Information Technology (IT)

[luckyluchiano]

You think so? I don't at all.
You won't make it past the weed out courses without coding. Pull up any CS curriculum it will be heavily focused on programming.


Goodluck man @LuckyLuchiano
 

Goodluck to you too @silkboi

Yea CS is essnntially Focused on building developers while CIS/MIS is for the other areas of IT minus computer engineerings.


And thanks

 

[luckyluchiano]

Good luck. I have one coming up next week and hopefully will get a call about another position.

Yea hoping i get one of these roles because my new gig was misrepresented and the project is a mess on a level higher than those of us in the office. Lots of unneeded stress for something i dont feel i am gaining any valuable experience in.

 

[yogurt]

 

 
The syntax is trivial to the program. Programming is just a tiny subset of computer science. You could theoretically study/obtain a BS in CS without coding.

You think so? I don't at all.

You won't make it past the weed out courses without coding. Pull up any CS curriculum it will be heavily focused on programming.

I mean, you definitely need to code for the courses, but a lot of the topics use the programming in order to implement the theory.

Take data structures and algorithms for example. You'll be implementing them in various coding languages, but the abstract theory behind them isn't based on the code, it's based on logic and set theory - it just uses the code as a way to apply them. 

 

[capital sb]

 
I mean, you definitely need to code for the courses, but a lot of the topics use the programming in order to implement the theory.

Take data structures and algorithms for example. You'll be implementing them in various coding languages, but the abstract theory behind them isn't based on the code, it's based on logic and set theory - it just uses the code as a way to apply them. 

Exactly, to prove that you understand and can apply the principles and theories, you have to submit a program. You also have to pass exams with questions that require you to write working code on paper.

You don't submit a working program in your courses you will fail. Programming projects are usually due every 2-3 weeks, this goes on for pretty much all 4 years of the degree (2 programs/mo on average) . Programs count for almost 50% of your grade in most courses.

I just think you all aren't really being realistic, this is coming from someone who struggled through the first 2 years of CS. I didn't really learn how to program well until my 3rd year in.

Do you all have CS degrees?

 

[yogurt]

Exactly, to prove that you understand and can apply the principles and theories, you have to submit a program. You also have to pass exams with questions that require you to write working code on paper.

You don't submit a working program in your courses you will fail. Programming projects are usually due every 2-3 weeks, this goes on for pretty much all 4 years of the degree (2 programs/mo on average) . Programs count for almost 50% of your grade in most courses.

I just think you all aren't really being realistic, this is coming from someone who struggled through the first 2 years of CS. I didn't really learn how to program well until my 3rd year in.

Do you all have CS degrees?

I guess what I'm trying to say is that programming isn't computer science - the field of CS is more abstract than people give it credit for. That's why I said theoretically, you could study it without knowing how to code, but that won't happen in real life. I'm just differentiating studying CS versus studying programming, a lot of people think those two are interchangeable. 

My degree was in math, I took the applied CS courses but had no interest in the theory.

 

[capital sb]

Okay I understand what you are saying, yes CS is a very abstract field.

For recent grads and entry level positions, not that abstract.

Lucky said it best, CS teaches people to become Software Engineers, IS/IT is for other tech specialization,

CE's for hardware (most are going into software now though). Of course you can branch out from these fields, but a BS in these majors pretty much prepare you for one field out of school.

 

[yeah]

Programming isn't computer science, but it is a major component. To say that someone could "theoretically" earn a degree in computer sciense is like saying someone could theoretically earn a ph.d in mathematics without ever using an algorithm.

I mean its abstract, but not that abstract.

 

[capital sb]

I don't know any CS majors/graduates that think CS ins't mainly programming, its dam near all you do for 4 years

 

[sneaky]

You could theoretically study/obtain a BS in CS without coding.

Definitely not possible.

 

[HankHill]

I have a CS degree. I'm sure someone can create a curriculum without the use of coding assignments, but you will still need to look at code if you plan on doing anything with software. Otherwise you're doing CE with a heavy math concentration.

 

[4318michaeljohnson4318]

I'm not aware of any software internships that are taking non technical/software majors. I applied to hundreds of internships don't recall a single one taking non tech/comp eng majors.

Getting into tech, and getting into software engineering are two totally different things IMO. Not saying its impossible, but I think some of the recommendations are very unrealistic. There are CS majors that can barely land an internship out here.

If I remember correctly the guy I responded said tech not cs. Getting into development there are roles that don't require programming i.e. Analysts and sme

 

[luckyluchiano]

If I remember correctly the guy I responded said tech not cs. Getting into development there are roles that don't require programming i.e. Analysts and sme

You might not code but you still have to understand it as a BA/SME.

