Unpopular Opinion(s) Thread

[WASHED KING]

I just feel like if I can make a statement about someone not being able to do their job well I would be able to provide clear examples of that.

What is a “quality” teacher? How are you measuring it?

 

[friscostylez]

This doesn't make any logical sense nore is it backed by any data. The vast majority of public school teachers when compared with other professions of a similar education level are paid 23.5% less. So they can excel in the same course work in college and obtain a degree but can't do the other jobs?

Once again what is a “quality” teacher? It seems like you’re making all these statements based on feelings and bad experiences you’ve had with teachers. For that I apologize.



Police officers it makes sense. You don’t need a degree to be a police officer.

similar education level? are we holding constant for the type of degrees (stem vs non-stem), quality of school (top public, ivy, etc vs non), how well they did in their degree?

don't make me laugh b/c i know you aren't

i'm not sure defining quality is critical in the convo we are having now. i think the important point you need to takeaway is that I am willing to pay for it & don't think all teachers are bums.

from your experiences, what do you think is the % of bad quality teachers? you can define quality however you want. it appears that from statements in here, some people think it's 0% & they are bad bc they were dealt a bad hand

 

[WASHED KING]

similar education level? are we holding constant for the type of degrees (stem vs non-stem), quality of school (top public, ivy, etc vs non), how well they did in their degree?

don't make me laugh b/c i know you aren't

i'm not sure defining quality is critical in the convo we are having now. i think the important point you need to takeaway is that I am willing to pay for it & don't think all teachers are bums.

from your experiences, what do you think is the % of bad quality teachers? you can define quality however you want. it appears that from statements in here, some people think it's 0% & they are bad bc they were dealt a bad hand

I teach AP Computer Science. I’m proficient in Java, JS, Python, Visual Basic, C#, HTML, the list goes on. My first 3 years of year undergrad I was in the same courses as the Econ, Business, and Comp Sci majors. It didn’t differ until my last year of undergrad for my internship.

That’s the case for most teachers outside of elementary ed. They have to know a little bit of everything. The courses you’re taking lineup with everyone else specializing in your core subject until you get closer to graduating. You live in Cali right? Last time I checked California has one of the worst teaching shortages in the country. The reason that is, is because a lot of teachers found other jobs that paid them more AND there isn’t an influx of new talent because of the low pay.

So maybe they’re not bums who can’t get another job?

 

[tr1ll]

Y'all have more patience than me lol.

The "teahers aren't underpaid" might be the worst take I've seen on NT in about 3 years. God that was bad.

However I do have a question. What is a "good" teacher, and what is a "bad" teacher? I went back and read the last few pages and saw both of those adjectives used to describe teachers without much clarification on what is defining each.

I had a geometry teacher in the 10th grade, all she did was work equations on the over head and say whatever she was writing out loud in the most monotone voice. If we didn’t ask any questions, no additional insight was given. If someone did ask a question, she would just repeat what she said. I would always drift off daydreaming, fall asleep or just start drawing during her class. I think I ended failing and having to go to summer..which was just busy work and a test at the end.

Fast forward to my senior year and we had to take a standardized test to graduate. It was one part writing/reading comprehension and one part math. I did pretty good but failed the math portion on what was the equivalent of 1 question. They put everyone who failed in a class just for this. This teacher, frankly just had good vibes, and she made sure everyone understood the curriculum. If you didn’t get, she’d tell you another way until you did get. This lady had it down. There were times she’d explain something and the whole class would go, “ooooh”. Fast forward to the second round of the test….I hit a perfect score on it. Thats when I knew there were levels to teachers. The crazy thing about it, I had NEVER seen that lady the whole 2 and half years I was there. To drive to point further home, they my old HS into a middle school, so you know most of those teachers were phoning it in.

 

[friscostylez]

I teach AP Computer Science. I’m proficient in Java, JS, Python, Visual Basic, C#, HTML, the list goes on. My first 3 years of year undergrad I was in the same courses as the Econ, Business, and Comp Sci majors. It didn’t differ until my last year of undergrad for my internship.

That’s the case for most teachers outside of elementary ed. They have to know a little bit of everything. The courses you’re taking lineup with everyone else specializing in your core subject until you get closer to graduating. You live in Cali right? Last time I checked California has one of the worst teaching shortages in the country. The reason that is, is because a lot of teachers found other jobs that paid them more AND there isn’t an influx of new talent because of the low pay.

So maybe they’re not bums who can’t get another job?

Mr. Data Man wants to refer to only anecdotes now.


why don't you refer to how the US attracts nearly half of the teachers coming from the bottom third of their college class?


Mr. Data Man, can you provide data proving that the teachers found a better paying gig after leaving teaching?

 

[HarlemShakeStory]

Friscostylez is arguing in bad faith. Don’t waste your time. It’s not even worth a response.

 

[WASHED KING]

Mr. Data Man wants to refer to only anecdotes now.


why don't you refer to how the US attracts nearly half of the teachers coming from the bottom third of their college class?


Mr. Data Man, can you provide data proving that the teachers found a better paying gig after leaving teaching?

We just reported the lowest unemployment rate in 54 years, yet the number of teacher shortages across the country is increasing.

Where did they go? Thanos snapped them?

 

[friscostylez]

We just reported the lowest unemployment rate in 54 years, yet the number of teacher shortages across the country is increasing.

