aojmf
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for real tho
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Originally Posted by WallyHopp
It's been happening for awhile now. I think the proper term is "Constitutional Terrorist".
A FBI pamplet given to various law enforcement divisions in the Phoenix area n received this awhile back
http://www.progress.org/fold223.htm
What the FBI agents and police officers are to look for include "Someone who makes numerous references to the U.S. Constitution." So if a highway patrol officer flashes his lights and orders you to pull over to the side and stop, and he says he will arrest you because the bumper sticker on your car says "Preserve the Bill of Rights," and you say you have a Constitutional right to free speech, he could brand you a terrorist suspect.
Originally Posted by rashi
people are against the idea of being searched because they feel they are above being searched...
if you are getting on a plane they are going to search you....
period.
right to be free of "illegal searches".....you agree to be searched when you buy a plane ticket....
Show me where it says that in the Terms and Agreements when you buy a plane ticket.
If the pilots were allowed to carry guns on the plane, this owuldn't even be a discussion. 9/11 would have never happened.
a.) because they fly regular flights so regularly, right?(besides, im pretty sure the background check to work in the president's cabinet is more in depth than TSA, anyway, good one, tho)
b.) it doesnt say it in the terms and agreements, actually, i have no idea if it does or doesnt because i dont read it. But its quite understood that, if you want to fly on an airplane, you're going to go through a security checkpoint....are you refuting that? is it not commonplace in every american airport to go through a security checkpoint, however in depth or lacking it is? When i said 'when you buy a ticket, you agree to be searched" i wasnt saying implicitly that the law states that....im saying that its COMMONLY understood that, in the united states, buying a plane ticket and showing up at an airport ready to board a plane ALSO means going through a security checkpoint...IF YOU DONT WANT TO BE SEARCHED, DONT FLY IN AN AIRPLANE. IF THEY STOP YOU IN YOUR RENTAL CAR AND TRY TO SEARCH YOU, CRY ABOUT THE 4TH AMEMDMENT ALL YOU WANT
c.) opinion/speculation. You have no idea what would or wouldnt have happened with a gun or not.
thats like me showing up to the white house then taking offense to being searched....
"WHY ARE YOU SEARCHING ME? IM AN AMERICAN, THIS IS AN ILLEGAL SEARCH"
to go in the white house, you gotta get searched
to go on a plane, you gotta get searched
to go in certain nightclubs, you gotta be searched
AGAIN
the people up in arms about this are the people who feel they're above being searched....searches are for "those terrorist" people....not "us americans".....how dare the TSA touch me? do they not know who i am? im Joe Blow from Idaho.....i have rights!
no. they are against them b/c they are overly invasive and have no real effect on securityOriginally Posted by Dirtylicious
people are against the idea of being searched because they feel they are above being searched...
if you are getting on a plane they are going to search you....
period.
Originally Posted by ShadyKay NT
inb4 TSA fingers LDS bootyhole to check for crackrocks.
Originally Posted by LarryDavidSwag
Originally Posted by Dirtylicious
I don't see what that has to to with accepting these searches
people are against the idea of being searched because they feel they are above being searched...
if you are getting on a plane they are going to search you....
period.
oh, okayOriginally Posted by Icecixz
Originally Posted by LarryDavidSwag
Originally Posted by Dirtylicious
I don't see what that has to to with accepting these searches
people are against the idea of being searched because they feel they are above being searched...
if you are getting on a plane they are going to search you....
period.
And dont turn this into an Airbus vs. Private Jet matter
Dont be delusional. Their are alternatives to security at airports which dont violate rights. Ex: the Cruise line industry's way of screenings. But instead of offering solutions or changing certain aspects which doesnt violate rights you rather just spin the topic.Originally Posted by LarryDavidSwag
oh, okayOriginally Posted by Icecixz
Originally Posted by LarryDavidSwag
people are against the idea of being searched because they feel they are above being searched...
if you are getting on a plane they are going to search you....
period.
