- Dec 8, 1999
- 7,429
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If you believe that Harris is bad, but Trump is worse, why do something that will help the “monster” get elected? Who benefits from that?“genocide must stop. kamala is complicit”
“yea yea yea…but remember trump moved the embassy to jeruselam” (which biden didn’t undo lol)
not sure that’s the burn you guys think it is
if it makes you feel better i don’t live in a swing state so my stein vote won’t be more than a protest vote (unfortunately). if i did live in a swing state id still vote for stein.
if you don’t vote for stein, you’re anti-semetic
If you can’t honestly answer that by yourself, then you’re parroting a thought that isn’t yours for reasons you can’t explain.
I get the point that people who invoke this metaphor are trying to make, but in this context I’ve yet to see it accomplish anything other than come off as callous and detached.I have to partially disagree there. The point of the trolley problem metaphor was to illustrate the absence of logic in pro-Palestine Jill Stein voters or abstainers.
The trolley symbolizes the uncomfortable reality that inaction does not make any logical sense and can result in the worst outcome for a position, in this case the fate of the Palestinians.
The problem is of course as simple as Trump undisputably being far more pro-Israel than Kamala and the Democrats. Yet there are single issue pro-Palestine voters choosing inaction, which could lead to the worst outcome for the Palestinians. Inaction directly contradicts the Pro-Palestine stance.
That's what the trolley metaphor was for. To show that inaction (third party voting or abstaining) has no logical basis and that it may contribute to an even worse fate for the Palestinians.
It's rather obvious why DLF didn't want to answer the trolley question.
He'd be faced with the unfortunate reality that inaction has absolutely zero basis in logic and is arguably anti-Palestine.
Voting for Jill Stein isn't going to change anything. Those are the actions of someone blinded by privilege and unwilling to deal with an uncomfortable reality.
Voting third party while proclaiming to be a single issue pro-Palestine voter is patently absurd. I do view that as an anti-Palestine position, albeit not maliciously but under the delusion of privilege and unwillingness to confront an uncomfortable reality.
Misapplying it to this situation frames Palestinian genocide as either a lost cause or “acceptable casualties” relative to the greater good, which is repugnant. It’s not an argument you’d try to make (or be receptive to) if it were your loved ones tied to the tracks.
It’s also overcomplicated. You don’t need to use it to make the argument that inaction is not innocence and complacency is complicity. That’s one the driving messages of the ongoing protest movement.
It’s far more effective and direct to simply extend these same principles to blocking a Trump administration that anyone paying attention would agree would make an already unbearable situation even worse.
If your top priority truly is to reduce - by any amount and by any means - the suffering, you’d be using your vote for that very real, exigent purpose and not for symbolism or spite. No small number of people died in the first Trump presidency who might otherwise still be with us.
People don’t protest members of the Biden Administration or the Democratic Party because they’re all Russian/Republican plants. Many do so because they KNOW Trump and Republicans do not care and they feel that Vice President Harris/Democrats are comparatively persuadable.
94 Congresspeople have called for a ceasefire. ALL of them are Democrats. If elected, Harris will need their support to fully enact her agenda. Trump will not.
Even if you for some reason don’t care about anything else (climate change, healthcare, police brutality, affirmative action, Social Security, immigration, protecting the rights to bodily autonomy and no-fault divorce, preventing “Moms for Liberty” types from gutting libraries and policing bathrooms in their crusade against LGBTQ Americans, etc. etc. etc.) we are undeniably better off with an administration we CAN protest vs. one that has proven in both word and deed their intent to deport, criminalize, and brutalize nonviolent protesters.
Simply put: you don’t need hypothetical thought experiments to explain why abetting White Christian Nationalism in the United States is a bad idea.