 

[yanky]

Go to a state

Gen Bio

Going from a BA in Bio to an MS in Comp Sci would be a very bad idea. Unless you know how to program very well, and know programming principles and theories I would not recommend jumping into a MS. MS classes will assume that you already have the foundation, and like others have said there are prerequisites for getting into the program.

Most MS in CS prereqs will include higher level math courses, higher lever programming courses ( advanced data structures and algorithms usually). Most schools also have a prereq of obtaining a similar degree in undergrad (CS, CE, engineering). I say if you want to go the CS route start with a graduate certificates program, and if you do well with that continue on to finish the degree.

I'll explore the graduate certificate program since I think MS is out of my reach right now with my current standing.

yanky

Are you planning on working in tech immediately upon graduation? From what you've mentioned so far, that's probably going to be nearly impossible.

1. Lack of any programming courses: codeacademy may have helped you break into coding, but questions on technical interviews include some academia as well (if this is for a developer role).
   i.e. You learned the sort method/function for a given language online, but I've sat in interviews where they ask "what sort algorithm is faster between bubble-sort, merge-sort, etc". A CS major may be able to recall their Big-O to answer or make a close enough guess. I've never seen that mentioned on any of these tutorial sites.
2. Low GPA: Most companies aren't looking for someone below a 3.0 in this field. Those that do may want you to have a 3.0 in the related CS courses or some related work experience (internship, school help desk, side-projects, etc).

Since you still have 2 semesters left, I'd suggest at least throwing in a "Intro to Programming" class, or an intermediate one, to have something on your transcript. Continue with the self learning as well. If you're not trying to get into the field immediately, maybe taking classes at a community college for an associates/certifican would help?

Again, not impossible, just nearly. I've worked with a guy who was a linguistics major with little to no experience in programming. I guess linguistics can be applied to understanding code syntax, and writing it the best way possible, etc.. I never knew.

This will be my last semester so I signed up for an intro CS class. After graduating I'm not sure I'll even be able to land a job doing anything in the tech field since I have no experience. I'll head to my career center and see what internships are available and hopefully I can land one of them even though I'll be graduating. Thought about getting a couple certificate as well since that may help in the long run.

Depends what you want to do but our tech program at work will take non tech majors. The tech field isn't exclusive to CS work. If you have two semesters left you should try to get an internship. A lot of companies don't care about your skills at the intern level (and to be frank the entry level as well). Most of enterprise technology is processed based work as opposed to what you see on tv. Hell our software testing done at my location has maybe 1 person with a CS degree. Coming out of a college you just need someone to take a chance on you.

Check your schools career website, refresh your resume, and apply to big tech leadership programs. All major companies have them. Some do look to fill rolls in development but like I said that's just one part of technology. MetLife for example fills all roles in their new NC location and gave a great program. I would apply with them as they were willing to offer me a dba-like position with no experience on a prod environment(which lets be honest most students will not have).

You don't know until you try. Apply apply, getting into Technology isn't as hard as people make it seem and def doesn't require a masters in CS.

I'll go to my career center and see what's available. Out of curiosity what were everyone's first job out of school? You don't have to answer if you don't want to. All of this is new to me so I want to get a feel for what jobs I should be looking for and what I'm expected to do.

Also random note but I want to change majors because I figured I'm in sf and there are a TON of startup tech companies here. Landing a job somewhere here can't be that bad.......I hope. :\ That and CS is actually coming along pretty well from what I've learned on my own with the exception of Java.

 

[capital sb]

I have a friend that got an undegrad CS certificate and was able to land a software architecture position. Her UG degree was in architecture though she was extremely talented. 

My first position out of school was Software Engineer 1, just hit my 1 year mark 2 days ago.

 

[yanky]

I have a friend that got an undegrad CS certificate and was able to land a software architecture position. Her UG degree was in architecture though she was extremely talented. 

My first position out of school was Software Engineer 1, just hit my 1 year mark 2 days ago.

Congrats!

 

[capital sb]

Congrats!

Thanks, time is definitely flying.

Goodluck with your career switch.

 

[degenerate423]

My first position out of school was Software Engineer 1, just hit my 1 year mark 2 days ago.

Congrats!

In my 2nd year as well at my current job and I'm trying to figure out a side business I can get going to get out of the 9-5 world .

 

[capital sb]

Congrats!

In my 2nd year as well at my current job and I'm trying to figure out a side business I can get going to get out of the 9-5 world

.

Congrats to you too man ! 

 I feel you, everybody is trying to get of this 9-5 life.

 

[4318michaeljohnson4318]

Where are my ciso employees

Just got enrolled in some arcsight analyst and administrator training. What is the market like for arcsight experience

 

[willie mcfly22]

ok, so im taking classes to obtain a BA in IT, mainly networking. So im in this intro IT class about the busniess and how IT work together. im reading a chapter on how componaines go about gettin new or updating their systems and or computer applications and deploying them whether its in house or outside vendor. its talking about programmers and analysts and whatnot. im kind of interested in that aspect now than the networking. so my question is, and this for software and network folks, is one better than the other? is one more exciting i guess to say, than the other lol. like i could b working on different software for companies rather then building and maintaining networks for companies, right?? i do know writing code is long and tedious and must be really good at it....jus thought that part of IT was really interesting after reading about it.....

