and we're done

The reason why Melo would never average 30 or shoot 50 percent from the field is because he's fat , lazy , and most importantly stupid. Dude is a nightmare on the offensive end but him being limited by his basketball IQ will never allow him to let the game come to him like a lebron does and score efficiently. Also him having a 3 inch vertical doesn't help .
 
Thinking that Carmelo Anthony can just drive to the basket and get easy buckets is not a better game plan. He doesn't get easy buckets when he drives to the basket. He gets in there, doesn't jump very high but uses his strength and finesse to make contested shot/lay ups (double-clutched specifically), but he misses a lot of them. Melo blows more lay ups than any star in the league, he's just not that physically gifted so its tougher for him.

You guys been watching too much LeBron therefor leading you to expect too much from Melo.
 
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You guys need to stop comparing everything to Lebron. Melo will never be Lebron.

He is what he is. Give me 25+ a game, score in the clutch, play defense, rebound, and pass when you're double teamed. Thats all I ask from him.
 
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MaxElite said:
Making up stats now. Cool.
Click to expand...

You want to get shut down now or later bruh?

Melo by far has the worst percentage of close shots than any of the top stars in the league. Their is no stat for blown layup's but do you watch Knick game? Do you see how many times this season he blows easy shots close shots? I'm def not the only one whose addressed it in here or anywhere either.

Truth hurts, I know. It hurts me too, I wish Melo could get to the basket and finish like other players do. But thats not his game, and I've always known that. So it's useless to think that Melo driving the ball and taking close-contested shots is going to start helping - It won't. Thats the point.
 
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So you say Melo misses more layups than any other star in the league, but cannot prove it with actual evidence, other than the fact that you see him miss layups when watching games.

Oh ok.

If there is some actual stat to back up your stupid claim then hey, by all means shut me down

OR

Just admit you used hyperbole to make your lil point about Melo and that it was baseless
 
Here is the closest stat I could find

Per Hoopdata.com

At the Rim (dunks, tips, lay-ins)

Melo = 3.4 Makes / 6.2 Attempts 55.5%
Lebron = 5.3 / 6.7 79.2%
Durant = 3.4 / 4.5 76.1%
Kobe = 3.7 / 5.3 70.6%
Harden = 3.9 / 6.2 63.7%


Consider myself shut down...I guess :lol:
 
Come on son.

You really couldn't tell without looking at the stats that melo blows lay ups and put backs?

An average knick possession is him going to rack, missing a layup, making a face and the ref looking for a call and failing to get back in defense on the other end.
 
MaxElite said:
Here is the closest stat I could find

Per Hoopdata.com

At the Rim (dunks, tips, lay-ins)

Melo = 3.4 Makes / 6.2 Attempts 55.5%
Lebron = 5.3 / 6.7 79.2%
Durant = 3.4 / 4.5 76.1%
Kobe = 3.7 / 5.3 70.6%
Harden = 3.9 / 6.2 63.7%


Consider myself shut down...I guess :lol:
Click to expand...

Bro, you just proved my own point. Look how dismal Carmelo Anthony is at lay-ups & dunks percentage compared to the other NBA stars. 55.5%

Numbers never lie.

Thanks dude.

:lol:
 
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If he was able to get to the line on some of those misses like the rest of the guys he would be right there with them % wise. Melo just doesnt get those calls. But I do agree that it makes it look much worse because we come away with nothing when he misses. While the rest of them are missing prolly the same amount but they are getting to the line on a good amount of them which negates the miss and they get FTs out of the trip at the worst.

But thats like a broken record at this point. Melo will never get the calls any of those guys get. Unless when Stern leaves things go a little bit away from "Faces of the league" getting preferential calls and go back to playing basketball. But thats just wishful thinking.
 
Yes the stats seem to bear it out. Doesn't take into account when he gets fouled though and really we are talking about 1 maybe 2 attempts at the rim per game. Yes Im nitpicking.

Also when you guys say blown layups its not like he's missing uncontested attempts at the rim.

His attempts at the basket usually don't come from transition or alley-oops like Durant and Lebron get for the most part. His drives come from the mid post area where defenses are ready to bring help faster and easier.

So take that for whatever it's worth.
 
I'm going to give you credit for saying you were wrong, and bringing in the stats to do so. Respect, didn't really need stats to prove that Carmelo doesn't finish at the rim like the other nba stars, that should be obvious.

But Melo has a tendency to miss close shots he should make at times, it's clear. Although he does a great job of getting the offensive putback. Maybe I exaggerated it by saying "blown layups" but sometimes it feels like it. So I rather him take the 10 foot pull-up, like he knows and he's been doing is whole career.

I'm just saying, finishing at the rim and Carmelo driving to the basket is not our solution because its never been an essential part of Carmelo's game. It's easy for defenses to contest Melo going to the hoop because he's not very athletic, that's why he misses more. Melo won't those calls like LeBron, Durant, Harden, or Kobe because he doesn't finish like them. You have to earn that type of respect before the refs give you those calls. He still gets to the line 8 times a game tho, it's not like he's not getting calls. He just won't get those type of calls all the time. Thats basketball, what are you going to do?

That's not the reason why the Knicks are losing and are in trouble. We have bigger issues at hand. There is a bigger picture.
 
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Coupe. You seem to watch a lot of the games. Do you not see the difference between when Melo goes into the lane and when guys like Bron and KD go into the lane. Melo gets hammered on every layup attempt and guys like Bron and KD either breeze by for an easy layup because everyone is afraid of brushing up against and giving them an easy and 1. Or its just an automatic foul and they are at the line for 2.

I mean I know you have a little thing against Melo. But its almost impossible to not differentiate how differently those guys are refed.