And dont turn this into an Airbus vs. Private Jet matter
guess i have nothing to say to you, then
@ celebrities on private jets don't get searched, why should everyone else
YES, BECAUSE WE NEED TO RUN A BACKGROUND CHECK ON KANYE WEST TO KNOW WHO HE IS AND WHY HE'S FLYING ON A JET BY HIMSELF
(and why do rappers always complain about going through security checkpoints with all their jewelery, then? that's just for effect on rap records?)
do they pat down the pilot before he gets in a single passenger cessna, too?
THEN WHY SHOULD THEY CHECK MILLIONS OF PEOPLE WHO FLY EVERYDAY?
Originally Posted by LarryDavidSwag
no. they are against them b/c they are overly invasive and have no real effect on securityOriginally Posted by Dirtylicious
people are against the idea of being searched because they feel they are above being searched...
if you are getting on a plane they are going to search you....
period.
people were ok with Xrays.metal detectors back of the hand pat-downs.. but then they switched to full on groping and these unproven backscatter machines that don't even pick up PETN.
a.) because they fly regular flights so regularly, right?(besides, im pretty sure the background check to work in the president's cabinet is more in depth than TSA, anyway, good one, tho)
Who cares, they aren't above us "regular" people and no, I can guarantee you they don't get searched.
b.) it doesnt say it in the terms and agreements, actually, i have no idea if it does or doesnt because i dont read it. But its quite understood that, if you want to fly on an airplane, you're going to go through a security checkpoint....are you refuting that? is it not commonplace in every american airport to go through a security checkpoint, however in depth or lacking it is? When i said 'when you buy a ticket, you agree to be searched" i wasnt saying implicitly that the law states that....im saying that its COMMONLY understood that, in the united states, buying a plane ticket and showing up at an airport ready to board a plane ALSO means going through a security checkpoint...IF YOU DONT WANT TO BE SEARCHED, DONT FLY IN AN AIRPLANE. IF THEY STOP YOU IN YOUR RENTAL CAR AND TRY TO SEARCH YOU, CRY ABOUT THE 4TH AMEMDMENT ALL YOU WANT
It doesn't say it. The government intrudes on a contract between airline and individual. The government shouldn't be dictating who gets on a plane or not, they don't own that plane. Let the airline company figure that out.
c.) opinion/speculation. You have no idea what would or wouldnt have happened with a gun or not.
Come on, guy. The guys invaded the +%!$ pit with practically nothing.
thats like me showing up to the white house then taking offense to being searched....
"WHY ARE YOU SEARCHING ME? IM AN AMERICAN, THIS IS AN ILLEGAL SEARCH"
to go in the white house, you gotta get searched
to go on a plane, you gotta get searched
to go in certain nightclubs, you gotta be searched
There is a very big difference. A nightclub provides security by people who are experience in searches, it is part of the contract you have with the night club. You pay to go into the nightclub, but you have to be searched.
The White House is a federal building that also requires searches before entering. That is the contract between you and the White House.
The you pay the airline company to ride on a plane, it is not in the terms to purchase to be molested by a government official who has no experience before boarding the plane. With a third party stooge, who has nothing to do with the contract you have with the airline being an inconvenience. There is no contractual obligation to be searched by the TSA.
You have no concept of free and open contracts.
the people up in arms about this are the people who feel they're above being searched....searches are for "those terrorist" people....not "us americans".....how dare the TSA touch me? do they not know who i am? im Joe Blow from Idaho.....i have rights!
I wish that George W. Bush was still President. He was a terrible President but he put civil liberties at the forefront of the national discussion.
What?
Yeah, he said a big F U to Civil Liberties via the PATRIOT Act.
Originally Posted by Mojodmonky1
Originally Posted by GrimlocK
Originally Posted by Nawth21
Not trying to justify anything, I'm just saying there is a better reason for the 4th amendment being in place. Don't like it, don't fly. No one is being FORCED. Flying is voluntary. It's like drug testing for potential employees. It's not an assumption of guilt, it's just a hoop you have to jump through in order to do something (fly, get a job, whatever). That doesn't mean people can't be upset over it, but I wouldn't go so far as it being a violation of our rightsHell, sign me up for the scanning and the pat down. I have nothing to hide and I don't really care if someone sees my quasi nekkid outline. Oh gee the horror.
