- Mar 27, 2005
- 36
- 10
what if u have a job in jb
- Thread in 'Jordan Brand Archive' Thread starter Started by jordanhade,
- Start date
- Jun 21, 2004
- 699
- 42
if i have a job in jb...
EVERYDAY IS PICK-UP DAY!!!!
EVERYDAY IS PICK-UP DAY!!!!
b1lly hoyle
Banned
- Jan 23, 2005
- 1,830
- 10
Good Point.
[/center]
- Aug 7, 2004
- 23
- 10
damn math you put up some real good points especially the one about turning off the core comsumers with all this hype-beasting they have been doing lately.
Life is a beautiful strugglePeople search through the rubble for a suitable hustleSome people usin' the noodle, some people usin' the muscleSome people put it all together, make it fit like a puzzle - Talib Kewli
Life is a beautiful strugglePeople search through the rubble for a suitable hustleSome people usin' the noodle, some people usin' the muscleSome people put it all together, make it fit like a puzzle - Talib Kewli
- Oct 23, 2004
- 22
- 10
you buy jordans to look like a basketball fan? to look like a basketball fan?
and the point about it being worn by the best player of course we cant say that anymore for what should be obvious reasons.
im not turned off by jb getting theirs and i am a first generation jordan buyer.they put out a lot of shoes i liked last year and a whole lot of shoes i didnt.i went ahead and bought the ones i liked.
in my real life (not on niketalk) i dont really run into to many people crying about the brand like i see on the computer and i know many many sneakerheads most of them have never heard of niketalk until i mention it.to be honest comparing the jordan line a 20 year MAJOR brand success business to some fly by night apparel company that has 1000 people wearing it then blows up is ridiculous.most of the jordan heads i know the only complaint was that they didnt have enough money to buy every release not that they put out so many shoes.just my 2
and the point about it being worn by the best player of course we cant say that anymore for what should be obvious reasons.
im not turned off by jb getting theirs and i am a first generation jordan buyer.they put out a lot of shoes i liked last year and a whole lot of shoes i didnt.i went ahead and bought the ones i liked.
in my real life (not on niketalk) i dont really run into to many people crying about the brand like i see on the computer and i know many many sneakerheads most of them have never heard of niketalk until i mention it.to be honest comparing the jordan line a 20 year MAJOR brand success business to some fly by night apparel company that has 1000 people wearing it then blows up is ridiculous.most of the jordan heads i know the only complaint was that they didnt have enough money to buy every release not that they put out so many shoes.just my 2
teamwhit eboy
Banned
- Nov 1, 2004
- 386
- 10
that's a direct correlation...
s...55
- Oct 23, 2004
- 22
- 10
your laughing at nothing though .they were mad at THEMSELVES for not having enough money.they werent mad at all at the releases.
- Jun 28, 2005
- 1
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everythang! ahhaa
MIKE BIBBY IS THE BEST POINT GUARD IN THE NBA
MIKE BIBBY IS THE BEST POINT GUARD IN THE NBA
- Jan 12, 2005
- 1,740
- 11
and i would see to it that the retros that come out are as close to the originals as possible. not like the traveshamockery the "cardinal" VII retro is looking like right now
"When am I gonna come to my good senses?
Probably the day Bush comes to my defenses."
- Dec 8, 1999
- 7,406
- 29,373
You completely missed the point there.
Whether we like it or not, whether we intend to or not, what we choose to wear makes a statement about us as individuals. Our likes, our sense of style, and even our personalities are reflected in the way we dress.
The Air Jordan is, obviously, rooted in the game of basketball. For years, when someone has worn the Jumpman, most people tended to infer that they were looking at someone who was at least a fan of basketball or athletics. The brand STOOD for something.
There's a difference between an isolated purchase and brand LOYALTY. If you're loyal to a brand, odds are there's a reason behind it that extends beyond sheer aesthetics.
When I wear Jordan brand gear, I of course do so because I like the individual design I've purchased - but also because I love the game of basketball and I've been a Michael Jordan fan for the majority of my life.
Let's be realistic here. There is something MORE to the brand - and to each of our individual purchases - than the intrinsic quality of each product. There are more comfortable walking shoes than Air Jordans - but most of us here wear Air Jordans for casual use. As mentioned, Fubu could put out the most attractive apparel collection in the history of mankind and virtually no one would buy it - because no one wants to wear the Fubu name anymore.
Let's say David Duke starts a Klan Klothing Kompany. They could produce the best looking and highest quality clothing in the world at a bargain price, but would you wear it? Meaning counts.
