- Dec 27, 2014
- 35,524
- 78,113
This Brady-Dorsett connection has been encouraging.
-----The Official New England Patriots 2018 Season Thread - (14-5) - 6 Time Super Bowl CHAMPS!!!
- Thread in 'Sports & Training' Thread starter Started by DeadsetAce,
- Start date
DeadsetAce
Supporter
- May 31, 2004
- 107,240
- 53,425
pretty meh half on offense. i always gotta remind myself we're not showing all our cards yet and that we're trying different things.
would have liked to see Decker get time with Brady. need to see what he can do
would have liked to see Decker get time with Brady. need to see what he can do
DeadsetAce
Supporter
- May 31, 2004
- 107,240
- 53,425
DeadsetAce
Supporter
- May 31, 2004
- 107,240
- 53,425
i totally passed out after that poggi fumble 
- Sep 29, 2012
- 576
- 506
Super shocked we extended shaq. I’m beyond glad but I thought for sure we’d let him walk.
Now we just need to extend flowers.
Now we just need to extend flowers.
- Apr 30, 2002
- 7,636
- 9,705
^^ me too.
DeadsetAce
Supporter
- May 31, 2004
- 107,240
- 53,425
Hunting for deals: Who are the viable options if the Patriots bring in a receiver?
ByGreg A. Bedard
Posted on August 29, 2018
It’s fairly obvious — unless you view the Patriots’ roster through navy blue-colored sunglasses, right now, New England does not have enough at receiver to give itself the best chance to win a Super Bowl.
Can they be a top-10 offense and reach the AFC championship with the current roster? Sure, and they probably will. Could they be competitive in a Super Bowl with the current group? Yes, if Rob Gronkowski, Julian Edelman and Chris Hogan stay healthy. With Edelman able to replace Danny Amendola‘s catches, the Patriots should be able to replace the 23 catches for Tom Brady‘s 28 completions in the Super Bowl, when he threw for 505 yards (Gronkowski had nine, Amendola eight and Hogan six).
But to use just that game to justify the state of the receivers is a tough sell, because first you have to get there. And the Patriots saw 97 regular-season receptions walk out the door with the offseason departures of Brandin Cooks and Dion Lewis (again, we’re saying Edelman will replace Amendola’s output). If those aren’t replaced, that’s another six receptions each game of wear and tear on Gronkowski, Edelman, Hogan and James White. Sure, Sony Michel could, in theory, could replace Lewis’ receptions. But that’s a big projection. And it still leaves the 65 catches and 1,082 yards from Cooks.
Who’s going to do that? Phillip Dorsett? Cordarrelle Patterson? Riley McCarron? A combination of all three? It can’t totally be ruled out. But, again, it’s just a leap of faith. And one I don’t think the Patriots are willing to take.
They are expected to be active through a trade, waiver claim and/or free-agent signing in the coming days. What are the most-likely options? I asked three general managers and all of them were unanimous that a big-time trade is unlikely. All three said the best two options for the Patriots were:
Either signing Dez Bryant, or trading for Browns receiver Josh Gordon.
I have a hard time seeing the team doing either unless they’re utterly desperate. Bryant may not be able to grasp the offense, and Gordon has all types of issues that make him extremely unreliable. But Gordon is only making $790,000 and is still a restricted free agent after this year, which would be extremely enticing to the Patriots if they had faith in his ability.
Beyond that, the Patriots will look to acquire a player who is either in the last year of his deal, or on the outside looking in for their teams. We’ve asked around, and here are lists for both.
Need to make cap space
One thing to keep in mind before we get to the lists: To acquire anyone making more than, say, $2 million, the Patriots are going to have to create cap room. (And keep in mind they need roughly $7 million in operating space for the season.) How can they do that? Releasing the likes of Dwayne Allen ($5 million), Patterson ($3.25 million), Jason McCourty ($2.968 million), Mike Gillislee ($2.181 million), Eric Rowe ($1.1 million).
Other players who could be traded: Dont’a Hightower (net of about $3.5 million in cap space).
PLAYERS IN FINAL YEAR OF DEAL
Larry Fitzgerald, Cardinals ($11 million ’18 salary): Pretty much a pipe dream, as he negotiated a no-trade clause into his contract. The white whale is not going to happen. Likelihood: No chance.
Randall Cobb, Packers ($9.1 million): The Patriots need boundary receivers. And Cobb, who is injury-prone, is not that. Patriots would also need to make room financially for Cobb. Likelihood: Unlikely.
