Kobe Bryant = PLAYER OF THE CENTURY???

[worldbeefreeg]

 And Kobe was a leading MVP candidate in the first half of the season.  At you guys thinking Bean doesn't have it anymore.

My goodness, how quickly they forget...

He's been sweeped out the playoffs and beaten to a pulp the past two years while still being straddled by two all-star seven footers. That would make me think he doesn't have "it" anymore. Real talk, if Kobe isn't scoring 30+ what he is bringing to the table that night anymore?

 

[ThaxbyChamblis]

Why do you all argue hypotheticals?

Because you can't let facts get in the way of a good argument

 

[do be doo]

 And Kobe was a leading MVP candidate in the first half of the season.  At you guys thinking Bean doesn't have it anymore.

My goodness, how quickly they forget...

He doesn't check this.

 

[do be doo]

Think about this too.

Beandip and shaq won three together. Right? How did they do without each other?

Shaq - 1
Beandip - 2

Hmmm

now lets look at TIM Duncan who never played with a "top five players in the NBA" as a teammate.

Duncan - 3 rings.

With 2 FInals Mvp. And 2 RS MVP.

Now tell me who REALLY is the player of the century?

 

[iamyourfather]

Outplayed by Miller?

.. clearly shows that you don't know what you're talking about.. if i remember correctly Miller went 1-15 or something in Game 1 against Kobe, sorry to burst your bubble little fellow
Kobe got injured in Game 2, remember? .. Sat out game 3 and Indiana earned their first win.. Kobe came back in Game 4 and we all know what happened then..
He did struggle in Game 5 . HORRIBLY..
I love the fact that you didn't even mention that he was playing injured. SHAQ was clearly the #1 option but you making it sound like Kobe sat to the bench and made little impact in that series.

kobe was outplayed by reggie miller. if game 1 was miller's screw up then kobe gets that game 5 pass. he was also outplayed in every game he played by jalen rose. and even in at least 1 game was outscored by mark jackson who was 177 years old at that point in his career. 

the team with "two #1 options" pretty much has kobe gone for 1 entire game, gone for all but 10 minutes in game 2, a complete choke job in game 5 and still wins the title in 6 games. 

Shaq = batman, kobe = smithers in 2000.

 

[iamyourfather]

Think about this too.
Beandip and shaq won three together. Right? How did they do without each other?
Shaq - 1
Beandip - 2
Hmmm
now lets look at TIM Duncan who never played with a "top five players in the NBA" as a teammate.
Duncan - 3 rings.
With 2 FInals Mvp. And 2 RS MVP.
Now tell me who REALLY is the player of the century?

u can make the case of who was the better 'franchise player' also comparing duncan and kobe's careers and what they brought to their teams/franchises

kobe wasnt really drafted to be an impact player right away, duncan was

duncan pretty much led the spurs to their first title in 99 as a sophomore (winning finals mvp), had a greater impact in games for the spurs than kobe did being a frontcourt player, esp on defense

first 10 years in the league

duncan had 4 titles, 3x finals mvp, 2x league mvp, 

kobe = 3 nba titles, 0 finals mvp, 0 league mvp

to date, its 5 titles, 2 finals mvp, 1x league mvp (kobe) vs 4 titles, 3x finals mvp, 2x league mvp (duncan)

so yes theres an argument to be made duncan vs kobe. esp considering the teammates, 

that ridic illuminati move they pulled trading gasol for KWAME BROWN is the only reason kobe has post-shaq success in his career. otherwise he would've either signed with another team or continued to lead the lakers to the same post season success he experienced after shaq left. 

 

[CP1708]

that ridic illuminati move they pulled trading gasol for KWAME BROWN is the only reason kobe has post-shaq success in his career. otherwise he would've either signed with another team or continued to lead the lakers to the same post season success he experienced after shaq left.

I know right? Cuz Kwame, Luke Walton and Smush Parker is alot like having Manu Ginobili and Tony Parker in their primes huh? Kobe is so much worse cuz he had no help, and Dunc did it all alone.


It's been and always will be obvious, til the end of time the trolls are just going to take this away, take that away, Kobe didn't do this, Kobe didn't do that, Shaq, Pau, Dwight Howard, 6-24, all of that was something else, but not Kobe.

Kobe with Kwame, Smush and Luke as his starters, THAT"S the true indicator of Kobe's legacy. Those years, those were all actual factual proof. The other 14-15 years of his career, those were all somebody else.

