OFFICIAL NFL OFFSZN THREAD 2023-24: R.I.P Jacoby Jones

[CP1708]

Those book suggestions.

Vol 2

 

[aepps20]

aepps20

He truly is

 

[Peep Game]

DCAllAfrican I’m so insatiable

 

[mr s j king]

The Troy Aikman debate again

Growing up he was regarded as a great QB. Especially in those championship runs.

I’m nowhere close to a cowboys supporter… but that is categorically false

Either of you care to provide proof that he was considered a top 3 quarterback in the 90s?

Here’s my proof straight from the horses mouth

Spoiler

Pro Football 101: Cowboys QB Troy Aikman ranks No. 89 on the all-time list | Fox Sports

Troy Aikman didn't rack up the gaudiest stats, but he was one of the best ever when it came to winning, Joe Posnanski writes.

amp.foxsports.com

 

[IATT]

Either of you care to provide proof that he was considered a top 3 quarterback in the 90s?

In the 90s, dude for sure was looked at in that Steve young and farve group at least to the public

That’s why he has 6 pro bowl selections.. but zero all pros

It’s only in recent times when we’ve starting looking deeper into things and numbers that we’ve started reevaluating things

 

[spacedoodoo]

His wife betraying him like that to the public.

Shazier cheating and sending his sneaky link books on anal sex and you’re upset with his wife for sharing her pain? Lmao

 

[g-time]

Think that stuff could have stayed between them though and didn’t have to be put out there.

 

[spacedoodoo]

Think that stuff could have stayed between them though and didn’t have to be put out there.

Everyone handles and responds to situations differently. Just because you or I wouldn’t post certain private matters publicly, doesn’t mean others shouldn’t

 

[g-time]

Everyone handles and responds to situations differently. Just because you or I wouldn’t post certain private matters publicly, doesn’t mean others shouldn’t

I understand that completely. Doesn’t make what she did not come off as attention seeking though. She’s hurt. We understand that. But she announced that to the world to where she has to hear that hurt over and over again?

 

[finessence]

Still can’t believe we still have this debate YEARLY about Aikman.

Roger Craig had 3 1000 yard seasons…. Ricky Watters had ONE 1000 yd season as a 49er…

Montana and Steve Young were in west coast, pass first offenses. There’s a reason Jerry Rice had 20,000 receiving yards and 200tds

Steve young only had 3 total (Ricky and garrison Hearst) RBs eclipse 1000 yards…

Emmitt Smith had 11 1000 yard seasons

8 10+ Rushing TD seasons. He had a 25, 21, 18 rush TD season.

Dude was routinely getting 400+ touches per season.

To think Troy would ever be allowed to throw the ball a lot, with Emmitt being the focal point like that is ludicrous.

But look at Troy’s mechanics, look at how he threw the pill. Dude had an elite arm. He wasn’t allowed to showcase it like Montana or Steve, or Marino. Him and Steve Young, and Kelly were the only dudes from the 90s who were career 60% passers.

You can’t look at stats with Aikman when his RB had 18,000 rushing yards and 164 rush TDs.

Put Troy in a pass-first offense and he’s easily getting 50,000+ and 300+ TDs. Dude had the perfect blend of arm strength and accuracy.

Troy’s are was wayyyyy better than Montana’s or Young’s. Dan Marino played 17 years and only had maybe 2 or 3 1000 yard rushers.

No one even knows who played RB for those Dolphins teams. That’s how much they threw the ball

 

[finessence]

I understand that completely. Doesn’t make what she did not come off as attention seeking though. She’s hurt. We understand that. But she announced that to the world to where she has to hear that hurt over and over again?

Clown millennial behavior. They want everyone in there business, then get upset. They don’t realize that it makes them look crazy. But airing of dirty laundry is the millennial/Gen-Z thing to do. If you date a young person, best believe everything will be recorded, screenshot, documented or posted some way or another

The soap box generations

 

[spacedoodoo]

All of this could’ve been avoided if shazier was handling his business lmao

 

[IATT]

Still can’t believe we still have this debate YEARLY about Aikman.