Kelvin Benjamin, Bills ($8.459 million): Buffalo’s new regime has shown it isn’t afraid to make moves for the future. The Patriots have seen Benjamin’s success against them up close. Would need to clear space. Likelihood: Possible.
Golden Tate, Lions ($7 million): Probably the player who makes the most sense, but this would require Detroit — which kept its whole offensive operation intact despite hiring a new coach in Matt Patricia — to take Tate away from Matthew Stafford and their offense, which is pretty good. Patriots would near to clear space. Likelihood: Possible but unlikely.
Cole Beasley, Cowboys ($3.25 million): Dallas loves their players and wants to make Dak Prescott/Jason Garrett look good, so hard to see this one. Plus, Beasley is an inside guy and with Edelman returning, not really needed. Likelihood: Unlikely.
Kevin White, Bears ($2.693 million): Now we’re talking. White was the seventh overall pick in the 2015 draft, but ended each season on injured reserve. This is a guy who needs a fresh start. He’s big (6-foot-3) and fast (4.35 seconds in the 40-yard dash) when healthy. But can he get up to speed quickly or even be relied on? Likelihood: Very possible, but not be an instant game-changer.
Tyler Lockett, Seahawks ($1.907 million): Seahawks just signed him to a contract extension today.
Martavis Bryant, Raiders ($1.907 million): Certainly talented, but I have no faith he can pick up the offense and be a reliable player. Likelihood: Highly unlikely.
Devin Funchess, Panthers ($1.087 million): Looks to be Carolina’s top receiver, so it’s doubtful they’d listen. Could a good free-agent signing in the offseason. Likelihood: Highly unlikely.
Josh Gordon, Browns ($790,001): Arguably the most talented receiver in the NFL. The Patriots have stayed away from him in recent years due to his issues. But do they have information that has changed their mind? Likelihood: Possible but unlikely.
Mike Campanaro, Titans ($790,000): If the Patriots want a slot guy and a punt returner, then sure. But he’s not making a difference. Likelihood: Possible but unlikely.
Michael Floyd, Saints ($790,000): Could be cut loose in New Orleans, so he could be had for basically nothing. He’s been here before and shown some potential … if he’s past his off-field issues. Likelihood: Very possible.
Bernard Reedy, Bucs ($555,000): Former Patriot who could be an upgrade over Riley McCarron and Braxton Berrios. Likelihood: Very possible, but not an instant game-changer.
Tommylee Lewis, Saints ($630,000): A small but super fast receiver with kick-return viability. A good talent to cultivate. Likelihood: Very possible, but not be an instant game-changer.
OTHER POSSIBLE TRADE TARGETS
Emmanuel Sanders/Demaryius Thomas, Broncos ($8.125/$8.5 million): Denver would clear some cap, but Sanders is one of their top targets. The Patriots signed him to an offer sheet when he was an RFA in Pittsburgh. Makes much more sense in the New England scheme than Thomas, but sources say Bill Belichick likes him as well. John Elway and Belichick did business previously on TE A.J. Derby. Likelihood: Possible.
Mohamed Sanu, Falcons ($6.125 million): Bit of a pipe dream considering his status on the Falcons’ roster, but it never hurts to ask. And you know Thomas Dimitroff has a past with Belichick. Likelihood: Highly unlikely.
Brandon Marshall, Seahawks ($1.015 million): Yup, that Brandon Marshall. He’s no lock to make the Seahawks. Had 109 catches for 1,502 yards for the Jets just three years ago. Might be worth kicking the tires — he’s always professed an admiration for the Patriots. Likelihood: Possible.
WHO ARE THE MOST LIKELY TARGETS FOR THE PATRIOTS?
So where does that leave us? Here’s a list, ranked by likelihood/impact on the Patriots:
Emmanuel Sanders, Broncos
Josh Gordon, Browns
Kevin White, Bears
Brandon Marshall, Seahawks
Michael Floyd, Saints
Bernard Reedy, Bucs
Tommylee Lewis, Saints
Golden Tate, Lions
ByGreg A. Bedard
Posted on August 29, 2018
It’s fairly obvious — unless you view the Patriots’ roster through navy blue-colored sunglasses, right now, New England does not have enough at receiver to give itself the best chance to win a Super Bowl.
Can they be a top-10 offense and reach the AFC championship with the current roster? Sure, and they probably will. Could they be competitive in a Super Bowl with the current group? Yes, if Rob Gronkowski, Julian Edelman and Chris Hogan stay healthy. With Edelman able to replace Danny Amendola‘s catches, the Patriots should be able to replace the 23 catches for Tom Brady‘s 28 completions in the Super Bowl, when he threw for 505 yards (Gronkowski had nine, Amendola eight and Hogan six).