Where did they go? Thanos snapped them?

"a lot of teachers found other jobs that paid them more AND there isn’t an influx of new talent because of the low pay."

find data to directly prove that or keep it moving

 

[friscostylez]

Friscostylez is arguing in bad faith. Don’t waste your time. It’s not even worth a response.

The whole teacher are underpaid camp is arguing in bad faith but i'm sure they will keep replying or starting up the debate for whatever reason

 

[cs02132]

How much harder/more school etc is it to be a college professor vs high school? Is it worth the extra pay?
My dads been a professor for like 40 years but I have no idea how much he makes

 

[WASHED KING]

"a lot of teachers found other jobs that paid them more AND there isn’t an influx of new talent because of the low pay."

find data to directly prove that or keep it moving

You ask and you shall receive:
https://www.nytimes.com/2021/03/27/us/cov

Here’s the cliffs in case you didn’t feel like reading it.


“The number of education degrees conferred by American colleges and universities dropped by 22 percent between 2006 and 2019, despite an overall increase in U.S. university graduates, stoking concerns about a future teacher shortage.”

That was BEFORE COVID. After COVID.

“Colleges for Teacher Education found that 19 percent of undergraduate-level and 11 percent of graduate-level teaching programs saw a significant drop in enrollment this year. And Teach for America, which recruits recent college graduates to teach in low-income schools across the country, said it had received fewer applications for its fall 2021 corps compared with this period last year”

So let’s build conclusions. If you have more of something leaving. Then you have replacing it what is going to happen? A shortage. When the shortage of teachers happens you know who hurts the most? Black and brown students and people in low socio economic areas. You wanna know why? Cause all of the suburban and rich areas, cherry pick and pay the good teachers more money to get them at their school. My current school offered me 25k more a YEAR than my last.

Then you have what you call the “bum” teachers at other schools and they can’t be replaced cause what are you going to replace them with?

 

[gry60]

"a lot of teachers found other jobs that paid them more AND there isn’t an influx of new talent because of the low pay."

find data to directly prove that or keep it moving

Factors driving vacancies​

Thousands of open posts does not mean that teachers left the classroom in droves during the pandemic, researchers at Rand, Kansas State University and Brown University told The 74.


Rather, three trends are unfolding simultaneously: teacher preparation programs face declining enrollment; respect for and interest in teaching has plummeted; and most districts expanded hiring beyond pre-pandemic numbers with federal relief aid.


“It’s only in this year two, and really, in year three [of the pandemic] that we’ve seen an uptick in turnover, but nothing like a mass exodus, the attrition that we were concerned about,” Nguyen said. “The teacher supply pipeline seems to be stagnating or decreasing over time. Over the last 10 years or so there has been a substantial drop in the number of teacher candidates.”

Concerns about public disrespect, low wages and legislation restricting classroom content may help explain some of the pipeline challenges and high vacancies particularly in southern states, Nguyen hypothesized.

New Teacher Shortage Research Shows Very Different Situations Across States

First national comparison of unfilled, full-time teacher roles shows that nine states are experiencing high vacancy rates

www.the74million.org

Even articles with conservative estimates can't put lipstick on the issue of growing teacher shortages.

 

[WASHED KING]

Yes there is a bunch of old a** teachers who are boring, stuck in their ways and can’t connect with the students in any way shape or form. But you can’t get rid of them cause it’s nothing to replace them with.

The only reason I’m teaching now is because I got a scholarship ride to do it. I graduated with minimal debt. And if Bidens forgiveness goes through I will be student loan debt free. Why on earth would a student want take on the cost of college now for $40,000 a year BEFORE taxes?

It doesn’t make any sense. There isn’t enough love and wanting to be a teacher in the world to pitch to someone that you will struggle your adult life and won’t be able to enjoy the fruits of your labor.

 

[DCAllAfrican]

"Gays love harder" was the worst take on NT.

 

[Mark Antony]

If I was bored enough I would dissect that to play steezy's advocate.

 

[WASHED KING]

"Gays love harder" was the worst take on NT.

I’ll raise you “Black people skin rub off when they shower”

 

[friscostylez]

New Teacher Shortage Research Shows Very Different Situations Across States

First national comparison of unfilled, full-time teacher roles shows that nine states are experiencing high vacancy rates

www.the74million.org

Even articles with conservative estimates can't put lipstick on the issue of growing teacher shortages.

shortages will continue to allow BUMS to become teachers as it has always done

 

[DCAllAfrican]

BUMS

 

[friscostylez]

do i think ALL teachers are BUMS? absolutely not

but let's get one thing straight, our schools are infested by BUMS who are disguised as teachers

it's TIME to drain the swamp

 

[heelsandeers]

Some of these strawman arguments sound like the epitome of failed teaching

 

[friscostylez]

Some of these strawman arguments sound like the epitome of failed teaching

feel free to quote what I said & state why you think it's a strawman

 

[friscostylez]

the teacher shortage in the US has been a problem going on 50 years


if there is a shortage problem, do you think it is easier, harder, or doesn't make a difference for a BUM to become a teacher?

 

[Deleted member 212461]

I feel this way about police officers

In Canada?

 

[ahat]

"Gays love harder" was the worst take on NT.

Was that an Anton Lavey take?

 

[1995]

If teachers are so great how come I'm so stupid?