Roger Craig had 3 1000 yard seasons…. Ricky Watters had ONE 1000 yd season as a 49er…

Montana and Steve Young were in west coast, pass first offenses. There’s a reason Jerry Rice had 20,000 receiving yards and 200tds

Steve young only had 3 total (Ricky and garrison Hearst) RBs eclipse 1000 yards…

Emmitt Smith had 11 1000 yard seasons

8 10+ Rushing TD seasons. He had a 25, 21, 18 rush TD season.

Dude was routinely getting 400+ touches per season.

To think Troy would ever be allowed to throw the ball a lot, with Emmitt being the focal point like that is ludicrous.

But look at Troy’s mechanics, look at how he threw the pill. Dude had an elite arm. He wasn’t allowed to showcase it like Montana or Steve, or Marino. Him and Steven Young, and Kelly were the only dudes from the 90s who were career 60% passers.

You can’t look at stats with Aikman when his RB had 18,000 rushing yards and 164 rush TDs.

Put Troy in a pass-first offense and he’s easily getting 50,000+ and 300+ TDs.

Troy’s are was wayyyyy better than Montana’s or Young’s. Dan Marino played 17 years and only had maybe 2 or 3 1000 yard rushers.

No one even knows who played RB for those Dolphins teams. That’s how much they threw the ball

the problem with aikman’s numbers is the high number of turnovers on a regular basis

if you have a lower usage, of course you’ll have lower “positive” volume stats or should.. but with everything you gotta add context, it’s like with the air raid guys

but aikman had zero problem being up there in INTs every year.. he has multiple years with under 400 attempts and double digit INTs

i look at it as a positive that we as a whole are getting smarter at football.. and realize the importance of oline and surrounding guys with talent and having smart coaches and organizations

for the cowboys as a whole, it’s not surprising that things fell off once jimmy was gone and as we know the impact over usage of RBs can have

 

[finessence]

the problem with aikman’s numbers is the high number of turnovers on a regular basis

if you have a lower usage, of course you’ll have lower “positive” volume stats or should.. but with everything you gotta add context, it’s like with the air raid guys

but aikman had zero problem being up there in INTs every year.. he has multiple years with under 400 attempts and double digit INTs

i look at it as a positive that we as a whole are getting smarter at football.. and realize the importance of oline and surrounding guys with talent and having smart coaches and organizations

for the cowboys as a whole, it’s not surprising that things fell off once jimmy was gone and as we know the impact over usage of RBs can have

I mean Elway, Favre, Marino, all through INTs at a high clip also. Even if Troy threw it at the same clip as them, he’d have the same numbers.

His first two seasons, he was thrown to wolves and had 18 INTs each year. He never threw over 14 after that.

After that is was 10-14 per season which was the average in the 80s and 90s. Rules were wayyyy different. Everyone was throwing 10+ and 20+ INTs per season back then.

Troy had a lower INT% than Elway, Kelly, and Favre. So basically if he threw it as much as them, they’d all have the same amount of INTs

 

[IATT]

Clown millennial behavior. They want everyone in there business, then get upset. They don’t realize that it makes them look crazy. But airing of dirty laundry is the millennial/Gen-Z thing to do. If you date a young person, best believe everything will be recorded, screenshot, documented or posted some way or another

The soap box generations

nah man people always been messy, just got more opportunities to be blatantly, unabashedly messy these days

but shhh BEEN going down publicly since forever

id even say at least these days we get more of an opportunity to hear full sides rather than piece piece here and there

 

[dwileykyot]

Either of you care to provide proof that he was considered a top 3 quarterback in the 90s?