Perhaps 25% of the people on this board love a brand like abercrombie and 40% of the people on this board consider it corny and wouldn't be caught dead wearing it. That has to do with the brand's IMAGE as much, if not more, than the products they sell.
For better or worse, that's how we all understand fashion to work.
If you change your brands image, if you change the meaning BEHIND the brand, you risk alienating your core audience in attempt to expand your appeal. That strikes me as common sense.
Now, you can say, "why even care what other people are wearing, just do you" but the problem still comes back to the following question: does the brand still represent you to the point you feel comfortable representing IT? If the direction of the brand shifts to the extent that die hard fans feel it no longer applies to them - that the brand is simply taking their loyalty for granted - then I believe that constitutes a problem.
Is it a widespread problem now? Of course not.
Have they added more new fans in recent years? It would seem so.
However, is there a growing sense of dissatisfaction among many of the brand's core fans? I believe so. I see it on NikeTalk AND in real life, even among fans who know Jordans by vague description or nickname ("the hares" etc.) rather than by specific number and colorway. They sense the declining quality among retros.
The average kid on the street doesn't care about the UNDFTD IVs now, but the average kid on the street doesn't have any qualms with fake Jordans, either. However, if in 5 years the "crossover" market swells to the point where the effect of UNDFTD type products has become visible to the average kid on the street, then you have yourself an image problem that DOES have some reach.
We're on the vanguard when it comes to Jordan products. We know what's coming out 6 months from now while the average fan only knows what's out NOW. We're more attuned the nuance in a sneaker brand's direction because we follow them so closely. So, if they change their direction in a way that displeases us, eventually that sentiment may spread to others if the trend is allowed to continue. Perhaps only a small portion of fans will feel the same way, perhaps the effect will be significant.
We've been complaining about fakes for years now. Early on, people didn't consider it a major concern. Who cares if a few sneaker nerds have a tougher time buying old shoes on ebay? How does that effect Jordan? Jordan doesn't sell OGs anyway. Today, there's an enormous fake problem virtually every major metropolitan area. Its traveled up the chain pretty quickly. Its not just a sneaker fans problem anymore. Fakes are already hurting retailers and they will increasingly harm companies like Jordan brand. In many cases, fakes aren't even CONSIDERED fakes by the average sneaker consumer, but "exclusives." All of this limited release hype only makes THAT problem worse, too. Maybe that Laker AJ III was just another online exclusive.
Since we pay such close attention, we're able to pinpoint SPECIFIC problems and causes, articulating them earlier and more precisely than the mass market. Jordan brand has an image problem with regard to build quality these days. Ask the average kid on the street what, specifically, is wrong and they might tell you, "I don't know, they just feel cheaper than they used to." Ask a NT member why and you'll hear a laundry list of differences between an original product and its retro equivalent. Of course, who's even asking the average kid on the street what they think? A focus group is a completely different dynamic and sales figures only offer whether or not someone IS buying - not how satisfied or dissatisfied they are with their purchase. So, don't discount the criticism of NikeTalk members. Not every complaint here is exclusive to NT. Sometimes these issues just hurt us first.
Lets say I get fed up with Nike after 5 low quality retros or nike.com after being burned by 3 limited online exclusives. Given the buying frequency of dedicated sneaker fans, we may reach those thresholds within the course of just a few months.
Obviously there's a stronger and far more loyal core audience surrounding Jordan products than Fubu, Ecko, and the like. That said, although it would be more difficult to alienate the core consumer, the easiest way to do so is to eliminate the very foundation that has predicated loyal interest in Jordan products for the past two decades. They have a long way to go before fans like myself stop buying the product altogether, but the question is simply this: are they going in the right direction? I don't think so, and I'd rather speak on it now rather than later.
They've had 20 years of success at selling basketball-oriented products, not 20 years of success as an "urban" fashion brand and/or a hipster fashion brand. Success in one field doesn't easily translate into success in another. Anyone like that Kobe Bryant rap album?
You have to be true to yourself.
teamwhit eboy
Banned
- Nov 1, 2004
- 386
- 10
^ First off....Thug Poet was a banger....
Seriously....WHO bought that plaid JB shirt that just dropped around the same time as the Ice Blue X's? That was possibly THE single worst clothing apparel design in the history of the fashion industry. No Bill Walton. It was that bad. Then JB has the nerve to MSRP it at $70?
