December Wrestling Thread | Rest In Peace Brodie Lee | Happy New Year | JOTM Bruce Mitchell

Yea that is cool and all but if it didn't amount to anything does it really matter?

But they point that was being made was that Hogan doesn't let folks shine at their expense which is not 100% true. Kidman never had it but he still went over.
 
But they point that was being made was that Hogan doesn't let folks shine at their expense which is not 100% true. Kidman never had it but he still went over.
Sure, it isn't 100% true.

But the general consensus is he didn't understand when to step aside for the next generation.

But that isn't on him, that is on whoever gave him such a high amount of creative control.

He only did what he was allowed to do.
 
:rofl: Tony is SICK OF Heenan

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WCW World Television Title Match
Diamond Dallas Page (w/Diamond Doll & Maxx Muscle) (c) vs. Johnny B. Badd
Johnny B. Badd in yet another LONG opening match. The match had good crowd participation but why on earth was it so damn long.

Singles Match
Randy Savage vs. Zodiac
Waste of time. This could have been on WCW Pro. I assume since Kamala wasn’t there, for whatever reason, they couldn’t put anything more than what was shown together.

Singles Match
Road Warrior Hawk vs. Kurasawa (w/Col. Robert Parker)
Finish was cold. Hawk was made to look like a sucka here. I don’t think Kurasawa was made to look strong though. Weird.

Singles Match
Sabu (w/The Sheik) vs. Mr. JL
:lol: - I wish we could have gotten a better angle of the fireball. But man, they crammed in a LOT of MOVES into this short match. Definitely fits the modern style. Probably the best looking pair of Moonsaults I have even seen from Sabu. (Top Rope and Asai). WCW could have at least mentioned that The Original SHeik was in fact Sabu’s uncle instead of it just being a random pairing of two wild and crazy men.

Singles Match
Lex Luger vs. Meng (w/The Taskmaster)
Ok match. Again, a better finish would have been appreciated. Meng did a good job with hiding the Golden Spike, nice work there. Whenever Luger comes out, he just looks like a STAR. The music, the Pyro, the fan reactions. Always Top Level.

:::: Matchguide Rating: 6.27 based on 29 votes. :: WON: ***3/4 ::::
Tag Team Match
Arn Anderson & Brian Pillman vs. Ric Flair & Sting
Flair wrestling in slacks. :lol: - He should have had some trunks under his pants. “You can tell he never hooped.” ( freeze freeze ). Solid tag-work from Arn and Pillman here, keeping Sting in their corner and on the defensive end. Really impressive work there. As expected, Flair did what we expected him to do and they beat the hell out of Sting. :lol: - Match was good.

Monster Truck Battle
I think I have skipped this every other time I was supposed to watch this but I was entertained. Hogan looked uncomfortable in there and honestly, I don’t blame him. I wonder about the logistics of this setup. How did the trucks get up there? I wonder what Big Stinky Giant fell on when HOgan knocked him off the ledge. :lol: @ Hogan being concerned, funny. I liked how Heenan and Shiavone couldn’t think straight until they found out if the Giant was OK. This was cool, no place on a wrestling card, but I was Sports Entertained.

:::: Not enough votes for total rating. ::::
Singles Match
Randy Savage vs. Lex Luger
ANother dumb finish here. Luger gets pushed into damn Jimmy Hart and he is knocked out? That made NO sense at all. Waste of time.


WCW World Heavyweight Title Title Can Change Hands Via Disqualification Match
Hulk Hogan (w/Jimmy Hart) (c) vs. The Giant (w/The Taskmaster)

Hogan was invincible man. :lol: - Hogan got a lot of offense considering he was going to make his stupid comeback later in the match. The match held my attention but looking back on it, a shorter, dominating performance by Big Giant would have been nice to see.

:smh: This Yeti nonsense. Goofy WCW acting like WWF.

:rofl: @ Luger wanting to rack everybody. He told “Yeti” to move out the way so he could rack Savage.


Overall, I give this a D. This wasn’t good at all. Bad finishes, quick tv style matches. The Tag Match and the DDP/JBB matches were worth seeing. Everything else was skippable.
 
