Can LeBron be an effective scorer once he ages?

[knightngale]

^ dude is actually the mad one since he brought up the all around game stuff when he could not defend lebron's weak +$! shooting compared to kobe

 

[bigtimejerky]

this thread was destined for failure.....

especially when Kobe gets involved

 

[outacontrol music]

Compared to LeBron's 30-7-7 at the age of 22?

Or his 29-7-7 last year at the age of 23?

 

[poeticjays]

Originally Posted by CP1708

outacontrol music wrote:

---

knightngale wrote:

---

ONCE AGAIN, LEBRON IS NOT EVEN CLOSE WHEN IT COMES TO OUTSIDE SHOOTING AT THE SAME AGE

Somebody is mad

Reeeeeally mad.






LeBron's strength is not his shooting, but he is still very good at it. LeBron has a better ALL-AROUND game than Bean could have dreamed
of at 24. That's truth that cannot be denied.






Now when Lebron gets into his mid-thirties, he will be probably be one of those players more in line with a Karl Malone type game.




I wouldn't be surprised if in his 34-40 years old part of his career, he's a consistent top 5 rebounder in the league, as he brings his game more
towards a pure PF type game.






Dude has so much potential.

02-03

LAL

82

82

41.5

10.6-23.5

.451

1.5-4.0

.383

7.3-8.7

.843

2.2

0.8

3.5

2.7

1.3

5.6

6.9

5.9

30.0

Kobe did this at 24 WITH another guy on his team takin 20 plus shots a game. 30, 7 and 6 at 45 percent with 38 from 3, and 84 at the line. 2.2 steals a game
just for fun also.




Kobe couldn't DREAM of this huh? Truth can't be denied?

Did Kobe run the point consistently and get his teammates involved also?

I don't think anyone believes Lebron has a better jumper than Kobe, now, or when Kobe was 24. But Lebron's vision and rebounding>>>>Kobe's.

Kobe is the best pure scorer since Jordan, no question, but the beauty of Lebron's game is that he can get 30 a night in the flow of the offense, whilelooking to pass and set up his teammates first.

At this stage of his career, with the amount of god-given ability he's been blessed with, Lebron would be a fool to jack up jumpers all day. That would behelping the defense out.

 

[jbone2308]

Originally Posted by PoeticJays

Originally Posted by CP1708

outacontrol music wrote:

---

knightngale wrote:

---

ONCE AGAIN, LEBRON IS NOT EVEN CLOSE WHEN IT COMES TO OUTSIDE SHOOTING AT THE SAME AGE

Somebody is mad

Reeeeeally mad.






LeBron's strength is not his shooting, but he is still very good at it. LeBron has a better ALL-AROUND game than Bean could have dreamed
of at 24. That's truth that cannot be denied.






Now when Lebron gets into his mid-thirties, he will be probably be one of those players more in line with a Karl Malone type game.




I wouldn't be surprised if in his 34-40 years old part of his career, he's a consistent top 5 rebounder in the league, as he brings his game more
towards a pure PF type game.






Dude has so much potential.

02-03

LAL

82

82

41.5

10.6-23.5

.451

1.5-4.0

.383

7.3-8.7

.843

2.2

0.8

3.5

2.7

1.3

5.6

6.9

5.9

30.0

Kobe did this at 24 WITH another guy on his team takin 20 plus shots a game. 30, 7 and 6 at 45 percent with 38 from 3, and 84 at the line. 2.2 steals a game
just for fun also.




Kobe couldn't DREAM of this huh? Truth can't be denied?

Did Kobe run the point consistently and get his teammates involved also?

I don't think anyone believes Lebron has a better jumper than Kobe, now, or when Kobe was 24. But Lebron's vision and rebounding >>>>Kobe's.

Kobe is the best pure scorer since Jordan, no question, but the beauty of Lebron's game is that he can get 30 a night in the flow of the offense, while looking to pass and set up his teammates first.

At this stage of his career, with the amount of god-given ability he's been blessed with, Lebron would be a fool to jack up jumpers all day. That would be helping the defense out.
As with most people who don't like Kobe you say the typical. So you saying Jordan and Kobe don't score within the flow of the offense? What you think the Triangle is set up for? The Lebron slurp-fest is ridiculous. DUDE IS AMAZING BUT DO WE HAVE TO DOWNGRADE OTHER PLAYERS TO JUSTIFY IT?

