2014 NFL Draft Thread

[jjs07]

What scenario you talking about?

And Derek Carr aint look too bad against Boise, looked like he got a nice arm

The scenario where people think the Rams are going to end up with the #1 overall. Rams have the Skins pick this year due to the RG3 trade.

 

[jj watt]

CP I'm hiring you as my scout.

Houston needs a QB

Let's get it

 

[IATT]

The scenario where people think the Rams are going to end up with the #1 overall. Rams have the Skins pick this year due to the RG3 trade.

What other picks are the rams getting out of the trade, if any?

 

[CP1708]

What other picks are the rams getting out of the trade, if any?

This is the last one. They got a #1 last year, and a #2 in 2012 as well as the drop from 2 to 6. So just one pick left to use, but it's lookin like it might be pretty valuable.

Houston needs a QB

Myself, I have McCarron pegged to you. Schaub is a "solid" QB, not flashy, sexy, or elite, but good enough. Enter McCarron. He's played and won at Alabama, he's a leader, doesn't get rattled, and is well coached as well as plenty of reps, and facing NFL talent every week (almost) in the SEC. McCarron can't be a guy that you build around say in Oakland, where he's the piece and you build around just him. But if you drop McCarron onto a roster with talent already on board (Foster, Andre, Nuke, solid Oline, etc) then he can survive his early years, and then you replace those aging parts while he develops on the job training.

Another guy that could be in your range would be Zach Mettenberger, LSU's live arm. Thing is, he's been wild early in his career, but seemingly this year has cleaned up his act. I look forward to seein him against Georgia this week to look even closer. But scouts that I follow have been praising him non stop early in this season.


On paper, there seems to be a lot of QB's that could come out this year, but you never know. Some may decide to take the Barkley/Landry route and stay that extra year, we'll see. If the class deepens, that benefits a team like you big time, you'll be able to find someone late 1, or maybe even into round 2 if the class gets thicker.

 

[do work son]

I pray to God we don't take aj or mettenberger. If it's not boyd, mariota, or Manziel, I don't want em.

 

[do work son]

Because aj isn't a playmaker. He's a good qb with good tools, just had a stronger arm than Schaub. We can win with Schaub, but we won't win BECAUSE of Schaub. AJ would be no different.

Manziel would actually work because of kubiaks love for getting a QB on the edge on bootlegs, and he has the legs and arm to make plays. He's a flat out playmaker. His only issue is mechanics. Doesn't reset his feet, throws off back foot etc

 

[buc em]

If Schiano is still our coach I guarantee we pick McCarron. Hopefully he isn't our coach next year though.

 

[champcruthik]

Fisher was money in that first draft. Brockers, Janoris, additional picks.

Doubt STL gets the first pick via Washington. If they do end up with a top-3 selection, trade back again and stockpile more picks for the future.

 

[DeadsetAce]

Doubt STL gets the first pick via Washington. If they do end up with a top-3 selection, trade back again and stockpile more picks for the future.

yup

 

[blackxme]

LOLOL the texans with AJ, s_ would be the same man.

Manziel in a Texans uniform? Yes please.

 

[do work son]

LOLOL the texans with AJ, s_ would be the same man.

Manziel in a Texans uniform? Yes please.

sumlin as the coach

 

[Peep Game]

LOL

 

[IATT]

texans' giving up on yates already?!

but im not sure who would be a good fit, unless the philosophy changed from being so conservative.. i guess those guys (mariota, hundley and manziel) would offer a run threat.. but upgraded arm strength is the biggest need at that spot..

like bill simmons said in his most recent podcast, if the steelers decide to trade big ben, houston might be the best match

 

[do work son]

texans' giving up on yates already?!


but im not sure who would be a good fit, unless the philosophy changed from being so conservative.. i guess those guys (mariota, hundley and manziel) would offer a run threat.. but upgraded arm strength is the biggest need at that spot..


