Too much thanking God and not enough thanking parents.

[davidisgodly]

Hey 23ska, I'm all for God
But there I'm just saying there is not enough thanks given to the parents.

 

[loveofthegame916]

I never said I didn't thank my parents all I said was He gave them to me...but of corse this is Niketalk so if you believe in God you must be an idiot

 

[northparkblind]

Originally Posted by davidisgodly

Hey 23ska, I'm all for God
But there I'm just saying there is not enough thanks given to the parents.

Every religion thread you make

you always @#!%@** argue with other religions or

you try to put someones religion to the test.

Stop asking NT for some advice on religion and go outside

and find the answers you seek yourself.

 

[roc boy jada]

Originally Posted by northparkblind

Originally Posted by Roc Boy Jada

I don't know about anyone else thanking him too much but I know that I damn sure won't be thanking him for anything.

Originally Posted by northparkblind

Because without God,

none of us would be here.

Right.

Yea,

i am right.

Instead of despising other peoples religion,

why wont you tell me what you believe in....

You're right, huh?

Oh, and I'm an atheist.

 

[bonafide hustla]

Originally Posted by 23ska909red02

Ummm... if a Christian believes in God and believes that God created everything, wouldn't it be illogical for that Christian to believe that something else created their parents?

Stop being such a condescending elitists and wrap your minds around accepting that your belief systems are not superior to anyone else's, because all of our belief systems are founded on a number of items which remain unproven.

 

[keithdajuiceman]

Originally Posted by CarminePOWER

We'll see in the end.

exactly what I was thinking

I do believe there is a God , but I'm not going to knock anyone who does not

 

[dathbgboy]

Originally Posted by SpeakUp23

God then Fam then anyone else. Easy

Yup, unwritten law

 

[korto]

If you need to ask this question, then you do not really understand who or what God is.

Originally Posted by wawaweewa

People really do believe that a mythical being created the earth.

The older I get the more I just have to laugh at most of the religious dogma.
I mean seriously, c'mon.

What did create the Earth then? The "Big Bang"? Don't you see how it is fundamentally thesame idea. All it takes is a little honest thinking and things will begin to make sense.

Originally Posted by DatZNasty

If you went by empirical evidence, religion wouldn't stand up, nor would it stand up in court if you judged it using the same standard of logic used in that environment. It pretty much comes down to, "I just do," which is what faith is-

As with "trust", faith involves a concept of future events or outcomes, and is used conversely for a belief "not resting on logical proof or material evidence."

c/o wikipedia
Why is it that people who are so insistent on logic can't realize that logically the world is more than just what we perceive with the senses(which is how we get empirical evidence). If you want to use logic, that's the logical conclusion. Also, logic is a product of the human mind, it changesand evolves along with the human mind. The logic of 50 years ago and the logic of 1000 years ago was completely different than the logic of today, so it'ssilly to decide whether or not an objective reality (something unchanging - God) exists by using something subjective such as logic. By the way, there'sbeen tons of scientific research on near death experiences, and a large number of them have many similarities. Since empirical evidence is simply observationsmade by people, and many people have had similiar observations, I don't see why this shouldn't count. Look into NDE's yourself if you'reactually curious.

On an individual and personal level however, it is possible to know beyond any doubt that God exists. However, youhave to actually be open to the possibility and live your life in accordance with it before you can truly know.. that's what faith is. Faith isn'tjust believing that God exists, but living your life that way as well. I don't even want to convince you that God exists because I know that wouldn'treally have any effect on you.. it's something you have to see for yourself. But I can tell you that if you start living your life motivated by love andkindness instead of anger and fear, and if you have an honest and true curiousity about whether or not God exists, you will in fact be able to know the answer. In death, everyone finds out, just as some have already found out in life. But it would do your life much goodif you didn't wait until you died to do so.

 

[datznasty]

I can live my life based on all those positive values without believing in God or feeling like I need to be scared into doing so by some perpetual damnationpost death.

 

[darthska]

Why does fear have to be the motivating factor?

I work with juvenile delinquents, and one of the VERY FIRST things I tell a kid when he is placed under my care is that I want him to listen to what i say notbecause he's afraid of me, but because he respects me... and the process towards earning his respect has already begun (as well as the process towards himearning my respect).

Know what I mean? Doing what I say because you respect me and you know I want what's best for you > doing what I say because you're afraid of what Imight do to you if you disobey me

And you better believe I've already begun raising my son the same way. When it comes to him having a decision to do something wrong or keep it moving, Iwould rather him know that I love him and respect him and I'll be severely disappointed in him as a person for doing that wrong thing than for him to beafraid of what I'll do if he does it and gets caught.