I caught a feeling to watch some PPV's and I'm at Macho Man's title run from 88-89 and they disrespected him so much. He was still in Hogan's shadow. Wearing Hogan's colors as the mega powers. Having Miss Elizabeth "neutral" in their WM 5 match when she supposed to be Savage women. Savage CARRYING Hogan in that whole match only for Hulk to do the boot and leg drop to win. :lol:

I'm just watching this like damn I understand why Randy was so bitter.
 
Johnny b badd and ddp with a long match for the tv strap ...... decent back and forth match .... good to see a manager at ringside .... kinda adds to the match

never understood why when your own manager hit you it’s not a dq but if he hit your opponent it is lolol

wonder what Vince seen in mero.... and what did he think his ceiling was ....

ceiling was being power bombed by sable
 
My thoughts so far:

I don’t get this whole thing with Marc Mero being late to matches. It was certainly different but so corny

Max Muscle got called a thug

Good opening match with DDP putting Marc Mero over with all types of heel tactics



Squash match for Randy



Why was the colonel always getting paired up with the Japanese wrestlers



Sabu vs JL was terrible. No selling and all the moves had low impact



Man I miss prize giveaways during PPV’s



Meng with the extensions



Why was there a Crockett tombstone?



Giant’s Jacket was swagged out



Flair’s loader sliding off. Genius turn by Flair! I legit didn’t expect that!

I’m still watching
 
Man those monster trucks are cool AF. Got me here like a little kid cheering.
Please tell me Bischoff cut a deal and made toy versions of these trucks. I’d buy them right now.
 
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Halloween Havoc 1995 review by Meltzer
The 1995 version of a creatively booked PPV show contained a man falling off a five-story balcony to his apparent death, either into a river or a parking lot (nobody was quite sure), and showing up 15 minutes later to wrestle without even a scratch, or for that matter, wet hair. It contained so many turns (all of which were at least very well done) that the 1988 booking by Dusty Rhodes that put Jim Crockett out of business seems mild in comparison. Anyway, the pro wrestling version of Planet Nine from Outer Space was a thumbs down to me even though there were two great angles and one of the stupidest angles in history. The wrestling was better than last week's WWF PPV, but it's scary when that becomes the measuring stick. Perhaps the most telling stat of all were the phone calls and faxes here after the Havoc show all of a sudden being praiseworthy of the WWF show the week before (which explains the percentages shift).

Havoc on 10/29 from the Joe Louis Arena drew about 13,000 in the building set up for about 18,000 which of course was announced as a sellout on the show despite empty seats being easily visible. Roughly 7,000 was paid with a gate of $138,040. It's a very healthy gross considering the easy availability of paper throughout the city.

A. Eddy Guerrero pinned Disco Inferno (Glen Gilbertti) in 3:21 with a springboard huracanrana off the top rope. Guerrero did some nice moves and get the best sustained crowd chants of the entire show. Of course Eric Bischoff called the finisher a victory roll which is basically the exact opposite of what it was. *1/2

B. Paul Orndorff pinned Renegade (Richard Williams) after two piledrivers in 1:22. Renegade's body has changed a lot. This is probably his last WCW appearance for a long time as they're sending him back to wrestling school. Orndorff was acting depressed because his mirror broke. Orndorff got a big babyface pop for winning. DUD

C. Chris Benoit & Dean Malenko (Dean Simon) beat Steve Regal (Darren Matthews) & Bobby Eaton in 8:41 when Benoit held Regal in a full nelson, Malenko dropkicked Regal and Benoit took him over into a dragon suplex. Regal's knee injury, complete with heavy brace was acknowledged by Bischoff, and in another example of a booking committee missing the obvious, the legit injury occurred in a match against Benoit. Benoit's gimmick is "The Canadian Crippler." As with the Alex Wright injury, which also occurred coincidentally against Benoit, nobody made the tie-in. Some very good mat wrestling. Regal did a good job since he's got eight to nine inches on Benoit & Malenko and for the most part didn't work in a manner that made the size difference hurt credibility. Benoit has lost noticeable weight. Lots of near falls at the end. This ended up being a damn good match and the crowd even picked up on it by the end. Originally this was going to be billed as a match to determine the top contenders for the tag titles (Blue Bloods were getting a shot already taped upcoming), but since for whatever reason they decided to change the finish (probably because Benoit is about to get a big push as the fourth Horseman), they had to drop the stip that was never actually announced. ***1/2

