**LA LAKERS THREAD** Sitting on 17! 2023-2024 offseason begins

I am feeling exactly what atlsfinest atlsfinest is saying and the stats and history suggest this is exactly what will happen. But at the same time it’s out of my hand and as a fan of the team I will just sit back and try to enjoy the ride. I’ll let Vogel pull his hair out and Pelinka be questioned about his job. My hope is that Pelinka and co. Know about all this history too and they make an effort to ensure they build around them to maximize his game.

I will say, Shroeder spent plenty of minutes on the bench in the fourth quarter. Wonder if the same will happen to Westbrook and how will he take it?
 
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You did it, Washington.

Somehow, some way, you got off John Wall’s contract, and along the way, some stuff happened that actually helped your team.

Thursday’s trade agreement to send Russell Westbrook to the Lakers finished the job started a year ago with the Wall trade to Houston and sets up the Wizards to have the flexibility to put a real team around Bradley Beal.

Amazingly, the final cost of getting off one of the worst contract extensions in league annals was a trade of Washington’s 2023 or 2024 first-rounder, most likely, for the Lakers’ first in 2022, a year of Russell Westbrook and three middling players on halfway decent contracts who won’t negatively impact the Wizards’ short-term or long-term picture.

This is a minor miracle, to put it lightly, a liberation day for the Washington franchise. Is it possible Washington’s motto for the last 20 years — life, liberty and the pursuit of the eighth seed — can now pivot to loftier goals? Are the Wizards set up to actually become (gasp) good in two or three years?

It sure seems like that may be possible now. Washington turned Westbrook’s contract — one that pays him $44 million next year and $47 million the year after — into the expiring deal of center Montrezl Harrell and the far less toxic contracts of Kyle Kuzma (starting a three-year, $39 million extension) and Kentavious Caldwell-Pope (owed two years, $26 million, only $16 million of which is guaranteed).

In a related transaction, Washington also received the 22nd pick from the Lakers and turned it into the 31st pick and guard Aaron Holiday from Indiana. Washington will also land a small trade exception worth $4.5 million and sent second-round picks in 2024 and 2028 to L.A.

Immediately, then, the Wizards cut $31 million from their payroll in 2022-23 (if they waive Caldwell-Pope), a scenario that potentially leaves them with $25 million in cap room for that season.

More importantly, it gives the Wizards the flexibility to operate under the luxury tax and build the rest of the roster around Beal and a cohort of young players who will get to actually touch the basketball this season instead of watching the Russ show. With several middle-class contracts to use in future trades, a cohort of four young forwards in Corey Kispert, Deni Avdija, Rui Hachimura and Kuzma, a developing center in Daniel Gafford and the offensive brilliance of Beal, it’s possible to see brighter days ahead in the nation’s capital.

Filling Westbrook’s high-usage shoes may result in a half-step back this season. Washington still needs to acquire a starting point guard for the coming season but has enough room below the tax line to use its full midlevel exception on whoever falls the cracks in the initial blast of free agency; alternatively, the Wizards could trade for one from their wing surplus with either Kuzma, Caldwell-Pope or Davis Bertans.

For any time frame longer than the immediate future, however, the Wizards seem to be in much better shape. One prays the Wizards will use this manna from heaven dividend taking chances in pursuit of excellence rather than repeating the missteps of the past two decades by continually running it back with veterans in a desire for guaranteed averageness.

The lingering question, of course, is how this impacts Beal’s desire to stay in Washington beyond this season, but I have to think if he’s looking at the time frame of his next contract, he should be very encouraged by this trade. And if for some reason he’s not, the Wizards improved their post-Beal future just as much.

As for the Lakers, I would have much rather seen them target Buddy Hield, even though Westbrook is clearly a better player. The issue with this trade from the Lakers’ perspective is that while Westbrook is the large, shiny object, the biggest name they could have acquired, he’s not the player who best fits around LeBron James and Anthony Davis. Not even close, actually. The Lakers went Hollywood here instead of thinking about their best postseason roster.