Do I believe in God? Yes, yes I do. I don't associate myself with 'Christians' the way the word is defined and understood today, but I do believein God. And the reason I try to do right on a day to day basis is more about how disappointed I feel when I do something wrong, not because I'm afraidI'll go to hell for doing wrong.

Know what I mean?

 

[ramzs8906]

Originally Posted by Jwill JR

Originally Posted by jawnyquest

i only thank people that exist

without God, you nor your parents would exist....

 

[wawaweewa]

Originally Posted by 23ska909red02

DatZNasty:

---

By that standard, you can't prove anything then. What if I said I think there's a huge fire breathing dragon in my living room? Sure, you don't see/taste/hear/touch/smell it nor do I, but I believe that it's there without any evidence. So neither of us can prove the other wrong.

Exactly. But that's my argument.

If you think there's a fire-breathing dragon in your room and I have absolutely NO proof that there isn't one, I have no right to say 'Absolutely not. Impossible. You're an idiot if you think there's a dragon in there.'

However, proof that fire-breathing dragons don't exist would be at least SOMETHING concrete that would prove there's no fire-breathing dragon in your room, and that would be one step closer than anyone has ever come in proving that no deity exists.

Ummm........

People/Groups do exactly what you said you can't do.

If I murder someone and plead my innocence based on the fact that I'm positive my victim's "spirit" attacked me first, does that make meinnocent?
I mean, i can plead insanity but at least I'd be recognized as insane.

We're just talking about the belief here.

Say, I walk around and talk to every tree because I know I can interact with them. What does that make me? People won't shy away from me right?
If you saw me doing that, the thought that I'm insane or mentally unstable wouldn't even enter your mind,right? Be honest because I already know the answer.

I mean let's cut the bs.

If a kid believes Harry potter is real that means he has a "vivid imagination".
If an adult believes in an omnipotent being that answers to people mumbling (prayers) and also has the ability to create entire universes, split seas, rewardand punish individuals..........

C'mon. If you think about it it's complete lunacy.

 

[wawaweewa]

Originally Posted by Korto

If you need to ask this question, then you do not really understand who or what God is.

Originally Posted by wawaweewa

People really do believe that a mythical being created the earth.

The older I get the more I just have to laugh at most of the religious dogma.
I mean seriously, c'mon.

What did create the Earth then? The "Big Bang"? Don't you see how it is fundamentally the same idea. All it takes is a little honest thinking and things will begin to make sense.

It doesn't matter how exactly the earth was created (at least to me).
All I know is that an omnipotent being somewhere out there deciding to create his own little theatre is way low on the list.

Ok. Let's concede that there is a god.
Apparently he's either a sadist or he's not as powerful as people think. Oh, I'm sorry. God works in "mysterious ways". Sort of likeDat's fire breathing Dragon.

Seeing as how completely %+%$+# up thje world has been for it's entire history, I ask.

a) is god just sadistic
b) is "hands off"
b) not really omnipotent or all that powerful (than how does he do all that he supposedly does)
c) doesn't really exist

If A, well, then why worship him?
If B, what's his use again? He created something completely horrible and doesn't want to fix it. Not so "benevolent", right?
If C, Did he just lose his mojo or on vacation?

Please, please, spare me the "god works in mysterious ways" and "god helps those who help themselves" bs. Should people really be makingexcuses for god?

I'm not against religion at all.
In fact I believe that the polytheistic and pagan religions are multiple times more possible to be true than monotheism.
At least I can see why someone would worship the sun or lightning or water or trees, etc.

 

[darthska]

There's more than enough evidence to believe that humans can not talk to trees, man.

C'mon.

Y'all talking about fire-breathing dragons and chatting with trees, like there's not significant evidence supporting a certain stance on those twothings.

You not being able to talk to trees is not so because I don't believe it to be so; it's not so, because we have plenty of evidence showing that theylack the receptors and blah, blah, blah. So on and so forth.

That has very much to do with proof of a certain fact and very little to do with belief in a theory.

Belief in God or a lack of belief in any higher power has everything to do with personal interpretation of things which are definitely subject to personalinterpretation.

The reason it sounds crazy to fathom someone saying they chat with trees is NOT because I don't believe we have the ability; it's because we have proofof that impossibility.

Saying something sounds crazy because it's the opposite of what you believe when your belief system can be neither proven or disproven is elitist andclosed-minded, whether you subscribe to a secific religion or none at all.

 

[wawaweewa]

Originally Posted by 23ska909red02

There's more than enough evidence to believe that humans can not talk to trees, man.

C'mon.

Y'all talking about fire-breathing dragons and chatting with trees, like there's not significant evidence supporting a certain stance on those two things.

You not being able to talk to trees is not so because I don't believe it to be so; it's not so, because we have plenty of evidence showing that they lack the receptors and blah, blah, blah. So on and so forth.

