IS KOBE BRYANT...OVERRATED?

[tennhouse2]

My point is, when is it EVER Kobe's fault.  From you dudes perspective Kobe is "such a great player"..........he's this, he's that.  When does he ever get the blame for his team coming up short as the leader of the team?? When it comes to Kobe, it's always somebody else and never him..........in more ways than one.

Nobodys ever saying kobes never shot the team out of winning games or has played to selfish at times, but to try and blame kobe for the teams lack of success for a season or playoff series is crazy considering there's no way the lakers would have ever reached that point without him

Like the example you tried to use, how could we blame kobe for the team not playing well so far? He's been playing by far the best basketball of anyone on our team, if he wasent out there wed be playing far worse

 

[alphawolf]

While it may be flawed, it still is used as a measurement by ad companies to determine how to move promote and move product, and it is efficient enough for the NBA to continue to use it as well. So your opinion does not trump that of David Stern, who continues to use it in negotiations.

So perhaps there is no one more misinformed than you.

Intentionally misinformed, actually.

The score is 234 to 59. Deal with it. And just like Kobe, your shooting percentage is horrible.

Always the fall back when accurate Kobe discussions arise. 

You are not built for real life.

What do you guys do when you do not have a report button to rely upon when someone disagrees with you, hide indoors?

So if you said Neilsen rating show NBA declined over the years then why did David Stern said the NBA grew faster than ever over the past 10 years. If he rely on Nielsen Rating then why you said Neilsen rating show that NBA is down but David Stern said it is growing faster than ever?

Are you contradicting yourself?

If you do a quick look up on Nielsen Rating. The way the conduct their rating is by taking a voluntary small sample let's say 10% out of the market. They have no ideas on the other 90% of the market.

Everyone know damn well that since the 2000s the NBA have grown faster than any other past decades.

The number of jersey sale internationally is another example of this

So for you to say that Nielsen rating speak for the whole basketball market is just flat out wrong and that's why you're ignorant

Since the end of MJ era. The NBA have grew not decline.

 

[curbsideprophet]

I'll just leave this here...

 

[longstroke]

So if you said Neilsen rating show NBA declined over the years then why did David Stern said the NBA grew faster than ever over the past 10 years. If he rely on Nielsen Rating then why you said Neilsen rating show that NBA is down but David Stern said it is growing faster than ever?

Are you contradicting yourself?

If you do a quick look up on Nielsen Rating. The way the conduct their rating is by taking a voluntary small sample let's say 10% out of the market. They have no ideas on the other 90% of the market.

Everyone know damn well that since the 2000s the NBA have grown faster than any other past decades.

The number of jersey sale internationally is another example of this

So for you to say that Nielsen rating speak for the whole basketball market is just flat out wrong and that's why you're ignorant

Since the end of MJ era. The NBA have grew not decline.

The reason Stern MIGHT have said what you claim he has said about the current state of the NBA, is to keep the shareholders happy. It's just like with Nike saying that Kobe's shoes sold well, meanwhile they've, Nike, as a company, recently posted six consecutive low earnings, over the past six quarters.

Stern isn't going to come out and say, you know, the players that we have right now, suck. They are soft, and the guy that is supposed to be one of  the best, while in one of the largest markets, is a complete jackass because he can't get along with others, including his coach that he recently allowed to get fired.

So those who are in marketing look at those Nielsen ratings, and when they sit down with Stern, they use it as leverage to get a better deal on advertising during NBA games.

So no, I am not contradicting myself, you simply fail to comprehend and then understand, business.

Probably, more than likely, you simply refuse to understand.

 

[longstroke]

My point is, when is it EVER Kobe's fault.  From you dudes perspective Kobe is "such a great player"..........he's this, he's that.  When does he ever get the blame for his team coming up short as the leader of the team?? When it comes to Kobe, it's always somebody else and never him..........in more ways than one.

Repped big time. 

For that comment, if I could rep you more, I would.

 

[powerballin]

Funny how a guy is in his mid 30's and still an elite player putting up great numbers gets so much negative energy.Just say you don't like him as a person even tho you don't know him but when it comes to basketball hes one of the best to ever lace them up and any person who has been involved with basketball at a high level will tell you so.

 

[longstroke]

Funny how a guy is in his mid 30's and still an elite player putting up great numbers gets so much negative energy. Just say you don't like him as a person even tho you don't know him but when it comes to basketball hes one of the best to ever lace them up and any person who has been involved with basketball at a high level will tell you so.

There is a long list of transgressions, all of which have to do with basketball, never mind his off court dalliances with controversy.

Where should I begin?