Westbrook is a tremendous shot creator but a poor shooter, and as a result tends to be much more of a “floor raiser” than a “ceiling raiser.” Let’s start with the positive: He can help the Lakers a lot in the regular season as a secondary shot creator, the role Dennis Schröder struggled to fill a year ago, and that will be especially useful if James needs to miss some games. The non-LeBron minutes will definitely be better.

Unfortunately, for a team that’s all-in for the title this year, Westbrook likely hurts that pursuit when you look at playoff lineups. When the ball is in LeBron’s hands, as it inevitably will be, or Davis has the ball on the block, opponents aren’t going to guard Westbrook on the perimeter. Hield’s knock-down shooting was actually far more threatening in that context.

Additionally, the Lakers used all their chips here. Kuzma and the 22nd pick in the draft were all the capital the Lakers had left to improve the team, as their future picks are all committed to the Pelicans from the Davis trade. L.A.’s willingness to take on any amount of money was its other “asset” here, and it sure as heck used that (more in a minute) but could have done so in a way that meshed better with the Lakers’ two most talented players.

Also, the Lakers still have to build out the rest of their team. Do you realize they only have four players right now? Westbrook, James, Davis and Marc Gasol are the entire team. Alfonzo McKinnie is on a non-guaranteed deal that is unlikely to be picked up.

The Lakers need a starting shooting guard and a starting center, most notably, and only have their taxpayer midlevel exception and whatever they can muster in the sign-and-trade market to fill those spots.

The good news is that by trading for Westbrook rather than acquiring a player via sign-and-trade, the Lakers can spend far in excess of the luxury tax apron … and man, will they ever. Just using the taxpayer MLE and filling out the rest of the roster with minimum contracts would send them $10 million into the tax. However, the Lakers will blast far beyond that number when they likely re-sign Alex Caruso and Talen Horton-Tucker, and one suspects they’ll try to use the likely departing Schröder in a sign-and-trade to bring back either another player or a large trade exception. When all is said and done, the luxury-tax check they write to the league could approach $100 million.

And they’re pretty much stuck now. Flexibility-wise, the Lakers are an 80-year-old man. It’s going to be awfully hard for the Lakers to do much work in-season, or even next offseason, with no first-round draft picks to access in a trade until 2027 and, most likely, no large expiring contracts. At the end of pushing all their chips in, the Lakers are basically stuck for the next two years paying a heavy luxury tax for a Westbrook-James-Davis triumvirate that is an iffy fit and notably short on shooting.
 
atlsfinest said:
Bro, what are you talking about? Have you actually watched Russell Westbrook in the playoffs? He's played with Prime Durant and Harden (twice) and he's still out there wilding in the playoffs shooting sub 40%. You think he's going to change his game now? 😂

I know some of you guys are trying to be optimistic but we need to accept that this is a terrible move. I hope I'm wrong but I don't see how this improves our team in the playoffs.

In the regular season, I think Westbrook might help because he can dominate second units and be a playmaker when LeBron is on the bench but come playoff time when LeBron is playing 40+mins a game I don't see what Westbrook brings to the team.

Also, you guys don't want Russell Westbrook to be the primary ball handler in crucial moments of playoff games. If you watch him play, he's prone to jacking up terrible jumpers and turning the ball over in pivotal moments. I wouldn't be surprised if Westbrook is on the bench in the closing moments of playoff games because LeBron will have the ball in his hands and Westbrook can't shoot and doesn't move off ball.
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Different teams & different roles, i don't expect Russ to completely change his game but he's also not going to be doing the things he was doing in OKC with Bron & AD on the floor. This Trio is the best Trio He's been apart of, & we've seen him reach the finals & WCF when he doesn't have to take on so much responsibility.

Again there is a HUGE difference between Paul George/Harden vs Lebron & AD, especially both of them on the court at once. I would look more towards Russ runs with KD as how things will go but to a lesser extent. He was nowhere near as reckless then as he has been the past few years. Again because he had less responsibility.

if the front office fills things out right this becomes a much less weird fit. AD has to do the right thing & take his place as the best "Small Ball" 5 tho
 
All the doom & gloom is unnecessary.