Kobe running the point in an offense where the PG never gets high assist. Heck Pippen was a SF and averaged the most assist. Look at Jordans assist numbers,when the triangle was instilled they dropped down. Why? BECAUSE HE DIDN'T HAVE THE BALL AS MUCH IT MOVED AND HE GOT THE BALL WHEN IT WAS TIME FOR HIM TODO HIS JOB, SCORE. THE SAME GOES FOR KOBE. THEIR ROLE IS THE SCORE AND PLAYMAKE.

Lebron and the new generation of Wade, CP3, D-Will, and Rose are throwbacks to the Big O era. If you can score and handle the ball you will have moreiso's than offensive set plays. That is why they get the points and assist they do.

But people say well Kobe can't do that. If he didn't run the triangle of course he could, why couldn't he?

 

[poeticjays]

Originally Posted by jbone2308

PoeticJays wrote:

---

CP1708 wrote:

---

outacontrol music wrote:

---

knightngale wrote:

---

ONCE AGAIN, LEBRON IS NOT EVEN CLOSE WHEN IT COMES TO OUTSIDE SHOOTING AT THE SAME AGE

Somebody is mad

Reeeeeally mad.














LeBron's strength is not his shooting, but he is still very good at it. LeBron has a better ALL-AROUND game than Bean could have
dreamed


of at 24. That's truth that cannot be denied.














Now when Lebron gets into his mid-thirties, he will be probably be one of those players more in line with a Karl Malone type game.










I wouldn't be surprised if in his 34-40 years old part of his career, he's a consistent top 5 rebounder in the league, as he brings his game more


towards a pure PF type game.














Dude has so much potential.

02-03

LAL

82

82

41.5

10.6-23.5

.451

1.5-4.0

.383

7.3-8.7

.843

2.2

0.8

3.5

2.7

1.3

5.6

6.9

5.9

30.0

Kobe did this at 24 WITH another guy on his team takin 20 plus shots a game. 30, 7 and 6 at 45 percent with 38 from 3, and 84 at the line. 2.2 steals a
game


just for fun also.










Kobe couldn't DREAM of this huh? Truth can't be denied?

Did Kobe run the point consistently and get his teammates involved also?




I don't think anyone believes Lebron has a better jumper than Kobe, now, or when Kobe was 24. But Lebron's vision and rebounding
>>>>Kobe's.




Kobe is the best pure scorer since Jordan, no question, but the beauty of Lebron's game is that he can get 30 a night in the flow of the offense, while
looking to pass and set up his teammates first.




At this stage of his career, with the amount of god-given ability he's been blessed with, Lebron would be a fool to jack up jumpers all day. That would
be helping the defense out.

As with most people who don't like Kobe you say the typical. So you saying Jordan and Kobe don't score within the flow of the offense?
What you think the Triangle is set up for? The Lebron slurp-fest is ridiculous. DUDE IS AMAZING BUT DO WE HAVE TO DOWNGRADE OTHER PLAYERS TO JUSTIFY IT?




Kobe running the point in an offense where the PG never gets high assist. Heck Pippen was a SF and averaged the most assist. Look at Jordans assist numbers,
when the triangle was instilled they dropped down. Why? BECAUSE HE DIDN'T HAVE THE BALL AS MUCH IT MOVED AND HE GOT THE BALL WHEN IT WAS TIME FOR HIM TO
DO HIS JOB, SCORE. THE SAME GOES FOR KOBE. THEIR ROLE IS THE SCORE AND PLAYMAKE.




Lebron and the new generation of Wade, CP3, D-Will, and Rose are throwbacks to the Big O era. If you can score and handle the ball you will have more
iso's than offensive set plays. That is why they get the points and assist they do.




But people say well Kobe can't do that. If he didn't run the triangle of course he could, why couldn't he?








