.

[you go boy]

like i said its not going to happen... but you know how us knick fan gets... wishful thinking

 

[yeeupp]

If all three accepted $8-10 Mil each.. won't happen

 

[the gr8]

Originally Posted by airmaxpenny1

Originally Posted by THE GR8

Originally Posted by airmaxpenny1

4 PSAL titles like that means anything

PSAL is bunz.  I'm a Lance guy and we need no parts of him.  This is why Knick fans are clueless, they swoon over guys who aren't going to help us aka Nate aka Pat Ewing Jr aka LAnce now.  **@! those dudes, they are NBA scrubs at best.  Lance is a headcase who maybe could have been a decent player with a couple years in college.  We need good all-star caliber players, why are y'all caring about such bums?

im not heads over heels over Lance. not at all. Im not saying we need to sign him to be part of this teams starting 5 next year and *%*!. Im not an idiot i know who we need to get. Im talking about using a 2nd round pick on the guy. I dont see how that means i dont think we should go after some all-star caliber players. Who do you think is an all-star caliber player that will be available in the 2nd round? At the end of the day its not that important its just a 2nd round pick, imo i just think that a guy like Lance is a steal for a 2nd round pick, thats all. 

Lance isn't a future all-start talent though....Real talk when was the last time a dude from NYC lived up to the hype?

Yea...I thought so.  NYC is the wrong place to go if you are an NYC player regardless, if Lance has any chance at succeding he needs to be in a place far away from distractions and leeches.

dude thats exactly what im trying to say. Im not saying Lance isnt a future all-star but i am saying he is GREAT value for a 2nd round pick. If we had a lotto pick i wouldnt even think of mentioning his name, but for a 2nd round pick, and hes still available, i think it would just be foolish to pass up a guy with his potential. Call me clueless if i start hyping Lance up to be our all-star SG for the future, or if i was saying we should pick him in the lotto. Im not an idiot, if you have been on this forum for awhile now like i have yall probably know that i have been one of the biggest advocates of what Donnie is doing and finally bringing some big name all-stars over here. But i dont think its that outlandish to say we should use a 2nd round pick on Lance IF hes even available.
EDIT: and $8-10 mil 

 lets worry about getting DLee to sign a contract for $8-10 mil before we start discussing that with Bron, Wade, and Bosh

 

[sircharles2ol3]

Damn all this Lance talk has me feeling salty we passed up on Jennings. Lol.

 

[the gr8]

Originally Posted by sircharles2ol3

Damn all this Lance talk has me feeling salty we passed up on Jennings. Lol.

pretty much how me starting to talk about Lance has came from 

 Not saying Lance is in that class cause he isnt but people have just been taking character issues OD to the max lately. Im not gonna lie and try and cover myself up and say i was at the draft and wanted Jennings so bad. Cause thats not true. Not saying i wanted Hill, cause i didnt, but most of the dudes that i liked were picked ahead of us (Flynn, Rubio, Evans, and to a lesser extent Curry). And even in the beginning of the year when BJ was dropping 55 i was getting a little skeptical but i still said i had faith in Donnie and well see how Hill plays out. But honestly right now, drafting Hill over Jennings is already a certified L on Donnie's fault. Even if Hill does turn out to be a good player some day, fact is that imo we would be a playoff team right now with Jennings. We are fine as far as the 2-4 positions go, but we have no PG and no center, and Jennings was a franchise changing type of PG that was ready and available for us and wanted to play here, and with no draft picks this season and no one worth note in FA he was the last quality young PG we had a shot in in god knows how long. He would have made us a better team this season, and with him, Will, Gallo, and Lee we would honestly look like one of the best young teams in the NBA (kind of like the Eastern Conference Thunder in a way but to a lesser extent), not to mention all the salary cap wed still have, AND we have NYC. Free agents would be DYING to come here and lead our already talented, young team. Now we do have cap space and NYC, but the players we are looking at in FA all play the same positions of our best players and we still have no answer for a PG or a center in place. I hate to say it but passing up on Jennings will bite us in the ++#, and i honestly dont see how anyone can think differently at this point looking at the Bucks right now, and it was all because of %@%@%@% character issues and fear of having another Marbury. Its the same **@+ to why Dez Bryant fell to 24 in the NFL draft, why Sprewell was so easy to aquire, etc. 