 

[alphawolf]

The reason Stern MIGHT have said what you claim he has said about the current state of the NBA, is to keep the shareholders happy. It's just like with Nike saying that Kobe's shoes sold well, meanwhile they've, Nike, as a company, recently posted six consecutive low earnings, over the past six quarters.

Stern isn't going to come out and say, you know, the players that we have right now, suck. They are soft, and the guy that is supposed to be one of  the best, while in one of the largest markets, is a complete jackass because he can't get along with others, including his coach that he recently allowed to get fired.

So those who are in marketing look at those Nielsen ratings, and when they sit down with Stern, they use it as leverage to get a better deal on advertising during NBA games.

So no, I am not contradicting myself, you simply fail to comprehend and then understand, business.

Probably, more than likely, you simply refuse to understand.

The reason ad companies are coming to negotiate with David Stern is because how big the NBA have become dude.

And you said my opinion don't hold up to David Stern but then you have the authority to question his opinion and speak for him?

Which is it dude? You're contradicting yourself all over the place.

Are you working for David Stern?

By the way. Here's a recent report on the basketball market by Forbes.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/aliciaj...nbas-international-viewership-and-popularity/

The surge of international interest that the NBA has seen in recent years is arguably driven by a number of factors.  First, in the off-season, coaches, players and team personnel travel overseas to promote basketball and the NBA through various goodwill clinics and events.  The growth of interest in the sport has also caused the NBA to open offices in 15 international markets.  Additonally, team rosters are largely made up of international talent.  Approximately 20 percent of the league’s players are international, as 79 international players are on team’s rosters.  Four of the league’s international players play for teams competing in this year’s Finals:  Oklahoma City’s Serge Ibaka (Congo) and Thabo Sefolosha (Switzerland), and Miami’s Ronny Turiaf (France) and Joel Anthony (Canada).  

When asked specifically what is driving international interest in the NBA, Heidi Ueberroth, NBA President, International provided the following insight:

“It’s all about the game.  The Playoffs were incredible, and The Finals match-up features All-Star players that are known worldwide.  Basketball’s popularity is at an all-time high.  Fans want to see the very best compete and what’s unique in our sport is that the best players in the world play in a single league.  Basketball is the number-two sport globally with an estimated 500 million people playing the game.  We work with FIBA, the governing body of basketball, and local federations on developing the game at the grassroots level.  We believe our joint efforts to encourage participation helps bring fans to the game.”

And here's direct quotes from NBA coaches, players and David Stern

http://www.nba.com/2012/news/10/26/nba-international-growth.ap/index.html

Erick Spoelstra and David Stern

Commissioner David Stern has talked for years about the prospects of more NBA games, possibly even teams, abroad. On Thursday, Stern announced his plan to step down in 2014, but it's certain that at least some - probably quite a bit - of his remaining tenure will be spent on laying more groundwork for the league to keep evolving internationally.

"Look, if you said 10 years ago that we were going to be playing regular-season games in Europe, I would have probably said, `Not a chance,"' Miami coach Erik Spoelstra said. "And last year they played two games over there. So anything's possible. The fan base continues to grow over there. It's cool to be part of a league that has become so global."

The numbers are eye-popping. The league's games are now shown in 215 countries and territories. The NBA says a total of 114 games have been played in 32 international cities across 17 foreign countries since 1988. Through social media, the league says it engages 320 million fans - that's more than the entire U.S. population - across the globe, and seems to put the NBA at the front when it comes to interest internationally among the four major U.S. leagues.

Stern says international potential is an area "of extreme importance" for the league, which is clear. The NBA has a newly opened office in Brazil, which will play host to the World Cup in 2014 and the Olympics in 2016. There's an NBA office in Mumbai now, for the growing market in India. And Stern said he wasn't even sure the league would be able to respond to all the requests from firms there to do business with the NBA.

"It's the reality of the game," Stern said. "There has been enormous improvement in the quality of the basketball around the world. In the London Olympics on 11 of the 12 teams, we had 59 current or former NBA players. That just speaks to the quality of the international competition. The quality being that international players make our game better by playing in the NBA, and then they return to play for the national teams."

Tyson Chandler

"I think it is a good thing," Chandler said. "I think the game is slowly turning into a global game. I think it's good for everybody. It's good for the fans over there, it's good for the game, it's good for players as well, as long as it's done correctly."

Lebron James

"Every time I go to another country, I'm always amazed by where the game's going," James said. "I think the interest in our game just keeps growing. You're talking about billions of people in this world, and a lot of people know the NBA."

I can post more quotes from multiple NBA players and executives on the state of the NBA and how it have grown over the the past 10 years.