But to use just that game to justify the state of the receivers is a tough sell, because first you have to get there. And the Patriots saw 97 regular-season receptions walk out the door with the offseason departures of Brandin Cooks and Dion Lewis (again, we’re saying Edelman will replace Amendola’s output). If those aren’t replaced, that’s another six receptions each game of wear and tear on Gronkowski, Edelman, Hogan and James White. Sure, Sony Michel could, in theory, could replace Lewis’ receptions. But that’s a big projection. And it still leaves the 65 catches and 1,082 yards from Cooks.
Who’s going to do that? Phillip Dorsett? Cordarrelle Patterson? Riley McCarron? A combination of all three? It can’t totally be ruled out. But, again, it’s just a leap of faith. And one I don’t think the Patriots are willing to take.
They are expected to be active through a trade, waiver claim and/or free-agent signing in the coming days. What are the most-likely options? I asked three general managers and all of them were unanimous that a big-time trade is unlikely. All three said the best two options for the Patriots were:
Either signing Dez Bryant, or trading for Browns receiver Josh Gordon.
I have a hard time seeing the team doing either unless they’re utterly desperate. Bryant may not be able to grasp the offense, and Gordon has all types of issues that make him extremely unreliable. But Gordon is only making $790,000 and is still a restricted free agent after this year, which would be extremely enticing to the Patriots if they had faith in his ability.
Beyond that, the Patriots will look to acquire a player who is either in the last year of his deal, or on the outside looking in for their teams. We’ve asked around, and here are lists for both.
Need to make cap space
One thing to keep in mind before we get to the lists: To acquire anyone making more than, say, $2 million, the Patriots are going to have to create cap room. (And keep in mind they need roughly $7 million in operating space for the season.) How can they do that? Releasing the likes of Dwayne Allen ($5 million), Patterson ($3.25 million), Jason McCourty ($2.968 million), Mike Gillislee ($2.181 million), Eric Rowe ($1.1 million).
Other players who could be traded: Dont’a Hightower (net of about $3.5 million in cap space).
PLAYERS IN FINAL YEAR OF DEAL
Larry Fitzgerald, Cardinals ($11 million ’18 salary): Pretty much a pipe dream, as he negotiated a no-trade clause into his contract. The white whale is not going to happen. Likelihood: No chance.
Randall Cobb, Packers ($9.1 million): The Patriots need boundary receivers. And Cobb, who is injury-prone, is not that. Patriots would also need to make room financially for Cobb. Likelihood: Unlikely.
Kelvin Benjamin, Bills ($8.459 million): Buffalo’s new regime has shown it isn’t afraid to make moves for the future. The Patriots have seen Benjamin’s success against them up close. Would need to clear space. Likelihood: Possible.
Golden Tate, Lions ($7 million): Probably the player who makes the most sense, but this would require Detroit — which kept its whole offensive operation intact despite hiring a new coach in Matt Patricia — to take Tate away from Matthew Stafford and their offense, which is pretty good. Patriots would near to clear space. Likelihood: Possible but unlikely.
Cole Beasley, Cowboys ($3.25 million): Dallas loves their players and wants to make Dak Prescott/Jason Garrett look good, so hard to see this one. Plus, Beasley is an inside guy and with Edelman returning, not really needed. Likelihood: Unlikely.
Kevin White, Bears ($2.693 million): Now we’re talking. White was the seventh overall pick in the 2015 draft, but ended each season on injured reserve. This is a guy who needs a fresh start. He’s big (6-foot-3) and fast (4.35 seconds in the 40-yard dash) when healthy. But can he get up to speed quickly or even be relied on? Likelihood: Very possible, but not be an instant game-changer.
Tyler Lockett, Seahawks ($1.907 million): Seahawks just signed him to a contract extension today.
Martavis Bryant, Raiders ($1.907 million): Certainly talented, but I have no faith he can pick up the offense and be a reliable player. Likelihood: Highly unlikely.
Devin Funchess, Panthers ($1.087 million): Looks to be Carolina’s top receiver, so it’s doubtful they’d listen. Could a good free-agent signing in the offseason. Likelihood: Highly unlikely.
Josh Gordon, Browns ($790,001): Arguably the most talented receiver in the NFL. The Patriots have stayed away from him in recent years due to his issues. But do they have information that has changed their mind? Likelihood: Possible but unlikely.
