***Official Political Discussion Thread***

[Belgium]

Our minister of domestic affairs here in Belgium is currently facing 53 complaints of defamation and inciting hatred because he made a false claim that "a significant amount of muslims were cheering in the streets" after the terrorist attacks on March 22. Members of the muslim community have united and filed complaints with the justice department.
When asked to clarify his statements in parliament he failed to answer where he saw this or exactly how many "a significant amount" means. The police also disputed his statement.
It's looking pretty likely he'll be indicted on charges of defamation and inciting hatred.

If y'all had such laws in the US Trump would be getting roasted in court by now

 

[rexanglorum]

Our minister of domestic affairs here in Belgium is currently facing 53 complaints of defamation and inciting hatred because he made a false claim that "a significant amount of muslims were cheering in the streets" after the terrorist attacks on March 22. Members of the muslim community have united and filed complaints with the justice department.
When asked to clarify his statements in parliament he failed to answer where he saw this or exactly how many "a significant amount" means. The police also disputed his statement.
It's looking pretty likely he'll be indicted on charges of defamation and inciting hatred.

If y'all had such laws in the US Trump would be getting roasted in court by now

For the most part, I think that the US should have policies more akin to Northern Europe. However, on this matter, I guess I'm just too Anglo-Saxon and too American to be comfortable with the state being able to mount a criminal prosecution against people for saying things, even dumb and hateful things.

 

[ninjahood]

Prosecution for speech? No thanks europe.

 

[slighted]

why do we have to adapt the market to people. why can't the people adapt to the market.

i just don't get how people who live-and-die by the concept of a free market also want to give everyone jobs. maybe in the best most productive market only 30% of people work full time.

this isn't aimed at you, dathbgboy, by the way. just my off-the-cuff rambling on what i think is a flawed premise, especially when it's put forth by republicans, especially given their ideologies on other issues.

looking at it realistically... food and manufacturing and energy are so damn cheap these days. we don't face the same limits that our ancestors did. we don't need a dozen people working a farm to feed a family. we can probably have 1 guy with a few good machines feeding a small village by himself. service industry too will be revolutionized since now i can ask google 99% of what i need. i don't need to call someone or visit a library or ask a useless department store clerk what shoe is in style.

what jobs do we actually need? the ones that don't require skill or don't have good profit margins or can be mass-produced in a way that means the labor can't be paid well, to hell with those jobs. let the chinese produce them.

What's the alternative? What will "regular" folks do for jobs?

 

[d nice]

Hilary vs. Trump. This is definitely Hilary's race to lose. I wonder if Sander's supporters will come into the fold and put their weight behind Hilary. As for me, I'm unsure if I'll even vote this election. I always vote in my local elections so I might sit the presidential race out.

 

[RustyShackleford]

Hilary vs. Trump. This is definitely Hilary's race to lose. I wonder if Sander's supporters will come into the fold and put their weight behind Hilary. As for me, I'm unsure if I'll even vote this election. I always vote in my local elections so I might sit the presidential race out.

There are down ticket races this year too famb

 

[whywesteppin]

why do we have to adapt the market to people. why can't the people adapt to the market.


i just don't get how people who live-and-die by the concept of a free market also want to give everyone jobs. maybe in the best most productive market only 30% of people work full time.


this isn't aimed at you, dathbgboy, by the way. just my off-the-cuff rambling on what i think is a flawed premise, especially when it's put forth by republicans, especially given their ideologies on other issues.


looking at it realistically... food and manufacturing and energy are so damn cheap these days. we don't face the same limits that our ancestors did. we don't need a dozen people working a farm to feed a family. we can probably have 1 guy with a few good machines feeding a small village by himself. service industry too will be revolutionized since now i can ask google 99% of what i need. i don't need to call someone or visit a library or ask a useless department store clerk what shoe is in style.


what jobs do we actually need? the ones that don't require skill or don't have good profit margins or can be mass-produced in a way that means the labor can't be paid well, to hell with those jobs. let the chinese produce them.

What's the alternative? What will "regular" folks do for jobs?

government will provide basic needs for all. with things streamlined we can afford to give healthcare, food, and shelter to all citizens.

I think I'm borrowing some of what Rex has said at some point? But the idea being that people will still want to work if they're able. But they could pursue what they truly love since they wouldn't necessarily need to be paid a lot.