I'm not downgrading kobe at all, dude above me said Kobe's all-around game was on par with Lebron's and that's just not the case. Betterscorer? more ways to score? sure. but that wasn't the argument.

up until the gasol trade, Kobe was arguably one of (if not the) most selfish players in the game. Why do you think many of his ex-teammates bashedhim/don't like playing with him? Numerous people calling him a bad teammate/lone wolf...etc. He's gotten much better at getting his teammates involvedand being a leader, but thats only recently, in the past couple of seasons.

Lebron has been a team-first guy since his first day in the league (remember his debut against the kings when he had a wide open fast break dunk and chose togive it up to Ricky Davis instead?). I think his leadership is his most underrated quality. He always looks to get his teammates involved, gets them easylooks. Why do you think the Cavs have such good chemistry? it always starts at the top. I don't think i've ever heard lebron be called a ball-hog,despite the fact he averages over 27 a game for his career.

 

[kobe82410]

Originally Posted by PoeticJays

Originally Posted by jbone2308

PoeticJays wrote:

---

CP1708 wrote:

---

outacontrol music wrote:

---

knightngale wrote:

---

ONCE AGAIN, LEBRON IS NOT EVEN CLOSE WHEN IT COMES TO OUTSIDE SHOOTING AT THE SAME AGE

Somebody is mad

Reeeeeally mad.














LeBron's strength is not his shooting, but he is still very good at it. LeBron has a better ALL-AROUND game than Bean could have
dreamed


of at 24. That's truth that cannot be denied.














Now when Lebron gets into his mid-thirties, he will be probably be one of those players more in line with a Karl Malone type game.










I wouldn't be surprised if in his 34-40 years old part of his career, he's a consistent top 5 rebounder in the league, as he brings his game more


towards a pure PF type game.














Dude has so much potential.

02-03

LAL

82

82

41.5

10.6-23.5

.451

1.5-4.0

.383

7.3-8.7

.843

2.2

0.8

3.5

2.7

1.3

5.6

6.9

5.9

30.0

Kobe did this at 24 WITH another guy on his team takin 20 plus shots a game. 30, 7 and 6 at 45 percent with 38 from 3, and 84 at the line. 2.2 steals a
game


just for fun also.










Kobe couldn't DREAM of this huh? Truth can't be denied?

Did Kobe run the point consistently and get his teammates involved also?




I don't think anyone believes Lebron has a better jumper than Kobe, now, or when Kobe was 24. But Lebron's vision and rebounding
>>>>Kobe's.




Kobe is the best pure scorer since Jordan, no question, but the beauty of Lebron's game is that he can get 30 a night in the flow of the offense, while
looking to pass and set up his teammates first.




At this stage of his career, with the amount of god-given ability he's been blessed with, Lebron would be a fool to jack up jumpers all day. That would
be helping the defense out.

As with most people who don't like Kobe you say the typical. So you saying Jordan and Kobe don't score within the flow of the offense?
What you think the Triangle is set up for? The Lebron slurp-fest is ridiculous. DUDE IS AMAZING BUT DO WE HAVE TO DOWNGRADE OTHER PLAYERS TO JUSTIFY IT?




Kobe running the point in an offense where the PG never gets high assist. Heck Pippen was a SF and averaged the most assist. Look at Jordans assist numbers,
when the triangle was instilled they dropped down. Why? BECAUSE HE DIDN'T HAVE THE BALL AS MUCH IT MOVED AND HE GOT THE BALL WHEN IT WAS TIME FOR HIM TO
DO HIS JOB, SCORE. THE SAME GOES FOR KOBE. THEIR ROLE IS THE SCORE AND PLAYMAKE.




Lebron and the new generation of Wade, CP3, D-Will, and Rose are throwbacks to the Big O era. If you can score and handle the ball you will have more
iso's than offensive set plays. That is why they get the points and assist they do.




But people say well Kobe can't do that. If he didn't run the triangle of course he could, why couldn't he?








I'm not downgrading kobe at all, dude above me said Kobe's all-around game was on par with Lebron's and that's just not the case. Better scorer? more ways to score? sure. but that wasn't the argument.

up until the gasol trade, Kobe was arguably one of (if not the) most selfish players in the game. Why do you think many of his ex-teammates bashed him/don't like playing with him? Numerous people calling him a bad teammate/lone wolf...etc. He's gotten much better at getting his teammates involved and being a leader, but thats only recently, in the past couple of seasons.

