would be to offer a 3 year 250/month option.) so that 1. the California government would be able to collect taxes on a car for a longer period of time, and 2. citizens would be able to afford to lease a vehicle by prolonging the time they have to pay for it without incurring outrageous amounts of additional cost. To encourage people to buy EVs, people whose car doesn't meet emissions standards would get taxed more (like a Supercar tax.)

Also, the pure electric car has been introduced, recalled, and reintroduced into the market. Each time the electric car did pretty well, only to be recalled for mysterious reasons. Check out the documentary "Who killed the Electric Car" to get some insight on it. I fully believe that the electric car hasn't been as successful as it could have up to this point because the powers that be didn't want it to be successful. (See: Exxon, Standard Oil, etc.)

People don't want to lease a car for an extended period of time though.  If that were the case, dealers would be offering leases longer than 5 years on normal cars already.  Most people who are willing to buy new technology want something newer when it comes out.  They don't want to be stuck with a 7 year old car.  With a lease, that's essentially what you are... stuck.

GM has tried reintroduced the "EV" with the Volt.  It has been such an astounding success that it has sold a grand total of 6000 vehicles as of December!  I have seen 3 Volts on the highways in California, and this is the state where people were climbing over each other to get the Prius to show how green they were.

 

[rawsheed]

yeah I'm as green as any person on this board but these cars aren't all that. batteries are extremely toxic to the environment and what not. I was hanging out with some NOAA guys and they didn't even want anything to do with Prius's etc. All while they roll around in their Chevy Surburbans

 

[crcballer55]

Originally Posted by yngSIMBA

Originally Posted by frostythepoptart

You guys are tree hugging sheep. I respect and do my end to care for the planet but to sit here and cosign being FORCED into a purchasing decision is absolutely ridiculous. Yeah why dont we just force folks to eat vegetarian, choose greener brands of coffee, and can only run windows because macs use too much energy. Clowns.

Tree-hugging sheep? 

 Doesn't make too much sense..  
You want the big, bad car/truck, yet other people are the sheep.. 

California is doing this because they have a bad smog problem (polluted air.) Who wants to breathe that in everyday? I also didn't read anywhere that people are going to be FORCED to buy it.. 

Why do we need a law mandated on us because of a problem that China gives us?

California Pollution: Made in China?

 

[yngsimba.sneakershoebox]

X

 

[mplsdunk]

we don't even have emissions here

i ran straight pipes on my rx-7.

 

[0cks]

Originally Posted by ninjahood

Originally Posted by 0cks

Why are ya'll in such fear of the elimination of gas guzzlers/supercars?

oil is PLENTIFUL, there is no need to eliminate something that basically still plays a super important part for human civilization since da industrial revolution.

and as far as da practicality of these electric cars imma explain how uncompetitive batteries are STILL compared to good ol' gasoline...

da chevy volt's battery weighs 375lbs and has a 40 mile range going all electric

a gallon of gas weighs 6.073 pounds per US Gallon,,now let's say you have a similarly size chevy cruze and fill up da tank with a capacity of 15.4 gallons

you multiply da weight of da gas by da tank capacity and its 93.5242 lbs

so if da chevy cruze does 26 City / 38 Hwy

it'll go 400 miles in da city and 585 hwy all while being 281.4758 lbs LIGHTER then da electric battery and DWARFING da 40 mile electrical capacity...

da chevy volt cost $41,000

da chevy Cruze is $16,800

there's NO WAY you're gonna force people to buy cars like this unless you put a gun to their heads

why do you think Enviormentalist are such staunch opponents to da keystone pipe XL? it'll bring HOARDS of cheap conflict free gas from Canada into da US and make da electric car even more undesirable then

they already are.

I'm sayin tho, gas guzzling cars will be relegated to weekend/hobby vehicles for the rich... you won't be forced out of your HEMICharger, you'll just be priced out... Which I don't think is all bad, in those LA streets what good does it do if your car can do 0-60 in 3.2 but you're stuck in gridlock traffic all day

Also don't you think the world would be a better place if we could leave the Middle East be and not HAVE to be all up in their business? Oil is the only thing making them hot and the sooner we get off this dependency the less we have to spend on defense/homeland security and put tax money towards better things like schools and the environment...