Im not saying we should look for all low character kind of players, but i hate when teams get completely turned off on players because of so. Honestly everyone makes mistakes, and in most problems the issues are way overplayed. Alot of teams get turned off because of this and they overlook their skill set and how hard guys like BJ or Sprewell go for you. I mean the Knicks in the 90s, we were built off guys considered "thugs" by many, but at the end of the day those guys didnt take **@+ from anybody, they played their %@%@%@% hearts out every night, they were loved by all of New York, and most importantly they won. Oakley, Starks, Sprewell, Mason, etc. all these dudes fit this role but no one worked harder and bled with this team more than guys like that. Alot of yall are saying **@+ like "I'm tired of all these players with character issues" all these "thugs" i say bull **@+. Its these "thugs" that will play harder most cases and with more heart and these "thugs" were the reason that we won the last time we ever assembled a winning team here in a lot of cases  Im tired of passing up on talented players who will play hard every night with a chip on their shoulder and drafting a bunch of "high character" scrubs. Im done with it, i sware next time we pass up on a guy who is talented and would be great heart just because of attitude problems or a crime record in the past, ima flip a **@+.

 

[nycknicks105]

Jordan Hill

 

[mronegative]

I really wish Milwaukee woulda fell apart and dropped outta top 8. Then we wouldn't have to see how nice Jennings is.

 

[al3xis]

I've been one of the bigger Lance supporters on this board for the past couple years..

Until he played like crap all year and his game didn't translate. I'm not hating, I'd like to say he'd be a nice pick, but my eyes won't allow me to say so. I saw literally nothing except a handful of plays that made me go, "Okay, that's what I've been waiting to see"

Again, it has NOTHING to do with his character issues, he had no problems at UC that involved anything off the court.


I got $100 to anyone who wants to bet he's not on an opening day roster next fall.

 

[Mister Meaner]

Originally Posted by you go boy

like i said its not going to happen... but you know how us knick fan gets... wishful thinking

*checks page 1 for official fan list.


Anyway, this thread will continue with useless banter until the market opens. And I personally would want no parts of Lance. He's just not NBA ready mentally. Isn't he just 2 years removed from some assault allegations. Also, he's probably got that NYC bravado that doesn't sit well in a locker room.

 

[proshares]

Damn, here I was thinking me mentioning it would anger AMP.

 

[you go boy]

Originally Posted by YEEUPP

If all three accepted $8-10 Mil each.. won't happen

i dont know where your getting your numbers at... this year the knicks can sign 2 max free agent at 16 mill each and we already have curry on the hook for 11 mill... so if curry werent on the team then we have 11 mill to give somebody which would be that third free agent... i was just giving an example... obviously curry aint going nowhere and bosh, wade, and bron cant sign on the knicks at the same time... but seriously though all jokes aside if we dont get any of those 3 id be happy with amare and joe johnson and then find a center and pg for cheap

 

[ThaxbyChamblis]

Lets not compare Lance's fall to that of Dez and Randy Moss (of all people in the world? Randy friggin Moss?!?!?!). Or Even Brandon Jennings.

Lance is falling NOT because of Character issues, but because he did next to nothing this year. His fall is due to his skill, NOT because of his attitude.

People come up w/ outlandish !!%% to try and prove a point

 

[the gr8]

Originally Posted by dreClark

Lets not compare Lance's fall to that of Dez and Randy Moss (of all people in the world? Randy friggin Moss?!?!?!). Or Even Brandon Jennings.

Lance is falling NOT because of Character issues, but because he did next to nothing this year. His fall is due to his skill, NOT because of his attitude.

