Official 2017 Knicks Offseason thread, Phil Jackson gone

[kingfoamnyc]

I rather have KP camped in the paint stationary getting blocks when guards penetrate or in post up situations against bigs. Seeing him chase around the perimeter oriented 4's like the Tobias Harris' of the world is ticky tack foul central for him. Imagine if Pringles would've coached this team I know damn well Melo/KP would've been our starting PF and C. Dude would've told Phil and his cronies if you don't like it fire me.

 

[kingfoamnyc]

Anybody but the Packers or Pats. I can't root for those teams

THIS

 

[jf95]

I rather have KP camped in the paint stationary getting blocks when guards penetrate or in post up situations against bigs. Seeing him chase around the perimeter oriented 4's like the Tobias Harris' of the world is ticky tack foul central for him. Imagine if Pringles would've coached this team

I know damn well Melo/KP would've been our starting PF and C. Dude would've told Phil and his cronies if you don't like it fire me.

Can't Disagree with these points, but I could visualize foul trouble hurting KP.

Bottom line is KP is best as the "low man" alongside another PF/C who can defend smaller players on the perimeter, while also being better than KP than handling bruisers (not too many these days ) on the low block

Melo's best case scenario has always been alongside a SF/PF who could defend both spots better than him, allowing him to pick his preference night to night.

Both of our star frontcourt players are tweeners, so plugging them into one position for all their minutes hurts them. 

Hard to find a defender other than Draymond who compliments both  Melo and KP. Guys that can guard 3-5 don't grow on trees. 

If we play a wing (Pookie/Holiday) it puts more pressure on KP on the defensive end

If we play a big (Noar/KOQ) it puts more pressure on #7

 

[mjmoney23]

Side note...what happened to the Family Band? On Friday night it was just Robert Randolph. Perhaps the Family Band was responsible for the Friday Night Knicks lows??

 

[kingfoamnyc]

Our roster construction sucks balls. Sans Noah a Cole Aldrich/Nic Batum signing would've been amazing. Knicks had a hard on for Joakim since the day free agency began

 

[njavier03]

KP is still not ready to play the 5. he's getting little injuries here and there playing mainly on the perimeter. if he's going to be routinely banging down low with the likes of drummond, cousins, etc. then expect to see more DNPs bc of injury. i'm not saying he CAN'T be our 5 in the future, but just not yet. offensively, he can definitely play center right now, but defensively, he's outmatched. however, i do think that he can play center depending on the match up if the opposing 5 has a similar body type. for example, capela on the rockets isn't an opposing force and gobert on the jazz isn't even a threat offensively. drawing out gobert to the perimeter would've opened up driving lanes easily. against the likes of whiteside or cousins? HELL NO.

 

[kingfoamnyc]

Didn't know the Knicks were facing Whiteside, Cousins, and Drummond every night.

Dudes always have an excuse on why the Knicks can't match up against the opposition. How about the Knicks make the opposition match up against them ?

Exact reason why the Knicks are a dinosaur franchise in the modern style NBA.

You draft a dude who's 7 foot 3 with limitless range and biggest strength defensively is blocking shots with his length and protecting the paint

Plays him at PF

"Hes too skinny" "he'll get in foul trouble"

Meanwhile his troubles primarily come from chasing quicker and shorter guys on the perimeter which forces him to reach in a lot causing ticky tack fouls

Dude keeps his hands high and blocks shots inside with the best of them but somehow he's not ready.

Loser mentality for real

This organization is a joke. They rather protect Phil and his ego and not do the right thing (bench Noah) so he could save face.

If this organization was all about winning and putting the best product on the floor they would let Hornacek open up the offense and play fast paced and play Melo and KP at the 4/5

Period.

 

[everysingletime]

The twin towers model is outdated. It's a space and pace league and Knicks should follow suit accordingly.

If you're going to play two seven footers...the second guy better be someone like Giannis who can guard any position.

Which Rockets would you take right now... The current version or the version that rolled out Dwight and Asik :x

 

[kingfoamnyc]

Over here talking about the likes of Cousins, Drummond, and Whiteside when their teams all suck

The NBA champions center is a 6'8" dude who hustles his *** off and rebounds like his life depended on it while having the ability to successfully guard the perimeter on switches.

But we want to act like you can't be successful and win in the NBA if you don't have a back to the basket 7 ft behemoth parked in the paint taking up space

 

[njavier03]

hey kingfoamnyc do you have any position in an NBA front office or any professional coaching experience? naw, didn't think so. 90% of you dudes think you're smarter than the professionals. if so, where y'all at on the sidelines? there's a reason for everything. it's as simple as "well he's tall, he should play center". **** goes on that isn't put out the media. y'all get more frustrated than you should be bc you think you know better.