So i guess the NBA players , coaches, and David Stern all lied about the state of the NBA over the past 5-10 years?

Hmm.

Look like you either have been living under a sewer or just flat out in denial.

David Stern lied to keep shareholder happy? LOL Yea right. You do realize the majority of shareholders are not stupid right? These are multi millionaires. CEO and such. They know exactly what's going on in the world and what they're investing in

You're talking like you know it all but you really don't know much at all. Bluffing is what you do best

 

[alphawolf]

Here's another report of the amount of NBA jersey sold worldwide.

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/blog/eye-on-basketball/19396795

The NBA released its top jersey sellers internationally on Thursday, with Kobe Bryant coming in number one overall, and as the top seller in China, Europe, and Latin America. Here's the complete list, courtesy of the NBA.

1. Kobe Bryant, Los Angeles Lakers
2. Derrick Rose, Chicago Bulls
3. LeBron James, Miami Heat
4. Kevin Garnett, Boston Celtics
5. Dwight Howard, Orlando Magic
6. Dwyane Wade, Miami Heat
7. Rajon Rondo, Boston Celtics
8. Carmelo Anthony, New York Knicks
9. Blake Griffin, Los Angeles Clippers
10. Kevin Durant, Oklahoma City Thunder
11. Pau Gasol, Los Angeles Lakers
12. Dirk Nowitzki, Dallas Mavericks
13. Amar'e Stoudemire, New York Knicks
14. Tony Parker, San Antonio Spurs
15. Ricky Rubio, Minnesota Timberwolves

It's a tribute to both Bryant's staying power and the global fascination with champions that Bryant maintains his hold, as well as the inevitable delay that comes with the translation of popularity from the states to overseas (or beyond our borders in some cases).

You have to imagine that Kevin Durant, should the Thunder make a miraculous title run, would jump up the charts. On one hand, Dwight Howard's showing in the top five is impressive, given the amount of investment he and his team has made internationally. On the other, he's still behind Kevin Garnett despite all that, so the star power is still lacking.

Dirk Nowitzki won the title last year, is a Hall of Famer, is European, and is 12th, failing to make the top five even in just Europe. People are weird.

Region specific numbers:

2011-12 Top Selling Jerseys in China
1. Kobe Bryant, Los Angeles Lakers
2. Derrick Rose, Chicago Bulls
3. LeBron James, Miami Heat
4. Dwight Howard, Orlando Magic
5. Rajon Rondo, Boston Celtics

2011-12 Top Selling Jerseys in Europe
1. Kobe Bryant, Los Angeles Lakers
2. Derrick Rose, Chicago Bulls
3. LeBron James, Miami Heat
4. Kevin Garnett, Boston Celtics
5. Dwight Howard, Orlando Magic

2011-12 Top Selling Jerseys in Latin America
1. Kobe Bryant, Los Angeles Lakers
2. LeBron James, Miami Heat
3. Derrick Rose, Chicago Bulls
4. Kevin Garnett, Boston Celtics
5. Dwyane Wade, Miami Heat

I'm not even a Lakers fan but you have to admit that Kobe is the among the most popular players not only in the United States but around the World.

For you to say nobody but LA fans watch Kobe is flat out wrong.

 

[longstroke]

So you said my opinion don't hold up to David Stern but then you have the authority to question his opinion?

Which is it dude? You're contradicting yourself all over the place.

By the way. Here's a recent report on the basketball market by Forbes.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/aliciaj...nbas-international-viewership-and-popularity/

And here's direct quotes from NBA coaches, players and David Stern

http://www.nba.com/2012/news/10/26/nba-international-growth.ap/index.html

Erick Spoelstra and David Stern

Tyson Chandler

Lebron James

So i guess the NBA players , coaches, and David Stern all lied about the state of the NBA over the past 5-10 years?

Hmm.

Look like you either have been living under a sewer or just flat out in denial.

David Stern lied to keep shareholder happy? LOL Yea right. You do realize the majority of shareholders are not stupid right? These are multi millionaires. CEO and such. They know exactly what's going on in the world.

You're talking like you know it all but you don't know nothing

You know, I could say plenty here about your utter and complete lack of understanding of the job that David Stern has to do, but it is also in my opinion that even that would be incredibly difficult for you to grasp.

So here, just one more time, here is the info that you are in complete denial of.....