Duncan barely made it longer than Shaq. Duncan been washed up since 2006, Tony got him that extra ring in 07, well, that and the Pistons folded after 6 years of ECF runs and ran out of gas against Lebron. Since then, we haven't seen Duncan do a damn thing but play 3rd fiddle to Manu and TP.

 

[do be doo]

Duncan did do it all alone.

at duncan having to play with a past his prime David. Then carry 28 and 56 picks to the promise land. (

Check the 03 SPURS team take out Duncan and they get a lottery top 5 pick that year.

Plus some would say Beandips prime years were that 05-07 era. The best he could do was 1st round exits. :x

To break it down some players need more help than others. kobe needed a top 5 player as his teammate and 2 seven footers.

 

[Maximus Meridius]

These Kobe threads are always entertaining. It's crazy how much hate people STILL have for this dude. I don't even know why some yall waste your time debating these dudes.

You got people still tryna act like Kobe was a role player during the three-peat, somebody else is tryna say Melo is better than him. Wow.

 

[CP1708]

See everybody? Everyone see that?

Then carry 28 and 56 picks to the promise land

This right here, this is a fraud spurs fan. Knockin on Manu and Tony Parker, right here inside of a Kobe Bryant thread.

And yet, whenever someone say somethin about those 2 in another thread, he'll swoop in to save them to the best of his abilities, but when it comes to Duncan, he acts like they straight bums.

HOFers in other threads, bums when it helps make a case for Duncan.

Somebody's fugazi is showing.........

what a poser.

 

[worldbeefreeg]

These Kobe threads are always entertaining. It's crazy how much hate people STILL have for this dude. I don't even know why some yall waste your time debating these dudes.
You got people still tryna act like Kobe was a role player during the three-peat, somebody else is tryna say Melo is better than him. Wow.

Kobe is a top 10 player prolly ever I actually like him, I just don't think he is that great anymore. I said at this current moment, Melo is better than him. Someone explain to me how Kobe is more than a volume scorer at this point in his career? I still haven't seen anybody debate that point.

I never said he was a role player during the finals, I just said at this current moment, Melo is better than him. Kobe is 34 years old with a ton of miles on him, he isn't especially explosive anymore, doesn't rebound as well as he used to and isn't a very good defender anymore. If he's not on he doesn't bring too much to the table anymore. Its why he played dreadful at times during the Olympics.

 

[Maximus Meridius]

These Kobe threads are always entertaining. It's crazy how much hate people STILL have for this dude. I don't even know why some yall waste your time debating these dudes.
You got people still tryna act like Kobe was a role player during the three-peat, somebody else is tryna say Melo is better than him. Wow.

Kobe is a top 10 player prolly ever I actually like him, I just don't think he is that great anymore. I said at this current moment, Melo is better than him. Someone explain to me how Kobe is more than a volume scorer at this point in his career? I still haven't seen anybody debate that point.

I never said he was a role player during the finals, I just said at this current moment, Melo is better than him. Kobe is 34 years old with a ton of miles on him, he isn't especially explosive anymore, doesn't rebound as well as he used to and isn't a very good defender anymore. If he's not on he doesn't bring too much to the table anymore. Its why he played dreadful at times during the Olympics.

I wasnt taking about you on that. The other dudes that stay in here saying the same stuff over and over. You made some good though. Father time is catching up to him but I still dont think somebody like Melo is better than him. Melo is a great scorer but thats it. With his size he should be getting alot more rebounds. I like Melo but its like we are still waiting on him to take that next step. When Melo does play good defense it gets talked about because we rarely see it. While Kobe is in decline he's still gonna give 100% on both ends. We know what Kobe can do in June. Kobe can still get 26+ a game and 5 & 5. I'll take that over waiting for Melo to mix his great scoring wth team chemistry and getting outta the first round again.

 

[CP1708]

I mean, he's still getting 5 and a half boards a game from the SG position and little over 4 and a half assists a game at 34 with a steal a game, and he doesn't get burned on D by anybody when he actually tries. He don't lock down like he used to, but he isn't abused by anybody either. Those averages are pretty much in line with his whole career minus an extra assist a game and maybe half a rebound. He's been 25, 5, and 5 for 12-13 years now give or take a percentage point. But yeah, all he does is score. *shrugs*

Saying Melo is better than him is funny to me, but I don't have the interest to argue it. I've wasted millions of words in here already.