Mike Campanaro, Titans ($790,000): If the Patriots want a slot guy and a punt returner, then sure. But he’s not making a difference. Likelihood: Possible but unlikely.
Michael Floyd, Saints ($790,000): Could be cut loose in New Orleans, so he could be had for basically nothing. He’s been here before and shown some potential … if he’s past his off-field issues. Likelihood: Very possible.
Bernard Reedy, Bucs ($555,000): Former Patriot who could be an upgrade over Riley McCarron and Braxton Berrios. Likelihood: Very possible, but not an instant game-changer.
Tommylee Lewis, Saints ($630,000): A small but super fast receiver with kick-return viability. A good talent to cultivate. Likelihood: Very possible, but not be an instant game-changer.
OTHER POSSIBLE TRADE TARGETS
Emmanuel Sanders/Demaryius Thomas, Broncos ($8.125/$8.5 million): Denver would clear some cap, but Sanders is one of their top targets. The Patriots signed him to an offer sheet when he was an RFA in Pittsburgh. Makes much more sense in the New England scheme than Thomas, but sources say Bill Belichick likes him as well. John Elway and Belichick did business previously on TE A.J. Derby. Likelihood: Possible.
Mohamed Sanu, Falcons ($6.125 million): Bit of a pipe dream considering his status on the Falcons’ roster, but it never hurts to ask. And you know Thomas Dimitroff has a past with Belichick. Likelihood: Highly unlikely.
Brandon Marshall, Seahawks ($1.015 million): Yup, that Brandon Marshall. He’s no lock to make the Seahawks. Had 109 catches for 1,502 yards for the Jets just three years ago. Might be worth kicking the tires — he’s always professed an admiration for the Patriots. Likelihood: Possible.
WHO ARE THE MOST LIKELY TARGETS FOR THE PATRIOTS?
So where does that leave us? Here’s a list, ranked by likelihood/impact on the Patriots:
Emmanuel Sanders, Broncos
Josh Gordon, Browns
Kevin White, Bears
Brandon Marshall, Seahawks
Michael Floyd, Saints
Bernard Reedy, Bucs
Tommylee Lewis, Saints
Golden Tate, Lions
DeadsetAce
Supporter
- May 31, 2004
- 107,240
- 53,425
^ good read on potential targets to help us at WR which is extremely thin. i know they tried, but what a disservice to Brady to cut Amendola and Cooks loose and not even come remotely close to replacing them. **** like this and the Butler benching have me all about the #****YouBill train
- Apr 15, 2013
- 7,720
- 4,976
their wide receiver scenario and doing nothing about it is baffling.
- Dec 27, 2014
- 35,524
- 78,113
Regarding Emmanuel Sanders, I remember being heated when we had a legit shot at him a few years back but the Steelers matched the Pats offer.
Wouldn't mind seeing him here at all. He's mad versatile and has a lot of toughness for his size ala Jules, Welker, Troy Brown.
Wouldn't mind seeing him here at all. He's mad versatile and has a lot of toughness for his size ala Jules, Welker, Troy Brown.
- Apr 15, 2013
- 7,720
- 4,976
etling released and berrios on IR
DeadsetAce
Supporter
- May 31, 2004
- 107,240
- 53,425
so not a TON of surprises but here were mine:
- Berrios to IR AND McCarron released...not that either guy showed us much but we're already so thin at WR. figured one of them was making the squad, at least for weeks 1-4. maybe McCarron comes back to the PS
- Bolden released...this was mind blowing. this is one of the few special teams aces that can ACTUALLY come in and play. he's a great option to have at RB in an injury pinch. i actually hate this move. hope he re-signs similar to last year
- Marquise Flowers got let go. he flashed a bit last year but his coverage ability as a LB is prob what got him nixed. i think the dude that took his spot (Grigsby) has got serious speed for a LB
the decisions i like/loved:
- Crossen and Jackson making the squad
- McCourty 2.0 making the team. even tho he struggled, they've got to find a role for him. he's gotta be able to play still and help out
- Gillislee gone. i like this not cause i have a problem with him, but that it means Hill is the guy to pound the ball. i liked what i saw from Hill in the pre-season
i'm concerned about WR at this point and LB. WR got worse (how do you let Cooks and Amendola go without remotely finding guys to fill the shoes) and LB is at best in the same position as last year, which isn't good.