That has very much to do with proof of a certain fact and very little to do with belief in a theory.

Belief in God or a lack of belief in any higher power has everything to do with personal interpretation of things which are definitely subject to personal interpretation.

The reason it sounds crazy to fathom someone saying they chat with trees is NOT because I don't believe we have the ability; it's because we have proof of that impossibility.

Saying something sounds crazy because it's the opposite of what you believe when your belief system can be neither proven or disproven is elitist and closed-minded, whether you subscribe to a secific religion or none at all.

It has nothing to do with being elitist or close minded.

According to your logic, one can never prove or disprove the existence of nothingness so therefore it can be true?

There's no significant evidence that god doesn't exist because 1) you can't prove a negative and 2) for the greater part of history those thattried to argue against it were killed or exiled.
Has there ever been a serious/prolonged discussion in any society on disproving the idea of a god(s)?

 

[Jordan8]

Originally Posted by wawaweewa

It doesn't matter how exactly the earth was created (at least to me).
All I know is that an omnipotent being somewhere out there deciding to create his own little theatre is way low on the list.

Ok. Let's concede that there is a god.
Apparently he's either a sadist or he's not as powerful as people think. Oh, I'm sorry. God works in "mysterious ways". Sort of like Dat's fire breathing Dragon.

Seeing as how completely %+%$+# up thje world has been for it's entire history, I ask.

a) is god just sadistic
b) is "hands off"
b) not really omnipotent or all that powerful (than how does he do all that he supposedly does)
c) doesn't really exist

If A, well, then why worship him?
If B, what's his use again? He created something completely horrible and doesn't want to fix it. Not so "benevolent", right?
If C, Did he just lose his mojo or on vacation?

Please, please, spare me the "god works in mysterious ways" and "god helps those who help themselves" bs. Should people really be making excuses for god?

I'm not against religion at all.
In fact I believe that the polytheistic and pagan religions are multiple times more possible to be true than monotheism.
At least I can see why someone would worship the sun or lightning or water or trees, etc.

Stop with the is God sadistic, all knowing,blah blah. You're thinking like a human. God isnt human. Stop trying to figure him, her, it Godout. Many of you cant grasp the thinking of intelligent mammals what makes you think you can understand God

 

[wawaweewa]

Originally Posted by cartune

Originally Posted by wawaweewa

It doesn't matter how exactly the earth was created (at least to me).
All I know is that an omnipotent being somewhere out there deciding to create his own little theatre is way low on the list.

Ok. Let's concede that there is a god.
Apparently he's either a sadist or he's not as powerful as people think. Oh, I'm sorry. God works in "mysterious ways". Sort of like Dat's fire breathing Dragon.

Seeing as how completely %+%$+# up thje world has been for it's entire history, I ask.

a) is god just sadistic
b) is "hands off"
b) not really omnipotent or all that powerful (than how does he do all that he supposedly does)
c) doesn't really exist

If A, well, then why worship him?
If B, what's his use again? He created something completely horrible and doesn't want to fix it. Not so "benevolent", right?
If C, Did he just lose his mojo or on vacation?

Please, please, spare me the "god works in mysterious ways" and "god helps those who help themselves" bs. Should people really be making excuses for god?

I'm not against religion at all.
In fact I believe that the polytheistic and pagan religions are multiple times more possible to be true than monotheism.
At least I can see why someone would worship the sun or lightning or water or trees, etc.

Stop with the is God sadistic, all knowing,blah blah. You're thinking like a human. God isnt human. Stop trying to figure him, her, it God out. Many of you cant grasp the thinking of intelligent mammals what makes you think you can understand God



I don't need to understand god in order to judge his actions, right?

Do you care why a mass murderer went on his spree? You may never understand why.
Maybe he did it for the greater good? All part of the plan?

 

[darthska]

You edited and added in your whole multiple choice question, but that's a topic for a whole separate discussion.

All I'm saying in this discussion is that's it's both closed-minded and elitist for a person (or group) who believes in a belief system founded onunproven items to ridicule or demean another individual (or group) who is doing the same thing on the opposite end of the spectrum.

But I ask you this: when was the last time someone put you in a situation where it was impossible to please them... and you pleased them? If they'vedecided that it's an impossibility and that you will lose no matter what you do, then... no matter what you do, you will lose.

Perspective is paramount, and if you are deadset that God is either the bad guy or worthless or nonexistent, then that's how you'll see Him.

If you think you're the first to ask me that question, you're mistaken. But that question definitely begins another lengthy debate, just like the onethat has taken place in this thread. I have to be to work in less than 4 hours... to work the entire weekend, clear through Monday afternoon.

If the question still peaks your interest, feel free to get back to me. I suspect you'll have lost interest by then, but I hope I'm wrong about that. Iwould hate to think that you just asked the question to stump me, and that you've interpreted my 'work excuse' as a personal victory in stumpingme.