Edit: Nevermind I wrote this before you responded. We on the same page. I got the sense you were blaming our losing on Melo's finishing ability. But those stats are very relative. But they are stats. Like I said, im not holding my breathe on officiating changing anytime soon. So it is what it is at this point.

I wouldnt want Melo to stop attacking the rim. Because even when he is missing it gives Chandler weak side put backs a lot of times and he punishes the defenders down there. But misses are going to happen with what refs allow a defender to do down low compared to other guys.
 
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AllenIversonFan01 said:
Coupe. You seem to watch a lot of the games. Do you not see the difference between when Melo goes into the lane and when guys like Bron and KD go into the lane. Melo gets hammered on every layup attempt and guys like Bron and KD either breeze by for an easy layup because everyone is afraid of brushing up against and giving them an easy and 1. Or its just an automatic foul and they are at the line for 2.

I mean I know you have a little thing against Melo. But its almost impossible to not differentiate how differently those guys are refed.
Click to expand...

Of course I see the difference between Melo and LeBron/KD getting calls. Especially KD, he's so frail so he goes down easy.

But I also see the difference between Melo and LeBron/KD finishing at the rim. They are legit finishers, it's almost impossible to stop them. Melo is not that type of finisher, he's guardable when he gets to the basket, that's why he won't get those calls.

Thats just the way basketball is, thats the NBA. It's always been like that. If you're an amazing finisher, you'll get to the line sometimes when you shouldn't because it's impossible to guard it at times.. From MJ, Allen Iverson, Kobe, Harden, LeBron.
 
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Then how do you explain Derrick Rose, who was a great finisher at the rim and didn't get calls?

There is a special treatment that Bron and KD get, that they don't.

But yeah...with LeBron we're wondering...will his teammates let him down? Will he hit the clutch shot?...as to whether he'll win a ring or not.

With Melo...everything has to go perfectly. Everything. Everyone has to make the hustle play, steal momentum, hit their shots, everything. He's a 2nd-tier superstar with a not so great attitude, questionable leadership and spotty shot selection. But when he's on, he's as great as anyone. It's just everything has to go perfectly for us to ever come out of the East with him as our best player.
 
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MrONegative said:
Then how do you explain Derrick Rose, who was a great finisher at the rim and didn't get calls?

There is a special treatment that Bron and KD get, that they don't.

But yeah...with LeBron we're wondering...will his teammates let him down? Will he hit the clutch shot?...as to whether he'll win a ring or not.

With Melo...everything has to go perfectly. Everything. Everyone has to make the hustle play, steal momentum, hit their shots, everything. He's a 2nd-tier superstar with a not so great attitude, questionable leadership and spotty shot selection. But when he's on, he's as great as anyone. It's just everything has to go perfectly for us to ever come out of the East with him as our best player.
Click to expand...

Derrick Rose didn't get calls? I mean thats news to me, I've seen the dude get some ridiculous calls against the Knicks when he throws himself in the air. He was getting to the line during his MVP season, not as much as LeBron/KD/Kobe, etc but he was still in there. He was obviously also more guardable as well, because he's was undersized. Usually the players that are nearly unguardable going to the basket and finishing get the calls.

Am I wrong here or something? Has this not always been happening in the NBA?

Btw Proph, I'm glad you understood the point I was making but don't get sidetracked by me mentioning Harden. I'm not now or ever going to put Harden on that level, but he's one of the most unguardable slashing finishers we have in this game, he's going to get his calls. Don't hold me to that regard :lol:

If Melo was as athletic as his teammate James White he'd be the best player in the world, but when your 6'8 and you can barely get higher or run faster than the frontcourt bigs in this league who are protecting the paint, it becomes difficult for him to score, therefor it's difficult for him to get those calls because the ref's are looking at it like "He had no chance at even finishing that layup and attempt, why the hell are we going to give him the respect for those types of call"

Bigger Picture - We're a jump shooting team for a reason, I wish we weren't, but we're not losing games because Melo isn't getting a call or two. He didn't get those calls in Denver either but the Nuggets had very impressive seasons in a difficult conference. Melo can play perfect for the rest of the season and playoffs and we still have no chance to get past the Heat. Melo needs more athletic counterparts that will help spread the floor. God what I wouldn't give to have Wilson Chandler back on this team and a speedy PG. That'd be the only way we could contest with Miami, since we already have our rim protector and closer in Carmelo.

At this point (even tho I love Stat for having heart) I'd seriously trade him for a second round draft pick (basically nothing) during the draft, so we can have some salary cap wiggle room to improve going into free-agency. Thats the Knicks biggest problems. Thats what we should be discussing, having Melo change his game at the age of 29 is impossible, he is what he is.
 
No point in freeing up cap room, this core is put together to stay in tact until 2014-15 and with the salary we have under contract until then, even without amare, I doubt we'd be able to make enough room to do anything significant. We also would be reluctant to offer a multi year deal to any mid-tier player since we want flexibility after 14-15. Also doubt any team with cap room available to take on Amare would do so even if they didn't have to give up anything for him.
 
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nYcHipHopHippo said:
No point in freeing up cap room, this core is put together to stay in tact until 2014-15 and with the salary we have under contract until then, even without amare, I doubt we'd be able to make enough room to do anything significant. We also would be reluctant to offer a multi year deal to any mid-tier player since we want flexibility after 14-15. Also doubt any team with cap room available to take on Amare would do so even if they didn't have to give up anything for him.
Click to expand...
You may very well be right, thats whats scary and that what sucks. Because something needs to happen talent wise, we need more cap room to get the right amount of complimentary players for Melo, or else it may just be more of the same and that's going to be troublesome going forward. I doubt someone would take Amare too, but if we basically gave him away for free, maybe some team would take a chance. Probably not tho. :rolleyes
 
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