Lebron has been a team-first guy since his first day in the league (remember his debut against the kings when he had a wide open fast break dunk and chose to give it up to Ricky Davis instead?). I think his leadership is his most underrated quality. He always looks to get his teammates involved, gets them easy looks. Why do you think the Cavs have such good chemistry? it always starts at the top. I don't think i've ever heard lebron be called a ball-hog, despite the fact he averages over 27 a game for his career.


you dont know how bad the lakers were before last year. you had kwame, smush mihm/cook as starters. the only player that was decent was lamar. kobe HAD to beshoot alot for his team to do well. lebron's supporting cast was soo much better than kobe's. but this isn't kobe vs lebron thread.

 

[CP1708]

Originally Posted by outacontrol music

Compared to LeBron's 30-7-7 at the age of 22?

Or his 29-7-7 last year at the age of 23?

Naw, none of that crap is the point.

The point is, you said flat out that Kobe couldn't even DREAM of being as all around at the age of 24, when in fact he was just as good. Period. Pointblank.

Numbers are solid all the way across the board for both of them. They are and were the elite of the elite.

But you said he couldn't even DREAM of it. And that is a fail of a statement.

Cuz I would like to see Lebron average 30 a game with ANOTHER 30 point a game scorer takin shots on the team.

Or how about getting 7 rebounds a night, with another guy on the team getting 10 plus a game.

And still pitchin in those 2 steals and 6 dimes as well.

LeBron has had his own team from jump. Not a knock on the kid, he should be commended. But if you gonna try and claim that at 24 he was SOOOOOOOO much betterthen another 24 year old, check out how the situations were first.

Would Bron right now get 30 7 and 6 with 2 if he had another guy on the team gettin 27 and 11 every night which is what Shaq was doin at that time? Maybe hecould, but do you know that for sure? Cuz he didn't do it this year. He came close, but not quite 30, not quite the two steals. Now mix in that otherguy takin shots and boards away. Tough call huh?

 

[outacontrol music]

So you're using hypotheticals?


LeBron's had to do more and he's done it.

That's the facts.

Last time I checked

More > Less

 

[CP1708]

Originally Posted by outacontrol music

So you're using hypotheticals?


LeBron's had to do more and he's done it.

That's the facts.

Last time I checked

More > Less

What does this even mean?


Wasn't it hypothetical to say Kobe ain't sniffin all around greatness at 24, which I then disproved? Isn't that hypothetical?

And you stated it like it was a fact, when really it's just your biased opinion. So much so that when the numbers were presented in front of you, youlocked up and started throwing other years and other numbers out.

But I thought we were talkin at age 24. They both extremely similar if you ask me. Bron may in fact get the nod, I have no problem with that, but youforgettin 5 years ago how dominant another guy was. That's a shame.

 

[jbone2308]

Originally Posted by PoeticJays

Originally Posted by jbone2308

PoeticJays wrote:

---

CP1708 wrote:

---

outacontrol music wrote:

---

knightngale wrote:

---

ONCE AGAIN, LEBRON IS NOT EVEN CLOSE WHEN IT COMES TO OUTSIDE SHOOTING AT THE SAME AGE

Somebody is mad

Reeeeeally mad.














LeBron's strength is not his shooting, but he is still very good at it. LeBron has a better ALL-AROUND game than Bean could have
dreamed


of at 24. That's truth that cannot be denied.














Now when Lebron gets into his mid-thirties, he will be probably be one of those players more in line with a Karl Malone type game.










I wouldn't be surprised if in his 34-40 years old part of his career, he's a consistent top 5 rebounder in the league, as he brings his game more


towards a pure PF type game.














Dude has so much potential.

02-03

LAL

82

82

41.5

10.6-23.5

.451

1.5-4.0

.383

7.3-8.7

.843

2.2

0.8

3.5

2.7

1.3

5.6

6.9

5.9

30.0

Kobe did this at 24 WITH another guy on his team takin 20 plus shots a game. 30, 7 and 6 at 45 percent with 38 from 3, and 84 at the line. 2.2 steals a
game


just for fun also.










Kobe couldn't DREAM of this huh? Truth can't be denied?