- Berrios to IR AND McCarron released...not that either guy showed us much but we're already so thin at WR. figured one of them was making the squad, at least for weeks 1-4. maybe McCarron comes back to the PS
- Bolden released...this was mind blowing. this is one of the few special teams aces that can ACTUALLY come in and play. he's a great option to have at RB in an injury pinch. i actually hate this move. hope he re-signs similar to last year
- Marquise Flowers got let go. he flashed a bit last year but his coverage ability as a LB is prob what got him nixed. i think the dude that took his spot (Grigsby) has got serious speed for a LB
the decisions i like/loved:
- Crossen and Jackson making the squad
- McCourty 2.0 making the team. even tho he struggled, they've got to find a role for him. he's gotta be able to play still and help out
- Gillislee gone. i like this not cause i have a problem with him, but that it means Hill is the guy to pound the ball. i liked what i saw from Hill in the pre-season
i'm concerned about WR at this point and LB. WR got worse (how do you let Cooks and Amendola go without remotely finding guys to fill the shoes) and LB is at best in the same position as last year, which isn't good.
- Sep 29, 2012
- 576
- 506
The WR situation is baffling. How do you go into a season with three receivers(slater doesn’t count lol). Not to mention how weak those three are.
I know we’re stacked at RB and TE, but we have to make some type of trade for a WR. We have the bears 2nd rounder next year, that should be able to get a pretty good one.
I know we’re stacked at RB and TE, but we have to make some type of trade for a WR. We have the bears 2nd rounder next year, that should be able to get a pretty good one.
DeadsetAce
Supporter
- May 31, 2004
- 107,240
- 53,425
^ this is good news
Darboh
DeadsetAce
Supporter
- May 31, 2004
- 107,240
- 53,425
^ good for depth
good PS addition to practice for RPO teams
DeadsetAce
Supporter
- May 31, 2004
- 107,240
- 53,425
get ready for 2-2 out the gates this year, boys (0-2, in fact). Greg's painting a pretty big doom and gloom picture which i think might be a little OD, but for the most part, it's definitely not going to be pretty to start this year. not until Edelman is byke:
Bedard: Analyzing the Patriots’ offensive roster – Tom Brady’s readiness cloudy
ByGreg A. Bedard
Posted on September 3, 2018
Now that the waiver claim process has been completed (for the most part), we can take a little bit of a closer look at the Patriots’ final (for this week) 53-man roster heading into the opener.
Let’s first post my version of the roster, which sort of mixes the Patriots’ system with the regular depth chart. Note — this chart is a snapshot right now. So Jeremy Hill is ahead of Rex Burkheadat this point, as Burkhead comes back from injury.
(The chart below is visible to members but not visitors)
Let’s go through each position with a few thoughts:
Quarterback
I think, for the first time maybe ever, I’m not really sure how Tom Brady is going to come out of the blocks. Actually, I expect the passing offense — outside of dump offs to the backs and slip screens — to really struggle for a while. But I’m talking more about Brady in general. He didn’t go to any of the offseason workouts. He didn’t throw for, basically, 10 days in camp, which wasn’t all that competitive. He didn’t complete one pass of over 20 yards in the preseason. He threw just four passes (completed three) between 10 and 20 yards. Sure, Brady didn’t have Rob Gronkowski, and he changes a lot of things for the defense. That’s a legit point. But you can’t tell me Brady is as prepared for this season as he has been in the past. He’s not. The opener should be very interesting.
Brian Hoyer is what he is. With that patented ball pat, he’s going to have trouble the more a team sees him. It’s like a green light for the defense to jump the route.
I can see why they kept Danny Etling on the practice squad. A lot of people had fun with some his throws — no mention of the chicken crap he was playing with — and I would agree his play declined over the summer. But this is a guy who needed a lot of work with his mechanics, and he showed up for camp having tightened up a bunch of stuff. That tells me he takes coaching very well, and that’s important. He’s not a lost cause. He just needs a lot of work. Now, he’ll get it.
Running backs
Jeremy Hill is very much an upgrade over Mike Gillislee, whose vision was exposed in his time with the Patriots. Hill’s a much more patient back as he sets up blocks and allows them to develop. Gillislee was more of a car crash.
When he’s on the field, Rex Burkhead is still the best overall back on the team. How long have we been saying that for? Would be nice if he stayed on the field.
James White may be the best pass-catching back in the league. He’s slowly improved as a runner.
Sony Michel … he’s all hype and on rep, at least as of this moment. There hasn’t been one instance in his time with the Patriots that has screamed, “Now that’s a first-round running back.” To this point, he looks like a colossal failure by the scouting and medical departments. Maybe this oil change with his knee will him get back to what he put on film in college — which was impressive. He hasn’t come close to showing that with the Patriots.