 

[thorrocksjs]

China needs electric cars we don't .If china had stricter laws on driving and better testing they wouldnt even have half the people driving.

 

[wanksta23]

Originally Posted by JPTHE3

shut yo #$4 up ninjahood ,ill body you up real talk

coming from a 14 year old

callmate guey

 

[j2legend]

Disposing of the batteries hurts the environment more than actually using gasoline vehicles IMO.  Plus, I'm in the oil industry, so that hurts us a little bit 

 

[ninjahood]

Originally Posted by 0cks

Originally Posted by ninjahood

Originally Posted by 0cks

Why are ya'll in such fear of the elimination of gas guzzlers/supercars?

oil is PLENTIFUL, there is no need to eliminate something that basically still plays a super important part for human civilization since da industrial revolution.

and as far as da practicality of these electric cars imma explain how uncompetitive batteries are STILL compared to good ol' gasoline...

da chevy volt's battery weighs 375lbs and has a 40 mile range going all electric

a gallon of gas weighs 6.073 pounds per US Gallon,,now let's say you have a similarly size chevy cruze and fill up da tank with a capacity of 15.4 gallons

you multiply da weight of da gas by da tank capacity and its 93.5242 lbs

so if da chevy cruze does 26 City / 38 Hwy

it'll go 400 miles in da city and 585 hwy all while being 281.4758 lbs LIGHTER then da electric battery and DWARFING da 40 mile electrical capacity...

da chevy volt cost $41,000

da chevy Cruze is $16,800

there's NO WAY you're gonna force people to buy cars like this unless you put a gun to their heads

why do you think Enviormentalist are such staunch opponents to da keystone pipe XL? it'll bring HOARDS of cheap conflict free gas from Canada into da US and make da electric car even more undesirable then

they already are.

I'm sayin tho, gas guzzling cars will be relegated to weekend/hobby vehicles for the rich... you won't be forced out of your HEMICharger, you'll just be priced out... Which I don't think is all bad, in those LA streets what good does it do if your car can do 0-60 in 3.2 but you're stuck in gridlock traffic all day

Also don't you think the world would be a better place if we could leave the Middle East be and not HAVE to be all up in their business? Oil is the only thing making them hot and the sooner we get off this dependency the less we have to spend on defense/homeland security and put tax money towards better things like schools and the environment...

-this is NOT a absolute though....exploration and da expansive progress in Canada's oil sand continuing...do you know they have da 2nd MOST oil behind Saudi Arabia? http://www.rense.com/general37/petrol.htm

and they're our neighbors AKA BBFs, we ALREADY get most of our oil from Canada, so if they ramp up production with da Keystone XL (which Obama is cockblockin) we can ween ourselves OFF OPEC oil and

secure our energy independence from conflict oil.

 

[10 piece nuggets]

How are they gonna actually make 1.4 million electric cars sell?

What if people just dont want to buy them for whatever reason?

 

[0cks]

Originally Posted by ninjahood

Originally Posted by 0cks

Originally Posted by ninjahood

oil is PLENTIFUL, there is no need to eliminate something that basically still plays a super important part for human civilization since da industrial revolution.

and as far as da practicality of these electric cars imma explain how uncompetitive batteries are STILL compared to good ol' gasoline...

da chevy volt's battery weighs 375lbs and has a 40 mile range going all electric

a gallon of gas weighs 6.073 pounds per US Gallon,,now let's say you have a similarly size chevy cruze and fill up da tank with a capacity of 15.4 gallons

you multiply da weight of da gas by da tank capacity and its 93.5242 lbs

so if da chevy cruze does 26 City / 38 Hwy

it'll go 400 miles in da city and 585 hwy all while being 281.4758 lbs LIGHTER then da electric battery and DWARFING da 40 mile electrical capacity...

da chevy volt cost $41,000

da chevy Cruze is $16,800

there's NO WAY you're gonna force people to buy cars like this unless you put a gun to their heads

why do you think Enviormentalist are such staunch opponents to da keystone pipe XL? it'll bring HOARDS of cheap conflict free gas from Canada into da US and make da electric car even more undesirable then

they already are.