Did Kobe run the point consistently and get his teammates involved also?




I don't think anyone believes Lebron has a better jumper than Kobe, now, or when Kobe was 24. But Lebron's vision and rebounding
>>>>Kobe's.




Kobe is the best pure scorer since Jordan, no question, but the beauty of Lebron's game is that he can get 30 a night in the flow of the offense, while
looking to pass and set up his teammates first.




At this stage of his career, with the amount of god-given ability he's been blessed with, Lebron would be a fool to jack up jumpers all day. That would
be helping the defense out.

As with most people who don't like Kobe you say the typical. So you saying Jordan and Kobe don't score within the flow of the offense?
What you think the Triangle is set up for? The Lebron slurp-fest is ridiculous. DUDE IS AMAZING BUT DO WE HAVE TO DOWNGRADE OTHER PLAYERS TO JUSTIFY IT?




Kobe running the point in an offense where the PG never gets high assist. Heck Pippen was a SF and averaged the most assist. Look at Jordans assist numbers,
when the triangle was instilled they dropped down. Why? BECAUSE HE DIDN'T HAVE THE BALL AS MUCH IT MOVED AND HE GOT THE BALL WHEN IT WAS TIME FOR HIM TO
DO HIS JOB, SCORE. THE SAME GOES FOR KOBE. THEIR ROLE IS THE SCORE AND PLAYMAKE.




Lebron and the new generation of Wade, CP3, D-Will, and Rose are throwbacks to the Big O era. If you can score and handle the ball you will have more
iso's than offensive set plays. That is why they get the points and assist they do.




But people say well Kobe can't do that. If he didn't run the triangle of course he could, why couldn't he?








I'm not downgrading kobe at all, dude above me said Kobe's all-around game was on par with Lebron's and that's just not the case. Better scorer? more ways to score? sure. but that wasn't the argument.

up until the gasol trade, Kobe was arguably one of (if not the) most selfish players in the game. Why do you think many of his ex-teammates bashed him/don't like playing with him? Numerous people calling him a bad teammate/lone wolf...etc. He's gotten much better at getting his teammates involved and being a leader, but thats only recently, in the past couple of seasons.

Lebron has been a team-first guy since his first day in the league (remember his debut against the kings when he had a wide open fast break dunk and chose to give it up to Ricky Davis instead?). I think his leadership is his most underrated quality. He always looks to get his teammates involved, gets them easy looks. Why do you think the Cavs have such good chemistry? it always starts at the top. I don't think i've ever heard lebron be called a ball-hog, despite the fact he averages over 27 a game for his career.
Ok if Kobe is so selfish then why don't the Legends say he is? Why are they first to say he's the best and give him credit? Not evenpeers who play against him say that. Also name teammates besides Smush Parker that have bashed him and cried? Recently getting teammates involved? Lets try2006 since it has became his team and you can't tell me Caron Butler didn't want to play with Kobe. Kobe hated how he got traded, he wanted himinstead of Odom because Caron plays hard every night. This argument is dead about the selfishness because yeah he may have tried too much with Shaq, but if hedidn't do you think they get 3 rings?

How important was Kobes aggressiveness on the road in the West? Go look at how Shaq would perform against the Spurs, Blazers, or Kings on the road during the3-peat and compare to his home games. You tell me Kobe was selfish every game.

Outacontrol:

Lebron has less now but you cannot tell me before the Gasol trade or even last year his team was that much worse than what Kobe has had. I think people lookat the fact LA has had Phil Jackson. Phil actually had to start from the ground up in '06 for the first time in his career. When he got on the Bulls theywere already contending in the Eastern Finals, they just had to beat Detroit. '91 they did that. '06- last year LA was getting bounced and Phil wasgrooming players while he had 1 vet, then they added Fisher.

 

[crazy dav0]

he needs to call my dude penny for some footwork lessons and low post tips

he is showing signs of an improved jumper ... if it ever becomes consistent ... its a wrap as we already know

so the answer is yes ... he will always be effective ... instead of crazy dunks ... he'll just get crazy layups ... no 1 will be able to stop him fromgetting in the lane ...

since this thread has all types of extra comments in it ... i'll say while i'm not a fan of lebron ... who cares if his stats are virtually unchangedfrom the past couple of years....
dude is the best leader in the NBA ... w/ that being said lebron would have never went out like kobe did in game 6 last year ...