X receiver
The Patriots don’t have one. Phillip Dorsett is really a Z, and Amara Darboh, claimed from the Seahawks, has talent but he earned the reputation — among coaches and players — of being soft in Seattle. But Dorsett is going to be the other “starting” receiver opposite Chris Hogan by default. It boggles my mind how the Patriots can’t find a tall and lanky receiver to play on the boundary. I’m still waiting for Dez Bryant to get a call. I believe he could add something to this offense.
Slot receiver
Hogan can do it, but he doesn’t really have the shake required to make this position work. So that means the Patriots don’t really have their ideal starters at the two spots until Julian Edelmanreturns.
As for Edelman … he made progress during the summer, which is what you’re looking for. The million-dollar question: Will he be, at 32, the same guy, pre-surgery/suspension? I don’t see how he can. But Edelman’s smarts and his ability to work well with Brady will make up for a lot. One thing to keep in mind: Edelman had 14 drops in 2016, which was the same number Brandin Cooks and Gronkowski dropped combined last season. When your legs start to go as an aging receiver, your hand-eye coordination struggles. (Just ask Eric Decker.) He could have been on the decline last year, and we wouldn’t know it yet.
The only explanation I have for Riley McCarron still being here as a practice squadder is that he’s insurance (because he knows the system and is plug and play) during Edelman’s suspension. McCarron wasn’t good enough for the same system in Houston. He was on the Patriots’ practice squad all last year, here all offseason and in the preseason, the Patriots have no receivers and … McCarron still couldn’t make the team. He’s the definition of a JAG — just another guy — but he happens to know the playbook.
As soon as the team is more comfortable with Jace Billingsley (former Lion), I expect McCarron to be on another team.
Z receiver
Cordarrelle Patterson would normally be a No. 4 with some gadget potential, but this is where the Patriots are right now. For you scoring at home, we’re now 3-for-3 with receiver spots not having the best candidate playing there. There could be a case made — and perhaps they’ll show it in the opener — to put James White at slot receiver, which would allow Hogan (X), Dorsett (Z) and Patterson (gadget) to play their best spots against the Texans. As it stands right now, the Patriots are weakening all three spots by shuffling receivers around.
Patterson has shown more receiving ability so far with the Patriots, but there is a lingering question about how he’ll function in the offense with Brady when the real bullets are flying. It looked like he struggled on a handful of routes in the preseason. Brady won’t want to deal with that if it’s not cleaned up.
Tight ends
If you’re a defensive coordinator worth a spit playing the Patriots until Edelman proves he’s healthy, how aren’t you throwing multiple bodies at Rob Gronkowski? I don’t care where he lines up, I would double Gronkowski and make Brady beat you with everyone else. Remember that scene in “Bill Belichick: A Football Life” where the coach says, “If you just take Moss away in the middle of the field and get down on Welker … we’re done”?
Well, this offense — at least the passing part — has that feel with Gronkowski in the Moss role and Edelman as Welker when No. 11 returns. Now, the Patriots should have a better running game than the 2009 offense, but the point remains.
Dwayne Allen hasn’t shown he can do anything consistently except block. Jacob Hollister has potential to be a very viable secondary target, but he’s another player who has durability questions. James Develin is a good, solid fullback.
Offensive tackle
Trent Brown has the potential to be the team’s best left tackle since Nate Solder in 2013 (his best season) and could exceed that level. He’s that good, or at least that’s what he’s shown. But there are durability and conditioning issues with Brown. Will he be able to function at a high level, at his size, if the Patriots are running 80-plus plays every week? There may very well be a rotation among all three tackles for the first month to keep Brown and Marcus Cannon as fresh as possible.
Cannon, when healthy, is among the best right tackles in the league — but that’s really only happened once. LaAdrian Waddle has vastly improved over the past year — he’s in terrific shape and has cleaned up his technique. Could be one of the better third tackles in the league.
Guard/center
This group has a chance to be one of the best in the league last season. Approached that status last year and didn’t see much letup this summer. … I’m sorry, but LG Joe Thuney is a good player — I don’t care what anyone else thinks. He gave up less pressure than Solder and Shaq Masonlast year. But he does need to improve his run blocking. … David Andrews is highly underrated as one of the better centers in the league. … Mason had a little leakage early on in camp and still has some things to clean up. I certainly don’t have any worries about him getting fat and happy with the new contract. Mason showed much growth going from a run-only college offense to the multi-faceted Patriots attack. But this is where the hard work begins. Going from being a very good linemen to elite player is all about refining techniques and building that database of reactions to what you see in a game. Can he take that final step? Patriots think so based on his contract. … Ted Karras is a rock-solid backup at all three spots. And he’s all they have right now.