D. Craig Pittman pinned V.K. Wallstreet (Lawrence Rotunda) in 3:37. First Bubba Rogers ran in with his fist taped and KO'd Pittman. Jim Duggan then ran in with his fist taped and KO'd Wallstreet and Pittman got his arm on Wallstreet for the pin. The winner was to face Randy Savage on Nitro the next night. 1/4*

1. Johnny B. Badd (Marc Mero) won the WCW TV title from Diamond Dallas Page (Page Falkenberg) in 17:01. Badd's ribs weren't 100% so he didn't do nearly as much as usual, although he did throw in a somersault plancha toward the finish and didn't do anything that would make anyone notice he was hurt. Page did a great job early bouncing around like Terry Funk outside the ring including getting punched with a bucket over his head. They teased an eventual break-up angle with Page and Diamond Doll throughout the match. Page used Hunter Hearst Helmsley's Pedigree move, called the Pancake here. Page controlled and carried most of the match. It dragged a little but turned into a good match with lots of nice near falls at the end. Finish saw Max Muscle clothesline Page when Badd ducked, and Badd got the pin. ***

2. Randy Savage (Randy Poffo) pinned Zodiac (Ed Leslie) in 1:30 after an elbow drop off the top rope. Zodiac subbed for Kamala, who decided to quit the promotion early rather than do a job here. The only excitement was a fan hopped the rail and escaped when ref Randy Anderson tried to hold him back, bring out tons of security and turning the fan into the biggest babyface on the show. Savage, to his credit, immediately took the match outside getting as far away from the real action so the cameras didn't see the fight inside the ring. Savage is working with a detached tricep, which is a pretty serious injury that should be keeping him out of action a few months. Bobby Heenan tried to sell the big crowd pops for the fans as being for Savage. DUD

3. Kurasawa (Manabu Nakanishi) pinned Road Warrior Hawk (Michael Hegstrand) in a major surprise in 3:15. Hawk didn't look bad for a change, being very aggressive, I guess since he was the one doing a job. Kurasawa didn't even get a chance to look horrible and his offense consisted of suplexes, which at least he's good at. After Hawk clotheslined Kurasawa over the top rope, he clotheslined Col. Parker off the apron. Kurasawa then hit a Samoan suplex on Hawk and pinned him with his leg on the ropes, and with Parker holding his legs for added leverage. *

4. Sabu (Terry Brunk) pinned Mr. J.L. (Jerry Lynn) in 3:25 with the arabian moonsault. Give them credit for foresight in time management. They have Luger and Meng go 13:00, and these guys go 3:00? It was a hot short match. Sabu used an Asai moonsault on J.L. and nearly wiped out The Sheik, who was at ringside, in the process. Since Sheik is pushing 70 and can barely move, and suffered a heart attack in the spring, I was scared to death seeing him go down. But he was okay and even threw fire at J.L. after the match. J.L. did a plancha over the post. **1/2

5. Lex Luger (Larry Pfohl) beat Meng (Uliuli Fifita) via DQ in 13:14. Horrible match with an even worse finish. Meng hit Luger in the throat with a foreign object and had him pinned, but Kevin Sullivan ran in and kicked Luger, who was being pinned, causing Meng to be disqualified for outside interference. This angle actually made sense for later in the show. -*

6. Sting (Steve Borden) & Ric Flair (Richard Fliehr) were technically awarded a DQ win over Arn Anderson (Marty Lunde) & Brian Pillman in 17:09. When the show started, it was announced that Flair had been injured in a pre-match attack by Anderson & Pillman and was questionable for the match. This made perfect sense since just two minutes earlier, Anderson & Pillman had been out doing an interview and none of this was acknowledged. The quality control division of this company leaves much to be desired. So Sting ended up coming out by himself and worked the first 6:00. Anderson & Pillman did a great job doing the old Anderson & Blanchard spots, and having Sting cross-up their spots as well. Actually Sting controlled the first 6:00, and when he finally got into trouble, Flair came out in street clothes to cheer him on. The next 11:00 saw Sting get pounded on with Flair cheering him on. There were only mild hints by the announcers that Flair was trying hard enough to save Sting and make the tag. Finally Sting made the tag and Flair immediately turned on him and they did a three-on-one on him and announced the Four Horsemen were back together. The match had the most heat of the card and the angle was very well done. Flair suffered a rotator cuff (shoulder injury) earlier in the week and wouldn't have been able to work at anywhere near 100% if they had decided to book the thing differently, although coming out of the Nitro match, this is probably how it was originally booked all along. ***3/4