I can't what marketing research went into determining that I'd want to pay $70 for a white/blue/red plaid shirt that had a circle reverse plaid design that would contrast on the shirt and stand out. :x
:x
:x
:x
:x
On the subject of fakes, I've spoken with people on campus and this problem is crippling revenue. It could eventually be as damaging as the capability of the consumer to download music and not pay for songs through CD's as we used to. While it's slightly different in that the consumer is paying for a replica, the quality is ever increasing and the consumer is paying usually half of what they would for an authentic shoe. The black/cement/red IV's can be had on ebay for $50-$110 any day of the week in size 8-12, and the quality on them is surprisingly very good. I've seen many pairs up close and in person as I had the misfortune of knowing a friend at summer school last year who bought them. Other than the netting not being parallel (which will definitely be corrected shortly), the shoe was very respectable and comparable to an authentic pair.
This is costing Nike/JB millions....maybe even billions in revenue. Not only does the consumer use ebay/fake sites to make purchases, but they also equate the sometime shoddy quality of a fake jordan with the actual quality of Jordan products. If they play in a fake XI, and don't know they're fake (which, if you check the feedback of Variant Power Sellers, the amount of unknowledgeable buyers is in the tens of thousands), these people will then think that Jordans don't provide enough cushioning for their basketball needs, and would then resist buying a future Jordan product they otherwise may have purchased.
The fake problem has been around realistically for maybe 5 years, and I really believe Nike/JB waited too long to really jump on the problem from the start. Now the evolution and quality of fakes has increased so drastically over that period that Nike/JB has an enormous problem on their hands after not handling it in its early stages. It's like that time as a kid you didn't clean up your room the first day of the week and then by the end you had an amazing task ahead of you. JB now has their work cut out for them as the trouble of shutting down fakes is seemingly impossible and far more complicated than you'd think. It's not as simple as shutting down a factory. The government won't allow them to just shut an operation down because that factory is helping the economy and creating jobs for Chinese citizens. While the Nike corporation may be hurt as a result of the emergence of fakes, I'm pretty sure the job opportunities that have arisen are a positive in the eyes of the local chinese govenment.
There's far more problems that JB has to solve in the near future, some caused by themselves and others not really in their control, but I'm interested to see what more people think about this topic and feel it could be one of the more important posts in this forum in quite some time.
Almost like a state of union analysis of sorts.
I think this coupled with the overzealousness of the brand to differentiate itself by offering a wide array of clothing options are the two major problems the brand needs to address.
Seriously....WHO bought that plaid JB shirt that just dropped around the same time as the Ice Blue X's? That was possibly THE single worst clothing apparel design in the history of the fashion industry. No Bill Walton. It was that bad. Then JB has the nerve to MSRP it at $70?
On the subject of fakes, I've spoken with people on campus and this problem is crippling revenue. It could eventually be as damaging as the capability of the consumer to download music and not pay for songs through CD's as we used to. While it's slightly different in that the consumer is paying for a replica, the quality is ever increasing and the consumer is paying usually half of what they would for an authentic shoe. The black/cement/red IV's can be had on ebay for $50-$110 any day of the week in size 8-12, and the quality on them is surprisingly very good. I've seen many pairs up close and in person as I had the misfortune of knowing a friend at summer school last year who bought them. Other than the netting not being parallel (which will definitely be corrected shortly), the shoe was very respectable and comparable to an authentic pair.
This is costing Nike/JB millions....maybe even billions in revenue. Not only does the consumer use ebay/fake sites to make purchases, but they also equate the sometime shoddy quality of a fake jordan with the actual quality of Jordan products. If they play in a fake XI, and don't know they're fake (which, if you check the feedback of Variant Power Sellers, the amount of unknowledgeable buyers is in the tens of thousands), these people will then think that Jordans don't provide enough cushioning for their basketball needs, and would then resist buying a future Jordan product they otherwise may have purchased.
The fake problem has been around realistically for maybe 5 years, and I really believe Nike/JB waited too long to really jump on the problem from the start. Now the evolution and quality of fakes has increased so drastically over that period that Nike/JB has an enormous problem on their hands after not handling it in its early stages. It's like that time as a kid you didn't clean up your room the first day of the week and then by the end you had an amazing task ahead of you. JB now has their work cut out for them as the trouble of shutting down fakes is seemingly impossible and far more complicated than you'd think. It's not as simple as shutting down a factory. The government won't allow them to just shut an operation down because that factory is helping the economy and creating jobs for Chinese citizens. While the Nike corporation may be hurt as a result of the emergence of fakes, I'm pretty sure the job opportunities that have arisen are a positive in the eyes of the local chinese govenment.