Bedard: Analyzing the Patriots’ offensive roster – Tom Brady’s readiness cloudy
ByGreg A. Bedard
Posted on September 3, 2018
Now that the waiver claim process has been completed (for the most part), we can take a little bit of a closer look at the Patriots’ final (for this week) 53-man roster heading into the opener.
Let’s first post my version of the roster, which sort of mixes the Patriots’ system with the regular depth chart. Note — this chart is a snapshot right now. So Jeremy Hill is ahead of Rex Burkheadat this point, as Burkhead comes back from injury.
(The chart below is visible to members but not visitors)
Let’s go through each position with a few thoughts:
Quarterback
I think, for the first time maybe ever, I’m not really sure how Tom Brady is going to come out of the blocks. Actually, I expect the passing offense — outside of dump offs to the backs and slip screens — to really struggle for a while. But I’m talking more about Brady in general. He didn’t go to any of the offseason workouts. He didn’t throw for, basically, 10 days in camp, which wasn’t all that competitive. He didn’t complete one pass of over 20 yards in the preseason. He threw just four passes (completed three) between 10 and 20 yards. Sure, Brady didn’t have Rob Gronkowski, and he changes a lot of things for the defense. That’s a legit point. But you can’t tell me Brady is as prepared for this season as he has been in the past. He’s not. The opener should be very interesting.
Brian Hoyer is what he is. With that patented ball pat, he’s going to have trouble the more a team sees him. It’s like a green light for the defense to jump the route.
I can see why they kept Danny Etling on the practice squad. A lot of people had fun with some his throws — no mention of the chicken crap he was playing with — and I would agree his play declined over the summer. But this is a guy who needed a lot of work with his mechanics, and he showed up for camp having tightened up a bunch of stuff. That tells me he takes coaching very well, and that’s important. He’s not a lost cause. He just needs a lot of work. Now, he’ll get it.
Running backs
Jeremy Hill is very much an upgrade over Mike Gillislee, whose vision was exposed in his time with the Patriots. Hill’s a much more patient back as he sets up blocks and allows them to develop. Gillislee was more of a car crash.
When he’s on the field, Rex Burkhead is still the best overall back on the team. How long have we been saying that for? Would be nice if he stayed on the field.
James White may be the best pass-catching back in the league. He’s slowly improved as a runner.
Sony Michel … he’s all hype and on rep, at least as of this moment. There hasn’t been one instance in his time with the Patriots that has screamed, “Now that’s a first-round running back.” To this point, he looks like a colossal failure by the scouting and medical departments. Maybe this oil change with his knee will him get back to what he put on film in college — which was impressive. He hasn’t come close to showing that with the Patriots.
X receiver
The Patriots don’t have one. Phillip Dorsett is really a Z, and Amara Darboh, claimed from the Seahawks, has talent but he earned the reputation — among coaches and players — of being soft in Seattle. But Dorsett is going to be the other “starting” receiver opposite Chris Hogan by default. It boggles my mind how the Patriots can’t find a tall and lanky receiver to play on the boundary. I’m still waiting for Dez Bryant to get a call. I believe he could add something to this offense.
Slot receiver
Hogan can do it, but he doesn’t really have the shake required to make this position work. So that means the Patriots don’t really have their ideal starters at the two spots until Julian Edelmanreturns.
As for Edelman … he made progress during the summer, which is what you’re looking for. The million-dollar question: Will he be, at 32, the same guy, pre-surgery/suspension? I don’t see how he can. But Edelman’s smarts and his ability to work well with Brady will make up for a lot. One thing to keep in mind: Edelman had 14 drops in 2016, which was the same number Brandin Cooks and Gronkowski dropped combined last season. When your legs start to go as an aging receiver, your hand-eye coordination struggles. (Just ask Eric Decker.) He could have been on the decline last year, and we wouldn’t know it yet.
The only explanation I have for Riley McCarron still being here as a practice squadder is that he’s insurance (because he knows the system and is plug and play) during Edelman’s suspension. McCarron wasn’t good enough for the same system in Houston. He was on the Patriots’ practice squad all last year, here all offseason and in the preseason, the Patriots have no receivers and … McCarron still couldn’t make the team. He’s the definition of a JAG — just another guy — but he happens to know the playbook.