I haven't thought this out fully but my original intention is to say that I sense some hypocrisy when people talk in the same breath about championing true capitalism while also maintaining archaic jobs. (i.e. upholding capitalist principles while also trying to keep coal and manufacturing jobs here)

 

[Belgium]

For the most part, I think that the US should have policies more akin to Northern Europe. However, on this matter, I guess I'm just too Anglo-Saxon and too American to be comfortable with the state being able to mount a criminal prosecution against people for saying things, even dumb and hateful things.

Hate speech is illegal here. To be indicted you have to be pretty blatant with it and it's almost exclusively enforced on politicians or and other leadership roles.

It's kind of an unwritten rule. Technically you can file complaints on anyone but they'll be dismissed if it's not a person of importance.

 

[wubalubadubdub]

The way europe deals with offensive speech would never work in america and it shouldn't. I can't even fathom it. It's disturbing.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/apr/15/angela-merkel-agrees-prosecution-comedian-erdogan-poem

 

[RustyShackleford]

I'm against people getting charged for saying something hateful.

On the other hand, people that say hateful, ignorant, and bigoted things should be called out for that they are and stop crying being challenged.

The constitution protects your right to say something bigoted, it doesn't protect you from being called a bigot in response

 

[wubalubadubdub]

Nothing should protect you from being ridiculed, laughed at, or even getting fired in most cases. But the government stepping in to prosecute scares the hell out of me.

 

[Belgium]

The way europe deals with offensive speech would never work in america and it shouldn't. I can't even fathom it. It's disturbing.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/apr/15/angela-merkel-agrees-prosecution-comedian-erdogan-poem

That's a different law, not sure if we have it here. It forbids people from insulting an allied head of state, which is extreme imo.
There was a lot of outrage here about Merkel agreeing to the prosecution of that comedian.
I don't agree with that.

The laws against hate speech here in Belgium are only enforced on politicians or other highly influential people such as company CEOs. The average person, comedian, ... etc doesn't qualify.
Hate speech cases are actually pretty rare and almost everyone who's been indicted the past few years was an extreme-right politician making blatantly racist statements on national tv.

 

[RustyShackleford]

Here is a perfect example why this would be a bad idea in the U.S

Clowns like this : http://www.politico.com/blogs/on-media/2016/02/donald-trump-libel-laws-219866

 

[Belgium]

Here is a perfect example why this would be a bad idea in the U.S

Clowns like this : http://www.politico.com/blogs/on-media/2016/02/donald-trump-libel-laws-219866

Yeah our laws would be a disaster in the US. I think we make it work well here because we're a small country and our political system and culture is very different. The hate speech laws we have here would be abused endlessly in the US.

 

[deleted]

There's a comedian named Mike Ward who is currently awaiting a decision from the Human Rights Tribunal in Canada to see if he'll have to pay 80,000 for making jokes about a disabled kid

 

[rexanglorum]

I would certainly trust the Belgian prosecutors and the Belgian Judiciary to enforce a vaguely defined law much more than I would trust American prosecutors, especially US Federal prosecutors.

 

[wubalubadubdub]

Simply too ripe for abuse and politicization, i don't care what government body it is. Governments change. I'm not even comfortable with holocaust deniers being prosecuted.

 

[ninjahood]

The way europe deals with offensive speech would never work in america and it shouldn't. I can't even fathom it. It's disturbing.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/apr/15/angela-merkel-agrees-prosecution-comedian-erdogan-poem

Straight speech police out there in Europe

 

[zapatohead408]

Considering calling in on Tuesday and going to the Bernie Rally in Sacramento

 

[RustyShackleford]

 

[the red model]

I wish I'd gone to Howard sometimes :/

 

[ninjahood]

[Video]

 

[Master Zik]

I heard about Bloomberg ******** on ppl crying about safe spaces. He kept it real like Maher did.

 

[Nike Jordan]

I heard about Bloomberg ******** on ppl crying about safe spaces. He kept it real like Maher did.

Uppity white guys with lots of money, "keeping it real".

 

[Master Zik]

I heard about Bloomberg ******** on ppl crying about safe spaces. He kept it real like Maher did.

Uppity white guys with lots of money, "keeping it real".

Well they're talking mostly to fragile sensitive young white ppl so they're the guys to do it I guess

These are the ppl that felt offended when other students said they support Trump and cry racism or sexism when comedians come to their campus and tell jokes.

They sound like a generation of extra virginal vaginas.