FOX *CBM thread - RIP STAN LEE - Dark PhoeniX 06/07/19

[robinvandamn]

Just give Matthew Vaughn all the money and have him take over these franchises

 

[Master Zik]

Wow since last night (before watching the vid posted it in here and I will watch it late) but I've found out a lot more about the issues with Trank on set and FOX studios during filming. I wasn't paying any attention to this film during filming nor was I seeking to be spoiled about it but now this stuff has me like I would've felt really different about Trank and this movie had I known.

Apparently somebody on set posted on 4chan what douche he was being, on something during filming, erratic behavior with everybody, disappearing for long periods of time, had no vision for the movie at all (which makes sense why they kept calling this continuation of Chronicle ). Then somebody pretending to be Trank also posted on 4chan and it gained momentum and FOX was forced to send C&Ds to stop this fake controversy With how he's said to be acting I'm not even sure it wasn't him from some posts I saw.

This stuff ties in to Kinberg allegedly being the one to advise Lucasfilm to let Trank go.

I mean I've never heard of a director distancing himself from a "summer blockbuster" the night before debut. I've seen in other ppl mention Fincher and Aliens 3 but this is such a different situation

It's like FOX and Trank didn't want to give this movie a chance.

 

[robinvandamn]

Wasn't this initially a found footage film? Did any of that make it into the final film?

 

[Master Zik]

Yeah that was early rumors and I and others complained they didn't want a shaky cam superhero movie. The concept of it did not make sense at all to me for an established superhero flick.

If you were doing some indie comic adaption the novelty of it could work but with F4? :x

 

[rfx45]

It's too easy to blame Fox on these but I think most blame has to be on Trank. I mean it's his "vision" and his movie and there were reports that Kinsberg and other producers had to stand in for him during shoots and they had to edit it themselves because Trank was a no show. Seems like Fox just trusted the wrong director that was a huge flake with a supposedly coke addiction to boot.

Wasn't this initially a found footage film? Did any of that make it into the final film?

Got to stop believing the rumors, Doom was also supposed to be a blogger but that wasn't the case.

 

[Master Zik]

If you believe the video about Trank's F4 then it's all his fault

Kinberg ghost directed this? Vaughn was brought in away from Apocalypse writing to ghost direct? C'mon now.

Not to mention that not until yesterday with that tweet Trank had been denying that he was removed from directing this movie and was standing by it all the way unlike the less than confident comments from Teller and Kinberg. He's only changing his tune cuz of reviews.

What you can blame FOX for is purposely releasing a ****** F4 movie just to keep the rights and if 7 years or whenever the time for it to revert draws near and they release a straight to DVD release to keep the rights you'll no how pathetic they can be. They literally have no faith in the ip but want to keep the ip regardless. That's one thing I hate about most media conglomerates. They all sit on ips they have no plans of doing anything with.

 

[IATT]

if im in charge of fox, im calling up marvel and telling them they can have the rights back to the F4 and everything associated with it for a percentage of the box office of any film which any of those characters appear in (and merchandise)

then talk deals similar to what sony and marvel are doing with xmen

 

[tdogg2k]

I'm going to post this in both here and Marvel
but very interesting about license and who can use what. What has happened

very long but good read

Spoiler: Warning: Spoiler!

Sorry I hate to be "that guy", but I gotta make a correction to your correction.

WARNING: If you don't care about Marvel movie rights, look away.this is going to take a while... I know this isn't strictly Funko related, but it will hopefully try and explain the licensing problems!

Believe it or not this whole situation was a hell of a lot more confusing 5 years ago as licenses were handed out like candy in the 90's, but recently most of these have reverted to Marvel. Short story is Marvel was on the brink of bankruptcy and sold movie rights to Universal, Fox and Artisan for some much needed cash (Artisan being a tiny company with a fat wallet off the back of the success of the Blair Witch project).

Over the years they sold lots of movie license to lots of studios. Contrary to popular belief Fox didn't own tons of rights and they were spread all over the shop. Here is a quick history of all the licenses that were dished out:

Republic Pictures made a Captain America film in 1944, but this doesn't really count as Marvel wasn't even known as Marvel then! (they were Timley Comics)
Constantin Film had Fantastic Four (interesting story, they made an entire film and just before release Avi Arad purchased all copies and prints and had them destroyed as it was so bad!)
Universal had Hulk and Namor (back to them later) and had Howard the Duck
Fox had X-Men, Fantastic Four (shared with Constantin), Daredevil and Elektra
Artisan Entertainment had Captain America, Black Panther, Deadpool, Iron Fist, Morbius, Longshot, Power Pack, Mort the Dead Teenager, Ant-Man, Punisher and Man-Thing
New Line Cinema had Blade, Iron Man and Deadpool (purchased from Artisan)
Lionsgate had Black Widow, Punisher , Iron-Fist and Man-Thing (all inherited the purchase of Artisan, I will come back to Man-Thing in a minute)
Columbia had Black Panther (from Artisan)
Sony had Spider-Man, Thor, Ghost Rider (in conjunction with Crystal Sky) and Luke Cage
Dimension had Warewolf By Night and Dr. Strange
Paramount had Deathlok