There's far more problems that JB has to solve in the near future, some caused by themselves and others not really in their control, but I'm interested to see what more people think about this topic and feel it could be one of the more important posts in this forum in quite some time.
Almost like a state of union analysis of sorts.
s...55
- Dec 8, 1999
- 7,406
- 29,373
And that's what's amazing to me.
We've been saying this for over 5 years now. We talked about fakes as they relate to retro sales, diminishing consumer confidence, jordan brand CREATING demand for products (like PEs) that only variant makers successfully capitalized on. But no, it wasn't important in 1999, or 2000, or even 2001. We were largely ignored.
There was some background chatter about authentication systems, but if they couldn't find a PERFECT system, they'd just talk about it on and off without ever accomplishing anything. Nice strategy. Even a hologram on the box or tag would've been better than nothing. They can send US a cease and desist for a Jordan XVIII picture, but they can't send one to the same HUGE variant site that supplies Fabolous et al.? That's PATHETIC.
More often than not, we're the first consumers to catch these types of problems. That doesn't mean that we're always right, but our concerns as dedicated fans are at least worth taking seriously.
Many of us were listening to mp3s in 1997. We could've told record companies back then that "if this catches on, you're screwed."
Their hubris was their undoing.
- Oct 23, 2004
- 22
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Meth i admire your convictions and like i said i personally agree with most of what you said.my point is a lot like some of your points anyway.i was playing devils advocate,a role i can slip into easily and i like breaking down points a lot like you seem to.my point is/was to show jbs side and thinking.and by that they are purposely pushing the very boundaries of how much is to much and when i look around me and talk to people who buy shoes(and i sell them every day) they havent got there yet.
when i type out a paragraph here im thinking i devoted way to much of my time to this post and then you hit with a 15 paragraph answer to something i typed in about 8 seconds.so again admire your dedication to this site.id like to appologize now to the whole community for keeping "what if u have a job in jb" thread on the first page (meth,team we should have moved this discussion to another post)i cringed everytime i read that.
back to some comments though a successful business has always changed with the times.agreed a whole lot of unsuccesful ones tried and failed.to pick things out of thin air to compare-
staying true to yourself would have, say-
kept the chicken sandwich out of mcdonalds (they did alright with that)
walmart opening full grocery stores in their existing stores
nike deciding that they should make a basketball shoe even if runners might have gotten worried about the direction that would send them on.
and no i havent even heard kobes cd and i dont plan to,but i did watch the fresh prince on tv and i even liked a few of his movies.
when i type out a paragraph here im thinking i devoted way to much of my time to this post and then you hit with a 15 paragraph answer to something i typed in about 8 seconds.so again admire your dedication to this site.id like to appologize now to the whole community for keeping "what if u have a job in jb" thread on the first page (meth,team we should have moved this discussion to another post)i cringed everytime i read that.
back to some comments though a successful business has always changed with the times.agreed a whole lot of unsuccesful ones tried and failed.to pick things out of thin air to compare-
staying true to yourself would have, say-
kept the chicken sandwich out of mcdonalds (they did alright with that)
walmart opening full grocery stores in their existing stores
nike deciding that they should make a basketball shoe even if runners might have gotten worried about the direction that would send them on.
and no i havent even heard kobes cd and i dont plan to,but i did watch the fresh prince on tv and i even liked a few of his movies.
- Mar 20, 2005
- 5,240
- 4,863
Well stated
f l i n t G R E Y
holstein714
Banned
- May 17, 2005
- 11
- 10
Ild probably looking through the classifieds for a better paying job with security....
*Anybody's who's worked over the **** knows what Im talking about...*
*Anybody's who's worked over the **** knows what Im talking about...*
jordan extreme
Banned
- Dec 13, 2004
- 7
- 10
I'd flood the market with AJ 4 Whi/Cements AJ 4 Black/Red, 5 White/Red, AJ 5 Black/Silver, AJ 6 Infra-Red and AJ 11 Concords, Black/Red and Spacejams so that the fake sellers have a tough time selling on eBay.
All the fans will be happy being able to cop J's at retail and JB will make $$$$$$$$$$$$$.
I'll release more retros that are faithful reproductions of the OGs and I'll reduce the release of retros with "strange" colorways.
Stop releasing hyper-strikes like UNDFTD M-AJ4 that only a select few people can afford and access.