 

[you go boy]

^ i hear what your saying and it makes a lot of sense but to be honest it doesnt matter if KP plays the 4 or 5... our roster sucks period... when he got drafted i thought he was our center i mean the guy is 7"3 why make him play pf? and signing noah served no purpose if they wanted to use KP at the 5 but now with the money noah is paid they feel obligated to start him... melo is a good 4 and had a career year but hes better at the 3 defensively...he cant bang with the 4s on defense on a consistent basis... KG ripped his shoulder apart and he hasnt been the same since look at that short playoff run in 2013....

 

[floodarea]

I thought being in an all Knicks thread that we'd all be cool and friends all the time but it seems like every other day 2 of us are going back and forth with each other about the team 

 

[nick.]

Porzingis isn't strong enough yet to bang down low with guys like Monroe, Vucevic, Jefferson, etc. Honestly though, Noah isn't doing a great job on defense either.

If you're not gonna get stops on defense anyway then maximize your offense with Melo/Porzingis at the 4/5.

 

[everysingletime]

I thought being in an all Knicks thread that we'd all be cool and friends all the time but it seems like every other day 2 of us are going back and forth with each other about the team 

Its got to be the NY blood. I swear ppl are nicer to each other in the general nba thread.

 

[njavier03]

i'm not a new yorker. it's when people use phrases like "Dudes always..." or the attitude like they have the superior opinion and everything else is laughable. then act like KP playing the 5 has NEVER even been thought of by any of the FO personnel or anyone on the coaching staff. i'll say it again...there are many things that happen in any sport in any board meeting where not everything is publicized to the outside world. there is a reason why KP isn't playing the 5. is it maybe because we have to play Noah, bc he's making so much money? possibly. in fact, his height makes the weight difference even more of a disadvantage bc the heavier shorter players have a lower center of gravity and much better balance than a skinny giant. is it because KP can't take the beating of constantly having to box out a guy that's on average 30-40 lbs heavier than he is? maybe. but it's not like our FO is THAT dumb where it never dawned on him. defensively, he will get backed under the rim by 90% of centers in the league. hell, he has trouble backing down GUARDS. tall doesn't mean ****.

 

[nick.]

Sixers signed Chasson Randle

 

[d3si]

^



We waited too long

 

[kingfoamnyc]

Sixers signed Chasson Randle

^



We waited too long

Baker can't even get consistent tick. Randle would've never cracked the rotation

i'm not a new yorker. it's when people use phrases like "Dudes always..." or the attitude like they have the superior opinion and everything else is laughable. then act like KP playing the 5 has NEVER even been thought of by any of the FO personnel or anyone on the coaching staff. i'll say it again...there are many things that happen in any sport in any board meeting where not everything is publicized to the outside world. there is a reason why KP isn't playing the 5. is it maybe because we have to play Noah, bc he's making so much money? possibly. in fact, his height makes the weight difference even more of a disadvantage bc the heavier shorter players have a lower center of gravity and much better balance than a skinny giant. is it because KP can't take the beating of constantly having to box out a guy that's on average 30-40 lbs heavier than he is? maybe. but it's not like our FO is THAT dumb where it never dawned on him. defensively, he will get backed under the rim by 90% of centers in the league. hell, he has trouble backing down GUARDS. tall doesn't mean ****.

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[Master Zik]

I thought being in an all Knicks thread that we'd all be cool and friends all the time but it seems like every other day 2 of us are going back and forth with each other about the team 

Dudes been acting like they know better since Van Gundy got fired.

Every coach and GM has been dumber than them in some way and they got the answers. In all that time I think we've had one rookie head coach while other first time coaches have been in the league as assistant coaches for years.

It feels more times than not dudes got this quick fix in their heads or know the superior recipe for a roster full of bums to play like all stars or they steady pining for a what if scenario where we didn't make a trade or FA signing. Only time that wasn't in full effect was when Walsh had a "plan" that failed with no promising thought out plan B and Dolan stepped in to force a trade cuz he aint trust dude.

With all that in mind there'll be arguments within the fandom during seasons like this when the roster isn't good enough but some fans want to blame that on one single player not being a leader, or put it all on the coach, or want to ignore key failings of the roster makeup.

It happens every season/off season. We draft well, have an average free agency, make no trades or none with huge impact other than getting rid of a bum or cap relief. Then dudes are up in arms when sports analysts have us not making the playoffs or only winning 38 games or a certain seed. Now I know part of that is due to the East being the weaker conference but every season there's a coming down to reality that happens before the asb when ppl face the fact that this team is not who they thought they were.

 

[goldenchild9]

Put KoQ back in the starting lineup and like 50% of our issues improve.

He was doing a great job neutralizing opposing big men and racking up blocks. Plus he was mobile enough to run around and cover Melo x KP man.