Schroder played like ****. Kuzma played like ****. KCP played like ****. Drummond & Trez didn't even play. 3pt shooting was bad. We need shooters etc. etc.


But, if AD wouldn't have gotten hurt, 9/10 the Lakers are in the finals trying to repeat. I don't understand all the apprehension when in actuality the only real limitation to this team since Bron got there has been health. The rim pressure they had in 2020 was way more important than they're lack of shooting.

I been saying it for three years. I understand fit and chemistry, but talent trumps all. This was a power move. Now lets see how they fill out the rest of the roster andd enjoy the show. The trade can't be complete until the 6th. I hope that means Schroder's moving somewhere and other peices are coming in return but we;ll have to wait and see.

Honestly Pelinka/Bron/Klutch hasn't really failed yet so I don't understand the panic. Last year's moves were great too.
 
The half full way I'm looking at it- Russ is an obvious upgrade from Dennis. Kuz can't find his identity here. Trezz is unplayable in playoffs. The pick wouldn't be in the rotation this year. Brons getting old so it's a strike when the iron is hot situation.

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All i wanted was Zo to come home and keep KCP :frown:
 
Atlanta needs a backup PG, Schroeder played there before....

who says no to Gallo/Redish for Dennis & two seconds or THT
 
Trez really played himself...dah well.

Gotta keep AC. THT can go.

I hope we can bring Dwight and Javele back. We need rim runners.

Wes Matthews and Kieff back on vet deals.

We gonna be alright. Can't wait for this season.
 
Lizakers said:
Why AD at center? Won’t he just get hurt more banging with bigs?
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Need a lob threat, reportedly he's changed his stance on playing it more. Space for driving lanes for Russ, these players aren't dumb they know each others strengths and at least are saying the right things so far.
 
Lizakers said:
Why AD at center? Won’t he just get hurt more banging with bigs?
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Because we have to create some type of spacing. We can't roll out there with a lineup of Westbrook, THT, LeBron, AD and Dwight. They're going to be five defenders standing in the paint on every possession. If we play a traditional, non-shooting center defenses are going to play us like this



No room to drive, no one to kick the ball to and no space for AD to post up. I understand the defensive concerns because of the wear and tear on AD but offensively, playing with a traditional center would be a mess. This is another reason why this trade for Westbrook makes no sense
 
MVP said:
Need a lob threat, reportedly he's changed his stance on playing it more. Space for driving lanes for Russ, these players aren't dumb they know each others strengths and at least are saying the right things so far.
Click to expand...

But here's the thing, Westbrook is stupid! I trust LeBron and AD completely but we have a dozen years of evidence that Westbrook is unwilling or unable to adapt his game to fit players around him. He literally played with prime KD and still took more shots and waved him off, you think he's going to act we asked to LeBron and AD?
 


Russell Westbrook traded to Lakers: What happened behind the scenes, what it means for Bradley Beal and Wizards

Shortly after the Washington Wizards’ season ended with a first-round playoff loss, general manager Tommy Sheppard dropped a hint of what was to come.

“This is not a run-it-back team,” he said.

Now, it’s official. Changes are arriving. Big ones.

Just before Thursday’s NBA Draft, the Wizards and Lakers agreed to a deal that will send Russell Westbrook to Los Angeles for Kyle Kuzma, Kentavious Caldwell-Pope, Montrezl Harrell and the No. 22 pick, sources told The Athletic. Washington also will route a 2024 and a 2028 second-round pick to L.A. The swap won’t become official until the start of free agency on Aug. 6.

As Bradley Beal spent the last few weeks mulling his future with the organization, as The Athletic previously reported, Westbrook also was deciding his own. The former MVP, who is from the L.A. area, spent parts of the offseason discussing the possibility of teaming up with four-time champion LeBron James and eight-time All-Star Anthony Davis. Westbrook had a growing desire to join James and Davis in Los Angeles to compete for a championship, sources said. He formally informed the Wizards of his desires recently, according to sources: if they could find a trade that works, Westbrook wanted to go to the Lakers.

They landed on one.