[h3]Post-Jordan decline[/h3]
The retirement of Michael Jordan set in motion the decline in NBA ratings which continues today. Ratings for the 1999 NBA Finals  (which in fairness, came after a lockout shortened season) were down significantly from the previous year, from an 18.7 to an 11.3. Primetime regular season games, which had become fairly routine (and highly-rated) during the Jordan years, set record lows for NBC once Jordan retired. With the rise of the Los Angeles Lakers  in the early part of the 2000s (decade), ratings improved, but never to the level of the 1980s or 1990s.The highest NBA Finals ratings on NBC after Jordan left was the 2001 Finals, which featured the dominant and then-defending champion Lakers with Shaq and Kobe Bryant  versus the polarizing Allen Iverson  and the underdog Philadelphia 76ers. The ratings for that series were a 12.1, still down 35 percent from 1998. NBC's last Finals, in 2002, came after a resurgence in playoff ratings (including a 14.2 rating for Game 7 of the Western Conference Finals). However, the Finals itself registered the lowest ratings the event had seen since 1981, topping out at a 10.2 average.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Basketball_Association_Nielsen_ratings

Then to show you how LeBron IMPROVED on those dismal numbers, from your source, FORBES,

[h3] [/h3]
http://www.forbes.com/sites/prishe/...rince-durant-faces-king-james-for-nba-throne/

As the Miami Heat dispatched of a veteran Boston Celtics team in Game 7 of the Eastern Conference Finals on Saturday night, NBA executives and their sponsors must have been jumping for joy.

- ESPN earned an 8.2 overnight Nielsen rating for Thursday night’s Heat-Celtics NBA Eastern Conference Finals Game Six, marking the best overnight ever for an NBA game on cable TV (with records dating back to 2003).  The 8.2 rating surpassed the previous overnight record set by Game Four of the same series.

- For the 2011 NBA Finals, the Heat-Mavs averaged a 10.2 Nielsen rating.

Deal with it.

 

[longstroke]

Here's another report of the amount of NBA jersey sold worldwide.

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/blog/eye-on-basketball/19396795

I'm not even a Lakers fan but you have to admit that Kobe is the among the most popular players not only in the United States but around the World.

For you to say nobody but LA fans watch Kobe is flat out wrong.

Jersey sales do not make up for empty seats.

 

[DCAllAfrican]

My point is, when is it EVER Kobe's fault.  From you dudes perspective Kobe is "such a great player"..........he's this, he's that.  When does he ever get the blame for his team coming up short as the leader of the team?? When it comes to Kobe, it's always somebody else and never him..........in more ways than one.

Basketball is a team sport.

 

[longstroke]

Here's Stern's take on the losses,

We are mired in the  NBA lockout  because David Stern said that owners lost $300 million last season, and had lost money in every year of the deal. While we all quibble over whether the rich men who own basketball teams ought to deserve a guaranteed profit, or whether the asset is more a vanity project  with value that grows almost continuously, the profitability question was absolutely central to the league's argument for a system reset. It was also the league's argument for the separation of labor negotiations and revenue sharing reform. The quote is nearly famous in nerd circles: "You can't revenue-share your way to profitability."

http://www.sbnation.com/nba/2011/9/21/2439772/nba-lockout-2011-owners-david-stern-the-hook

I don't see why some of the Kobe supporters here on this thread, love to come off as being so unaware of truth and honesty. You guys really don't do Kobe any justice. You make people hate him more, simply through your actions. 

 

[do be doo]

My point is, when is it EVER Kobe's fault.  From you dudes perspective Kobe is "such a great player"..........he's this, he's that.  When does he ever get the blame for his team coming up short as the leader of the team?? When it comes to Kobe, it's always somebody else and never him..........in more ways than one.

Basketball is a team sport.

and thats why the SPURS got fine $250,000 cause POP decided the team should skip the game vs the Heat...

 

[alphawolf]

You know, I could say plenty here about your utter and complete lack of understanding of the job that David Stern has to do, but it is also in my opinion that even that would be incredibly difficult for you to grasp.

So here, just one more time, here is the info that you are in complete denial of.....

Then to show you how LeBron IMPROVED on those dismal numbers, from your source, FORBES,

Deal with it.

So you posted a rating (which is just a small sample size of the market) FROM 1999? REALLY DUDE? 1999, 2000? LOL

We're taking in the past 10 years dude. 2003-2013. THE NBA is growing not declining.

You have no insight on David Stern or how the NBA work yet you have the super power to tell that the league is lying about the state of the NBA.

Damn if you have such intelligent then aren't you suppose to be working for some investment firm or 500 company? Why are you spend so much time on Niketalk?

 

[alphawolf]

Jersey sales do not make up for empty seats.

But we're talking about Kobe and his popularity here.

The crappy teams struggling to sell seats. Not the good teams.