I'm sayin tho, gas guzzling cars will be relegated to weekend/hobby vehicles for the rich... you won't be forced out of your HEMICharger, you'll just be priced out... Which I don't think is all bad, in those LA streets what good does it do if your car can do 0-60 in 3.2 but you're stuck in gridlock traffic all day

Also don't you think the world would be a better place if we could leave the Middle East be and not HAVE to be all up in their business? Oil is the only thing making them hot and the sooner we get off this dependency the less we have to spend on defense/homeland security and put tax money towards better things like schools and the environment...

-this is NOT a absolute though....exploration and da expansive progress in Canada's oil sand continuing...do you know they have da 2nd MOST oil behind Saudi Arabia? http://www.rense.com/general37/petrol.htm

and they're our neighbors AKA BBFs, we ALREADY get most of our oil from Canada, so if they ramp up production with da Keystone XL (which Obama is cockblockin) we can ween ourselves OFF OPEC oil and

secure our energy independence from conflict oil.

Extracting oil from that Canadian slurry is very expensive and you are making the assumption they will be willing to tear up their picturesque scenery for our oil consumption... That's like a last resort option, for now we will just continue to harass and meddle with Middle Eastern politics to maintain the flow we currently enjoy... It's big business and people are making crazy money off of it but alot of lives are being lost over some BS in the end

 

[crcballer55]

Originally Posted by yngSIMBA


The US is so fascinated with gas guzzlers tho.. 
I don't agree with electric, at least not yet..
But why are we still burning oil/gasoline? There ARE other fuel sources.

I guess these oil companies got some pull..

Gasoline is actually has the best combination of efficiency, safety, and price at this point.  Not all fuels have an efficient burn.  While natural gas, kerosene, and ethanol may be cleaner, you don't get as much bang for your buck when it burns.  Thus you need to carry more on board to go the same distance, thus further reducing the efficiency of the fuel.  You must also deal with the amount of fuel available.  In order to grow enough corn to meet the ethenol demand for just the U.S. we would need to farm the entire midwest with just one crop.  Most people don't realize what happened to the cost of food in 2006 when congress mandated at least 10% ethenol be used in gas.

It's not about "pull" so much as petroleum based fuel gets the job done the best for commuter vehicles.

 

[sillyputty]

Originally Posted by ninjahood

Originally Posted by 0cks

Why are ya'll in such fear of the elimination of gas guzzlers/supercars?

oil is PLENTIFUL, there is no need to eliminate something that basically still plays a super important part for human civilization since da industrial revolution.

and as far as da practicality of these electric cars imma explain how uncompetitive batteries are STILL compared to good ol' gasoline...

da chevy volt's battery weighs 375lbs and has a 40 mile range going all electric

a gallon of gas weighs 6.073 pounds per US Gallon,,now let's say you have a similarly size chevy cruze and fill up da tank with a capacity of 15.4 gallons

you multiply da weight of da gas by da tank capacity and its 93.5242 lbs

so if da chevy cruze does 26 City / 38 Hwy

it'll go 400 miles in da city and 585 hwy all while being 281.4758 lbs LIGHTER then da electric battery and DWARFING da 40 mile electrical capacity...

da chevy volt cost $41,000

da chevy Cruze is $16,800

there's NO WAY you're gonna force people to buy cars like this unless you put a gun to their heads

why do you think Enviormentalist are such staunch opponents to da keystone pipe XL? it'll bring HOARDS of cheap conflict free gas from Canada into da US and make da electric car even more undesirable then

they already are.

Invest in the technology and the price of it will come down over time. That alone kills that ridiculous argument you posted above. Its simply supply and demand. 
You act like the first carphone wasn't hundreds of dollars. 

Ninja, you are really against alternative energy and you make incredibly poor arguments against it.