Then I want my designers to design the next AJ looking something like Eric Avar's classic Flightposites but with transparent uppers (like ESPOs) and see-through outsole. Need to utilise "active" shox technology where a computer adjusts the stiffness of shox column via electrical signal (like skeletal muscle tissue contracting). Computer modulates the signal strength according to the distance of the foot from ground. Distance is calculated/detected by laser sensors embedded in the midsole... retail $190
Then I'll get MJ to wear all the general release retros and AJ ?? in all his public appearances to promote Brand Jordan.
Man, I'm so good that Nike should hire me!!
Peace
Michael Jordan, the best there ever was. The best there ever will be...
All the fans will be happy being able to cop J's at retail and JB will make $$$$$$$$$$$$$.
I'll release more retros that are faithful reproductions of the OGs and I'll reduce the release of retros with "strange" colorways.
Stop releasing hyper-strikes like UNDFTD M-AJ4 that only a select few people can afford and access.
Then I want my designers to design the next AJ looking something like Eric Avar's classic Flightposites but with transparent uppers (like ESPOs) and see-through outsole. Need to utilise "active" shox technology where a computer adjusts the stiffness of shox column via electrical signal (like skeletal muscle tissue contracting). Computer modulates the signal strength according to the distance of the foot from ground. Distance is calculated/detected by laser sensors embedded in the midsole... retail $190
Then I'll get MJ to wear all the general release retros and AJ ?? in all his public appearances to promote Brand Jordan.
Man, I'm so good that Nike should hire me!!
Peace
Michael Jordan, the best there ever was. The best there ever will be...
- Mar 7, 2005
- 45
- 10
it would be a dream come true
[/b]
- Aug 2, 2004
- 23
- 10
3 pair each
b1lly hoyle
Banned
- Jan 23, 2005
- 1,830
- 10
Shox in a AJ...
:x
[/center]
KanyIZZY
formerly j o 19
- Oct 1, 2004
- 18,667
- 49,657
I WOULD PROB. EXPLODE WITH THE AMOUNT OF HAPPINESS INSIDE.
b1lly hoyle
Banned
- Jan 23, 2005
- 1,830
- 10
up
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[/center]
- May 1, 2005
- 2,669
- 835
Perfectly Said.
Straight Outta Teaneck
- Feb 28, 2005
- 43
- 10
i would just make a decent colorway that everyone will enjoy
and don`t make nothing limited or quickstrike.And get a better shoe designer to make carmelo anthony signiture shoe
so it colud at least have better accents on the shoe so they can sell just like any retro or air-jordan sneakers
and last but least
retro the only grail of all jordans
AJKO`S
LOOKING FOR A JOB AT NIKE
GET AT ME
AIM:MAILKID14,EMAIL:[email protected]
and don`t make nothing limited or quickstrike.And get a better shoe designer to make carmelo anthony signiture shoe
so it colud at least have better accents on the shoe so they can sell just like any retro or air-jordan sneakers
and last but least
retro the only grail of all jordans
AJKO`S
LOOKING FOR A JOB AT NIKE
GET AT ME
AIM:MAILKID14,EMAIL:[email protected]
- Aug 28, 2004
- 2
- 10
yes increase production make more sells who cared about limited release. its all about the consumers not the hype. its not costing jb a cent these fakes being released because no matter what they sell out or meet their quota
WANTED
xiii og white black or playoffs sz 10 nds-ds
WANTED
xiii og white black or playoffs sz 10 nds-ds
- Feb 11, 2005
- 89
- 10
good points Meth(as always). i'd actually like to know what JB made in shoes sales alone no apparel etc. maybe the money they make is so astronomical that they could care less about the sales of fakes.
or, peep this conspiracy theory
maybe nike sells fakes!!! think before you flame. if nike knows that people who can't afford a "real" stamp would stoop down and buy a lesser quality model of the same stamp wouldn't they make that money(don't forget we're talking about a business. ran by businessmen). ppl if we all live throughout different part of the country and we see the same fakes, then obviously they're being massed produced, and they're being made in the same factories as the real ones. nike makes all the loot, a monopoly if you dare
I love living in New Orleans, it's so easy to cop J's
or, peep this conspiracy theory
maybe nike sells fakes!!! think before you flame. if nike knows that people who can't afford a "real" stamp would stoop down and buy a lesser quality model of the same stamp wouldn't they make that money(don't forget we're talking about a business. ran by businessmen). ppl if we all live throughout different part of the country and we see the same fakes, then obviously they're being massed produced, and they're being made in the same factories as the real ones. nike makes all the loot, a monopoly if you dare
I love living in New Orleans, it's so easy to cop J's
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