Next came the sumo monster truck match. This match was actually a compilation of about a 5:00 live match, and several hours worth of taping the previous night. They actually had two monster truck drivers doing the driving and had Hogan and the Giant inside the truck faking like they were driving. If you notice, all the "in the truck" shots were identical and spliced in badly which gave it the Planet Nine look. The Dungeon of Doom truck looked cool. Even Hogan's truck looked like it was on steroids. After the match, Hogan and The Giant argued, and shoved, and punched and eventually The Giant lost his balance on a ledge that was supposed to be overhanging Lake Michigan (although there actually is no part of the roof of Cobo Arena that overhangs the Lake as there is a parking lot totally surrounding the building) and plunged to his death, or so we were led to believe. Angles like this are the reason pro wrestling in this country is in the condition it is in.

7. Savage pinned Luger in 5:23. Jimmy Hart came to ringside. Savage at least tried. When Luger had the match won, Hart distracted the ref. Luger then went after Savage but Savage moved and Luger collided with Hart. Savage hit the elbow off the top for the pin. Given what was happening later in the show, this finish made no sense. 1/4*

8. The Giant (Paul Wight) beat Hulk Hogan (Terry Bollea) via DQ in 16:57 so Hogan kept the WCW title. Hogan came out first in street clothes explaining that because of what happened to The Giant, there would be no match. Giant then came out, proving to be immortal to falling off buildings, but not to legdrops and poorly timed foot to the faces. This was basically the Hogan-Andre match from Pontiac re-done with a different finish except that this Giant is a lot more mobile than Andre was and this Hogan has a lot less charisma than that Hogan did. For a guy in his second pro match (Wight had worked one show more than one year ago for Larry Sharpe in New Jersey), Wight looked real good as far as poise. He didn't do anything impressive athletically. There were only two spots where you could see he was looking lost which is kind of amazing for a guy under this kind of a pressure in such a long match. Not that they did anything good. The announcers tried to sell it like it was Flair vs. Steamboat which it was anything but. After the superman comeback, Hogan hit the legdrop but Jimmy Hart then knocked out ref Randy Anderson with the title belt. Hogan, not seeing it, told Hart to revive the ref, and the moment Hogan turned around, he threw the ref down again. As Hogan was pounding on Giant, Hart hit Hogan with the belt as well but he didn't sell it, but when he went after Hart, he was caught from behind by a deadly bearhug. Luger and Savage then did a run-in, but Hart hit Savage with the belt and Luger began attacking Savage and Hogan. Yetti (who turned out to be Ron Reis wrapped up like SMW's Prince Charmin since Giant Gonzalez went AWOL after being hospitalized in mid-week after actually getting into the country to do the angle), who was a good three or four inches taller than our original Giant, combined for a double bearhug on Hogan. At least I hope that's what it was, because it looked more like a kinky sandwich. Yetti isn't supposed to be a mummy but is supposed to be an abominable snowman from the Himalayas. They got it half right. Luger then put Hogan in the torture rack. Hogan and Savage were left laying as the Dungeon of Doom left the ring. It started as a great angle but turned into something campy in the worst way when the guy wrapped up in toilet paper showed up and tried to have sex with Hogan. Giant left with the title belt. ** (mainly for the post-match)

This was Hogan's final WCW match until February or March. While there was apparent communication between Hogan and the WWF for him to go there in 1996, if WCW felt there was any seriousness to the chance of this happening, there is no way they would have kept the belt on him and it's doubtful Jimmy Hart was going to shoot an angle against Hogan unless they all had long-term plans of staying put. The show was somewhat reminiscent of a 1990 Clash where Flair turned heel on Sting, and where Sting blew out his knee doing the angle, and the turn left WCW without any babyfaces. With everyone turning heel and Hogan gone, plus Savage working on a serious injury, they've got Sting and nothing else. They're building a charismatic Four Horsemen heel team and an unbelievably uncharismatic Dungeon of Doom team (aside from The Giant), but who are they all going to wrestle, especially since all the New Japan wrestlers coming in this week are also going to be heels?
 
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