like bill simmons said in his most recent podcast, if the steelers decide to trade big ben, houston might be the best match

houston isn't trading for big ben. trent richardson trade has the NFL on NBA trade rumors ish with chris broussard at the helm.

the biggest need is elite arm strength to stretch the field considering that's what our offense is geared to set up. run to set up playaction and attack the defense at all 3 levels. with schaub, we can't get the deep level, owen daniels eats in the middle, or the checkdown to foster/tate. adding a manziel/mariota would give you a viable threat at all levels adding his running ability.

and while i've only seen tj yates in short spurts, i don't think he's the answer. he never looked comfortable making progressions, and again just doesn't seem to have playmaking ability. i don't doubt he can be serviceable, but if the QB is supposed to be the most important player on the field, i don't want to settle with a serviceable QB.

 

[buc em]

Does somebody actually think that TJ Yates is worth a ****?

 

[CP1708]

I'm sorry, but what? I'm fairly sure I've seen Schaub throw deep to Andre plenty of times in my life. Off play action, dropping back, whatever. 50-60 yard heaves.

What he has NEVER had was a compliment to Andre, period. I honestly never understand why people put that on Schaub. As was stated above, you guys feel you can with Schaub, but not because of Schaub.

Ya know what, I am the dumbest defensive coordinator in the NFL, and I have a 13 point lead, guess what, as dumb as I am, I double Andre, now what ya gonna do Schaub? Know what? Manziel ain't fixin that. McCarron ain't fixin that. NO ONE is fixin that.

It is NOT Schaub's fault his franchise has failed year after year to get him a weapon to line up opposite the decade that Andre been around. That's flat out failure on Houston's part, not Schaub.

NOW they get Hopkins, when Andre and Schaub have maybe 2 years in them and their glory days are left behind them.

So yes, Manziel and Mariota would give a running option, but for how long? How long do you want your QB runnin around? When they reach 27, still have the legs to run wild in them?

If you get McCarron, he's got the arm, the brain, and the work ethic to do his part. Now you give him Hopkins, it's then on YOU to add another wide out, a back, and a tight end to complete his tool shed, then protect him. Do that, and he'll win you games. He won't make mistakes, he's great in play action, he won't get greedy, he'll stand tall in the pocket, he has the size you need, he's Troy Aikmanish. Right now he has the label as "game manager" sorry, but that's Saban. Maybe McCarron wants to come in and run the run and shoot, how do we know? He might come to the NFL and want to throw 50 times or maybe he wants to hand off 50 times, depends on his roster don't it? If McCarron went to Houston, he'd probably feel ok handing off, wouldn't he? If he went to New Orleans, he might want to sling it a little.

Call me crazy, but I feel better about a 6-4 strong armed QB who has won titles, played all 4 years in college, has 10 career interceptions those 4 years, and works hard, keeps his head down, stays out of trouble
over the 6-1 guy that throws the ball all over the place, runs around like crazy, gets into all kinds of issues with the world, jet sets, etc that may or may not work his *** off for me when he has millions of dollars to spend. Will he work out? Maybe, we'll find out someday, but would you have to worry about him EVERY DAY he's on your team? Yep.

Would you worry about McCarron?


To me, right now, Manziel is a USC QB. Leinart, Sanchez, etc. Fun stats, good times, livin the life, looks good on paper, and then the NFL games come and they are not even close to ready. Maybe he'll prove me wrong, I screw up all the time, but at this point, today, I don't see what makes him next level special.

Maybe in a couple years he'll prove me wrong while Logan Thomas fetches my soda. We'll see.