 

[skip0011]

i was thinking about this last night when i was watching the draft. everyone was thanking god that they got picked. weird.

 

[Jordan8]

Again you're comparing God to a human

. Who's to say on another more advance planet they look at death as birth and life as the beginning ofsuffering. We as humans see murder as evil but other beings might see it as what we call love. You add all that together and you still cant figure out where aGod's logic would come from. If you want to look at things like a God you have to begin thinking deeper than your human psyche.

 

[darthska]

See, your laughing and condescending tone is exactly what I'm getting at.

Prove to me that God doesn't exist if you're so positive that it's foolish to believe the He does.

Listen, if it's STUPID to believe that God exists... I mean... ... ... look, it's stupid for someone to believe the sun is made of Chee-tos. It'sstupid for someone to believe babies come from storks. The reason it's stupid to believe these things is not because a bunch of people believe a certainway regarding those two things, and everyone who believes otherwise is stupid; it's stupid to believe those things BECAUSE WE HAVE PROOF OTHERWISE.

People believe babies come from storks? We have proof otherwise, so it would be foolish to continue believing that way.

You act like it's foolish to believe there is a God? Where's the proof otherwise?

It must be there.

Spare me the 'You can't prove a negative' jargon, because if that's all you've got, then all you're doing is supporting the notion thatboth a belief and a disbelief in God rely on items unproven. If you can't prove that He exists but you believe that he does, then you believe in somethingthat can not be proven. If you believe that He doesn't exist but a negative can not be proven, the you believe in something that can not be proven('God does not exist', which is a negative, which can not be proven).

 

[dunks87]

Originally Posted by aubstuh86

exactly, parents > god imo.

But it was God who blessed you to the parents you have.

 

[wawaweewa]

Originally Posted by 23ska909red02

You edited and added in your whole multiple choice question, but that's a topic for a whole separate discussion.

All I'm saying in this discussion is that's it's both closed-minded and elitist for a person (or group) who believes in a belief system founded on unproven items to ridicule or demean another individual (or group) who is doing the same thing on the opposite end of the spectrum.

But I ask you this: when was the last time someone put you in a situation where it was impossible to please them... and you pleased them? If they've decided that it's an impossibility and that you will lose no matter what you do, then... no matter what you do, you will lose.

Perspective is paramount, and if you are deadset that God is either the bad guy or worthless or nonexistent, then that's how you'll see Him.

If you think you're the first to ask me that question, you're mistaken. But that question definitely begins another lengthy debate, just like the one that has taken place in this thread. I have to be to work in less than 4 hours... to work the entire weekend, clear through Monday afternoon.

If the question still peaks your interest, feel free to get back to me. I suspect you'll have lost interest by then, but I hope I'm wrong about that. I would hate to think that you just asked the question to stump me, and that you've interpreted my 'work excuse' as a personal victory in stumping me.

My belief system isn't founded on unproven items. When it comes to omnipotent beings wherever I don't have a belief system.
This is the problem in the entire debate. It's not about "believing in something". If an individual doesn't believe in a single omnipotentbeing that doesn't mean he must believe in something else.
It's not a matter of respecting beliefs.

It has to do with the obvious hypocrisy and disconnect in reality when it comes to, and only when it comes to believing in "god".

Real Life Harry potter. Impossible.
Fire Breathing Dragon. Impossible.
Talking Tree. Impossible.

Omnipotent being "somewhere" --possible?

The entire line of "well, those have been proven to be impossible" is so disingenuous it's not to be taken seriously.
If believers could show us where god lived or where exactly he intervened in certain situations ( like said hello or dropped 100k unto a poor family

)then we could prove or disprove his existence.

 

[wawaweewa]

Originally Posted by cartune

Again you're comparing God to a human

. Who's to say on another more advance planet they look at death as birth and life as the beginning of suffering. We as humans see murder as evil but other beings might see it as what we call love. You add all that together and you still cant figure out where a God's logic would come from. If you want to look at things like a God you have to begin thinking deeper than your human psyche.

You can keep on justifying things and coming up with lines of reason until the end of eternity. Advance planets. Murder= good. Maybe pain=pleasure right?
That only weakens your case.

 

[darthska]

Me personally, I have no problem saying 'I believe there is a God. It's never been proven to me, but I believe He exists. But because of that lack ofevidence, someone else chooses to believe that He doesn't exist, nor does any higher power? Awesome.'

I'd just like to know why it's so hard for you and your kind to say the following: "Enh, I don't believe there is a God, personally. It'snot been proven to me that He or She or It or whatever exists, so I don't believe. But someone else believes differently? Awesome.'

What's the problem with adopting that attitude?