People come up w/ outlandish !!%% to try and prove a point

im not comparing him to that. If the Knicks were picking at 8 last season and i was saying +##* like "Lance is good enough to be a 1st round pick and be taken at 8, he just wont cause of character issues" than you can say im doing +##* like that. But fact is just like players before him, Lance's value is lower than his skill level. He is imo a late first rounder's talent level who probably wont be drafted until the mid 2nd round because teams have issues with him. BJ and Dez Bryant were different cases because they were 2 elite players in their respective drafts probably each good enough to be taken in the top 5-7 and fell later cause teams were scared off by character issues. Lance is in a similar case, but not the same cause he clearly is not a top 5-7 player in this class. However all i am saying is that if Lance is available in the 2ND ROUND, when we pick, imo that is great value right there and we should not pass him up.
People need to learn how to @+@@#+% read, i swear this is like the 8th time i have explained this. Its not like im saying Lance is a top 10 talent, but he is definitley a better player than his draft selection will suggest, and he sure as hell is good value in the 2nd round. I simply brought up a dude like BJ because it is obvious we shoulda taken him last year at 8, and we only didnt cause we were scared off by "attitude problems" when just like Lance (reccently) he has had no legal issues to speak of. I just hate it when players get classified like that and their value keeps on falling because of overplayed issues similar to what happened to Dez this year in the NFL and i hope dude tears it up and shows all the haters wrong. Again, Lance is different because he is not as good as these dudes, but it is a 2nd round pick, and imo the only reason we would pass up on Lance in the 2nd round are similar to the issues we passed up on Jennings last season

 

[bangdak]

Originally Posted by sircharles2ol3

My dude, how'd you get over 500 posts in less then a damn week?

 

[ThaxbyChamblis]

People need to learn how to @+@@#+% read,

Ahhh yes, the go to defense mechanism.

i swear this is like the 8thtime i have explained this. Its not like im saying Lance is a top 10talent, but he is definitley a better player than his draft selectionwill suggest,
But he's not though, and that's what people are trying to get across to you. He's going to go Mid-Late 2nd because he is a Mid-Late 2nd rounder as a player. His falling out of the 1st has nothing to do w/ anything other than his play. He was a model citizen this past year w/ Cinci

 

[the gr8]

Originally Posted by dreClark

People need to learn how to @+@@#+% read,

Ahhh yes, the go to defense mechanism.

i swear this is like the 8thtime i have explained this. Its not like im saying Lance is a top 10talent, but he is definitley a better player than his draft selectionwill suggest,
But he's not though, and that's what people are trying to get across to you. He's going to go Mid-Late 2nd because he is a Mid-Late 2nd rounder as a player

I write that because you are saying the same %$*$, that i am not even arguing against. If you can find one time i said that Lance Stephenson is an elite player in this draft than you right and im using a defense mechanism, if not you still gotta actually read what i write before responding or shut the !+@$ up. 

I guess Jennings and Bryant were bad examples because they are clearly better players in their draft class than Lance is. I think a better example is a guy like LeGarette Blount. He was kinda a talent in his class similar to Lance. A first or 2nd round type talent, who ended up going undrafted because character issues scared people away cause of one little fight. Im not saying i defend Blount punching that dude, but !%!$ we all get into fights every once in awhile, i know that i have, especially when it comes to sports and you got that adrenaline in you, its easy to get pissed off. Does it mean dude should have acted upon it? no. But does it mean he should be held so much to that one mistake that he went undrafted? probably not either. This is why i think character issues have just been OD reccently and im tired of it quite honestly.

Lance is better than a mid-late 2nd rounder. Lance was getting %$*$ since HS about his character and his attitude and was put into the lime light way too early. There is no chance homie isnt thought of as a 1st rounder if it werent for some questionable incidences from his BK days. And in Cincy? I mean lets not make it like dud was a complete flop or something. He had to settle for Cinci after numerous schools looking away due to some minor instances similar to his draft status. He came in averaged 12 ppg as a freshman despite being the oppositions primary target on defense every night, won big east freshman of the year, and was the best player on a Cinci tem that was suprisingly competitive in the best conference in college basketball. Not saying that is eye popping, but it certainly is not bad either especially for a freshman, and Cinci does not play the right system for him. For a dude of Lance's skill to be considered a mid-late 2nd round "skill" is just straight up wrong. There is no way there are 30 dudes in the NBA draft more talented than him let alone 50. He had a decent freshman season, on a $$#%+* team in a tough conference that does not run a system that he fits in, but dudes still say he underachieves because his expectations are so %!%$!#+ high. He already has a great NBA 2 guard body, is very athletic, and has a really nice jump shot and ball handling skills. It is rare to find someone as strong with that kind of body with his athletisism and skills like he has already as a freshman. Lance is an intriguing prospect and while he certainly is not a lotto talent he is FAR better than a mid-2nd round TALENT and the only way he would get selected in the 50s would be because of character issues and if he is still around for our pick, it would be another classic mistake not to take him.