 

[do work son]

while you may have seen schaub connect with andre "plenty of times", i've also seen him throw interceptions on simple out routes because his ball doesn't have velocity. i've seen DBs sit on throws because we don't stretch the field. i've seen him on countless 3rd downs buckle under pressure and just check down or eat a sack because he can't do anything. this past sunday, we had two goal to go situations early in the game. not one throw he made crossed the goal line.

i completely agree that it's not all on schaub. we haven't given him a complimentary receiver to andre. i understand that. with that being said, i've still seen him short arm throws deep where TDs turn into INTs. i'm not necessarily wanting manziel/mariota just because they run, but because they CAN run. they add another dimension. i want an athlete back there. i know it's unfair to compare to andrew luck, but he's an athletic pocket QB, that can create with his legs if he needs, and has a live arm.


a lot of fault also needs to be placed on gary kubiak. his offensive scheme, while productive, is archaic. there's no flash, no wrinkles. stretch, stretch, play action bootleg, occasional tight end screen. we agree that the texans can win with schaub but not because of him. you need too many things to be right for him to succeed. we don't have everything else right.

point being, if the QB is the most important position on offense, do you really want to pay a guy who's not a playmaker, and is more a game manager?

 

[Peep Game]

I like that Yates doesn't hesitate to fire the ball down-field to his playmakers, and he's mobile enough. Other than that, I haven't seen enough of him long-term to make any kind of judgement. It does seem like he regressed as far as make reads and decisions from the last time got playing time though.

 

[dacomeup]

sumlin as the coach

Isn't he already fed up with JFB? 

 

[frshstunna]

while you may have seen schaub connect with andre "plenty of times", i've also seen him throw interceptions on simple out routes because his ball doesn't have velocity. i've seen DBs sit on throws because we don't stretch the field. i've seen him on countless 3rd downs buckle under pressure and just check down or eat a sack because he can't do anything. this past sunday, we had two goal to go situations early in the game. not one throw he made crossed the goal line.

i completely agree that it's not all on schaub. we haven't given him a complimentary receiver to andre. i understand that. with that being said, i've still seen him short arm throws deep where TDs turn into INTs. i'm not necessarily wanting manziel/mariota just because they run, but because they CAN run. they add another dimension. i want an athlete back there. i know it's unfair to compare to andrew luck, but he's an athletic pocket QB, that can create with his legs if he needs, and has a live arm.


a lot of fault also needs to be placed on gary kubiak. his offensive scheme, while productive, is archaic. there's no flash, no wrinkles. stretch, stretch, play action bootleg, occasional tight end screen. we agree that the texans can win with schaub but not because of him. you need too many things to be right for him to succeed. we don't have everything else right.

point being, if the QB is the most important position on offense, do you really want to pay a guy who's not a playmaker, and is more a game manager?

I feel like if you get McCarron on the Texans they basically just picking up a younger Schaub

 

[IATT]

houston isn't trading for big ben. trent richardson trade has the NFL on NBA trade rumors ish with chris broussard at the helm.

the biggest need is elite arm strength to stretch the field considering that's what our offense is geared to set up. run to set up playaction and attack the defense at all 3 levels. with schaub, we can't get the deep level, owen daniels eats in the middle, or the checkdown to foster/tate. adding a manziel/mariota would give you a viable threat at all levels adding his running ability.

and while i've only seen tj yates in short spurts, i don't think he's the answer. he never looked comfortable making progressions, and again just doesn't seem to have playmaking ability. i don't doubt he can be serviceable, but if the QB is supposed to be the most important player on the field, i don't want to settle with a serviceable QB.

not saying it will happen.. just agreeing with simmons that it is a good idea for both sides.. since i think the steelers need to rebuild

and isnt this exactly what i said?

and i was joking about yates.. but he wasnt THAT bad when he had to step in for you guys

 

[CP1708]

while you may have seen schaub connect with andre "plenty of times", i've also seen him throw interceptions on simple out routes because his ball doesn't have velocity. i've seen DBs sit on throws because we don't stretch the field. i've seen him on countless 3rd downs buckle under pressure and just check down or eat a sack because he can't do anything. this past sunday, we had two goal to go situations early in the game. not one throw he made crossed the goal line.

i completely agree that it's not all on schaub. we haven't given him a complimentary receiver to andre. i understand that. with that being said, i've still seen him short arm throws deep where TDs turn into INTs. i'm not necessarily wanting manziel/mariota just because they run, but because they CAN run. they add another dimension. i want an athlete back there. i know it's unfair to compare to andrew luck, but he's an athletic pocket QB, that can create with his legs if he needs, and has a live arm.


a lot of fault also needs to be placed on gary kubiak. his offensive scheme, while productive, is archaic. there's no flash, no wrinkles. stretch, stretch, play action bootleg, occasional tight end screen. we agree that the texans can win with schaub but not because of him. you need too many things to be right for him to succeed. we don't have everything else right.

point being, if the QB is the most important position on offense, do you really want to pay a guy who's not a playmaker, and is more a game manager?