People rather save money in this economy to stay home and watch the game rather than spending 2, 3 hundred dollars on a game where they can watch comfortably at home in HD.

Two complete different argument dude

 

[alphawolf]

Here's Stern's take on the losses,

We are mired in the  NBA lockout  because David Stern said that owners lost $300 million last season, and had lost money in every year of the deal. While we all quibble over whether the rich men who own basketball teams ought to deserve a guaranteed profit, or whether the asset is more a vanity project  with value that grows almost continuously, the profitability question was absolutely central to the league's argument for a system reset. It was also the league's argument for the separation of labor negotiations and revenue sharing reform. The quote is nearly famous in nerd circles: "You can't revenue-share your way to profitability."

http://www.sbnation.com/nba/2011/9/21/2439772/nba-lockout-2011-owners-david-stern-the-hook

I don't see why some of the Kobe supporters here on this thread, love to come off as being so unaware of truth and honesty. You guys really don't do Kobe any justice. You make people hate him more, simply through your actions. 

THE NBA owners losing money has nothing to do with the NBA growth over the years.

They're losing money because of the bad contracts they made and because of the economy.

Like i said. Can you afford to spend 2-3 bills 10-15 times a year under this economy?

People prefer to save money and stay home. Plus they can watch the game in HD on cable, direct TV etc.

Even so. Whenever a big name like Kobe come to town. The home team would see a boost in their ticket sales.

You're really getting desperate here. Posting an article regarding the lock out lol. Didn't we have a lock out in Jordan era as well?

 

[longstroke]

So you posted a rating (which is just a small sample size of the market) FROM 1999? REALLY DUDE? 1999, 2000? LOL

We're taking in the past 10 years dude. 2003-2013. THE NBA is growing not declining.

You have no insight on David Stern or how the NBA work yet you have the super power to tell that the league is lying about the state of the NBA.

Damn if you have such intelligent then aren't you suppose to be working for some investment firm or 500 company? Why are you spend so much time on Niketalk?

Perhaps the reason I can spend so much time doing what it is that I want to do, is because I CAN do it.

You don't know what I may do.

Again, your delusional tendencies are incredibly apparent. So much so, it's pretty clear that you have a hard time with reality.

Here, read this again.

We are mired in the  NBA lockout  because David Stern said that owners lost $300 million last season, and had lost money in every year of the deal. While we all quibble over whether the rich men who own basketball teams ought to deserve a guaranteed profit, or whether the asset is more a vanity project  with value that grows almost continuously, the profitability question was absolutely central to the league's argument for a system reset. It was also the league's argument for the separation of labor negotiations and revenue sharing reform. The quote is nearly famous in nerd circles: "You can't revenue-share your way to profitability."

http://www.sbnation.com/nba/2011/9/21/2439772/nba-lockout-2011-owners-david-stern-the-hook 

What part of three hundred million, don't you understand?

 

[longstroke]

THE NBA owners losing money has nothing to do with the NBA growth over the years.

They're losing money because of the bad contracts they made and because of the economy.

Like i said. Can you afford to spend 2-3 bills 10-15 times a year under this economy?

People prefer to save money and stay home. Plus they can watch the game in HD on cable, direct TV etc.

Even so. Whenever a big name like Kobe come to town. The home team would see a boost in their ticket sales.

You have no clue as to what you are talking about. You argue from ignorance in such a way, that you are coming off as if there is something incredibly wrong with you.

The numbers are right there. If the OWNERS aren't making any money, what makes you think that the league is making more money? That was the whole point of the lockout. If the league would have continued with such salaries, they would have lost even more revenue, and then even teams.

What in the hell are YOU talking about?

 

[jumpmanfromdabay]

this guy keeps this thread Alive

 

[powerballin]

I think Kobe gave his girl the Longstroke and now when she says "deeper" and "harder" he feels inadequate

 

[jumpmanfromdabay]

I think Kobe gave his girl the Longstroke and now when she says "deeper" and "harder" he feels inadequate

When you use a personal attack you're only making his point

 

[longstroke]

I think Kobe gave his girl the Longstroke and now when she says "deeper" and "harder" he feels inadequate

 

[powerballin]

I think Kobe gave his girl the Longstroke and now when she says "deeper" and "harder" he feels inadequate

When you use a personal attack you're only making his point

thats not an attack it was a theory.  I could be wrong.

 

[jumpmanfromdabay]

I think Kobe gave his girl the Longstroke and now when she says "deeper" and "harder" he feels inadequate

When you use a personal attack you're only making his point

thats not an attack it was a theory.  I could be wrong.

Sure