and btw not that it means much especially this early but nbadraft.net has him being picked in the 1st round at 25. I know it dont mean much especially this early, but that is definitley more of a credible source than you going out and claiming Lance sucks, and certainly i am not the only evaluator who sees Lance as a first round type talent, and imo he would be a great value pick at 38-39 where we pick. You can keep hating on Lance which you and i both know that you are whether you admit it or not but at the end of the day MY opinion is that Lance talent wise ranks somewhere between 20-30 in this draft, and im pretty sure scouts know that also, and the only reason we would have to pass him up at 38 or 38 IF he is even available would be his overplayed character issues like numerous players in the past couple of years

EDIT:

Once again when has a NYC kid ever lived up to the hype

HOLY @+*% WHAT HYPE??? I swear yall ++!#*+@@$**$% are ODin, making it out like we have the #1 pick in the draft and im saying we should we should take him or some +!%#. ITS A @##+*#@ SECOND ROUND PICK. Since when is your 2nd round pick supposed to live up to this "hype" and be a future all-star or some +!%#??

This is exactly what im talking about when i say being from BK and Lincoln dude had WAY too big expectations to the point where people think he underachieved as a freshman. He isnt the next Jordan, he had a solid season as a freshman on a team that he helped overachieve that plays in a crazy hard conference as well. Yall wilding if you thought hed be dropping 16+ a night or some +!%#. Im not trying to say he is a clear cut NBA all-star all ive been trying to say is that if he is available, he is great value for a 2nd round pick. But its still a +%!@#+% 2nd round pick, idk how much "hype" 2nd rounders usually have coming into the NBA

on that note these are my final comments on Lance. at the end of the day we all have different opinions on him, but it is really not a big deal whatsoever, not even close to a big enough deal to warrant 2 pages discussing him 

We have 2 second round picks, and i guess well just wait and see what happens on draft night. If he is even available at 38, i think it would be a mistake to pass him up and imo hed be the best possible player still around up until that point and in our system, in his hometown, on what is hopefully to be a winning team imo i think dude can be a baller. He is only 20 years old and imo is loaded with potential. If some of yall think different, whatever, well see what happens. But if or not we draft Lance at 38 or 39 really is not important enough to warrant this discussion because

a) its a +%++@#% 2nd round pick which should be the LEAST important part of the offseason this year

b) we dont even know if hell be available right now

so im just letting it rest, yall can respond or not, youve heard my opinion or the matter, i think he is a top 20-30 player and will only fall because he will face the problems that numerous people in his spot have faced reccently, and imo we should take him. some of yall dissagee thats fine, its really not that important though 

 

[airmaxpenny1]

Once again when has a NYC kid ever lived up to the hype...Lance no matter how much I hope for him to succed, just simply isn't that good.  He was overhyped when he was younger cause he was so much bigger and stronger than his peers, but when the rest of the kids in his class caught up to him he was exposed.  He hasn't really improved sicne his sophmore year in high school.  He can't shoot, his handle is suspect.  He doesn't really have a true position in the league.  He is a late second round talent at best.

 

[ThaxbyChamblis]

Originally Posted by THE GR8

I write that because you are saying the same %*+*, that i am not even arguing against. If you can find one time i said that Lance Stephenson is an elite player in this draft than you right and im using a defense mechanism, if not you still gotta actually read what i write before responding or shut the %*%! up. 

I know you never said he was an ELITE player. But what you ARE saying is that he is NOT  Mid-Late 2nd round player, correct? Well the fact of the matter is, he IS. If he balled out this past year and only had concerns off the court, he would still be a 1st round pick. I am reading all that you wrote (all 5,093,94,849,504,329 words of it)

Lance is better than a mid-late 2ndrounder.

As of April 30th, 2010 he most surely is not. He barely seperated himself from other players on a *#@%%@ UC team.

There is nochance homie isnt thought of as a 1st rounder if it werent for somequestionable incidences from his BK days.
What don't you understand? The reason that he is falling is because of everything he did ON THE COURT. Like seriously dude, I vouch for/support Lance on here (go check the CBB thread) but the fact is he did NOTHING of note this year. His '09-'10 season was nothing special at all.