 

[jstar25]

The answer to the original question is: Who gives a ____! The boy is good and will be good I'm sure for the rest of his career which will not go into hislater 30's by his own choice. Let us not forget he is not even in his PRIME yet!

Also can we stop quoting EVERY single message combined and then adding $.02 to the end of it. This page is comically HUGE!

 

[ph3n0m3n0n]

Stop quoting that long @#$ quote!

Also I believe Lebron could average 30+ alongside Shaq if he took 23+ shots a game too along with getting 7+ boards and a boatload of assists. Just sayin sincewe're speaking hypotheticals here. Y'all acting like Kobe only took 16 a night during that time.

 

[jsindaa]

Originally Posted by RUDOLPH1996

Originally Posted by JsindaA

1 I didn't bring up numbers
2 I never said Kobe is a different player based on his stats ever. He's always been this type of player...he just hasn't had the teammates(this is post Shaq era)
3 I never said Bron hasn't improved at all....nor did I say he can't. I also didn't say he wasn't dominating.

You can't look at a career year...this is EASILY his best year so far....and say oh he's improving. If he had been showing that steady improvement over the course of his career leading up to this....ok I'd agree. But when you have been showing a steady decline and all the sudden have a breakout year....usually doesn't mean more of the same is going to continue. Furthermore, in general, improvements more than likely won't show in stats. Anyone watching Bron play should be able to tell he's improved on his already ridiculous ability to drive and finish. But as far as adding other aspects to his scoring game...hasn't happened yet. Which is why the question was even posed in the first place. Wade has carried his team on his back and we've seen improvements on his offensive game. Melo, sans the last couple years, had to carry his team on his back...and we've seen improvements on his offensive game. So carrying your team isn't an excuse. It's great that he can dominate now with the game he has but for a continued career of dominance he's got to address the holes in his game. Of course because it's LeBron it's a sin to suggest that he has holes in his game. He's 24 so yea he has plenty of time to improve but if he hasn't by now....whats to definitively say he will? Most of the time this far in a career you KNOW what you are going to get from a player.

The only thing in this rant worth mentioning...

I can clearly recall ( but not on NT.) folks questioning Kobe and MJ at this age and saying the same thing about limitations, areas of improvement.... they did pretty well as they got to 28,29,30... ect.

And, as someone else said... Bron will have the eye popn stats when it is said and done... He will be judged by championshipS that are won or not.

Thank you for bolding exactly the point of the thread...and what I said originally. He can improve...most likely will but he's NOT completetoday....and if that remains he won't be as dominant. End o story.

 

[maldonado]

Originally Posted by knightngale

^ dude is actually the mad one since he brought up the all around game stuff when he could not defend lebron's weak +$! shooting compared to kobe

lol.. you sound reeeal young homie.

sall'good though you shall learn in time. its not just about shooting.

as you shall see this year...

 

[JD617]

Looks like LeBron remained an effective scorer as he aged.

 

[deusavertat]

Jordan fans are big mad on the nets.

 

[DsLee]

Good Lawd the dig

 

[Air273]

at this rate he might break the record for most points scored in combined non playoff seasons.....

all jokes aside - gotta admire him living up to the pressure to be all time great from 16 years old and still kicking - stayed 98% healthy over last 20+ years and still scoring at this level wow

 

[WASPS ANDD ASPS]

.........yea, probably.

 

[noblekane]

first and foremost, I think that LeBron is the best player in the NBA right now( even though my screen name is for kobe) Dude is just a monster. anyway, itspretty obvious that his athleticsim is main sorce of his scoring. hes got no j as of now(getting better though, but will he keep it up?). Guys like Kobe and MJcan play/played until thier mad old, since thier athleticism isn't the only way they can score. Kobe and MJ use footwork so well that they can get a goodshot off whenever they want.

IMO, i think that as lebron's athleticism deteriotes, hes going to have to adjust. he probly have to devlope a post up game if he wants to play in the Luntil hes in his older 30s

this is a crazy post.

wonder what i said back then lol