Sony still have Spider-Man, Fox have X-Men, Fantastic Four & Deadpool (purchased from New Line). Constantin Film still technically own the rights to Fantastic Four and co-produced and distributed the first 2 films, and is still involved with the reboot.

Lots of the above nearly went into production, Black Panther was going to be a spy film with Wesley Snipes and Ray Park was signed on to do Iron Fist. The above mostly reverted back to Marvel due to the lack of films surrounding the characters, except for Luke Cage which is believed to have been purchased back, and there are still some hangers on (more on that later). Fox tried to retain the rights to Daredevil too, but Marvel refused an extension. Once they were purchased by Disney in 2009, they were obviously keen to start making films and set about regaining as many licenses as they could, including any distribution rights. There is an infographic by the Geek Twins that does a good job of explaining the current state at a glance, but doesn't tell the whole story. Below is a list of the currently active licenses at other studios:

Sony
Sony still own all of the movie rights to Spider-Man, nothing has changed on that front. What Marvel have done is make a deal with them that allows them to use the characters in their movies, and exercise some creative control over the Sony movies in the sense they cannot do anything that conflicts the MCU storyline. Sony wholly own the movie rights and no money has exchanged hands. Marvel make no money from Sony's films, and the reverse is true for MCU films that contain spider man. There is potential for bonuses to be issues based on box office milestones, but these are tokenry. The other unknown is the extent of the deal and the characters it covers, it is entierly possible it limits Marvel to only using the Spider-Man character, and not any of the supporting cast, but at this point is all specualtion and probably subject to change. The only fact we know is that Marvel can use Spider-Man, this is not confimation that Norman Osbourne or Venom are going to start butting heads with Iron Man, and equally any Marvel charatcer outside of Sony's license will only appear in Sony's film when allowed on a case by case basis by Marvel (for example Iron man is rumored to appear in the Spider-Man standalone film).

Fox
The above explanation of Fox's situation is largely correct, but it is an incredibly complicated subject. They own the movie rights entirely for the X-Men and Fantastic Four franchises. Unfortunately this causes more confusion than it clears up given how mixed up the Marvel comic universe is, and how the phrases "X-Men" and "Fantastic Four" actually define very little. The contents of the deal between Marvel and Fox have never been disclosed so no-one outside those companies knows what it covers, there is a common assumption that first appearance in the comics determines the franchise but this is totally incorrect. Here are a few points to show just how unclear it is:

Ulysses Klaue (Klaw), the Kree and Ronan the Accuser, and Black Panther all debuted in Fantastic Four comics but belong to Marvel Studios
Rogue debuted in Avengers, Wolverine in Incredible Hulk, Mystique in Ms. Marvel, Sabretooth in Iron Fist, Viper in Captain America and Silver Samurai in Daredevil, all have been used in Fox's X-Men films. Equally Kang is primarily an Avengers bad guy, but movie rights belong to Fox
Ultimately the original deal probably wasn't as clear as it needed to be as no one at the time expected Marvel to start making it's own films, but I imagine there is either
a) a list of characters the license covers and ones that were not explicitly mentioned live in a grey area (a la Scarlet Witch and Quicksilver; mutants, who aren't actually mutants any more, who are primarily Avengers, also appear in major X-Men stories e.t.c)
b) Characters are not defined and everytime they want to make a film there is an argument between studios.
I imagine it is the former. A lot of people have decided that Marvel can;t use the term 'mutant' and have cited Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D show runner Maurissa Tancharoen for proof, but it is far more likley that Marvel have decided simply to not use the word (and subsequently ban it from the TV show) due to the fact that they can't use any of the characters. Despite the constant chatter that it is not allowed due to licensing, it is far more likely it is simply banned for creative reasons. It is known that other deals did list characters which saved them from other licenses by 'first appearance' rule, for example Kingpin was a Spider-Man villain but was packaged as part of the Daredevil license which recently reverted back to Marvel.

Universal
Namor is very confusing to define as he has been a part of every team under the sun... except that Universal own the rights to him specifically, but what is not clear is if they own the rights to supporting characters such as Namora and Namorita. Marvel have stated that while Universal can't actually make movies with him in anymore (presumably because the license expired), they can't either and are working on getting it back. Universal still own first refusal on the distribution rights for the Hulk, and did distribute the Edward Norton Hulk film (and got a nice chunk of change in the process). This is possibly why no other solo Hulk films have been produced.