And in Cincy? I mean lets notmake it like dud was a complete flop or something. He had to settle forCinci after numerous schools looking away due to some minor instancessimilar to his draft status. He came in averaged 12 ppg as a freshmandespite being the oppositions primary target on defense every night,won big east freshman of the year, and was the best player on a Cincitem that was suprisingly competitive in the best conference in collegebasketball. Not saying that is eye popping, but it certainly is not badeither especially for a freshman, and Cinci does not play the rightsystem for him. For a dude of Lance's skill to be considered a mid-late2nd round "skill" is just straight up wrong.
He did nothing this year to improve upon the questions that were out there about his game coming into college. Jumpshot, decision making, lateral quickness, ability to defend, ability to play w/o the ball,  on court demeanor, etc. He did nothing to maintain or vault himself into a 1st round discussion. Not bad for a freshman gets you into the middle of the 2nd round or even undrafted.

There is no way there are30 dudes in the NBA draft more talented than him let alone 50. He had adecent freshman season, on a $!+%#+ team in a tough conference thatdoes not run a system that he fits in, but dudes still say heunderachieves because his expectations are so #%$+%+# high.

Doesn't need to be 30 players in the draft better than him (as it makes no sense to compare a guard to center to a forward, etc) all there needs to be is x number of people at x position. Fact is there are a number of guards who thoroughly outplayed Lance and who are just flat out better @ the moment. Lance hasn't vauted very many guards who are in this draft, so why the hell WOULND'T he be a mid 2nd round pick?

 He alreadyhas a great NBA 2 guard body, is very athletic, and has a really nicejump shot and ball handling skills. It is rare to find someone asstrong with that kind of body with his athletisism and skills like hehas already as a freshman.


Lance is not VERY athletic, in fact that's one of the concerns about his game is the lack of said athleticism. Strong as an ox though. And his Jumper is shaky at best. He is a pretty good ball handler.

andbtw not that it means much especially this early but nbadraft.net hashim being picked in the 1st round at 25. I know it dont mean muchespecially this early, but that is definitley more of a credible sourcethan you going out and claiming Lance sucks, and certainly i am not theonly evaluator who sees Lance as a first round type talent, and imo hewould be a great value pick at 38-39 where we pick. You can keep hatingon Lance which you and i both know that you are whether you admit it ornot but at the end of the day MY opinion is that Lance talent wiseranks somewhere between 20-30 in this draft, and im pretty sure scoutsknow that also, and the only reason we would have to pass him up at 3r 38 IF he is even available would be his overplayed character issueslike numerous players in the past couple of years

nbadraft.net is one of the worst scouting/projection sites out there. Early or not. And don't put words in my mouth, I never said he sucks what I said was that at this time he is a Mid-Late second round pick. +@!% out my face w/ this 'Hating on Lance' ##%%$*#@. Just b/c I don't agree w/ you and b/c I don't think he is as good as a number of other prospects out there don't mean I'm hating. I wish the kid the best of luck as I have been following the kid since I first heard about him but facts are facts.

 

[yeeupp]

Originally Posted by you go boy

Originally Posted by YEEUPP

If all three accepted $8-10 Mil each.. won't happen

i dont know where your getting your numbers at... this year the knicks can sign 2 max free agent at 16 mill each and we already have curry on the hook for 11 mill... so if curry werent on the team then we have 11 mill to give somebody which would be that third free agent... i was just giving an example... obviously curry aint going nowhere and bosh, wade, and bron cant sign on the knicks at the same time... but seriously though all jokes aside if we dont get any of those 3 id be happy with amare and joe johnson and then find a center and pg for cheap

Aaahhhh because you said imagine if we got all three... Wade..Bosh n Bron.. That's what they all would have to accept

 

[yeeupp]

& Donnie did say he didn't know much about jennings, everything he heard about him was from his scouts and he kinda blamed them.. He did seem like he regrets not choosing him though


http://www.nydailynews.com/topics/Donnie+Walsh

Donnie Walsh met with his entire U.S.-based scouting department Wednesday todiscuss the future and perhaps one glaring mistake from the not-so-distantpast.