They put that "reasonable" in there for a reason. Leaves it open for interpretation.
So why do we have rights in the first place if they can just take them away at will. I agree with Rashi on this one, we aren't talking about other countries, so please don't bring that b.s. response "oh you don't like it here?...go move to another country...duhhhh!"
Of course we have the option of flying vs. not flying but why should we get demoted in rights for the same thing we've done for years? You wanna pat us down, use metal detectors/wands, remove a turban or headress...okay but don't try and get me buttnaked just to prove a point.
Then again I was trying to carry somethrough an airport so i'm biased as hell
whether right or wrong, we suffer cause some animals were able to bring weapons onto a plane, take it over, and crash them into the WTC.
in response to your other issue Grimlock... what we need to do to circumvent the new problem of stashin on planes is to develop of community of like minded individuals to help each other out. It is a minor (actually major) inconvenience when I travel for vacation and have to go a week without the. For better or worse, that helps me relax, and isnt the point of vacation to relax and enjoy yourself?
If you traveling out to socal, I got you brother. No need to worrry bout tryin to juke out the TSA bodyscan.
Originally Posted by AntonLaVey
Originally Posted by Mojodmonky1
Originally Posted by GrimlocK
So why do we have rights in the first place if they can just take them away at will. I agree with Rashi on this one, we aren't talking about other countries, so please don't bring that b.s. response "oh you don't like it here?...go move to another country...duhhhh!"
Of course we have the option of flying vs. not flying but why should we get demoted in rights for the same thing we've done for years? You wanna pat us down, use metal detectors/wands, remove a turban or headress...okay but don't try and get me buttnaked just to prove a point.
Then again I was trying to carry somethrough an airport so i'm biased as hell
whether right or wrong, we suffer cause some animals were able to bring weapons onto a plane, take it over, and crash them into the WTC.
in response to your other issue Grimlock... what we need to do to circumvent the new problem of stashin on planes is to develop of community of like minded individuals to help each other out. It is a minor (actually major) inconvenience when I travel for vacation and have to go a week without the. For better or worse, that helps me relax, and isnt the point of vacation to relax and enjoy yourself?
If you traveling out to socal, I got you brother. No need to worrry bout tryin to juke out the TSA bodyscan.
I'm sorry I fly, very often and the TSA is nothing more than an inconvenience. Nobody is "suffering" because of this. Let's be real. The TSA is going to come to your crib and kill your mother and rape your children.
Originally Posted by James Earl Zones
Originally Posted by WallyHopp
It's been happening for awhile now. I think the proper term is "Constitutional Terrorist".
A FBI pamplet given to various law enforcement divisions in the Phoenix area n received this awhile back
http://www.progress.org/fold223.htm
What the FBI agents and police officers are to look for include "Someone who makes numerous references to the U.S. Constitution." So if a highway patrol officer flashes his lights and orders you to pull over to the side and stop, and he says he will arrest you because the bumper sticker on your car says "Preserve the Bill of Rights," and you say you have a Constitutional right to free speech, he could brand you a terrorist suspect.
These threats are very real. They want us all to shut up and take it
this. there has to be a proper balance between safety and privacy.Originally Posted by TeamJordan79
a lot of ppl would argue that its more about the principle and the potential incremental relinquishment of rights. Today its boarding planes, tomorrow its dudes running up in our homes with rifles w/o a warrant. Most people would be ok with this imo, except that there is a lot of talk of expanding these searches to malls, public venues, transport etc.Originally Posted by LarryDavidSwag
eh, at the same time tho, its not like you randomly surrender that right...
youre buying a plane ticket and riding a plane...
plane riding is dangerous enough as it is....
i, for one, have no issue with being searched OR interrogated...
if this was on the street, tho (a la Arizona) i'd be against it
planes?
im all for it.
Originally Posted by DutchMasterRoller
Dude exercised his rights and was violated, I dont see what the argument is about
BTw kbweezy24 that avy is tight what fight is that?