How much of that is arm, and how much of that is system/opposite WR? If a CB sits on a throw, doesn't that also mean he knew that play/throw was coming?

I'm not sayin Schaub is Elway, just that earlier in his career, his arm was decent enough. At this stage, yeah he probably has lost some on his fastball, so have Brady and Manning, so did Favre, Marino, etc.


Thing is, what I am suggesting, McCarron lets your team/offense stay in perfect harmony. You have to do better adding talent around him, but the philosophy stays the same. ZBS, RB's, receivers, everything.
If you switch to Mariota, Boyd, or Manziel, or whoever that is completely the opposite of the offense you currently run, then you are talking about a complete rebuild. Coach out, Oline changes, RB changes, everything. You have to then draft and switch all those pieces. Just like switchin a 3-4 defense to a 4-3, the parts are different, you have to re-organize the players. It can get tricky.

If you do that, that takes time, and you sort of bottom out doing it. If that's what you want, then I see your point, if you want to continue being a 10-11 win team, and try to just load up around a McCarron type (doesn't have to be just McCarron, could be anyone similar) and do a better job getting the weapons around your QB, then he's a solid pick. He can learn behind Schaub a year, then step right in. Bring in some receivers to team up with Nuk, find some young legs to replace Foster pretty soon, and one of these fancy 6-5 former basketball player type TE's and you could be in good shape real quick. We'll see, should be interesting what they do after this season.

 

[IATT]

To me, right now, Manziel is a USC QB. Leinart, Sanchez, etc. Fun stats, good times, livin the life, looks good on paper, and then the NFL games come and they are not even close to ready. Maybe he'll prove me wrong, I screw up all the time, but at this point, today, I don't see what makes him next level special.

Maybe in a couple years he'll prove me wrong while Logan Thomas fetches my soda. We'll see.

i dont think he's like the USC guys.. since they dont have the mobility that manziel has.. granted i think they all have similar arm limitations

i think he can be a jeff garcia type (a gamer, that uses their mobility to hide their other limitations).. i would love for the eagles to get him in the 3rd and then he can be our main backup

 

[IATT]

Thing is, what I am suggesting, McCarron lets your team/offense stay in perfect harmony. You have to do better adding talent around him, but the philosophy stays the same. ZBS, RB's, receivers, everything.

If you switch to Mariota, Boyd, or Manziel, or whoever that is completely the opposite of the offense you currently run, then you are talking about a complete rebuild. Coach out, Oline changes, RB changes, everything. You have to then draft and switch all those pieces. Just like switchin a 3-4 defense to a 4-3, the parts are different, you have to re-organize the players. It can get tricky.


If you do that, that takes time, and you sort of bottom out doing it. If that's what you want, then I see your point, if you want to continue being a 10-11 win team, and try to just load up around a McCarron type (doesn't have to be just McCarron, could be anyone similar) and do a better job getting the weapons around your QB, then he's a solid pick. He can learn behind Schaub a year, then step right in. Bring in some receivers to team up with Nuk, find some young legs to replace Foster pretty soon, and one of these fancy 6-5 former basketball player type TE's and you could be in good shape real quick. We'll see, should be interesting what they do after this season.

this is my issue with the texans going with mariota/boyd/manziel.. unless you are changing the coaches, it doesnt make sense

 

[dacomeup]

McCarron or Dalton as a prospect? Hope the Bengals draft someone young with potential in 3-4 that can be a backup/push Dalton.