 

[DCAllAfrican]

Because you can't let facts get in the way of a good argument

But hypotheticals will never be settled

 

[mertonhanks]

Duncan been washed up since 2006, Tony got him that extra ring in 07

The way dudes disrespect the Greatest PF of all time is Straight Comical. If you actually watched the finals, Mike Brown (who came from SA) let Parker run free and score points by making Duncan a distributer. Parker outscored Duncan in the finals but Duncan put up more Rebs, Assists, Blocks, Steals, etc...

Duncan averaged 20 and 11 in the regular season shooting 55% in 34 minutes of play per night.
Parker averaged 19 and 6 in the regular season shooting 48% in 33 minutes of play per night

Duncan averaged Duncan averaged 22, 12, 3blks in that postseason run while shooting 52% from field.
Parker averaged 21 and 6 assists in the playoffs while shooting 48% from the field.


Parker "carried" Duncan by scoring less points, rebounds, and shooting a lesser FG percentage. Im not even going to bring up Defense.


I guess 22 and 12 is washed up... :\




Edit: Oh wait, I see the LA LAKERS in your sig, now I get where youre comin from.

 

[JD617]

I think CP was just using Do Be Doo's logic against him.

 

[CP1708]

You use that term logic loosely I'm sure.

Whoever was just yelling at me and showing stats about Duncan to me, calm down. And reading my sig don't tell you nothing about me and what I think dude, bigger things goin on in here bruh.

 

[iamyourfather]

I know right? Cuz Kwame, Luke Walton and Smush Parker is alot like having Manu Ginobili and Tony Parker in their primes huh? Kobe is so much worse cuz he had no help, and Dunc did it all alone.

It's been and always will be obvious, til the end of time the trolls are just going to take this away, take that away, Kobe didn't do this, Kobe didn't do that, Shaq, Pau, Dwight Howard, 6-24, all of that was something else, but not Kobe.
Kobe with Kwame, Smush and Luke as his starters, THAT"S the true indicator of Kobe's legacy. Those years, those were all actual factual proof. The other 14-15 years of his career, those were all somebody else.

Duncan barely made it longer than Shaq. Duncan been washed up since 2006, Tony got him that extra ring in 07, well, that and the Pistons folded after 6 years of ECF runs and ran out of gas against Lebron. Since then, we haven't seen Duncan do a damn thing but play 3rd fiddle to Manu and TP.

kobe cried when his team didnt have another "superstar" next to him, demanded trades and threw andrew bynum under the bus several times. 

so some satanic force allows the lakers to rape the grizz and ship kwame and a bag of doritos for one of the best big men in the game. finally gets back to the finals with odom and gasol as his teammates and what happens? lakers get violated in 6 and lose a SERIES clinching game 6 by 39 points, shooting 7-22 (31% fg) with 4 turnovers.  AND being outplayed (again) in the finals (again) by paul pierce. 

clearly, kobe's had a better time as a sidekick vs as a leader for the lakers. even if you ignore everything post-shaq and pre-gasol. the proof is in the pudding, kobe's best success came when he was being carried by shaq 

 

[CP1708]

I got a few minutes, why not?

08 means a lot to you, I see this. You forgot to mention 40% of his starting lineup was out that series, but you knew that I'm sure. But we won't bring it up, cuz it don't matter, right?

Paul Pierce, MVP of the series. Defended by Luke Walton and Vlad Radmonovic. Oh.

Question. If Luke Walton and Vlad Rad guard Kobe for a 6 game series, how does Kobe do? I hope you get the point of that.

Kobe had to choose, guard Ray, guard Rondo, guard Paul. Can't gaurd ALL of them, can only take 1, at a time at least. Naturally thru a series you will switch off onto each of them as the series goes along.

Boston on the other hand, guarded Kobe with Allen, Pierce, Posey, Tony Allen, and even some Rondo if I remember correctly. IE, they had BODIES to throw at Kobe. ENDLESS amounts of bodies.

So yes, Paul Pierce did outplay Kobe in that series. Cuz ya know, it was even in how they were defended.

Everything I just said tho, probably won't mean jack **** and some more haters will come and give you thumbs up and pat you on the back and you'll all feel good about yourselves. Only, you'll all look stupid. But hey, what do I know? I have Lakers in my sig. I know nothing.