Lionsgate
While Black widow and Punisher have clearly reverted to Marvel, Man-Thing is still a bit of a grey area. Until recently it was believed that Lionsgate still had the license, but they haven't made a film with him in since 2005 and also he has been mentioned in the MCU (both by Ellen Brandt in Iron Man 3 and Maria Hill in Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D) so it is possible those rights are with Marvel.

Paramount
Worth a footnote, Paramount distributed Iron Man 1 & 2, Thor and Captain America: The First Avenger, and owned the distribution rights to the Avengers and Iron Man 3 but sold these back to Disney.

The above only goes to show how big of a mess things are, and highlights how the current licenses are still unclear. For example Miles Morales, a character created in 2011 couldn't be used by Marvel, but cannot have been included in the license with Sony as it was created in 1999. It throws doubt on characters like Adam Warlock, who debuted in Fantastic Four, and there are rumors that the Chithari were used in the Avengers instead of the Skrulls due to licensing, but the same was thought of the Kree until they turned up in Guardians of the Galaxy. The ninjas in 'The Wolverine' were likley to be 'The hand', but they wern't called that due to the fact that license went back to Marvel with Daredevil. It also highlights how studios can hang on to licenses (like Constantin) without actually doing anything for decades.

Needless to say, it's a bit of a mess.

TL;DR Marvel sold everything to everyone back in the 90's and since being bought by Disney is slowly clawing everything back. Fox and Sony are the only other studios that can produce films with Marvel characters in (barring possibly Lionsgate with Man-Thing), but who owns the rights to what characters is somewhat of a mystery, and neither Sony, Fox or Marvel are telling.

-Key notes
-first appearances didn't count to who gets what
-Namor is still owned by Universal, only problem is a lot of his characters are owned by Marvel.
- Miles spider man is in Limbo because the deal was created in 99' but miles was created in 2011
- Guardians of the Galaxy may end up changing a lot of what gets used in what

 

[robinvandamn]

It's too easy to blame Fox on these but I think most blame has to be on Trank. I mean it's his "vision" and his movie and there were reports that Kinsberg and other producers had to stand in for him during shoots and they had to edit it themselves because Trank was a no show. Seems like Fox just trusted the wrong director that was a huge flake with a supposedly coke addiction to boot.

Wasn't this initially a found footage film? Did any of that make it into the final film?

Got to stop believing the rumors, Doom was also supposed to be a blogger but that wasn't the case.

http://www.newsarama.com/21454-fox-...ts-singer-to-return-for-x-men-apocalypse.html

This wasn't an rumor, an exec of Fox actually started this whole thing lol

And from what I've gathered most of the Doom stuff was true. My brother even told me you can tell they went back and ADR'd his name Hell, the actor even admitted it

 

[sunshineblotters]

The reason Trank was fired from Star Wars were all those problems. Apparently he caused tens of thousands of dollars in damages in a hotel room Fox was paying for. Still partially blame fox for this mess

Rebecca Ferguson has some of the nicest boobs i've seen on a tv show. Her scenes in The White Queen had my mouth watering.

Lea Seydoux was great in Blue Is The Warmest Color. Her lesbian skills were looking top notch.

Googled em. They just ain't man. Definitely seen way more succulent pairs.

 

[robinvandamn]

Another thing Marvel gets credit for is not hiring complete A-holes to make or star in their films. The most unlikable person in the MCU is probably Renner (his playboy interview is low key hilarious)

Seems like Fox was initially going to let Trank do whatever he wanted, lost faith in the project or he started acting weird and they started trying to cut their losses early on by removing things, then dude went completely downhill and they were left with a mess of a film to release.

The fact that it's only 100 minutes says a Lot to me because I can't remember a superhero film that short, especially not an origin story

 

[rfx45]

And from what I've gathered most of the Doom stuff was true. My brother even told me you can tell they went back and ADR'd his name Hell, the actor even admitted it

I can confirm that it is not true at all unless you count him as a blogger because he is seen in front of a computer... then yeah I guess he is a blogger?

Kebbel said he was a programmer and blogging site that he was Doom, they did not show that at all. He also said his name was Doomashev but in the paperworks in the movie, they clearly showed his name was Victor Von Doom and even said below his name "Latveria", really can't tell if that was altered after the fact, it was a quick glimpse. I mean they may be rumors, they may not, it might be changes made once Trank left the project, maybe not. In the end that is what I saw in the film.

 

[rfx45]

Another thing Marvel gets credit for is not hiring complete A-holes to make or star in their films.