"I'm pretty sure the name Brandon Jenningswill come up," said one team official.

The decision to pass on Jennings inJune's draft has backfired for the Knicks, and Walsh has not been shy aboutassigning blame to members of his scouting department, many of whom areholdovers from the Isiah Thomasadministration.

"I couldn't get a feel for hisgame," Walsh said of Jennings last month. "One scout said he thoughtBrandon Jennings was very good. I said, 'If he's that good you should come inmy door every five minutes and tell me.'"

Jennings, who played in Italy last season, was selected 10th by Milwaukee and has flourished in his rookieseason. Meanwhile, the point guard-starved Knicks used the eighth pick on powerforward Jordan Hill, who hasplayed just 80 minutes in 10 games for a team with a 7-15 record.

As the Knicks president, Walsh isultimately responsible for the pick and yet he continues to hint that part ofthe problem lies within the scouting department he inherited. Mark Hughes, Rodney Heard, Walker D. Russell and Steve Yoder were all hired by Thomas. Russell, infact, was believed to be one of Jennings' strongest advocates.

%@*@ and Scott McGuire are the longest-tenured scoutsgoing back to the '90s. Walsh's hires were Ben Jobe, John Gabriel and Misho Ostarcevic, who runs thedepartment. Walsh reportedly has been interested in hiring Chris Mullin, Billy King or Billy Knight as GM, but it is believed thatGarden chairman James Dolan doesn'twant to add front-office staff. According to a source, Dolan vetoed Walsh'splans to bring in George Feltonas a scout last summer.

In a recent interview with SI.com, Walshhinted that ownership wouldn't allow him to revamp the front office.

"I could have hired someamazing people," Walsh told SI.com. "But there are some things youcan't ask the owner to do, and that's eat some of these (front-office andscouting department) numbers."

That Dolan would be loyal towardThomas' hires is not surprising. Dolan continues to maintain a relationshipwith Thomas, the former Knicks coach and president who is now coaching Florida InternationalUniversity. Dolan dined with Thomas and invited him to be his guestfor the Knicks' season opener in Miami on Oct. 28.

When Walsh was hired to run theKnicks, it was Dolan who insisted that Thomas have a role in the organization.Thomas was eventually reassigned to a consulting position, and according to ateam source, had Thomas not accepted the FIU job he would have remainedemployed by the Knicks.

Judging from his recent comments,Walsh doesn't sound thrilled about having to retain all of Thomas' hires. Buthe may not have a choice.

Thomas and his staff are responsiblefor drafting Trevor Ariza,David Lee and Wilson Chandler. And it appears that some ofthose same scouts liked Jennings.

Perhaps they could have pushedharder or maybe they didn't want to step on anyone's toes.

"It's kind of like what I'mhearing with the players: They don't think they're going to be here, so theydon't want to play hard," Walsh told SI.com. "I'm like, 'What are youtalking about?' They've got to play hard, and I haven't said I wouldn't takethem back (as free agents), because if they're good enough, that would be oneof my options. So that doesn't compute to me, the same way if you've got scoutsworking for you - they work for the New York Knicks."

 

[ballinsam23]

all i can say is lance will have a better nba career than telfair. o and if he's on the board in the 2nd round and we're up WE WILL DRAFT HIM. /argument

 

[duba169]

LeBron James will win his second MVP and receive the award on Sunday in Akron.
Read more: http://basketball.realgm.com/src_wi...ll_receive_award_before_game_2/#ixzz0me9INjIc


bu ...bu... but.. he's so loyal to the city of Cleveland

 

 

[nychiphophippo]

Dirk + Bron + Bosh threaten to walk on the raps for nothing and forcing them into a sign + trade for Gallo + Curry

 

[you go boy]

who the heck is this dude lance everyone is talkin bout? yes im out of the loop... pls fill me in... PAUSE!

 

[fatherless child]

Like I said before, and I might be the only Knicks/Cavs fan from NY but: Lebron recieving his MVP in Akron is a giving, there's no discrepancy as to recieving it in Cleveland and I'm pretty sure being 30 or whatever miles away, that there is Cavs fans in Akron. Just watch the YouTube video of him recieving it last year. He said some pretty interesting things. Including free agency 2010 stuff.