Washington executed the deal with no issues from Beal, per sources. The three-time All-Star, who is entering the final season of his contract, has expressed no desire to leave the Wizards, according to sources. As speculation about his future has swirled, the team remains confident it can keep him for the long term. The Wizards can offer him a four-year, $180 million extension in October, but if he waits until 2022 free agency, he can sign a five-year contract for an estimated $235 million to return to Washington.

One of the main reasons Westbrook wanted to come to D.C. when the Wizards traded John Wall for him in December was the presence of head coach Scott Brooks, who coached the former MVP from 2008-15 in Oklahoma City. But the Wizards did not retain Brooks when his contract expired at the end of the 2020-21 season despite Westbrook’s outspoken recommendation that they should.

Westbrook preferred a more established coach to replace Brooks, according to sources. The Wizards eventually hired former Nuggets assistant Wes Unseld Jr., whose résumé includes 16 years as an NBA assistant and eight more as an advance scout.

The Lakers set an offseason goal to acquire an elite playmaker next to James and Davis. They deemed Westbrook worthy. He averaged a triple-double during his one season in D.C., the fourth time in five years he’s done so. Many in the Wizards organization praised him for how he changed the team’s culture and work ethic. He will turn 33 years old at the start of next season and has two years and $91 million remaining on his contract.

The Wizards believe the package from the Lakers improves their depth. They view Caldwell-Pope, one of Beal’s closest friends in the league and the type of player they have sought after for years, as their next starting small forward. Washington went into the offseason hoping to improve its defense and long-range shooting. Caldwell-Pope can guard the perimeter physically and is versatile. He sank 41 percent of his 3-point attempts last year.

He will reposition 2020 first-round pick Deni Avdija to the bench, the Wizards’ preferred spot for the 20-year-old as he returns from a fractured fibula.

The trade gives Washington more roster flexibility, too. Westbrook has a couple of seasons remaining on a supermax contract. Breaking his deal into three middling ones could make it easier for the Wizards to pull off trades for more reasonable salaries.

Harrell is only one year removed from winning NBA Sixth Man of the Year and averaged 13.5 points per game for the Lakers last season, but he fell out of their rotation during the playoffs. Kuzma has improved as a defender and shot 36 percent from beyond the 3-point arc in 2020-21. Both create redundancies on what’s now an imbalanced roster.

Renovations are coming — especially at point guard, where the team has an obvious, Westbrook-sized hole.

Sources say to keep an eye on 28-year-old free agent Spencer Dinwiddie, who missed most of last season with a torn ACL but averaged 20.6 points per game in 2019-20. The Wizards are above the salary cap but could try to negotiate a sign-and-trade with Dinwiddie’s incumbent team, the Nets. The other pieces from the Westbrook trade, Harrell and Kuzma alone, would not be enough for Brooklyn to accept a Dinwiddie deal, according to a source. Dinwiddie is expected to receive interest from several teams, including the Nets, Knicks, Heat and Raptors, sources said.

The Wizards made a smaller move for a point guard Thursday, flipping the No. 22 pick, which they received in the Westbrook trade, to the Pacers for fourth-year guard Aaron Holiday and No. 31, which netted them 19-year-old stretch 4 Isaiah Todd. Washington grew enamored with Holiday when he worked out for them before the 2018 draft and actually tried to trade for him a year ago.

That wasn’t all. The Wizards’ Thursday night also included selecting 22-year-old sharpshooter Corey Kispert with the No. 15 pick, which gives them another 3-point threat. Kispert, who made 44 percent of his long-range attempts last season at Gonzaga, was the top shooter on the Wizards’ list and No. 10 on their draft big board, a source said. Sheppard mentioned in a news conference that the Wizards explored trading up for him before taking him 15th.

Washington is now capable of loading lineups with shooters, something it seriously struggled with in 2020-21 when it neither made nor took many 3-pointers. It finished 23rd in 3-point percentage and 29th in 3-point rate (the percentage of their field-goal attempts that came from beyond the arc). Now, it can piece together units with Beal, Kispert, Davis Bertans, Thomas Bryant and whomever it has at point guard. Caldwell-Pope will fit in there, too. The Wizards now have 3-point menaces.