For one, Oil is NOT a renewable resource...certainly not in the face of the length of time it took to MAKE the stuff. So anything you're even remotely suggesting about "levels are fine" is something YOU don't know about any more than Chavez or the Al Saud knows. It could run out within your life time and you'll be here with the stuck on stupid face. 

Then you say ridiculous things like the government is forcing standards on the people.

Dont be ridiculous.

 Where were you when they wanted catalytic converters on all exhaust? 

Where were you when they banned texting and driving? 

Where were you when they mandated all cars use the same diagnostics? 

Where were you when they mandated seatbelts? 

Where were you when they mandated latches in all trunks? 

Where were you when they demanded emissions tests? 

Where were you when they mandated tint restrictions? 

Where were you on mandates to operate only certain types of vehicles?

Where were you on regulations for car modifications like clearing the wheel well or engine performance?

The government has BEEN regulating your car usage. You have less choice than you think you ever had. Thats the problem. You don't even know what YOU have any more. 

Plus, you know very well you aren't out here designing your own cars so you'll TAKE what the market GIVES you

...and you won't have a say in the matter until you start making your own. Consumers only get to whine so much. There is always a bike you can use. Lets be real here.

On top of that, anyone complaining about "well my Hemi won't purr anymore" ...well thats not what engines were made to do in the first place. Thats merely a sideeffect of how combustion engines work. You know very well that the noise as a result of design, not intention. We've just grown to love it. But we can grow to love other things as well. Its happened before and it will happen again. 

Anyone against this legislation is utterly selfish in my eyes.

If your only reason is "well my car won't have no power and make big rawr noises!

" then you need to grow up. Cars are first and foremost transportation. They had to learn in under 100 years how to get to where we are now...and the next 100 have the potential to be played by a different set of rules. Everything we know about engine performance, customization, and other intangibles is a result of only one experience. The future will be different and we have to embrace that fact.

Tradition does not deserve to be respected, just because its something we used to do. Thats not a validation nor a good reason to keep doing the same thing.

Its about what works best and how to get there for all of our benefit. 

It you want your new electric car to make dinosaur noises to make you feel better about yourself, you are more than welcome to introduce a new system of engineering dedicated to aftermarket modifications and "improvements" on newer technology. 

 

[kiendienn]

I think the issue is that fossil fuels upset the carbon cycle, as opposed to a net gain of 0 carbon emissions from current carbon productions. We are using carbon from extremely late ages and once CO2 is expelled, our current plant and ocean-life can only account for so much more CO2 removal on top of what is already naturally being produced.

If we look into biofuels and more realistically, drop-in fuels, then we are able to relieve the stress caused by fossil fuels.

I know Brazil is doing pretty well with their biofuel, however, the US has blocked its import.

If they made car batteries more efficient, reliable, and cheaper, then I believe electric cars would be a solid alternative, as well.


There's a line between and practical and luxury, and I just don't see anything above 175HP as practical. I just have something with 160HP and a turbocharger, and I'm very content.
There's tons of room for research, from butanol to macroalgae (which I think is the most interesting and possibly plausible)

 

[sillyputty]

Originally Posted by kiendienn

I think the issue is that fossil fuels upset the carbon cycle, as opposed to a net gain of 0 carbon emissions from current carbon productions. We are using carbon from extremely late ages and once CO2 is expelled, our current plant and ocean-life can only account for so much more CO2 removal on top of what is already naturally being produced.

If we look into biofuels and more realistically, drop-in fuels, then we are able to relieve the stress caused by fossil fuels.

I know Brazil is doing pretty well with their biofuel, however, the US has blocked its import.

If they made car batteries more efficient, reliable, and cheaper, then I believe electric cars would be a solid alternative, as well.


There's a line between and practical and luxury, and I just don't see anything above 175HP as practical. I just have something with 160HP and a turbocharger, and I'm very content.
There's tons of room for research, from butanol to macroalgae (which I think is the most interesting and possibly plausible)

Dudes wanna say alternative energy is "so expensive" but did ya'll forget how the US Auto industry sabotaged early attempts for hydrogen cars to get off the ground because they were made by foreigners?
I'll never forget what they did to brands like Toyota under the table. 

Its all a power struggle...