As soon as the team is more comfortable with Jace Billingsley (former Lion), I expect McCarron to be on another team.
Z receiver
Cordarrelle Patterson would normally be a No. 4 with some gadget potential, but this is where the Patriots are right now. For you scoring at home, we’re now 3-for-3 with receiver spots not having the best candidate playing there. There could be a case made — and perhaps they’ll show it in the opener — to put James White at slot receiver, which would allow Hogan (X), Dorsett (Z) and Patterson (gadget) to play their best spots against the Texans. As it stands right now, the Patriots are weakening all three spots by shuffling receivers around.
Patterson has shown more receiving ability so far with the Patriots, but there is a lingering question about how he’ll function in the offense with Brady when the real bullets are flying. It looked like he struggled on a handful of routes in the preseason. Brady won’t want to deal with that if it’s not cleaned up.
Tight ends
If you’re a defensive coordinator worth a spit playing the Patriots until Edelman proves he’s healthy, how aren’t you throwing multiple bodies at Rob Gronkowski? I don’t care where he lines up, I would double Gronkowski and make Brady beat you with everyone else. Remember that scene in “Bill Belichick: A Football Life” where the coach says, “If you just take Moss away in the middle of the field and get down on Welker … we’re done”?
Well, this offense — at least the passing part — has that feel with Gronkowski in the Moss role and Edelman as Welker when No. 11 returns. Now, the Patriots should have a better running game than the 2009 offense, but the point remains.
Dwayne Allen hasn’t shown he can do anything consistently except block. Jacob Hollister has potential to be a very viable secondary target, but he’s another player who has durability questions. James Develin is a good, solid fullback.
Offensive tackle
Trent Brown has the potential to be the team’s best left tackle since Nate Solder in 2013 (his best season) and could exceed that level. He’s that good, or at least that’s what he’s shown. But there are durability and conditioning issues with Brown. Will he be able to function at a high level, at his size, if the Patriots are running 80-plus plays every week? There may very well be a rotation among all three tackles for the first month to keep Brown and Marcus Cannon as fresh as possible.
Cannon, when healthy, is among the best right tackles in the league — but that’s really only happened once. LaAdrian Waddle has vastly improved over the past year — he’s in terrific shape and has cleaned up his technique. Could be one of the better third tackles in the league.
Guard/center
This group has a chance to be one of the best in the league last season. Approached that status last year and didn’t see much letup this summer. … I’m sorry, but LG Joe Thuney is a good player — I don’t care what anyone else thinks. He gave up less pressure than Solder and Shaq Masonlast year. But he does need to improve his run blocking. … David Andrews is highly underrated as one of the better centers in the league. … Mason had a little leakage early on in camp and still has some things to clean up. I certainly don’t have any worries about him getting fat and happy with the new contract. Mason showed much growth going from a run-only college offense to the multi-faceted Patriots attack. But this is where the hard work begins. Going from being a very good linemen to elite player is all about refining techniques and building that database of reactions to what you see in a game. Can he take that final step? Patriots think so based on his contract. … Ted Karras is a rock-solid backup at all three spots. And he’s all they have right now.
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- Sep 29, 2012
- 576
- 506
Greg does seem to take it to the extreme a lot of times but 2-2 would not be surprising at all.
We just gotta hope the TEs and RBs can step up. I’m hoping for a big year from hollister.
We just gotta hope the TEs and RBs can step up. I’m hoping for a big year from hollister.
DeadsetAce
Supporter
- May 31, 2004
- 107,240
- 53,425
- Dec 27, 2014
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Was listening to them talk about this on the radio this morning. Apparently it's pretty subjective so I don't know about it being "shots fired." Some think it might refer to the conditioning aspect. Others think it might have to with walking away from the game when he's all done. Guess we need to hear the full context. I personally haven't watched any of those Tom vs. Time episodes.
DeadsetAce
Supporter
- May 31, 2004
- 107,240
- 53,425
interesting. im bracing for the worst and going to predict it's the retirement after this year announcement
- Dec 27, 2014
- 35,524
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Patterson's involvement has been encouraging, especially given the circumstances at WR 
Defensive front making plays too.
Defensive front making plays too.
- Feb 13, 2005
- 5,667
- 1,514
Like what I’m seeing from the defense so far.
- Sep 29, 2012
- 576
- 506
Great first half. Defense making plays.
- Dec 27, 2014
- 35,524
- 78,113
Hill's knee just got jacked up on that turnover. Didn't look good.
- Sep 4, 2006
- 48,667
- 28,949
Glad they won their first game.