And his offensive game was clicking.

Last couple of games he hasn't been as productive but what do you expect when you fluctuate a player's minutes like that? Especially when they're doing everything right and still get their minutes reduced.

 

[floodarea]

Here's what I think about the season so far and where we currently stand as a franchise:

1. I don't think Coach Horny is the problem in the slightest. He is a good coach and only a dysfunctional franchise like the New York Knicks could make people think otherwise. He led a terribly assembled and under talented Phoenix Suns team to nearly 50 wins a few years back. That Suns roster had no superstars or egos which is why it ran so smoothly. His players actually listened to him. Our offense is just fine, it's our defense that is the problem. Who's running the defense? Rambis. Rabbis is our NUMBER ONE problem on the coaching staff right now. He's not a good coach, never was, and never will be. Our defense doesn't go anywhere with this roster unless he's gone. Horny had ZERO control of putting him as defensive coach. That was all Phil. I also think it should be at least a little obvious that Phil is STILL trying to be a press box coach and is influencing Horny's game plans unfairly. These are still triangle-esc rotations we're playing with and these are not reminiscent of the kind of lineups Horny would play with in PHX at all. I don't think he's being given much of a freedom to do as he pleases with Phil at the helm.

2. Phil has done a decent job as a GM but in retrospect the negatives can outweigh the positives. The good he's done is getting rid of Calderon, Grant and bring in players like Courtney Lee on a good deal. Lopez, D-Will and KOQ were all also good progressive moves in a free agency where not much was available. Bringing in D. Rose for a tryout on a contract year. I've always said this and I'll take it to my grave that Phil should get ZERO credit for taking Porzingis in the draft. If we had a top 3 pick he wouldn't be here period. I didn't really have a problem with D. Fish coaching gig because he did solid until Phil started wanting to but in. Noah has set us back miles but we have to live with that now I guess. 

3. Carmelo isn't going anywhere. He's going to retire a Knick. He'll get one more deal (hopefully at a discount) after his current one is up and that'll be it. I'm okay with that. As far as I'm concerned, he deserves it. Even though he's been looking washed lately he's given his absolute all to the Knicks and we owe him that much. He's been pretty ******* good as a Knick and eventually his number is going in the rafters. The way I see it is that by the time he retires KP will be entering his prime. 

4. Baring some sort of major injury or declined play, Rose is probably our PG for the next 4 years after we strike out on CP3. That's just how it is. 

5. Going back to our awful defense. I don't think it has anything to do with our player really but again back to our schemes. IE: RAMBIS... FIRE THAT MAN!!! But it won't happen because Phil loves the guy. There is absolutely NO REASON we should be this bad on D. Our personal is full of some below average defenders but I've never seen these players look this bad in their entire careers. Lee has always been known as a good 2 way player. We have him looking scrub out there on D. Carmelo has always been sub par but we could always at least count on him for effort. Same goes for D. Rose, he just looks lost out there. Not like he's a bad defender. KP is already a little above average in my books, at least at the rim. KOQ has the ability to be a good defender. Lance Thomas IS a good defender with the right matchup. Holiday IS a good defender. BJ is ball hawking and can be great at times when his emotions call for it. Noah is bad now, I'll give us that but he still shows flashes. Kuz is decent. Billy is decent. It's all schemes man I'm telling you. Ours are awful and thats the issue. 

This team is a joke in the league right now and something has got to change quick. 

 

[ballinsam23]

If you're not gonna get stops on defense anyway then maximize your offense with Melo/Porzingis at the 4/5.

BINGO

 

[worldbeefreeg]

LOL @ oweing something to Carmelo

We paid him about 200 million, we don't owe him **** from here on out. Dude won one playoff series. One!

Look at Miami? Sorry D. Wade, your old bye, bye!

That's how good franchises run themselves.

 

[floodarea]

LOL @ oweing something to Carmelo

We paid him about 200 million, we don't owe him **** from here on out. Dude won one playoff series. One!

Look at Miami? Sorry D. Wade, your old bye, bye!

That's how good franchises run themselves.

You serious man? FOH with that ish 

He won that playoff series with a torn labrum 

Every year after that he's had a terrible squad around him and still been loyal and gave his all

D-Wade never had to deal with what Carmelo has with the Knicks 

 

[kingfoamnyc]

Anything "good" Phil has done is negated by the fact that he appointed Rambis as our defensive coach and keeps him on the staff. The fact that he handcuffs Horny and doesn't allow him to coach the team the way he wants. The fact that he criticizes Melo as a player but doesn't say a peep about the defense (our biggest problem). Dude is a hack and our main issues derive from his incompetence and ego. Horny ******* sucks at rotations and his feel for the game sometimes leaves a lot to be desired but if he didn't have these Phil shackles on his team we would be better.