Official 2017-2018 Knicks season thread

Reading this thread is making my head hurt. Frank is the youngest player in the NBA, this thing takes time. Not everyone is going to come into the league like Porzingis, not to mention that Porzingis was a year older than Frank as a rookie. If he came into the League in 2014 instead of 2015, he would probably have been a similar type of project to Frank right now but he chose to develop one more year in Europe and improve his draft stock.

I was stressing this about KP at the time (that the project label was being overstated and was more due to Euro stereotyping) and I also have stressed since the Draft that Frank, as the youngest player in the Draft with less European production than KP, would be a project with a ton of upside.

Talking about you are regretting not giving him up for Bledsoe. ****. I'd legit stop watching this ******* team if they would have dealt Frank for Bledsoe. This team isnt a winner right now. The only hope we have is to hope we can build something for the future and Frank is a huge piece to that puzzle. There are countless NBA stars who were projects coming into the League as well as countless productive rookies who didnt amount to ****. If you are going to put your faith into one thing with this sorry *** organization, let it be Frank's development.

The way some of yall are acting like Frank is a future superstar after a couple of good games to "his ceiling is Pat Beverly" after a couple of bad ones, not even 20 games into his rookie season. Relax. Not to get all Hinkie but trust the process, at least for his full season. We are 19 games in.

Also, for the record, quick glance at the 2017 NBA All-Stars here are just a couple of players' rookie stats. Keep in mind that almost none of them were 19 years old either.

Kawhi: 24 MPG, 7.9 PPG, 5.1 RPG, 1.1 APG, 1.3 SPG, 0.4 BPG, 49% FG, 38% 3PT, 78% FT
Harden: 23 MPG, 9.9, 3.2, 1.8, 1.1, 0.3, 40%, 38%, 81%
Draymond: 13 MPG, 2.9, 3.3, 0.7, 0.5, 0.3, 33%, 21%, 82%
DeAndre: 15 MPG, 4.3, 4.5, 0.2, 0.2, 1.1, 63%, 0%, 39%
Hayward: 17 MPG, 5.4, 1.9, 1.1, 0.4, 0.3, 49%, 47%, 71%
Derozan: 22 MPG, 8.6, 2.9, 0.7, 0.6, 0.2, 50%, 25%, 76%
Giannis: 25 MPG, 6.8, 4.4, 2.0, 0.8, 0.8, 41%, 35%, 68% **Most comparable to Frank because of their physical attributes, background, and was only player on this list to play rookie season at 19 years old. Also played on the worst team in the NBA**
Butler: 8.5 MPG, 2.6, 1.3, 0.3, 0.3, 0.1, 41%, 18%, 77%
Lowry: 18 MPG, 5.6, 3.1, 3.2, 1.4, 0.1, 37%, 38%, 89%
Milsap: 18 MPG, 6.8, 5.1, 0.8, 0.8, 0.9, 53%, 33%, 67%

Frank (17 games): 19 MPG, 4.6 PPG, 1.8 RPG, 3.5 APG, 1.5 SPG, 0.2 BPG, 35% FG, 27% 3PT, 64% FT

The FG% will get up there as Frank gets more comfortable but Frank is leading that list in APG and SPG already. Not to mention that there are way more examples of players like this who became all-stars/super stars despite not bursting onto the scene as rookies. I'd say it happens more often than not which is why the Draft is way more about potential than who is the most NBA ready. Especially for developing teams.

I would not be defending Frank like this unless I meant what I was saying. This isn't some homer fan spin zone. Literally nobody has an idea how a Draft will shake out after one season. I'd be saying the same thing in April, but we are less than 20 ******* games in.

Tyreke Evans won ROY in a draft class that featured Steph and Harden. He was younger than both of them also. Giannis couldnt make 1st Team All-Rookie playing 25 MPG on the worst team in the NBA during a year MCW won ROY... This isn't even just about Frank. I'd still draft Fultz #1 without blinking an eye and he has looked woeful.

Good organizations do not give up on highly drafted rookies after one season, let alone less than 20 games into that season.
 
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The "he's the youngest rookie" garbage is way overblown. He's a couple months younger, not years younger.

I still believe in the kid. I'm just worried that I've seen absolutely ZERO improvement since game 1.
 
ballinsam23 said:
The "he's the youngest rookie" garbage is way overblown. He's a couple months younger, not years younger.

I still believe in the kid. I'm just worried that I've seen absolutely ZERO improvement since game 1.
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Ok, but what players in his age group are really producing in a major way right now? DSJ, Lonzo, Markannen, and Taytum. That's about it. The only players his age really showing out right now are offensive players more suited to produce numbers in the League right away.

The other rookies currently balling are Kuzma, Mitchell and Simmons, who are all older and more seasoned. Other highly drafted rookies with more of a defensive mindset like Frank have been experiencing similar offensive struggles, including Josh Jackson, Fox, and Isaac. Even Monk has been struggling more than Frank.

The players really producing right now all have developed offensive games and were expected to produce right away. And even guys like DSJ and Lonzo have had significant struggles thus far, but have been allowed to play through it and produce because they are on losing teams and are more seasoned offensive players.

But each one of them is a defensive liability. It is tough enough to have a major impact in the NBA as a 19 year old, but Frank and others were known coming in to have offensive games that will take some time to develop.

The good news is that many players who have come into the League as defensive stoppers have since developed really great offensive games. Look at Kawhi, Jimmy Butler, Paul George, Draymond, Rondo (besides shooting obviously), Lowry, and Giannis as examples. It rarely works the other way around. Developed offensive players tend to produce more coming into the League than defensive minded players with less developed offensive games, but the defense is much harder to develop later on than offense, limiting their long-term potential.
 
I get what you're saying. I really do. It's just definitely a red flag imo when you're being outplayed by a 40 year old back up PG and have shown no improvement or even flashes since your first game.

Frank is the definition of being two years away from two years away. I didn't expect this at all because I watched him play numerous games in France. He should be way more polished (even the basics like dribbling or taking the open shot) since he played professionally for years now. Past players who played professionally since like 15 picked up the game much faster (KP and Rubio come to mind off the top).
 
He was able to blow by people in France and finish at the rim. He cannot do that at all here, handle is sloppy af and needs a screen for EVERYTHING. If he doesn't improve his handle with like 50K VC in the off-season and gain some type of burst he's gonna be a bust.
 
He doesn't necessarily need to blow by people though. Once he gets the screen is an above average passer, just needs to take the damn shot when he's open.

I think Billups is a good comparison for him.
 
kingfoamnyc said:
He was able to blow by people in France and finish at the rim. He cannot do that at all here, handle is sloppy af and needs a screen for EVERYTHING. If he doesn't improve his handle with like 50K VC in the off-season and gain some type of burst he's gonna be a bust.
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Nah he’s definitely capable, he just isn’t doing it
 
I think he has all the tools to be a very good starting point guard. Just has to do more of that to become more of a scoring threat off the PnR.
 
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