 

[capital sb]

Really depends what you are after and what you are willing to do to get into software.

CS degree is very different and much harder than an IT/IS degree.

 

[willie mcfly22]

 
Really depends what you are after and what you are willing to do to get into software.

CS degree is very different and much harder than an IT/IS degree.

Got ya, yea just seemed interesting. Even said in the chapter writing code and developing software is more of a science LOL....I'll be taking a intro to programming class next. had to download a app to my computer called VisualLogic to use for the class...we'll see how it goes

 

[yeah]

You should focus on class and learn more about the industry before you make a choice. You're working on a BA for IT and just started your intro classes, so you've really only been exposed to a tiny piece of what the entire IT industry entails. Computers are used in just about every single industry these days. Consider that before you start trying to make decisions about where you'll end up.

That said, determining if software or networking is better really depends on you. Where do you see yourself in 15 years? What would you like to be doing from 30-60? Your goals? Software will grant you many more job opportunities than network, provided that you are a good developer. Those opportunities also come with more money, on average. The only issue is that most IT programs are not going to teach you how to code well enough, if at all, to land a job.

Networking on the otherhand is a narrowing field. There are a lot of network techs out there, just think about how many ITT Tech commercials you see every day. Unless you plan on getting into very specialized networking, it will be tough to find consistent, high paying work. In spite of that, networking can serve as a better foundation for a long career if you plan on going above networking. When you go with networking, it can lead you to just about anywhere. Whereas if you go with software development, you're pretty much going to be doing that for the foreseeable future.

 

[willie mcfly22]

You should focus on class and learn more about the industry before you make a choice. You're working on a BA for IT and just started your intro classes, so you've really only been exposed to a tiny piece of what the entire IT industry entails. Computers are used in just about every single industry these days. Consider that before you start trying to make decisions about where you'll end up.

That said, determining if software or networking is better really depends on you. Where do you see yourself in 15 years? What would you like to be doing from 30-60? Your goals? Software will grant you many more job opportunities than network, provided that you are a good developer. Those opportunities also come with more money, on average. The only issue is that most IT programs are not going to teach you how to code well enough, if at all, to land a job.

Networking on the otherhand is a narrowing field. There are a lot of network techs out there, just think about how many ITT Tech commercials you see every day. Unless you plan on getting into very specialized networking, it will be tough to find consistent, high paying work. In spite of that, networking can serve as a better foundation for a long career if you plan on going above networking. When you go with networking, it can lead you to just about anywhere. Whereas if you go with software development, you're pretty much going to be doing that for the foreseeable future.

yea im just getting into it so Im deff not making any kind of decisions at this point. jus stating what i was reading about. i like the idea of networking being my foundation because like you said, it can lead me into other opprotunities. im in the Bay Area so the IT world is thriving around these parts so hopefully landing jobs wont be too bad. the expeirence part of it i hope to get while still in school interning or landing some low level help desk gigs or somthing like that...my path has jus started, jus hoping its a bright one...thanks for your input!

 

[and1play5]

You should focus on class and learn more about the industry before you make a choice. You're working on a BA for IT and just started your intro classes, so you've really only been exposed to a tiny piece of what the entire IT industry entails. Computers are used in just about every single industry these days. Consider that before you start trying to make decisions about where you'll end up.

That said, determining if software or networking is better really depends on you. Where do you see yourself in 15 years? What would you like to be doing from 30-60? Your goals? Software will grant you many more job opportunities than network, provided that you are a good developer. Those opportunities also come with more money, on average. The only issue is that most IT programs are not going to teach you how to code well enough, if at all, to land a job.

Networking on the otherhand is a narrowing field. There are a lot of network techs out there, just think about how many ITT Tech commercials you see every day. Unless you plan on getting into very specialized networking, it will be tough to find consistent, high paying work. In spite of that, networking can serve as a better foundation for a long career if you plan on going above networking. When you go with networking, it can lead you to just about anywhere. Whereas if you go with software development, you're pretty much going to be doing that for the foreseeable future.

He's right, was originally a CS major, didn't like programming so I switched to IT Network Security (WGU). Now that I'm almost finished, I just got my ccna thinking I was going to jump right into a network engineering role, ended up with a cloud engineering position with lots of AWS and development. I think the networking base has made it a bit easier for me to understand programming. I also got my linux+ cert so it gave me a good intro to the command line and bash scripting. IT has a lot of fields that end up interconnecting so you never know.