As for demanding to be traded, Bynum, blah blah blah. Was he traded? No. Did they trade Bynum in 07? No. Did Bynum get a fire lit under him? Yes. Did he develop? Yes. There ya go. That's the end of your point. He said words, but nothing actually happened. He didn't quit, leave, hold out, or play for another team. He kept playing. Bynum and the rest of the bunch were actually near the top of the Western conference BEFORE Pau got there, in other words, they were improving as a unit. Bynum, Ariza was brought in, Fish was back, Farmar and Sasha were now useful, the team was growing on its own, Pau sealed the deal for them only to have 2 big holes created when Bynum and Ariza went down. (Bynum went down literally days before the trade) So please, spare all this trade/Bynum crap, it has zero point to anything except you and your buddies hate Kobe, which is perfectly fine.

 

[worldbeefreeg]

My point CP was if you asked melo or Kobe to get 10 rebounds right now, I think Melo could do it more easily. Same with scoring 40 points in a playoff game. I know all the knocks on Melo but he is still a tremendously talented player that when his game is clicking is as good as anybody in the league. And I know he hasnt neccisarily taken the steps but since D'antoni got fired and he started trying he has been pretty ******g good. I think that will carry over to this year.

Both Melo vs. Kobe have a lot of pressure on them this year, it will be interesting to see how this season plays out for both of them.

 

[do be doo]

d

Rep. great post.

According to you CP both Manu and Parker are not NBA HOF'ers right? they are only getting in cause of their international careers right?. (

Plus didn't Duncan play with Bowen??? Didn't you laugh that the SPURS retire Bowen's jersey? Guess that means he wasnt very good right? (

And didnt beandip get coach by the zen master. A proven winner with the Bulls. How many did POP win before Tim? (

Guess It was TIM DUNCAN who made everyone better. Never a complaint from Tim to get him "a top 5 player". Not a peep. Just improve the franchise and won with what he got.

 

[CP1708]

Did you see me mention Bowen smart guy? No, you didn't. So why you bringing him up?

And yes, I don't think Manu and Tony SHOULD be in the HOF, but you argued they should, NOW you're taking that back, to make Tim look better. Clown behavior. Even if I don't think the 2 of them should be in the HOF (and I for one said multiple times on this board, well, Yuku's board) that Tony Parker was better than Steve Nash while Nash was winning MVP's, so gee, I dunno, did I ever say Parker sucks? Oh, you gettin confused now ain't ya?

And when did Kobe ever clamor for a top 5 player to come help him? When did Kobe say that? Show me that quote, article, video, audio file, whatever the **** you makin stuff up about. Show it to this board. Oh that's right, it never happened. He said HELP. Get him HELP, as in, not Kwame, Smush and Luke. He never said bring me a top 5 player, and if he did, the Lakers didn't. They brought him a top 12 player, not a top 5, so why you spinnin **** to make it sound like you have a clue?

So yeah, spin away troll, it's all you know, so go on with it. I'll just keep slappin you around as usual in here.

Rep. great post.

Everything I just said tho, probably won't mean jack **** and some more haters will come and give you thumbs up and pat you on the back and you'll all feel good about yourselves

I didn't call that one now did I?

 

[do be doo]

Wait so is Drew not a top 2 center in the league last year? Gasol isnt a top 5 PF in the game? Beandip couldn't win with that. :x

Damn imagine if Duncan had one of them to play beside him this year But nope SPURS give him Tiago and 6'7 no ACLs blair at the end of Duncan career. :x

You hear Duncan ask for help? Nope takes the SPURS to the WCF 2 games shy of the NBA finals this year. :x

How did the leader koME do? only wins ONE game in the second round the last two seasons. :x

 

[CP1708]

Yep, we had 3 players, what else did LA have of use? Hell, Ron missed all but 5 playoff games, so he wasn't much help for us. Know a lot of 3 man teams winning stuff do you? I know, everyone will quickly point to the Heat, and maybe rightly so.

I see, 2 games shy of the Finals is your goal now? Cool. I guess getting knocked out in the first round and swept in the second round the year before that saved up his legs for a nice run, beating the Clippers and the Jazz........I'm extremely impressed by those wins.


Truth bombs.

 

[jjs]

The spurs of last year are centered around tony parker. The game is around him.

Tim has a second role now.

But for all the years before that, Tim was the man.

He is still really good, but the spurs's game does not run around him anymore. More Parker now.