If Dinwiddie does not end up in D.C., options remain. This summer’s free agency class is rich with capable point guards — from top-flight ones (who are not realistic for Washington), like Chris Paul, Mike Conley and Kyle Lowry to more reasonably-priced ones, like Reggie Jackson, Patty Mills, Cameron Payne and Devonte’ Graham, amongst others. A reunion with free-agent Raul Neto, who spot-started for the Wizards last season, is a possibility, sources say.

They can use the mid-level exception, worth up to $9.5 million, to sign free agents. The Westbrook and Holiday trades, which shave more than $5 million from their payroll, give them extra room to operate below the luxury tax line. They also created an $8.5 million trade exception in the Westbrook deal, which they can use to trade for a player who makes up to $8.6 million (yes, it’s confusing, but that’s not a typo) without having to match salaries in the exchange.

For now, the roster is unbalanced. But moves are coming. Teams can begin speaking to free agents on Aug. 2.

The Wizards have 15 players under contract. But with Westbrook gone and both Neto and Ish Smith hitting free agency, they have only one point guard in Holiday, a 24-year-old who was a backup in Indiana last season and projects to hold a similar role in 2021-22.

They have a logjam of 3/4 types. Rui Hachimura, Avdija, Bertans, Kuzma and Chandler Hutchison all overlap in some way or another. Kispert could fit into this player type, too. They’re adding the second-rounder Todd to the mix too. Power forward Anthony Gill and wing Caleb Homesley are under contract but are non-guaranteed for 2021-22.

They have another crowd at center with three players who warrant playing time: Bryant, Harrell and Daniel Gafford — though Bryant will miss the beginning of the season as he continues to recover from the ACL he ruptured in January. The Wizards hope he can return by December, according to a source, though it’s difficult to lock in a specific return time this far out.

But this is not what the roster will look like at the start of the season. The Wizards, after all, were not a run-it-back team. And now, they are officially not running it back.
 
MVP said:
Let me guess without even reading Hollinger, Wizards are fantastic for getting outta salary cap hell. Show should have went for Buddy. He's been a hack. Pretty sure he trashed every move we've done over the last 2 seasons.
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Yup

He did say green was underrated and that Shroeder was overrated. He was right

he did say Kuzma sucks. He was right.

can’t hate on his BS being right so far. Hope not this time
 
atlsfinest said:
But here's the thing, Westbrook is stupid! I trust LeBron and AD completely but we have a dozen years of evidence that Westbrook is unwilling or unable to adapt his game to fit players around him. He literally played with prime KD and still took more shots and waved him off, you think he's going to act we asked to LeBron and AD?
Click to expand...
Let’s just wait and see lol

maybe the years or losing and being passed around like a bottle of courvoisier after 13 years and his age will give him perspective lmao

plus maybe he respects Bron enough. Compared to James and kd where they came in together as peers
 
It’s ok to be optimistic

But it’s also ok to be pessimistic in this scenario.
We cannot ignore history. And people don’t generally change. Especially in year 13.

it’s possible. I’ll hang onto the possibility.

but let’s all stop judgment til Monday night. Let’s see what else is in store.

Caruso
ThT
Shroder
Vet min guys

huge implications coming up. Let’s wait.
 
This **** really like some twilight zone remix version of the Heatles lmao

and the shooting always sounds good until the come here and forget how to shoot
We also just seen Joe Harris get guarded like westbrook by the Bucks in the playoffs lol
 
atlsfinest said:
But here's the thing, Westbrook is stupid! I trust LeBron and AD completely but we have a dozen years of evidence that Westbrook is unwilling or unable to adapt his game to fit players around him. He literally played with prime KD and still took more shots and waved him off, you think he's going to act we asked to LeBron and AD?
Click to expand...

KD and PG had their best years individually playing with him. KD was as much as fault for them not getting it done in OKC as Russ was. I'm not going to sit here and say Russ' decision making at times is beyond reproach but cause that'd be a lie, but to say he's a stupid player and won't adapt is just silly before you've even seen them step on the floor together.
 
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