Here’s my proof straight from the horses mouth

Spoiler

Pro Football 101: Cowboys QB Troy Aikman ranks No. 89 on the all-time list | Fox Sports

Troy Aikman didn't rack up the gaudiest stats, but he was one of the best ever when it came to winning, Joe Posnanski writes.

amp.foxsports.com

Others have already said what I would’ve. Don’t let revisionist history change the perception of him at the time. 6 straight pro bowls during their run is proof how the league/fans thought of him.

Dude was nice idc

 

[IATT]

I mean Elway, Favre, Marino, all through INTs at a high clip also. Even if Troy through it at the same clip as them, he’d have the same.

His first two seasons, he was thrown to wolves and had 18 INTs each year. He never threw.

After that is was 10-14 per season which was the average in the 80s and 90s

but that’s the thing.. you can’t talk about his lack of opportunities conveniently when it comes to lack of “positive“ numbers

the guys you mentioned were throwing it a whole lot more and that’s what their teams needed

 

[finessence]

but that’s the thing.. you can’t talk about his lack of opportunities conveniently when it comes to lack of “positive“ numbers

the guys you mentioned were throwing it a whole lot more and that’s what their teams needed

I’m not disagreeing. I’m just saying, put Troy in those offenses (just off pure mechanics, how he threw, technique, etc) he’d have the same numbers, probably no Super Bowls but he’d put up numbers.

Put Marino,Elway, Young or Montana on those Cowboys and they’d have Troy’s numbers with the same productivity from Emmitt. There numbers would be pedestrian just like Troy’s.

The point of a hall of famer is that their skills and talent transcend eras and scheme styles. Troy is a HOF because of his skillset, not numbers. His numbers suffered because our personnel was predicated on running the football

 

[finessence]

People be talking like Troy was Ken Dorsey on those University of Miami teams, throwing ducks and noodle-arming his throws. Hoping and praying they reach their destination

Troy had a top 5 arm. Dude lowkey throws exactly like Aaron Rodgers. Of course I got to watch him as a kid too. Look at the footage. Dude could make every throw, with elite accuracy too.

 

[IATT]

I’m not disagreeing. I’m just saying, put Troy in those offenses (just off pure mechanics, how he threw, technique, etc) he’d have the same numbers, probably no Super Bowls but he’d put up numbers.

Put Marino,Elway, Young or Montana on those Cowboys and they’d have Troy’s numbers with the same productivity from Emmitt. There numbers would be pedestrian just like Troy’s.

The point of a hall of famer is that their skills and talent transcend eras and scheme styles. Troy is a HOF because of his skillset, not numbers. His numbers suffered because our personnel was predicated on running the football

irvin is the guy who should be salty about the volume number stats

but with aikman, you’re not getting a better situation elsewhere and being asked to throw it a 1/3rd more than he usually was in a season

most seasons he was around 400 attempts or less… those other guys are in the mid to high 500s

 

[IATT]

People be talking like Troy was Ken Dorsey on those University of Miami teams, throwing ducks and noodle-arming his throws. Hoping and praying they reach their destination

Troy had a top 5 arm. Dude lowkey throws exactly like Aaron Rodgers. Of course I got to watch him as a kid too. Look at the footage. Dude could make every throw, with elite accuracy too.

the talent was always obvious which is why whatever switzer’s issues with dude never made any sense either in college but especially in the nfl

but just saying as we look back his lack of all pros make a whole lot more sense then when we were automatically grouping him in with certain guys

and just like with shooting in the NBA, there’s a greater focus on accuracy now then there was then and the development in that area is a whole lot more now

but just like now we’re smart enough about the game to speak about dudes in certain perspectives to say there is mahomes and THEN this group and THEN this group and add context to the convo.. we can go back and look at these older guys and get deeper

 

[Maximus Meridius]

Shazier cheating and sending his sneaky link books on anal sex and you’re upset with his wife for sharing her pain? Lmao

It was sarcasm, relax.

 

[IATT]

 

[xxpizzo]

Game might do 35M this weekend

 

[broncos19dm]