How the hell are you going to know dude was going to have a meltdown mid-way through production? Come one now, just giving Marvel credit just to give them credit.

 

[robinvandamn]

I mean, it's highly unlikely that an actor with access to the script would completely fabricate the character he's playing.

He did damage control in his most recent collider interview lol jokingly blamed it on a brain tumor

 

[Master Zik]

And from what I've gathered most of the Doom stuff was true. My brother even told me you can tell they went back and ADR'd his name Hell, the actor even admitted it

I can confirm that it is not true at all unless you count him as a blogger because he is seen in front of a computer... then yeah I guess he is a blogger?

Kebbel said he was a programmer and blogging site that he was Doom, they did not show that at all. He also said his name was Doomashev but in the paperworks in the movie, they clearly showed his name was Victor Von Doom and even said below his name "Latveria", really can't tell if that was altered after the fact, it was a quick glimpse. I mean they may be rumors, they may not, it might be changes made once Trank left the project, maybe not. In the end that is what I saw in the film.

As far as his name I'm seeing in most of these videos, the reviewers say it's clear as day they edited the change of his name from Doomashev to Von Doom

Another thing Marvel gets credit for is not hiring complete A-holes to make or star in their films.

How the hell are you going to know dude was going to have a meltdown mid-way through production? Come one now, just giving Marvel credit just to give them credit.

Apparently FOX knew something like that when they were looking to scrap the director, cast, and script

http://www.bleedingcool.com/2014/03...cast-six-months-before-they-are-due-to-shoot/

 

[robinvandamn]

Another thing Marvel gets credit for is not hiring complete A-holes to make or star in their films.

How the hell are you going to know dude was going to have a meltdown mid-way through production? Come one now, just giving Marvel credit just to give them credit.

you're just having one of those days I see... Why even bother quoting it? We went through this same thing like two weeks ago man

 

[rfx45]

Wait me replying is having a "one of those day"? What's next, a U MAD meme? And you telling me to not bother quoting you yet you keep quoting me?

I honestly do not even remember what you're talking about. Unless you are jsut trolling and being an Marvel Studios fanboy or something then I have no idea what we talked about two weeks ago. Too many things to keep up in the comic book movie threads alone.

But anyways, even that link Zik provided justs aid there are casting issues but no detail. It was obviously denied by producers (I mean of course they would) but at the end of the day, it was a rumor. And maybe I am just not very observant but it didn't look doctored with changing the name, might just be me but I am not denying that it was changed either, I truly believe they did I just didn't notice it.

 

[nawghtyhare]

Deadpool and its sequels finna be Fox's saving grace

Isn't deadpool rated r???
That's gonna cut down its earning potential because it's not a "family" film
Plus
It's gonna suck
Like the trailers for it seem funny/corny at the same time
I know I'm not biting the bullet and gonna be the first folks to see this movie

 

[Barbados Slim]

^^ I don't think it will suck, but it is rated R and coming out Valentines weekend, so I'm not optimistic about opening weekend box office, but I'm sure it will do well over time.

 

[robinvandamn]

Dude was still in his 20s when he started working on this film. Realistically it's not a surprise he got caught up.

 

[robinvandamn]

dude really acts like a bird in these threads

 

[rfx45]

Deadpool and its sequels finna be Fox's saving grace

Isn't deadpool rated r???
That's gonna cut down its earning potential because it's not a "family" film
Plus
It's gonna suck
Like the trailers for it seem funny/corny at the same time
I know I'm not biting the bullet and gonna be the first folks to see this movie

^^ I don't think it will suck, but it is rated R and coming out Valentines weekend, so I'm not optimistic about opening weekend box office, but I'm sure it will do well over time.

I can see it doing Lucy numbers, that one had a $40m budget and made ~$450m. Deadpool supposedly had a low budget so if I were to guess less than $100m, maybe even close to that Lucy budget. I can see Deadpool doing those number or closer to $300-$400 (I know big gap) and that would be a huge success for a small budget film. If it's good enough, it can do $500m even if it is rated R.

 

[rfx45]

dude really acts like a bird in these threads

The hell are you even talking about? You mad your dumb statements are called out?

Not even gon' get into it with you though, go ahead and have your empty victory. I raise the white flag and just try to ignore you as much as I can I guess.

 

[robinvandamn]

/Filmcast has a pretty hilarious review up right now

Dudes recorded it right after they left the theater and are practically at a loss for words.

 

[Benny Hinn]

/Filmcast has a pretty hilarious review up right now

Dudes recorded it right after they left the theater and are practically at a loss for words.

"This movie makes the Green Lantern look like the Dark Knight." :x

Damn...

F4 getting Meek Milled out here...